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Senate Approves Censored .kids.us Domain
lostchicken writes "The Senate has approved the first viable "kid-friendly" system that doesn't try to control the Internet. See the story here. It is an opt-in system that allows a .kids.us domain to be pointed at a site approved as safe, as opposed to an adult only domain type system."
well if im a kid and im encouraged to go to .kids sites, kid stuff like pokemon probably won't be .kids cuz theres violence!
Web sites bearing an address like "www.example.kids.us" would have to certify that they do not contain sexually explicit material, hate speech, violence or other material not suitable for minors.
Who determines what material isn't suitable?
Do they get paid? By the taxpayers I assume?
Do they really have any power to tell ICANN to revoke a domain name?
they add the .mil to it?
I like choice. Choice gives you options.
This is a good idea, and maybe might be extended to the other TLDs: kids.com, kids.net, etc. Obviously, it would require some kind of monitoring and management, but it certainly appears to be a better way of "protecting" children then spurious free speech attacks on the 'net as an entity.
In fact, I believe extending this to the commercial TLDs would be a big marketing tool. Point out to parents that "our site is kid safe, we're part of the kids.whatever domain."
Build a better mousetrap...
Joe Dougherty, Florida, USA
The words I thought I brought, I left behind. So, never mind.
You know this'll be like those damned child-proof caps on medicine bottles. In your average (read: non-geek) household, who do you think will be the first to figure out how to setup the browser? Certainly not Mom and Dad!
...how long until a law passes restricting libraries to the kids.us domain?
While I look at most things that the government does as some veiled attempt of hiding the true motive I actually kinda agree with this.
Kids are running rampant on the internet and can come across some truly disturbing shite. I myself was on this technical-nerd-/. site one day and clicked on a link and was presented with largest bloody rectum I have ever seen. Wait the only large bloody rectum I have ever seen. And it is more ubitiqous than the Bonzai buddy pop up.
Anyway, I dont have kids, soon, and I plan on treating them like adults. But not turning them into little Ron Jeremys.(That is my job for the time being).
So a restricted domain where it is all about kidstuff is cool with me. Might even fun for our jades asses to look at. Of course when I strip off the emerald spectacles it is gonna be a marketing haven for toy companies, candy companies, and anything that sells kiddy products, a market with a demographic that is always renewing itself.
So lets see how it works. Could be a good thing. And we can always have a good guffaw when the script kiddies hijack a couple of sites and plaster them with the goat.cx guy, nude shots of ana nicole, and John Holmes memorials.
The Flatline
The Revolution Will Not Be Televised
The story title is off, it isn't "censored", it's "moderated", there's a difference.
Content isn't altered, content is accepted or rejected.
You're right, but remember who is the main beneficiary of this new domain.
.kids.us (like Slashdot).
If it were being created to help kids then this "opt-in" system would be deemed too drastic a measure that cuts kids off from too much information outside
On the other hand, since this law is being written for voting parents who just want peace of mind, it can get away with this level of generality.
It's sad, but not unreasonable in a democracy where children can't vote.
Sigmentation fault - core dumped
The problem is that there is lots of content that some people (christian right) would find "objectionable" for children, and a lot of it isn't pr0n. The classic example is that of renaissance nude paintings, which always get picked up by the "naked people finder" filter programs and will probably be banned from .kids.us as "smut" even though they are obviously art. For that matter, do you want to force every site that mentions human reproductivity into a pr0n domain, just because some "anti-smut" campaigners don't want their children to know that babies aren't delivered by the stork?
(cf the ridiculous controversy about a "burka" being forced on that statue of justice)
NeuStar would be expected to police the subdomain to ensure it remains free of inappropriate content.
Policing a kids domain is definitely necessary. It doesn't fall to the side of censorship but rather common sense.
However this may create an opening for the government to define what is appropriate for children beyond the known vices. For example, what about people's religious beliefs. Could the government decide on one over the other, ban all as hate speech for the sake of not having to deal with it, etc.?
If the kids.us domain is too restrictive, parents are going to let their kids look elsewhere for information, which may doom the kids.us domain. Of course kids.us is not supposed to be a success story (so "doomed" may be incorrect); instead it's supposed to protect children. For the kids it does protect I know we are all thankful.
