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P2P Streaming Radio
sonicsft writes "RIAA, CARP, and streaming internet radio, oh my. Well these guys may have found a solution. With the tag line, pirate radio for the digital age, they've released a peer to peer streaming radio solution and claim that it is untracable/closable by the RIAA."
The developer should be careful
... like the PVR which had unsed tracking software built in that the courts demanded was turned on.
"There's no listener count yet. To be added soon, along with stats to give some idea about the 'shape' of the data tree. "
It should be kept 100% anonymous, if there's a hint that the data is available then "they" will go after it
Just like any sort of encryption scheme or digital rights system, there's always a vulnerability, the human factor.
Somehow, someone will figure out some sort of system or program to trace the stream to it's origin. They'd like to think it's secure/untraceable, but someone will find a way around it.
The fact that this guy's website if expressly saying he's doing this to bypass carp is going to screw him in the long run. If he got taken to court and his most obvious defense would be to say that this was created to help independent artists broadcast their music. Then the judge will look at the pages from his website and that defense will be dead right away.
If you're going to try to take on the system, try to do it in an intelligent manner.
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It shouldn't take too long before people implement their own on other p2p platforms, such as PeerMetrics or JXTA. Relying on shoutcast is definitely a weak element in the solution. Sharing of connected peers shouldn't be transparent, too, as it leads to discovery of the stream source (the unreferenced node).
<rant>Speaking of which, do people know of other good p2p platforms out there for implementing stuff like this? This idea and other good ones would have come sooner if only there were more good, generic p2p vectors. As is, everyone home-rolls their p2p apps, still, thus requiring different channels of distribution, different standards, yada yada. We need a platform that's like apache with mods.</rant>
I've gone from being completely indifferent about internet radio to being a huge fan of it in the span of about a year. I have not listened to broadcast music in a couple years now. Just about everything I listened to for a long time came out of my friends and I's CD pools. We'd make compilation albums for each other or just snag songs we particularly enjoyed from albums in each others collections. Broadcast radio has always been shit but recently it has been so bad I simply can't stand to listen to it. I began to go to dozens of concerts from LA to San Diego. Last year I think I tallied 35 concerts in about 9 months. Was I going to see bigass arena shows being hyped by radio stations? Only in a very small handful of cases like the Yahoo Outloud Weezer tour, when I went to the LA and SD shows. Most shows I was going to were indie rock shows and small local shows. Anyhow, I was going to these shows SPECIFICALLY because the bands weren't being played on the radio. People I find incredibly talented like Ozma and The Get Up Kids will be lucky to ever have a single played on a station like KROQ. Going to all the shows I did and picking up albums from bands I liked, I not only put money in their pockets but got introduced to more bands than I can easily recall. These are some badass bands in my opinion but they're not going to be found on the radio.
Then I started getting into more electronic stuff but was never really one for the electronic scene. I can't stand seeing a bunch of cornbread white guys revving their rice burners in parking lots. It isn't racism or anything, it just looks stupid seeing some pimply faced kid with his Fred Durst hat with a "Powered by VTEC" sticker on his read window. The drugged out raver wannabes aren't exactly up on my list of social affiliations either. Rather than tell them they shouldn't be who they want to be I just avoid the scene entirely. So that leaves me with nowhere to get music other than Napster or something. It is nice to see if I want to spend money on an album but most songs are recorded poorly at too low of a bit rate for my taste. Then I fire up iTunes on my Powerbook and browse to the electronic stations. Holy shit! Music that doesn't sound like ass when I plug it into my sound system and doesn't have an inane DJ being wiggity whack on the air. Fuck yes. Not only do I get a good stream of music but I also have a display of what song I'm listening to in case I find myself interested in the artist. Then there is the choice available, if one station starts in with something I don't like I can double click another one with a different stream. Internet radio has become the radio I've been wanting for years. In an hour block I get to hear about an hour's worth of music, not 10 minutes of decent music, 30 minutes of slop I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy and 20 minutes of inane advertisements for shit I don't buy and DJs I'd rather have shot into the Sun.
Now it is facing some stiff opposition in the form the RIAA and their demonic minions. I don't want to see internet radio go down because it is the only inexpensive way I've got left to get introduced to some good music. Sharing with my friends is nice but there isn't enough variety to really find off the wall shit I end up really digging. P2P radio seems like an obvious solution because of the P2P buzzword culture surging as of late. The model however runs into serious problems. The RIAA doesn't have to go after a single individual or group of individuals to take out P2P radio like they were able to with various sharing programs. All they have to do is make some deals with cable and DSL providers. Lets say there was a popular P2P radio in my town, all it would take is a deal or lawsuit against Charter and he would be toasted. We'd all end up with our bandwidth curtailed more than it already is and P2P radio would end up specifically forbidden in the AUP.
