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Escape from California?
An anonymous reader asks: "Is there any escape from California? I'm a very experienced software engineer (7+ years) with a MSEE and lots of great work experience. Even in this market, jobs in CA are easy to grab if I want them. Trouble is, I don't want to live here anymore. Six figures in Northern CA gets mostly pissed away on a mortgage for a house that isn't worth half that anywhere else, and I'm pretty much just waiting for the earthquake to hit and wipe it out. I'd love to move to the midwest, but decent software jobs seem to not exist. I'm more than willing to take a huge paycut to get a job there, but where to even start looking?"
You may find a cool, sweet job in another state, but be aware, your most likely not going to really find what you want, or where you want it. Sure, some engineering firms are hiring developers again, but things are just downright slow, and nearly non existant. A lot of things have contributed to this economic downfall... and Its not going to fix its self till many things happen..... I'm not going to go into a list, but the .com economy is a good cause of our current economic state in the rest of the country.
I'm comming up on being out of work for three months.... with little end in sight. I have hope, but when you have bills to pay, hope does not spring eternal. I say, stay where you are, or maybe commute from Navada. Yes, I'm serious.
Software engineering involving multiple people is the kind of thing that requires teamwork and good communication. Have all the documentation you want, even use a development process like XP, but you're sure to find there is still a tremendous benifit in having the team work in close proximity.
I suppose it's just the way the world works, but it's hard to get the match the random hallway converstations. They often result in avoiding massive problems or substantial enhancements. It's also very benificial for your engineers to be able to stroll over and ask another developer a quick question (ideally with a whiteboard in near proximity).
My two cents.
-Bill
SlashSig Karma: Excellent (mostly affected by moderatio
novell is looking for an experienced software engineer.
Whatever you do, don't come to Portland. I barely managed to grab a job as it is; I don't need any qualified techies snapping things out from under me. That said, I love it here. But stay away. I'm warning you.
Seriously, I'm looking for some good Software Engineers. We outsource most of our development and are looking to move it in-house. Drop me a resume justin@_NOSPAM_Llamakeeper.com.
JUSTIN
Rule of Life Number 2: Remember, it can all go to hell at any minute. --Jimmy Buffet
The top states for Californians to move to were:
Washington - 534,000
Texas - 523,000
Arizona - 449,000
Oregon - 374,000
Neveda - 320,000
Yeah, and even bigger loads of unemployed programmers trampling down the door to get at them! :)
Friend of mine just got hired for a position which received over 800 applicants in less than a month! (They threw up their hands at the deluge and went the word-of-mouth route).
Another position I know of recently was very low paying kind of boring crappy little job at a non-profit org. and it got over a hundred resumes before it was even officially available! (At least they saved their advertising $.
Not to mention, if you actually bother to read the business section of the news, Seattle has the highest unemployment rate for the tech sector in the whole damn country!
So if you have a job you specifically want to offer the guy, go for it, but don't be leading him on...
Until the beginning of this year, I was working for a large corporation near Portland, Oregon. When they started downsizing, they offered me a generous severance package to leave. I took it and moved to Boise, Idaho, where I'm originally from.
I used the package to buy a house, and started living off of my savings while looking for a job. It took me about three months to find one. I've moved from being a software engineer at $62k per year to being a hardware tester at $15 per hour. But I absolutely don't regret it. I'm very happy here and don't miss Portland at all.
Though my pay has dropped from >5k / month to 2.5k / month, my actual take-home has only dropped to about 60% of what it was because I'm in a lower tax bracket. Further, my mortgage is now $500 / month less than it was, from $1110 to $609.
Start looking in all of the places you'd like to move to. If you've never been there, take some time off and go there, or talk to someone who has. There are relatively few jobs away from the coast, but they are out here. Check the local newspapers, and see what you can find. Find out who the big employers are in the towns you're interested in, and start trying to contact people within them.
Finally, if you're unhappy, move. You only live once.
I'm not kidding, it worked fine for me. Strong tech sector, affordable housing, good wages for engineers, friendly people, world class recreation (biking, skiing, hiking, climbing, etc.) I was glad to escape California, it didn't even take much adjusting: considering the fact that most of the people living in my neighborhood are from California.
One future, two choices. Oppose them or let them destroy us.
While were doubtless not the only govenrment hiring, I know Montana's state government is hiring and would love to get smart experienced techs. We're about as different as you can get from California (you will have to enter state of montana in the job type field, I can't seem to find a way to get the URL to recognise any search terms). Understand that your pay will stink, but you can pick up a nice house for 150,000 or so, your commute will be 20 min tops, and I live both down town and a five minute walk from a place that you can see one house far on the horizon. If you do decide to move here, either don't admit you are from California, don't comment on the deal you are getting for your house, and don't tell anyone I told you to come up here. If you wanted more money try Boise, ID or one of the university towns in the west. If the example job is well below your skill level, as it sorta looks, I am sorry, no insults were intended, and a single guy will live like a king here on that salary range.
Degaussing scares the bad magnetism out of the monitor and fills it with good karma.
If you are considering a move to the greater Detroit area in Michigan... I hear my job is opening up soon.
Houses here in No. VA are outrageous by normal-world standards. A modest house in Arlington costs what a farm would ten miles out, and a palace in the South or Midwest. Meanwhile, prices in No. CA are other-worldly. I mean, using California housing prices as a basis of comparison would be like starting with Hitler as your standard of compassion.
Median prices in Arlington have risen roughly 50% in 5 years -- a bit of sticker shock.
To the poster: There are many many mini Silicon-Whatevers around the country, including here. Things have slowed down with the economy, of course.
I grew up in California, N and S, and think it's a great state. But I have no question my standard of living (except weather) is better here. Anyway I like snow, damn it, and my mentality is much more East Coast than West.
the Northern Virginia/DC area, is pretty cool. While not, say, California cool, it has:
3% unemployment.
While telecom has been nuked, the government sector is growing and defense contractors are hiring. (Can you say homeland security?)
You are halfway between the chesapeake bay and the Shenandoah mountains, so most people can find something (sailing, hiking, lazing at the beach, hanging out downtown) to do.
And, when bored, you can always go to the whitehouse and watch people protesting all manners of things.
I don't know, its okay down here. Housing is expensive by most standards, but still maybe half of NoCal standards.
good luck to you--peace and joy
--Pete
www.avacal.com -- the home page of pete shaw
Well have you considered New Jersey?
Don't believe the common image of the state as a toxic hellhole - that's just the view from NYC (from NYC, you look out onto Newark and Jersey City, so I can understand the confusion). Most of the state is gorgeous, and the real estate prices, while not nearly the deal that they are in some parts of the midwest, are sane.
There's plenty of work as you get closer to New York, especially if you're at all inclined to work in financial or biotech places. (The New Brunswick-Princeton corridor is good too)
As you get closer to Philadelphia, the places that are hiring techs tend more towards regional offices of large corporations. (It's also my impression that there's a good deal of embedded stuff that people aren't allowed to talk about going on in Burlington and Atlantic counties) If you don't mind suburbia, I keep hearing that the Rt. 202 corridor NW from Philadelphia is a reasonably warm tech spot. (And I suppose I should point you at the local job website that found me my job)
If you head further south, into Delaware, you get companies that are all feeding off of subsidiary businesses surrounding the great DuPont, (or weasel businesses playing shell games with Delaware's loose corporate laws) and sales-tax-free shopping too.
I understand that there's tech. stuff both further north and further south, but what I've heard about both the NC (Research Triangle) and Boston area job markets is not encouraging.
A few pointers:
"It was a summer's tale: Just a boy, his Linux, and a head full of dreams..."