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Mathematics Unravels Optimum Way To Lace Shoes

Posted by timothy on from the is-with-velcro dept.

Seft writes "The knotty problem of choosing the optimum way of lacing up shoes has been solved by a new mathematical proof. There are many millions of different possibilities but, reassuringly, the proof shows that centuries of human trial and error has already selected out the strongest lacing patterns. However, the pattern using the least amount of lace possible, the decorative "bowtie" lacing, is usually only seen in shoe shop displays"

49 comments

  1. That's odd. by genrader · · Score: 0

    I use the 'bowtie' technique to tie my shoes...normally I must double tie it but my shoelaces are long enough...

    --
    the Political Inquirer
    1. Re:That's odd. by CableModemSniper · · Score: 2, Informative

      Not tie...LACE. If you look at the article you can see a diagram of what they mean.

      --
      Why not fork?
  2. Strength is Not Enough by 4of12 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I dunno about you, but I like comfort in my lacing system.

    If you have the highly zig-zaged pattern you can, with little force, end up applying an tourniquet to your foot.

    Less sharp angles will keep your foot more comfortable, not to mention giving you more lace with which to hang yourself - I mean, tie knots. Too many shoes come with short laces that can barely support a full bow.

    --
    "Provided by the management for your protection."
    1. Re:Strength is Not Enough by mph · · Score: 2
      Too many shoes come with short laces that can barely support a full bow.
      Hm, do you have large feet? My shoes seem to come with laces that are too long. I need to make sure the knot is very even, or I'll tend to step on whatever part is longer. I take a men's 8.5 or 9, and have suspected that they use the same length laces regardless of size.
    2. Re:Strength is Not Enough by 4of12 · · Score: 2

      My shoes seem to come with laces that are too long.

      Try tucking the long loops under the loose cross lacing near the front of your shoes.

      [I can't believe I've regressed to starting a Shoe Tying FAQ...]

      --
      "Provided by the management for your protection."
    3. Re:Strength is Not Enough by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm 6'1" and have a size 14 shoe in mens USA. My guess is that is above average for my height, but still not overly big.

  3. Re:Do what? by Lord+Bitman · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Read the article? Are you Mad!?
    I personally hate that shoes, boots, whatever, when bought, must consistently be re-laced before they can be effectively worn. I know that their lacing is usually loose in stores so that people can try them on faster, but I want an accurate feel for the shoe when I get in there!

    --
    -- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All
  4. Screw shortest.. by sporty · · Score: 4, Funny

    Screw shortest.. i want a way to use my laces that are too long for the shoes i have without buying new ones. Cutting them will only give me frayed eneds.

    -s

    --

    -
    ping -f 255.255.255.255 # if only

    1. Re:Screw shortest.. by PD · · Score: 1

      If the laces are an artificial fiber, a match can be used to melt the ends. If the laces are cotton, they won't melt, but you can use methylcyanoacrylate.

      --
      If tits were wings it'd be flying around.
    2. Re:Screw shortest.. by CableModemSniper · · Score: 1

      If they are nylon laces, if you are careful after you cut them apply a controlled flame to the ends after tying the "frays" together. Don't actually light it just melt the tips a bit. It'll make a diy cap kinda like the ones that used to be on there. Follow these instructions at your own risk, not responsible for ruined shoelaces, inhaled fumes, etc.

      --
      Why not fork?
    3. Re:Screw shortest.. by bbonnn · · Score: 1

      I've always double-, triple- and quadruple-knotted too-long shoelaces.

      Another thing you can do: tie a regular bow-knot. Leave the ends long. Then tie those long ends into another bow-knot.

      What's that you say? It looks silly? Yikes! What will the boys at my Mensa mixer think?? Better change back into the Armani.

    4. Re:Screw shortest.. by pcmills · · Score: 3, Funny

      Pre flame rule....