Switch to DSL you say? I fucking wish. PacBell couldn't find their dicks if they weren't at the end of their arms. Evne if DSL was viable for some people P2P regulating would still happen on the DSL system. Even with a competitive DSL provider like Covad or someone, they're still renting a pipe from PacBell and the bandwidth usage will make them be regulatory asses too.
P2P pirate radio is a noble idea I suppose, sticking it to the jackasses that are the RIAA but it is a short term solution to a long term problem. The RIAA has far too many lawyers on their side and enough backing to cow the major cable and DSL providers into line. An idea would be to get together with a bunch of schools around the country. Many schools have broadcast radio stations that don't have to stand up to RIAA scrutiny or lawsuits. They could house and host internet radio stations with the same function as broadcast stations, providing students with hands on experience either behind a mic or in an equipment room, but have much better standing in any internet radio lawsuits. Anything with P2P in the name is going to get turbofucked rather quickly by the RIAA no matter if they can track people down or not. It's sad but true. So who wants to build an island 13 miles off the Montery penninsula with an OC-192 hooked up to it? We could be Sealand Redux.
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
It also spreads the pain to the point where if the RIAA wants to sue then it is taking on its customers directly. It takes us another step towards the RIAA pissing off too many people, just enough so that the backlash starts in a big way. Connect a system like this with a donation network, a PAC, a legal defense fund, and more forms of action/advocacy... you might start to see congress understanding common sense just a bit more (or at least pretending to under threat of losing campaign dollars and votes).
Not transmitters. Cache/proxy according to the DMCA.
No, it really does avoid that fee. The RIAA would probably be getting a stream from another user who is only streaming it to a few people. And since the rebroadcaster is only relaying data and not keeping track of their connection they can't say how many people are on at any given time. For all they know they are only broadcasting to the RIAA's computer and therefore should not have to pay (why should they have to pay the RIAA for broadcasting their data back to them?)
"Well kids, you tried your best, and you failed. The lesson is, never try." -Homer Simpson
The fact that the game the guy is selling on his website requires a check to be sent to him in the UK means that RIAA cant shut him down. He is British. He is not affected by your silly US laws (if he sensibly hosts it on a machine in the UK). Simple.
Steve
Pirate radio stations tend to be low power, and serve their _local_ neighborhood. They can't be heard across the country, and thus they tend to avoid notice, so long as they don't interfere with other stations, and don't massively offend the listeners who discover them.
;-)
Since 802.11a and 802.11b traffic lives in parts of the spectrum where independent unlicensed transmissions are expected and are the norm, it might be possible to fly under the RIAA's radar with the following configuration:
- Set up a server with a 10.0.0.0/8 addressing space.
- DON'T hook it to the internet.
- Include a DHCP Server.
- Include a web page to describe what people have reached and allow links to software to listen.
- Include a submissions directory so anyone who wants to drop an MP3 or OGG on you, CAN.
- Play interesting music that YOU like, and even DJ the broadcast. (Voice changer might be desireable.)
Basically, all I'm doing is taking ideas presented in the movie "Pump Up the Volume" and thinking about how those ideas could be implemented using more modern methods. Done correctly, this could even be done with a mobile configuration in a vehicle.
'Cast Hard!
Please describe the operation of such a tool. Given encrypted communication between nodes, how do you determine from the outside whether any given node is a relay or source?
No more so than telephone companies have the "right" to eavesdrop on your conversations, or the post office to read your mail. Copying is not theft."Fundamentally sound" societies are those that recongize a diversity of values. "Fundamentally sound" societies recognize that sharing information is what makes us human. "Fundamentally sound" societies are not operated for the benefit of media conglomerates.
Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
You cannot wash away blood with blood
I haven't seen a post on it so far, but I may have just missed it on a day that I wasn't checking /.
u rthurnet.com/
Anyway...
- a p2p live music sharing system that's just blown my mind.
- open source
- much more searchable than other such software
- transfers only high-quality 44.1/16 (shn-compressed) audio
- the traded artists want you to take part in it (all traded artists encourage taping/trading)
This is a wonderful piece of software, built by the people, benefits bands, and doesn't have jack to do with record companies.
I definitely suggest giving it a spin, you're likely to discover a band you'll love:
http://sourceforge.net/furthurnet
http://www.f
-Jackson
"A matter of internal security, the age old cry of the oppressor" - Jean Luc Picard