Network Associates Aquires Deersoft Inc.

So, not "spamassassin" by JanneM · 2003-01-06 20:57 · Score: 5, Funny

How about "CannedHamHitMan"? It rhymes at least...

--
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.

Re:So, not "spamassassin" by hitzroth · 2003-01-06 21:01 · Score: 2

How about "CannedHamHitMan"? It rhymes at least...

No it doesn't.

But that's besides the point. This is the allmighty Slashdot. We hate spam, but we also hate screwy company mergers. I'm confused. I don't know what to think. Somebody please do my thinking for me.

--
In mathematics, one does not understand things, one merely gets used to them.
--VonNeumann
Re:So, not "spamassassin" by JanneM · 2003-01-06 21:21 · Score: 1

No it doesn't.

Well, close enough, if you sort of squint. :)

--
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
Re:So, not "spamassassin" by nhaines · 2003-01-06 21:39 · Score: 1

Maybe if you squint your ears. ;)

Actually, it is a near-rhyme, which is a valid type of rhyme. So...uhhh.... there. :P
Re:So, not "spamassassin" by CharlesDarwin · 2003-01-06 21:43 · Score: 1

That name only works if we can safely assume that Spam is made from ham ;)
Re:So, not "spamassassin" by bofkentucky · 2003-01-07 01:56 · Score: 2, Funny

It is not Ham or any pork product, SPAM is an acronym for Squirrels, Possums, and Mice, 2 rodents and a marsupial, not a swine in the lot of them.

--
09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0
Re:So, not "spamassassin" by jo42 · 2003-01-08 04:45 · Score: 2

I propose SpoojAssassin, since spam is so much spooj.

Wait no further... by BorgSquirrel · 2003-01-06 21:00 · Score: 1

It's already advertised as McAfee SpamKiller... http://mcafee.digitalriver.com/dr/v2/ec_MAIN.Entry 17c?CID=68368&PN=5&SP=10007&SID=39692&PID=388403&D SP=&CUR=840&PGRP=0&CACHE_ID=68368

Re:Wait no further... by SoSueMe · 2003-01-06 21:23 · Score: 5, Informative

Working link.

What's up with these guys buying... by Marton · 2003-01-06 21:05 · Score: 3, Interesting

all this inferior technology?

McAfee bought SpamKiller a number of months back. I actually paid for that thing back when it was just a shareware project. Big money came in, updates stopped...

Now they buy SpamAssassin, great! I actually used it after getting rid of SpamKiller, and it was OK-ish, but it bothered the hell out of me that I had no control over what's spam and what's not, except for a sender black- and whitelist. (Which sometimes does not work for mailing lists, some of the ones I'm on have date-specific senders such as blahblah-digest-20021220@blahblah.com.)

I switched to POPFile like two months ago, and never looked back. 97.8% accuracy and increasing, yay!

Re:What's up with these guys buying... by larien · 2003-01-06 22:54 · Score: 2

Well, as SpamAssassin is open source, you should be able to add new rules. In any case, you can easily modify the scores attached to certain messages in your ~/.spamassassin/user_prefs file
Re:What's up with these guys buying... by Matts · 2003-01-06 23:26 · Score: 2

SA2.50 (released soon - but nightly builds work well for most people) includes a Bayesian component just like POPFile, spambayes, bogofilter etc.

--

Matt. Want XML + Apache + Stylesheets? Get AxKit.
Re:What's up with these guys buying... by Kallahar · 2003-01-07 04:49 · Score: 2

Two ways to do what you want with SpamAssassin:

whitelist_from *@blahblah.com

or to do it by header:

header NAME1 Subject =~ /REGEXPMATCH/
score NAME1 -20

Travis

Stuff still missing... by Viewsonic · 2003-01-06 21:06 · Score: 5, Insightful

McAfee needs to add in more functionality to remove Gator programs, and other software that installs itself off the web for corporate users. Basically, they need to buy out Adaware and incorporate it within McAfee to make systems 100% clean. Virus Scanners for some reason have been very slow to scan for Gator-like programs that get installed and run in the background without the users knowledge and consent (Autoinstalls from certain sites, etc) and rack itself up as a legit virii if i've ever seen one. Users want to buy this protection, they need to offer it.

Re:Stuff still missing... by Anonymous Coward · 2003-01-06 21:30 · Score: 1, Insightful

I would HATE to see Lavasoft's Adaware be bought out by some humungous, slow company like Network Associates. They'd kill the product.
Re:Stuff still missing... by sheriff_p · 2003-01-06 22:58 · Score: 4, Interesting

There's a reason for this. And it's a legal minefield. Companies could sue NAI (McAfee) for detecting this software and removing it, and some AV company (I forget which, but probably H+BEDV) was sued recently by a German company that made porn dialers, because it was detecting them... Add in FBI-esque eBugs, and boy is it a spikey issue.

--
Score:-1, Funny
Re:Stuff still missing... by IIRCAFAIKIANAL · 2003-01-07 01:55 · Score: 2

More info, please. How is it a legal minefield?