      1. Take off shoes!

      --
      Ask Slashdot - google for stupid people.
    5. Re:Screw shortest.. by n-baxley · · Score: 2

      Oh, I'm afraid not! *ba dump bump* ...
      Get it afraid not ~= a frayed knot. ...
      it's funny, come on.

      --

      THIS SPACE FOR RENT
    6. Re:Screw shortest.. by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      Rule 2:

      Don't try this on an airplane. ;)

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
    7. Re:Screw shortest.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Rule 3: Profit!!!

  5. Re:I wear shoes without laces. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    This post brought to you by the Run-DMC Memorial Society.

  6. What about single side lacing? by Soul-Burn666 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Where I live, in the army, you lace by first knotting one side of the lace to the first eyehole and then make an above connection to the eyehole on the other side (from outside), then you go up one eyehole, and then go again to the other side... eventually leaving you with only one side of the lace to tie somewhere... After it's done, you see only horizantal laces, all the vertical ones are below. That way it is easier to cut the laces if you get injured.

    Also, needing only to use one lace makes lacing up and down faster, tho you need to get used to the fact that for each level of eyehole you need to lace in the opposite direction.

    Something like this:

    *-o
    o-o
    o-o
    o-o
    o-o
    /

    Where * is the knotted side and / is the leftover, coming from under the eyehole.

    --
    ^_^
    1. Re:What about single side lacing? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      In Soviet army, boots lace YOU!!

    2. Re:What about single side lacing? by Dannon · · Score: 2
      Quotes from the article:
      The most widely used "criss-cross" and "straight" lacing patterns were identified as the strongest. But criss-cross came out on top for a short, wide set of eyeholes - that is, when the vertical distance between eyeholes is low, and horizontal distance is high. Straight lacing came out tops for a long, skinny set of eyeholes....

      Furthermore, most people, including Polster, opt for criss-cross lacing not because it is stronger, but because it is easy and you do not end up with uneven ends - a big risk with straight lacing. Straight lacing is sometimes used in the army because, if the foot is injured, you can cut the lace with one swipe.
      --
      Good judgment comes from experience.
      Experience comes from bad judgment.
    3. Re:What about single side lacing? by floydigus · · Score: 2, Informative

      This is typical army shithead technique.

      I used to be in the army cadets here in the UK and they used to make you do your boots like this - especially when you showed them there was a better way.

      The problem is that you ONLY have one end of the lace to tie off. This is clearly a PROBLEM because it is HARD .
      Now. How about a way of lacing shoes where you only have one crossing of the lace between each pair of holes, but you can still tie in a bow, like 99% of human shoe users do?

      Pay attention. Here comes the science bit...

      5a 5b
      4a 4b
      3a 3b
      2a 2b
      1a 1b

      Start with the lace threaded halfway through 1a and 1b from the outside in. Now do this...
      1a, 2a, 3b, 4b, 4a...
      1b, 3b, 3a, 5a, 5b...
      Sometimes at the top you need to frig it just a little.

      --

      All things in moderation; including moderation

    4. Re:What about single side lacing? by Soul-Burn666 · · Score: 2

      You circle with the leftover around your leg (NOT THE SHOE!) and then you put it under the rubber bands that close the lower part of the pants.

      Also, you can turn the sock on it to make it really strong.

      --
      ^_^
    5. Re:What about single side lacing? by CreateWindowEx · · Score: 2, Funny
      >Now. How about a way of lacing shoes where you only have one crossing of the lace between each pair of holes, but you can still tie in a bow, like 99% of human shoe users do?
      So who are these non-human shoe users, and what do they do with their laces? Or do they have to use a different lacing algorithm because they have three columns of holes instead of two like us humans?
  7. Hiking up & down mountains by bbonnn · · Score: 3, Informative

    Of course, this study doesn't take into account terrain. Really hard-core backpackers lace their shoes differently depending on whether they're ascending or descending a mountain.