Might the system not work better if there existed different levels of these subdomains like "kids.highprotection.us", "kids.mediumprotection.us", and "kids.lowprotection.us" (no comments about the names please -- they are just examples), then the medium level might include religious beliefs, and the low level might include regular news sites, etc. This way parents could decide on a level that that deemed most appropriate for their kid/s (maybe based on age, etc). This would also provide a good way to wean the kid onto the "real" Interent as they get older. Sooner or later the kid is going to be at a friend's house (whose parents have less restrictions) and will experience the real Interent anyways. Just like when I was a kid I first got to play video games (Atari) at a friend's house because my family didn't own a game system (my parents probably thought it was a bad idea at my young age because I shouldn't have spent a lot of time in front of the TV).
I wonder how many times does it happen that 14 years old kids are the only ones able to configure a computer in their own family.
<SARCASM>Fortunately, these times are about to finish. With Trustworthy Computing and DRM all these free speech morons will finally shut up and we will live happily together placing our kids in front of the monitor and letting other people decide what's good for them.</SARCASM>
Seriously, I don't think such technology is bad, but the first prevention measure should be education of kids, which requires education of adults (I understand that not everyone is supposed to be a geek, but it's parents' responsibility to know what their kids are doing).
Signatures are for stupids.
I fail to see how this is better than any filtering software. If kids can only access .kids.us sites, then they are confined to a list of sites that have been pre-approved by some censor who thinks that only they know what is good for America's children. If, on the other hand, if children surf through filtering software, then they are confined to a list of ... (i.e. the same exact situation.
Several things need to happen here:
While we would all like for the world to be a place where everyone is happy, and protected, that is simply not the case. You have to look out for your own -- you can't rely on some (government, company, whatever) to raise your children for you.
There are no tiger attacks in my area and it's all because this rock I'm holding keeps the tigers away.
Part of growing up is being exposed to things you shouldn't be. I would assume most slashdotters here grew up in a time, when the interenet was first start to spread its wings. There was no safeguards or protection. My parents couldn't even grasp the concept of a modem, when I was already downloading porn. Seriously, our soft culture has gone to far. Next thing you know, you will be able to vote and die in war 3yrs before you can drink. Oh wait, that is already in existance. Toughen up America.
My brother has VNC going on the home network just to keep an eye on his two kids, and one of them's gotten the family AOL account shut down for inappropriate behaviour in a chat room (don't ask).
Leave the computer out in the open, like the TV, and let the oversight be implicit. Your kids may watch something out of line when they're out or you are, but something tells me that neither you nor they are going to watch XXX when you're both in the same house.
Like it is at work. Your behavior might change if a URL log is kept, but it would really change if your back is to your boss who can always see your screen.
I agree. This is not a bad idea, but the best thing would be for parents to do their job and monitor their children. You (hopefully) wouldn't allow you 5 year old to watch anything he/she wants on TV, you shouldn't do the same on the Internet. But still, I think this is a good idea. The people who are crying censorship are missing the point. It is opt-in, and the rest of the internet is out there if you don't want to "censor" your children.
This sounds like a perfectly reasonable solution. Those parents that do not restrict what their kids see online (like mine) do not have to worry about having the government do it for them. Those parents that do want to restrict what their kids see online have to make sure that their restrictions only affect their kids, and not anyone else. In both cases, the control is with the parents where it belongs.
"Do I dare disturb the universe?"
WHAT ARE YOU QUOTING?
The text of the bill is here. It doesn't say anything like that. Neither of the restrictions you discuss are in the bill.
This seems to me a perfectly good way to make an internet playpen without eating internet freedom. Please don't scaremonger.
I can the potential for abuse now:
"Hey let's get Ralphie in trouble!"
"Sure! How?"
"When he's in the bathroom, just try to go to [pornsite] on his computer."
"Kewl!"
Since it is an opt-in system, I'm comfortable with it. No serious site will place itself in the .kids.us domain. Those serious websites that do will no doubt also maintain a regular version.
Since the MPAA is an opt-in system, I'm comfortable with it. No serious movie will place itself in the PG-13 ratings domain. Those serious movies that do will no doubt also release a regular version.
Yeah, that's what happens, sure it does.
Hey webmasters! In the future, you only get one 'fuck.' Better use it wisely.
The point is that the US government has some loose control over the .us domain that they don't have over ICANN which controls the other domains. I would imagine that use of the domain would not be limited to US internet users....
Ben
It's a serious problem. I couldn't allow in good conscience a pre-adolescent kid to roam free on the internet. There's just too much junk. While I'm not in the US, .kids.* (or even .kids TLD) could set a good precedent, and really get children out of the crapola.
Combined with a ".kids" browser with severe linking limitation (browser only allows links to other .kids sites) and legal repurcussions for companies violating the .kids standard (Corruption of Minors?) I'd be more than happy to make changes to the way my computer worked to facilitate this.