I can install and remove anything from my pc at will, and if I am the one to install McAfee and tell it to remove spyware then it doesn't matter what the spyware manufacturer thinks (and don't give me no guff about licencing agreements - nothing I sign says I can't turn around and remove it (and expect to hold up in court) - besides, I didn't even click a yes/no to get that last batch of spyware I excised from my pc).

Just because some pr0n dialer sued somebody doesn't mean the case was justified or will even last or lasted 1 week.

--
Robots are everywhere, and they eat old people's medicine for fuel.
Re:Stuff still missing... by katarn · 2003-01-07 05:07 · Score: 1

Okay, I can't find reference to it now, here is an example which from came from another slashdot poster. Symantec offered some product which was supposed to monitor what programs did to your system when they installed themselves self; what things they changed in the registry, where they installed components, and where they made other changes. It would also allow you to undo or prevent some of these things from occuring during the install, if the user desired. To do it's functions intelegently the Symantec product had it's own internal list of other companies products so that it would know about some of the nasty tricks some of these installed products would do durring installs. For this reason several companies sued or threatened to sue Symantec for "trademark infringement" (possibly under the DMCA, but I'm not sure), since Symantec's product contained their products names internally. Thus symantec had to dumb down their product, making it much less usefull.

Name change must be a joke by iamacat · 2003-01-06 21:07 · Score: 5, Interesting

I assume Deersoft is the company that released regular SpamAsassin under GPL. In this case, I don't think they can remove GPL from any part of the code, including it's name. If they just used GPL code from other people, they would have to either release source code for the PRO version or license the original one separately. Even then, GPL license would still protect everyone's right to use the name. Not a lawyer, just seems common sense.

Re:Name change must be a joke by dirkx · 2003-01-06 21:55 · Score: 1

The mark was owned by DeerSoft, the license has nothing to do with that; nor does grant something like ownership of that mark to some community at large. Also note that the software up to this point has always been dual licensed; under the GPL and under the Perl Artistic License. The latter allows for considerable more freedom.
Re:Name change must be a joke by 1000StonedMonkeys · 2003-01-06 22:08 · Score: 2, Insightful

No, you're not a lawyer. Nor am I, but I atleast know a bit about trademarks. Whoever owns the trademark on a word has the sole right to use that word for a certain class of products/services.

The GPL does not in any way restrict the rights of the author of the source code, instead it grants the user of the software additional rights on the condition that they do certain things. Thus, the GPL would not force the author of a program to give up the trademark on the name of the program.

That said I really doubt that McAfee is going to force the open source project to change its name, as it would be a PR nightmare.
Re:Name change must be a joke by Basje · 2003-01-06 22:48 · Score: 2

The GPL Licence does not protect the name, as that is a trademark. It does, however, protect the code.

The GPL, being a licence, is a legally binding contract (assuming you agreed with it). If they decide to pull the GPL, it is always possible to make a fork from the last version released under the GPL.

They can, however, decide not to release any new free versions. In fact, I expect NAI to do this, after the money they lost with PGP.

--
the pun is mightier than the sword
Re:Name change must be a joke by iamacat · 2003-01-07 05:31 · Score: 2

Well, what if GPL'ed code, released by DeerSoft itself, has SpamAssasin.cpp, opens a top-level window named "SpamAssassin" and has Help/About item with the same name. Aren't file names, window names and contents of documentation part of the GPL'ed code? Or for that matter, name of the compressed file in which the code was distributed? Basically, I don't see what I have to change if they ask me to rename it.
Re:Name change must be a joke by spitzak · 2003-01-07 06:32 · Score: 2

The name itself is trademarked. The GPL means that if you can't figure out how to write the string "SpamAssassin" to the screen, you are free to copy the code from this program in order to do so. It does not give you the right to call your new program "SpamAssassin", it just gives you the right to know how to display the string "SpamAssassin".

Not sure if that was too clear, but that is what I think is the story.
Re:Name change must be a joke by belphegore · 2003-01-07 09:00 · Score: 3, Informative

The SpamAssasssin open-source project is licensed under the "same license as Perl itself" -- ie a dual PAL/GPL where the licensee can choose which license they wish to use. Deersoft used the open-source engine as the spam-identification component of (at time of acquisition) two products: an Outlook plugin, and an Exchange server plugin. There's a lot of windows/outlook/exchange-specific code in there which is covered under a commercial (not currently open-source) license, and these parts of the software are kept quite separate from the open-source bits.

We're currently floating between meeting after meeting after meeting with the Network Associates folks, trying to nail down timelines, roadmaps, etc. and will have more information hopefully soon.

Through the merger process, one of my main concerns was trying to ensure the preservation and independence of all aspects of the open source project. This was partially reflected in the press release announcing the acquisition, but I think that was written by a marketroid who doesn't necessarily understand what Open Source even means.

If you want to contact me directly, please email me at craig@deersoft.com or craig@hughes-family.org and I'll try and get answers to any questions you may have -- be warned though that NAI is a large company with the typical slowness associated with large organizations.

