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Integrated 3D Graphics Motherboard Round-Up

Posted by CmdrTaco on from the i-want-my-3d-pc dept.

Keefe writes "In the recent past, integrated video was seldom a viable solution for hardcore computer gamers. Enthusiasts shunned from motherboards with integrated video, and opted to buy ones without it, in additional to a much faster ATi or Nvidia-powered graphics accelerator. Today, the picture is beginning to change. The last few integrated motherboards sported decent graphics chipsets, like the Nvidia NForce (GeForce2 MX), ATI IGP320 (Radeon VE), or Intel 845G. Techware Labs has taken a look at the current integrated 3D video chipsets on the market and concluded how they perform in the latest 3D software."

17 of 188 comments (clear)

  1. Uhh... by Spazntwich · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The submitter makes it sound like these integrated video platforms are good enough for gamers. WTF? At no point in history, including now, have integrated video accelerators offered acceptable performance for current games. Sure, these things might run Quake 3, but they better, seeing as it's so many years old.

    True gamers are never going to use integrated video, when even the cheapest of new videocards spank them in all terms of performance, and most joe blows don't need anything approaching good 3d performance in their integrated video, because their activities consist of emailing and web surfing.

    These motherboards are trying to fill a niche that doesn't exist. Power users will ignore the integrated video, and normal users (if they have any say in what goes into their box) will get cheaper integrated video solutions that don't cost as much as 'supAr fast 3d shared memory game integrated 3d card things'.

    1. Re:Uhh... by Ciannait · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I take it you haven't really looked at the specs for this integrated chipset.

      While it's convenient to think that there are two and only two groups of users - the ubergamers, and the drooling morons - this isn't the case. If it were, there would be two, and only two, cards on the market. The "eke out 3 more fps in Q3A" card, and the "maybe it'll play The Sims" card.

      These integrated chipsets have a lot of nice features, including digital 5.1 sound. It's essentially like having a GeForce4 MX (a card I have in my machine at home) with a good quality sound-card - only, two fewer cards to buy.

      Not everyone likes having a mess of cards in their PC. Not everyone needs bleeding edge. Lots of people are perfectly happy not having the latest-greatest.

      That's who this integrated chipset is for.

      --
      A good traveller has no fixed plans and is not intent on arriving.
    2. Re:Uhh... by epukinsk · · Score: 5, Funny

      These motherboards are trying to fill a niche that doesn't exist.

      You mean the OEMs-looking-for-cheap-marketable-components market?

      Yeah, that market never existed, never will. What are these guys thinking?

      Erik

    3. Re:Uhh... by GigsVT · · Score: 3, Informative

      but anyone with a clue will not buy a MX chipset or a stripped down ATI product.

      There we go again with the elitist crap. Have you ever considered that it's possible to have a clue, and at the same time, choose not to get the highest end video card? Not everyone thinks games are the most important part of "computing".

      --
      I've had enough abrasive sigs. Kittens are cute and fuzzy.
    4. Re:Uhh... by vipw · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The Geforce2 mx and Geforce4 mx are nearly identical. There was a bit of concern at the time of the Geforce4 mx release as to why it was given the number 4. There was never a geforce3 mx, and the geforce 3 performed far stronger than the Geforce4 mx. A geforce 4mx card does have a pretty good edge though, the memory controller is way faster than the nforce's, since the nforce uses shared memory. It also runs at a higher core clock frequency. It's not exactly orders of magnitude better though.

      The bulk of card sales is in the low end market which integrated video can compete with nicely. Integrated video platforms make quite a bit of economic sense if they come with an AGP slot for a future upgrade. The nforce especially looks promising, all your drivers can be from 1 source, and from a company that has an excellent track record with drivers (except on linux/bsd, where the record isn't near as impressive). But if I were to build my parents a computer, it would be nforce/nforce2 based: Decent video, excellent sound and networking, only 2 driver packages, moderate price, and excellent upgrade path.

      Integrated video speed not as bad a situation as a lot of people imagine it to be; integration keeps getting better also.

    5. Re:Uhh... by Hoser+McMoose · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I know that people tend to really hate it when I post facts instead of blathering out mindless opinions.. however I'm going to go with the facts anyway.

      Here's a link to some real and true benchmarks of the nForce 220 and 420 with their integrated graphics as compared to a GeForce2MX in Unreal Tournament and Max Payne.

      For UT, the nForce 420 is 9.5% slower than the GeForce2 MX (at 1024x768), and for Max Payne the nForce is just under 15% slower. That's a far cry from "1/3rd the frame rate".

      Ohh, and the original nForce was available without integrated graphics as well (the nForce 415 chipset).

      Long story short, the nForce can and does play games just fine. It's not getting 200+ f/s at 1600x1200, but as long as you can get by with only 30-60f/s at 800x600, the nForce is up to the task. The nForce 2 should be about twice as fast since it has somewhat higher memory bandwidth and some new stuff which reduces it's dependance on memory bandwidth.

  2. Good enough for gamers? by DjMd · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Regardless of the level of chip you put into an integrated motherboard no serious gamer will buy this...

    If for no other reason than upgrade-ability. What's they point of intergrating the latest chip when a year from now (in the gamers mindset, and the games development) that chip will be out-dated...

    and from a manufacturing standpoint you will be left with motherboards that are too expensive for the low-mid end user and useless to the high end gamer...

    All arround pointless....

    --
    DJMD - The fourth man - Planetary
    1. Re:Good enough for gamers? by nilstar · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It does make sense from this perspective - integrate a cheap graphics core now. If the consumer wants to upgrade, most of these core have an AGP slot (if the mobo maker has one that is). Cheap now, Cheap later (when an decent AGP card usable for then-in-styles games is cheap).