    1. Re:Hiking up & down mountains by DrunkenTerror · · Score: 1

      Could you elucidate on that? Sounds intriguing.

  8. This proof is completely BIASED... by tswinzig · · Score: 3, Funny

    ...towards people with feet!

    --

    "And like that ... he's gone."
  9. Math != reality by linuxwrangler · · Score: 2

    This is further proof that mathematicians live in that interesting other-world where shoes are laced in a perfect plane, eyelets are precisely aligned and friction does not exist. The rest of us live in reality.

    --

    ~~~~~~~
    "You are not remembered for doing what is expected of you." - Atul Chitnis
    1. Re:Math != reality by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      University is a *cult* man, don't you see? It's a place where people can spend years masturbating each other with useless information and give each other little pieces of paper when they're done.
      Later on, in the job market, they hire each other because the little bits of paper show that they can put up with and dish out some serious bullshit.
      This is why it takes a Master's degree to sweep the floor in a bus station nowadays, and also why there's so much useless 'research' out there; when everyone and their arthritic dog is in university, the quality of the work will go down.

    2. Re:Math != reality by atomicdragon · · Score: 3, Funny

      I found that some of this stuff applies real well to reality. After a term of hard work in a topology class, the most important and practical thing I have learned is that it is impossible to tie shoe laces in four dimensions. Thanks to the work of generations of mathematicians, we know not to use shoe laces if another dimension were ever discovered. If it were not for mathematicians, how else would you be prepared for hiking in the fourth dimension?

    3. Re:Math != reality by Lars+T. · · Score: 2

      I see you are mad that sombody took your job.

      --

      Lars T.

      To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck

    4. Re:Math != reality by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 1

      Check out
      Spherical Cows. ;)

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
    5. Re:Math != reality by Goldsmith · · Score: 1

      Math lives in that world too.

      They just generally don't tell everyone. I have no idea why, as it's nice knowing that stuff.

      I mean, really, if you had only taken a graduate level classical mechanics course you might have done the realistic version of this problem already.

    6. Re:Math != reality by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I like that you replied with that 'steal your job' angle. It means I struck a nerve. Wait till you get in your 40s with kids and a mortgage, and your employer starts squeezing you for some more papers because the latest boatload of cheap labor just came in.
      University is not a hallowed place of learning where Man strives to be his best, it is merely an appendage of the frightful corporate world we made for ourselves.
      Also, I know how to spell, and you don't. Imagine you lose your job and you need a bachelor's in English to get it back?
      When does it stop?
      Smug people like you, I've seen plenty. University graduates are a dime a dozen, they think they're kings, but they are expendable like cheap Chinese radios. Just toss 'em when they don't work anymore.
      Just wait till you get squeezed. We'll see.

    7. Re:Math != reality by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > Smug people like you, I've seen plenty. University graduates are a dime a dozen, they think
      > they're kings, but they are expendable like cheap Chinese radios. Just toss 'em when they don't work
      > anymore. Just wait till you get squeezed. We'll see.

      Wow, someone's pissy.

      The thing is, math is damn useful stuff in the real world - the fact that your monkey paws could type out your tripe and send it to a global network is - while regrettable - in no small part due to a series of triumphs of the mathematically savvy.

      Just because you can't understand something is no reason to lash out at it. Not understanding math is no reason to be ashamed - it's hard stuff - but throwing hissy fits about it just makes you look like a fool.

      Which, perhaps, is only appropriate.

  10. A new mathematical proof... by duras · · Score: 5, Funny

    Not for the faint of heart... it uses string theory.

  11. Sandals by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I wear only sandals and slippers everywhere I go. Shoes with laces are over-rated. The last time I wore a pair of tenny shoes was when I was forced to wear sneakers for gym class.

  12. You got that right by yerricde · · Score: 1

    BIASED ...towards people with feet!

    as opposed to some of these pictures?

