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Pardon, Is This Your File?

Teknogeek writes "The BSA says piracy is thriving. At least, according to this article. Note one interesting statistic: '...the group found that 57 percent of respondents never or seldom pay for copyrighted works they download. And 12 percent admitted to pirating software.' How much do you want to bet that 45 percent gap is freeware and/or open source?" On a similar note, an Anonymous Coward writes: "MIT Technology Review reports on the process of scanning the entire internet for digital signatures matching copyrighted work (watermarking not required), and automatically emailing threats to the offenders and their ISPs."

22 of 442 comments (clear)

  1. the problem by oni · · Score: 5, Insightful

    MIT Technology Review reports on the process of scanning the entire internet for digital signatures matching copyrighted work (watermarking not required), and automatically emailing threats to the offenders and their ISPs

    The problem with this and all automated law enforcement schemes, be they traffic cameras or facial recognition, is that they create a substantial assumption of guilt that is almost impossible to refute. "The computer says you're guilty, so you must be"

    People find it hard to believe a system that is actually catching lawbreakers can make a mistake, until the mistake lands *them* in trouble.

    1. Re:the problem by meta-monkey · · Score: 4, Insightful

      When it comes to getting you botted off your ISP, the constitution doesn't really come into play. If they send enough threatening letters to your ISP, your ISP can just drop you for fear of being sued. Read your service agreement with your ISP sometime. They say in there that you can't do anything illegal with their service, and they reserve the right to can you at any time. When the RIAA is threatening your ISP with lawsuits valid or not, marching down to their office waving a copy of the fifth (and maybe sixth) amendment(s) probably won't help you get your service turned back on.

      --
      We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
    2. Re:the problem by cybermage · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The problem with this and all automated law enforcement schemes, be they traffic cameras or facial recognition, is that they create a substantial assumption of guilt that is almost impossible to refute. "The computer says you're guilty, so you must be"

      Of course this means that it could be bypassing a persons presumption of innocence. I wonder if this could be constitutional grounds from throwing such evidence out?

      Well, to answer your question, let's dispense with the premise above. The only thing these automated things can do is substantiate Probable Cause, which is the standard used by law enforcement to make arrests, request search warrants, etc. In some circumstances, for example, traffic violations, Probable Cause almost inevitably translates into guilt. If a cop clocks you going 80mph and hands you a citation for it. There's a very good chance you'll be found guilty by a judge, if you let it get that far. However, that doesn't mean Probable Cause equals guilt. The evidence in a traffic violation is usually enough to establish guilt beyond a reasonable doubt: The officer testifies he was tracking your vehicle, the officer testifies that the radar gun said 80mph; the officer testifies that radar gun was in good working order; and based on license surrendered to the officer at the scene, you were driving the car. Not a lot of room for reasonable doubt there.

      Using a computer to analyze facts and come to a conclusion of Probable Cause is perfectly fine. The only thing that can then be used in court is the facts from which it drew the conclusion. If you're mailed a ticket from a traffic camera, the facts are a) the light was red, and b) there's a picture of you running the light. The software correlates these facts and sends a citation based on Probable Cause.

      Probable Cause does not equate to guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. That's a decision for humans to make; and since none of us have computers for peers, that's how it will stay.

    3. Re:the problem by foniksonik · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Tom Cruise will be showing up at your door soon with a warrant for your arrest, stating that you were thinking about thinking about planning to kill some one who just cut you off on the freeway in some near future incident.

      You are guilty of course... I mean of thinking that is.

      --
      A fool throws a stone into a well and a thousand sages can not remove it.
    4. Re:the problem by bryan1945 · · Score: 5, Funny

      If Tom Cruise ever showed up at my door and accused me of "thinking", I'd remind him of Scientology and breaking up with Nicole Kidman, and then bitchslap him with a salmon and then an aardvark.

      --
      Vote monkeys into Congress. They are cheaper and more trustworthy.
  2. No, man! by Tackhead · · Score: 4, Funny
    > "Pardon, is this your file?"

    "No, man, I was just hostin' it for a friend, man!"

  3. Radio Ads by dead+sun · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Around the Milwaukee area there have been some radio ads about how ex-employees can "get back" at their former employers by reporting suspected piracy. It doesn't even have to be real, it can be just a mean spirited act of vengence to get the good old BSA fired up now. And they're advertising this.