In a way it would create a sub-web of the internet, kids domains only interlinking with kids domains, and this would be a great thing. Many existing domains exist to populate this with numerous sites targetted for kids.
In fact, if it was made a TLD, this could easily be expanded into pretty much all IP software to make 'em kid friendly. And kid friendly would have to come first over functionality; no putting in IP addresses directly to go to a site. It is a severe limitation but with a good watchdog, and approval process for .kids domains, I'd rest a lot easier about having a kid on the net.
---
When I grow up, I want to be a kid again.
Actually this is just fine.
Even if "hate speech" is too broad, I would like a domain like this that is very restricted and controlled.
When your kids grow up and you think they're mature enough, just turn off the kids domain stuff, and let them surf away. This is the best solution, no restrictions on the "regular" internet, and a very restricted optional space for kids.
I see no problem with this.
- sigs are for wimps.
This is really pretty condescending. Most of us who have children understand this. The real issue is that there is quite a bit on the net that children may encounter that they just aren't ready for. Only a few folks have real fears of actual physical harm befalling a child as a result of surfing the web. Most of us would just like our children to have an actual childhood, however brief.
People need to realize that most censorship does more harm than good. Every attempt to provide a list of "good" and "bad" sites has failed, and will always fail, because "good" and "bad" are purely subjective.
Censorship is a bad thing only when foisted on adults. I think, however, that you are going to have a pretty hard time making the case that keeping a 7 year-old from accidentally encountering www.fursuitsex.com is a bad thing.
People need to stop raising such gullible children, The world contains bad things, and everyone has to learn how to deal with them. If a child is brought up, and hasn't ever seen "bad" in his/her life, then (s)he will be ill-prepared to function in our world.
If you have ever raised children, you would understand that sheltering a child from all "bad things" is impossible. Few parents are attempting to do this. While I'm all for porn and violence, let's not pretend that it somehow builds character and prepares you for life -- it doesn't.
While we would all like for the world to be a place where everyone is happy, and protected, that is simply not the case. You have to look out for your own -- you can't rely on some (government, company, whatever) to raise your children for you.
Nobody is relying on the government to raise their children. All this bill does is attempt to create a limited, safe space. It does so without foisting draconian censorship on the rest of us and reducing the Internet to the lowest "kid-friendly" denominator.
More importantly, the creation of such a safe space strengthens the hands (politically) of those who oppose broader censorship laws, such as COPA and its ilk, since it essentially takes away the "but we must protect the children " argument. This is a good thing.
Roving Web-Teleoperated Robot
This idea is simple to implement for parents and easy to understand for everyone involved (but a pain for NeuStar).
The various objections raised here seem silly, and not very well thought out.
Kids need to learn to avoid this stuff on their own. It's censorship! Damn right it is censorship, and you're an irresponsible parent if you don't practice it. Kids get enough chances at avoiding (or seeking out) this stuff at school and around their peers. They don't need things handed to them on a silver platter. Parents need to be ever-vigilant, but they need a break too.
Someone else is going to decide what's okay, and what's not! Their morals might not be your own! I'm willing to let someone else make the decisions, and check in occasionally to make sure they make sense. There may be material that's a little too mature (ever see some of the teenage girls on Nickleodeon?) or a out of whack politically (PBS kids programming chaps my ass some days with this), but I'm willing to trade a little boundary-pushing for a much safer experience.
Parents will never figure out how to set this up! FUD & bullshit. They won't need to. If the US adopts this how long will it take for AOL 9.0 to come out with a button that locks down the system? Or Internet Explorer 7.0? Plugins galore that do the same thing? Not long and every software resaler will fall all over themselves to help parents remove this objection to letting the kids use the Net. Remember, *kids* drive a HUGE portion of the US economy.
It's a US-only thing! Yup. Too bad. (For you or for us, depending on your viewpoint.)
Why not just have a .XXX or .SEX domain? Two problems, first is that not every bad thing for children is porn -- I don't want my kid spending time at the Illinois Nazi website either. Second is that the genie's out of the bottle already. It's going to be impossible to legislatively corral it back in. Better to set up a sandbox where the genie's not allowed to go and defend that spot rigorously.
Get off my lawn.
It looks like Congress is once more failing to understand what the internet is, or rather what it isn't. The world wide web is not the Internet - the net is a much larger system encompassing many more services.
A domain name references a set of records that in turn may reference computers that in turn offer an array of services, one of which may be a set of web pages.
Is congress intending to police all of those services on all of those computers that are referenced by all of those different types of records under each domain name in kids.us?
And what are they going to police? As others here have mentioned, there is no single standard for content for children.