    --
    Will I retire or break 10K?
  13. What about TYING shoes? by rubinson · · Score: 2

    I'm disappointed. I was really hoping that this was a proof of how best to tie one's shoes. My shoelaces are always coming untied. I'm beginning to think that I never learned the proper way to tie shoes.

    I blame my mother.

    1. Re:What about TYING shoes? by DavidTC · · Score: 1
      The reason your shoes always come untied might be the same reason mine always did...you purchased, unknowingly, a pair of shoes with round shoelaces, which is the dumbest fucking idea in the history of the universe.

      Round and flat shoelaces stay in place entirely different ways. I gather the theory on round laces is that the tension of the rest of the laces (You know, the stuff in the shoe.) is supposed to hold the knot in place. You have to pull them taunt and the inside of the knot is supposed 'scrunch' tight, but us normal shoe wearers do not pull our laces tight when tying shoes, because it's too tight. (duh)

      Whereas flat shoe laces stay in place because of the knot. You can tie flat shoelaces in a knot in midair, and they will stay. Round shoelaces will not. Most people, when they were kids, tied their shoelaces where the bow wasn't anywhere near tight, often flapping around a good quarter inch from the shoe. As adults, we usually get it tighter than that, but not as tight as it needs to be for round shoelaces.

      Check your shoelaces. If they are round, go to a shoe store, spend five dollars, and purchase a flat-the-way-god-intended pair of shoelaces. Don't listen to people try to tell you that round shoelaces look 'correct' on nice shoes...when was the last time you noticed someone's shoelaces? Just get the right color and no one can tell.

      Seriously, I'm not kidding about this. I used to wonder why I couldn't keep my dress shoes tied, and all the others worked fine, and then one day I looked at the laces and said 'what the hell?'. The problem is usually worsened because it's the fancy shoes that have round laces, the very ones that are unconfortable to pull tight, while sneakers, which people wear pretty snug, have flat laces.

      --
      If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
    2. Re:What about TYING shoes? by Radish03 · · Score: 1

      $5 for shoe laces? That's crazy! I think I spent about $1.50 on a pair of really nice, two-toned, flat shoe laces that are on their second pair of shoes.

    3. Re:What about TYING shoes? by DavidTC · · Score: 1

      Well, I was just estimating, it's been years since I bought shoelaces. And it's been a very bad couple of years for lace growers.

      --
      If corporations are people, aren't stockholders guilty of slavery?
  14. Velcro by Tafs · · Score: 0

    Whatever happened to Velcro? I thought us geeks were supposed to have a practical approach on clothing issues. IMHO, velcro is much faster and easier than knots, though perhaps not as interesting for mathematicians.

  15. Forget about what God _drives_... by joeslugg · · Score: 1

    From the article:
    "Even if God wears shoes with 100 eyelets..."

    God wears shoes? What kind of marketing propaganda is Nike into now??

    ;-)

    1. Re:Forget about what God _drives_... by Kibo · · Score: 2

      You didn't see that episode of Married With Children?

      --
      --Jimmy has fancy plans; and pants to match.
  16. It's junk science by elronxenu · · Score: 1
    Both sets of calculations, which ran to over 30 pages, were based on an idealised shoe. For example, the eyelets are perfectly aligned, and the shoe exists only in one plane. The proofs also ignore certain physical properties, such as the friction exerted by the lace on the eyehole.

    First, postulate a spherical foot ...

  17. There is a reason for the perfection... by rye+bean · · Score: 1

    Think of it this way, there are billions of people on this planet, many, many shoe types and an almost infinite number of possible situatuions related the footwear, It would be difficult, if not impossible, to model every scenario accuratly. These scientist aren't in another world, they're just idealising the situation to make it possible for them to do the math.

    --
    I prefer MS Windows to Linux
  18. I don't have shoelaces, you insensitive clod. by rendermouse · · Score: 1


    Switched to mocs.

    --
    "Follow your Bliss." -- Joseph Campbell