    My question is what legal right do they have to storm in and do an audit? I wouldn't think that they'd just be allowed in, and I'm pretty sure they would have to go through legal channels to squeeze money out of people, unless they're dead scared. If a company is pirating and destroys all the evidence before the BSA gets them in court what sort of case do they have? I mean, "Yes your honor, we took a lead from an ex-employee hell bent on vengence, and we have no real evidence," doesn't sound like a case winner to me.

    Whatever, my boss would just give them the finger if they showed up here, then probably call the cops.

    --
    If not now, when?
  4. Since when does copyright imply a contract? by pongo000 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I'm a bit confused here...two different sources quoted in the /. article seem to indicate that copyright automatically implies licensing. Has there been some change in the copyright law in this regard? A copyright, under US Law, is automatic: The creator of the work is automatically granted the copyright. This post is copyrighted by me, and under the law I'm not required to note that anywhere (although doing so will make it easier for others to recognize the copyrighted nature of my work). According to BSA and MIT, the mere existence of this copyrighted work (my post) automatically implies a license between myself and anyone who chooses to view, cache, or copy this post. How have we allowed the notion of copyright to become so twisted?

    1. Re:Since when does copyright imply a contract? by Jordy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      More importantly, all software except for that which is released to the public domain is copyrighted, including things like the Linux kernel. Just because something is under copyright doesn't make it commercial.

      In a study of 1,026 Web users released Wednesday, the group found that 57 percent of respondents never or seldom pay for copyrighted works they download.

      This could very well mean that people are downloading shareware, free software or otherwise and simply decided not to pay for it.

      --
      The world is neither black nor white nor good nor evil, only many shades of CowboyNeal.
    2. Re:Since when does copyright imply a contract? by GeorgeH · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Reminds me of when I was in high school. This was 1997 and the school had to be online (just don't ask why the emperor is naked). So the school sprung for a new lab of 486s running Windows 3.11 and a box that had a 56k modem and a TCP/IP stack that did NAT - now the school could harness the power of thespot.com and the Trojan Room's coffee pot.

      Before you can let anyone actually use the computers, of course, you need them to sign an agreement saying that they won't do anything evil, like express negative opinions about the school online. Personally I never saw an end to the school's dictatorial powers that would necessitate signing away any rights, but I'm sure that there were some lawyer-parents who would if their perfect child got in trouble for downloading pr0n.

      So I was reading the agreement and anyone who signed it agreed not to download copyrighted material online. I pointed out to the vice-principal who was handling the signings that all material online was copyrighted, either explicitly or implicitly. She said that if I was downloading copyrighted material I was pirating software. I finally convinced her that it was only unlicensed software that was piracy (I'm still not a fan of that word) and she said I should just sign it because they weren't going to enforce it anyway. I didn't sign and didn't use the Internet at school that year, not a big loss as the only thing the computers were used for was seeing Yahoo.

      --
      Why can't I moderate something "Wrong" or at least "Grossly Misinformed"?
  5. BayTSP, Cyveillance by Dr.+Awktagon · · Score: 5, Informative

    Yeah, those guys have been trawling the web for a while, looking for lord knows what. I have a ModRewrite rule in my httpd.conf that feeds them a bunch of garbage whenever they come by (thanks, Sugarplum). I ought to feed them some Jennifer Lopez files next time, see what happens...actually I should just firewall them away.

    Cyveillance netblocks:
    65.118.41.192 - 65.118.41.223
    63.148.99.224 - 63.148.99.255

    Anybody know what blocks BayTSP uses for their spiders?

    1. Re:BayTSP, Cyveillance by follower-fillet · · Score: 5, Funny

      > What about giving them /dev/urandom for downloading?
      And get busted for eventually supplying every copyrighted digital work ever produced?

    2. Re:BayTSP, Cyveillance by kindbud · · Score: 5, Funny

      I got a funnier idea: go ahead and put up some copyrighted material. Configure the webserver to ONLY offer the material to the Cyveillance netblocks. When they send you the DMCA takedown notice, compose your response and deny that the material exists. Only Cyveillance will see it. Everyone else - including your ISP - will agree with you that the material does not seem to exist, despite Cyveillance's claims.