What kind of kids are you talking about?
My pre-teen children don't watch the news, unless I happen to be watching it with them. They aren't really interested in Israel and the PLO, unless of course you let them watch it in the news.
When I see "kids.us" I think toddlers just learning to use a computer, I think of my 8-year-old daughter who is looking for some fun game to play. Sure she is getting to the point where she'll outgrow a kids specific location, but the is what the rest of the Internet is for, along with other mediums.
Life moves pretty fast; if you don't stop and look around once in a while, you could miss it. -FB
Opt in. I think it's a great idea: It's not like there's a severely limited number of TLDs that can be created. So, if the censors of the world want to restrict freedom, then give them a "playpen" in which they can do it. You want to start a colony with religiously restrictive laws? Fine. Go to the new world and knock yourself out. Just leave the rest of us alone. Unfortunately, the goal of censors is not usually limited to "like minded people". If it were, they would not need censorship in the first place. The real goal is to "Save people from themselves whether they like it or not." So, this is a pacifier. If it shuts up internet censors, great. It's not going to be effective at keeping anyone from seeing what they *want* to see. But it *could* be effective at preventing people from seeing what they *don't* want to see.
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." - Philip K. Dick
Not unless the commentary was structured to incite hatred of the Japanese or some other currently existing group.
Given the current situation, yes, both sides undoubtably would. In fact I think we can assume that tens of thousands of complaints would be engendered by any statement that portrayed either side as less than saintly. Content providers would probably be wise to avoid the issue - and honestly, I don't think any "reasonable person" wants his or her kids to learn about the Middle East situation from a "kid" site. Such sites would be quickly dominated by the better-funded Zionist movement in any case; no balance could really be achieved.
I doubt our "reasonable person" would consider it "hate speech" to "talk ill" of an admittedly terrorist group, unless one advocated hate towards them, or a group that resembles them. It's obviously hate speech when Billy Graham's demented larva pronounces that "Islam is Evil" and proposes "new crusades", and it's hate speech when the President says we should single out Arab communities for opression, but it's not hate speech to describe terrorism accurately
But again, we come back to the issue of appropriateness for children - any truthful discussion of Al Quaeda is going to be sufficiently disturbing that it is not appropriate for unsupervised children.
I suspect that you have no kids! Why not just give three-year-olds loaded submachine guns, they have to learn sometime what death is like, right? FUD phrases like "political correctness" and "multiculturalism" should probably be banned from kids.us, incidentally.
Yes, far better, once the kids are old enough to handle the concepts. I didn't explain to my African-American three-year-old what "kill all nigger-lovers" meant when she saw it spray-painted on the sidewalk behind the house. I explained it very carefully to my WASP six-year-old, and I certainly would NOT want him to have had it explained by a web content provider while I was out of the room for a moment.
Your concern is understandable, given the slanted education given most kids by government controlled institutions (Sex is bad! The Government never lies!) entertainment concerns (Sex has no consequences! Violence is fun!) and religions (God hates people of other faiths! Sex is evil!). But I think the idea of an opt-in system where parents and providers can choose to impose censorship over what a parent's children can see is a good one, and far better than any of the current alternatives.
My children wanted to surf the web at two years old. It would have been very nice to have something equivalent to the Disney channel, where I could safely leave the room for a second or two and leave the box turned on. They will have time for hatred and violence later, right now I want them to learn things like language skills, music and arts.
We've tried to teach our kids the difference between sites that are meant for kids, and sites that are not. They know that if there is ever a question, it is okay to ask. Most of the sites we all worry about are so obviously over the line that even my seven-year old KNOWS -- and isn't likely to trip over it from the children's sites we know they frequent. But if she DID happen to trip over goatse.cx, or bigtitties, or whatever,
we would have an opportunity to talk about it. I'm not looking forward that day, but it's preferable to hiding from it.
Both my kids know the rules about chat rooms -- we borrow from the second Harry Potter book: "Never trust anything that can think for itself if you can't see where it keeps its brain."
My eleven-year old knows that there's some stuff out there she might stumble across while doing research for a school project, or whatever,
and we've talked about it. Some of the things we talk about are " ewww, GROSS!" and we don't need to dwell on the details.
Any page that falls in a gray area, we talk about: why we don't think the opinions expressed at site xyz are suitable to quote in your science project, or why these pictures aren't appropriate for children -- or daddies.
My kids know I keep a log of the Internet sites they visit. I hardly ever check the log, but the fact that they know it exists means that they don't go wandering off into grownup land without a guide.
It's supposed to be completely automatic, but actually you have to press this button.