      It is also cheap in the future - when these mobos become outdated the law of supply & demand (and discounting) - will make this cheaper than the then-current motherboard - with the added caveot that you can build a really cheap system (ie, no vid card) - or you can buy an AGP card.... as some solutions like Nforce 2 have superiour memory controller solutions - even compared to intel/via's next generation (dual channel ddr for example).

      --
      ===> An eye for an eye makes everyone blind - MG
    2. Re:Good enough for gamers? by i.r.id10t · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I don't think it is hard-core gamers that they are aiming at with these. However, for business use, or general family/AOL use, with the possibility of some games either after hours or when cousin Jimmy comes up for the holidays and brings his laptop.

      Integrated video is not always bad, and is in some cases quite good. What makes it bad is using shared system memory, and not being able to be disabled. What makes it really good is when it can be over riden in the bios to use a add-in PCI card. For example, my Dell Optiplex at work a few years ago (p2-350,128mb ram, 8mb ATI video) was quite a "average" machine for gaming - it ran Quake2 in GL mode and could maintain a decent 35fps average. Just fine for those "lunch time LAN parties" and after work frag sessions, but not what I'd plan on using to build that monster box that makes everyone at the LAN party ph34r your hardware advantage (remember the days of dual Voodoo2 cards?)

      --
      Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
  3. postgresopengl by j1mmy · · Score: 5, Funny

    The motherboard in our DB machine at work has an ATI Rage chip integrated. Especially useful for rendering our logs in 3D. It doesn't support vertex shaders, though, so the lighting on the timestamps is kind of shoddy.

  4. Video for the Masses by BaldingByMicrosoft · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Don't be elitist. There are plenty of gamers out there that can't bloody afford the latest and greatest, much less upgrade every two years (6 months?). Some folks are actually interested in knowing what the best integrated video is, even if it doesn't compare to your Robocop 6000 SUX.

    If only they had a sample of the NVIDIA nForce2 to compare. Then again, maybe they did -- anyone seen a mirror? I loaded their page once, it linked a supposed mirror, but it was for a 40x CDRW review...

  5. Re:Video on motherboard == Stupid. by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Then WTF would you want an integrated graphics chip?"

    If you're a bussiness. Seriously, most of the computers at work, even the ones we got receantly, have something like a Matrox G400 or a GeForce 2 MX or soemthing like that. There is just no need for a fast 3d card because it is for work, not for games. Now some of the systems come with built-in video cards and this is rather nice. Saves money and it's all interrgated. Does just fine for office apps.

    Not everyone needs the latest greatest accelerator. Yes, I have a GeForce 4 in my home computer, I play games here. At work I'd be fine with an integrated graphics card.

  6. Integrated GFX with DVI? by stew77 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Does anyone know of motherboards that have an DVI output for their integrated graphics? As a fan of low-noise low-cost computers I am interested in motherboards with integrated graphics, but I need a DVI connector.

  7. the latest and greatest is largely unnecessary by Perianwyr+Stormcrow · · Score: 4, Interesting

    You can play Everquest, Ultima Online (3D client,) America's Army, Warcraft 3, all Sims versions, and every half-life mod known to man with a GeForce2 MX and an Athlon 1 ghz quite nicely. It may not be as pretty as your more powerful cards, but your gaming experience with older gear is still quite good. You're not really missing out on the most popular gaming venues with an old system.

    Also, it's often not a matter of not being able to afford the card, but a matter of interest. If the low-end integrated video can play the more popular titles, it's possible that the player might develop an interest in gaming that he didn't have when he bought the machine (reason no. 1 to ALWAYS make sure you have proper expansion slots!)

    --

    What we call folk wisdom is often no more than a kind of expedient stupidity.-Edward Abbey

  8. Re:Video on motherboard == Stupid. by stew77 · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Then WTF would you want an integrated graphics chip?

    You save
    • money
    • space
    • cooling
    • installation trouble

    And if you use your computer not for 3D work or gaming, there probably won't be a reason to upgrade for the next 3 years. Doing my daily work, I can't tell a difference between a TNT and a GeForce4.
  9. Re:Video on motherboard == Stupid. by Skuld-Chan · · Score: 3

    Then again I haven't upgraded from my Geforce 2. Am I a uber leet gamer? Maybe - I play a lot of online video games, to be honest there's only one game that I could use a faster video card on - operation flashpoint.

    Even the latest greatest UT game seems to work just fine - at frame rates consistantly above 60 fps.

    I heard the same arguments when motherboards started coming with intergrated ide, serial/paralel. I was working at a small computer shop then and people were telling me they didn't want intergrated serial/io because they couldn't upgrade and what would they do if it went bad?

    Fact is most OEM's are going to be switching to these new boards - simply because there's less that can go wrong (and trust me on this - when it comes to tech support this is a major major plus) - and as a plus its a reasonably fast video card as well.

  10. Re:Its actually a pretty good deal by Junks+Jerzey · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I can speak from personal experience on this one here. This mobo isn't for your hardcore gamer, its for your average computer user who still wants to play video games at a reasonable price.

    You're right. The hardcore gamer these days doesn't mess with PC video cards, but owns a PS2, Xbox, and/or Game Cube. If you don't, then you're missing out on lots and lots of really great games. Compare the number of incredible console games released in the last two years with the number of PC games that actually make good use out of high-end video card features like vertex and pixel shaders. It's almost as if the PC 3D card market exists entirely to support first person shooters.

    Before modding me down, realize I'm a game developer. I love the hardware in cards like the GeForce 4. But I see those cards are being great for development platforms, not for commercial software. Heck, half of the machines that Dell sells ship with the Intel integrated 3D chipset, and we're talking 2+ GHz machines. The 3D game market on the PC, to a great, great extent, has become an marginally profitable niche.