      Could be fun if repeated over and over!

      RIAA dude: Hey, Cyveillance guy, why are you billing us for all these takedown notices where the material never actually existed? I went to look at some of these sites myself and despite my fervent wish to nail somebody for something, nothing was there.

      Cyveillance guy: TILT

      --
      Edith Keeler Must Die
  6. Well, in Fairness by Stephen+VanDahm · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Confessions of a Reformed W4r3z D00d:

    In my MS Windows days every single piece of software I used was pirated. Windows 98, Office, Photoshop, the works. Now that I'm 100% Unix, I still get all my software for free, but legally now. I know that some of you never pirate software and MP3's, but you've got to admit that you know a whole slew of folks that do.

    I don't think anyone contests that piracy exists, but even the existence of rampant piracy doesn't prove that software companies lose money due to piracy. Would I have bought a copy of Photoshop had I not been able to get it for free? Hell no! Same with Office 97 -- I wouldn't have paid hundreds of dollars for something when Lotus SmartSuite came free with my computer and worked just fine. The connection between unauthorized use of w4r3z and lost income is really hard to establish.

    Steve

  7. Wanna Bet? by phyxeld · · Score: 5, Insightful

    How much do you want to bet that 45 percent gap is freeware and/or open source?

    How much do you want to bet that a study about software piracy conducted by the BSA is about as unbiased as a study about communism conducted by China?

    Doing anything with these numbers is silly, we all know it's just a bunch of bullshit.

    --
    __
    Choose mnemonic identifiers. If you can't remember what mnemonic means, you've got a problem. - Larry Wall
  8. Re:Article Says: by br0ck · · Score: 4, Insightful
    hundreds of thousands of jobs...
    So the BSA is claiming that 5-10% of the 3 million unemployed people in the US lost their jobs to piracy. Does anyone know what these numbers are based on? I guess all that success that the RIAA is having hasn't helped after all.
  9. The other 43% are lying by andrel · · Score: 4, Insightful
    57 percent of respondents never or seldom pay for copyrighted works they download.

    Almost everything on the web is copyrighted. When you click on a link your browser downloads it in order to display it to you. 100% of web surfers never or seldom pay for the copyrighted web pages they read.

    (There are a few specialty markets, e.g. academic journals, where copyrighted web content is available by subscription only. But most of the web is gratis to all.)

  10. Re:Article Says: by alan_d_post · · Score: 5, Interesting

    From the GNU site:

    Publishers often refer to prohibited copying as ``piracy.'' In this way, they imply that illegal copying is ethically equivalent to attacking ships on the high seas, kidnaping and murdering the people on them.

    If you don't believe that illegal copying is just like kidnaping and murder, you might prefer not to use the word ``piracy'' to describe it. Neutral terms such as ``prohibited copying'' or ``unauthorized copying'' are available for use instead. Some of us might even prefer to use a positive term such as ``sharing information with your neighbor.''

  11. Broken statistics by ivan256 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Practically everying I download is copyrighted, including the slashdot page I'm typing this into. Most of it is freely available. Copyright doesn't imply that payment is necissary. It's unfortunate that the people with the most money available to buy laws with have the narrowest view as to how the existing laws work.

  12. Fuck Yeah I'm a Pirate by Monkelectric · · Score: 4, Insightful
    my peg leg is bigger then yours, my parrot knows twice as many songs as yours (he learned them from mp3s), and *my* eye patch is jewel encrusted.

    Please don't use the world pirate as a noun or a verb to describe copying bits. Seriously -- when you use this bullshit terminology -- "they" have already won the first battle.

    In the last few years various entities have *really* learned to use the language against us, we drive "pre-owned cars", we "pirate" music, we get blown up by "suicide bombers" (although some news stations are now calling them "homicide bombers"). We don't goto war we have "operations" ... I could think of a million others

    When someone wants to call a thing something i'ts not -- they are trying to color your perception

    --

    Religion is a gateway psychosis. -- Dave Foley

  13. Slashdot is right... go figure by kaphka · · Score: 5, Informative
    the group found that 57 percent of respondents never or seldom pay for copyrighted works they download. And 12 percent admitted to pirating software.' How much do you want to bet that 45 percent gap is freeware and/or open source?
    I've been trying to fight the urge to post to Slashdot lately, but when I read that quote, I was all set to rant about it. Surely, by "copyrighted works" the researchers meant "unlicensed, commercial copyrighted works", and someone had stupidly or deceptively misinterpreted their point.

    So, I checked the ZDNet article. It said the same thing. "Ah," I thought, "typical ZDNet incompetence, twisting the words of the press release."

    Next, I checked the press release, and found the same claim yet again. Now I was starting to get worried, but at least the press release provided a link to the actual report (PDF). The report says,
    A significant percentage of Internet users knowingly
    violate copyright laws.
    57 percent of downloaders either seldom
    pay or never pay for the copyrighted software
    they download. And 36 percent of all Internet users say it is not likely they will ever pay for software they download.
    Of all Internet users, 12 percent admit to acquiring unlicensed commercial software.
    There you have it. In the (distressingly significant) opinion of the Business Software Alliance, any individual who downloads a copy of Linux, Netscape Navigator, the latest Windows Service Pack, or any other software provided without charge, is "knowingly violating copyright law." That's terrifying.

    (I apologize for taking so much time just to repeat what was said in the original submission, but accurate hyperbole is so rare on Slashdot that I thought it should be highlighted.)

    As an aside, I'm actually very surprised that 41% of those surveyed indicated that they pay for downloaded software "most times" or "every time." I've been on the net since Pipeline NY (those were the days...), and I have paid for downloaded software perhaps 3 or 4 times in my life. Even in today's "internet economy," it's awfully hard to find someone who will sell you software without including an oversized box and ten marketing flyers. I strongly suspect that this survey was poorly designed, and that the results are garbage; however, that only makes the BSA's interpretation of it more disturbing.
    --

    MSK

  14. Organized IP Sharing: the American Way by rjamestaylor · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I spent the whole day downloading and consumming copyrighted material and didn't feel the least bit guilty. As a matter of fact the facility I used to do this non-buying consumption provided the tools and an organized database for me to pratice my skill at intellectual property consumption. The facility is not afraid of the police, infact it is located next door to the police station and the municipal court system--and they use this facility, too.

    Yes, I'm referring to using the library to consume written (and audio-visual) works for free, without paying a dime. Maybe you've heard of this, the library? It was brought to our culture by Benjamin Franklin, publisher and promoter of the patenting concept which gave rise to the notion of intellectual property.

    Infact, there is nothing discongruous between a patent or copyright and a library where such works are consumed freely by many people. Sharing a work wasn't the crime--misattributing someone else's work as one's own was the offense. But I digress.

    Where is the concept of the library of software? If my local library began offering donated titles on a check-out basis, would not Microsoft, through its front called the BSA, demand it to cease and desist?

    Today I spent the day at a library and at a Barnes and Nobles reading technical books on a subject I am not familar with, trying to (1) become familar with the subject matter and (2) to find good references that I would then purchase for my own collections.

    If the BSA went after published works as well as software, I would have had to purchase 30 books on Java, XML, RMI, XML-RPC, RSS, EJB, etc., to accomplish what I did today. It wouldn't have happened.

    Actually, I do the same with software. I'll borrow a friend's copy or use LimeWare, et al, to find a working copy of a program I want to evaluate (unless they have a true trial version to use; Office X preview was not a true trial version--it didn't work just like the real thing). Once I try it I'll make a decision: buy it or delete it. I don't continue to use it unless I buy it, because I want the updates and other goodies--and if I like it I don't mind paying for it. Just like my book scouring at the library/bookstore.

    I propose that we establish software libraries--donated purchased software licenses that can be checked out (for evaluation purposes and short-term use). I propose that these be mandated by law to accompany the ever stricter copyright/patent laws so that the "intellectual" benefit to society of Intellectual Property not be lost ensuring the "property" benefit to private concerns.

    Free software, on the other hand, falls into the library/copyright paradigm perfectly. Freshmeat, SourceForge, Savanaugh (sp? sheesh), are today's libraries for software. And it is Microsoft, not the FSF, that was fined for piracy--passing off the work of another as one's own. BSA and Microsoft: against casual sharing (like a library) and not respecting the copyright law. How un-American!

    --
    -- @rjamestaylor on Ello