Craig Hughes
Re:Name change must be a joke by duncf · 2003-01-07 11:06 · Score: 1

NAI really can't control whether or not there is another open source version of SpamAssassin (under whatever name).

However, since they now employ two of the leading coders, releases might now be a lot less frequent. Hopefully, NAI will do the right thing.

Deersoft by Error27 · 2003-01-06 21:10 · Score: 1

Assasin was pretty good and I really liked their original game as well.

Assassin was ok, but I liked this better by Anonymous Coward · 2003-01-06 21:12 · Score: 3, Informative

www.cloudmark.com

SpamNet is actually somewhat better at intelligently filtering out trash.

Re:Assassin was ok, but I liked this better by JonnyCalcutta · 2003-01-06 23:07 · Score: 1

Mate, SpamNet is Vipul's Razor. You can run MIMEDefang, SpamAssassin and Vipul's Razor together, as I do on my mail relay - and its all open source. They might not come with pretty GUIs but you do have full control over everything.

Now... by elixx · 2003-01-06 21:16 · Score: 3, Funny

With each purchase of NA Sniffer Pro, you get a complimentary copy of "Deer Hunter"! Absolutely /FREE/! What a bargain!

--
No, Beowulf clusters can't imagine in Soviet Russia.

Just the name? by mmoncur · 2003-01-06 21:17 · Score: 5, Interesting

I hope the name SpamAssassin is all they have the rights to. It seems like there might be some messy legal issues here.

Also, if this goes as mainstream as it looks like it's going, we might need a different open-source spam filter after all - because NAI's product will be the one the spammers will be testing on and trying to get past.

OTOH, maybe NAI throwing money at this will make ISPs everywhere notice and start taking spam a bit more seriously.

Anyway, while it lasts, SpamAssassin (or whatever we call it) is excellent. The new Bayesian filtering in the upcoming 2.50 is working wonders.

--

It's Slashdot's evil twin... SlashNOT

Re:Just the name? by belphegore · 2003-01-07 10:32 · Score: 1

They have acquired rights to the trademark, those parts of the open source code written by Justin or me, and rights too all of Deersoft's proprietary stuff. Justin and I have also entered into employment agreements with NAI to continue there as employees following the merger.

Since we haven't been at NAI very long yet, many decisions have yet to be made about roadmap, timelines, Justin and my level of continuing involvement in the open source project, etc., but all signs so far indicate the likelihood that NAI is planning to do the right thing, and continue Deersoft's license of the mark to the open source project, as well as allowing Justin and me to continue working on the project, while also working on NAI stuff which is not open source (just like we both were doing at Deersoft).

However NAI ends up using what they've acquired, you be bet they'll be very likely to invest in publicizing (and providing paid support for) whatever products they built based on the technologies.

Of course, all decisions are just my perceptions so far. I'm still chasing around the building (and on the phone to those people who aren't physically in this building) to nail down all the answers. Large companies move slowly though, so final confirmation on all this will likely take some time. I'll keep everyone posted as best as I can.

Craig Hughes

Is it just me.... by dtdns · 2003-01-06 21:19 · Score: 1

...or have there been a lot more spam related stories than usual these past few weeks? Weird..

I'm happy for the Deersoft guys by Argyle · 2003-01-06 21:29 · Score: 4, Interesting

I bought a copy to use at home and 30 licenses for the office. The stuff works good.

They've continued to update the program and add more features. I get 50-100 spams per day and the program might miss one of them.

I hope they are getting a nice tasty payout from Network Associates.

--
nuclear iraq bioweapon encryption cocaine korea terrorist

Re:I'm happy for the Deersoft guys by JonnyCalcutta · 2003-01-06 23:11 · Score: 2, Informative

Not to dis your support of the Deersoft guys, which is great, but if you are running 30 copies in the office why not simply use the GPL version on your mail server? The great thing about SpamAssassin (GPL version) is that it can simply mark the headers of spam so users can have their own rules for whitelists, deleting it or moving it to special folders.
Re:I'm happy for the Deersoft guys by Argyle · 2003-01-07 05:26 · Score: 3, Insightful

Well, two reasons.

1) What I bought was a version that works as a plug-in to Microsoft Outlook that runs client-side in a Outlook/Exchange environment. It's a specific implementation of the code that I wanted. I could have taken the GPL code and changed it to do this, but it is simpler and cheaper to buy it.

2) These guys deserve the money. They worked hard and made a good piece of software. Paying them for their work is a good incentive to continue writing good, useful code.

--
nuclear iraq bioweapon encryption cocaine korea terrorist
Re:I'm happy for the Deersoft guys by balamw · 2003-01-07 06:27 · Score: 1

Ditto! I bought a license to use at work and recommended it highly to anyone that asked. I also was in touch with the guys there about some bug in early releases and they were quite responsive

At home though I use(d) Outlook Express and thus had to look elsewhere. So, I came up with a way to use the GPL version "client-side" on Windows. One of these years I'll whip up a description of it.
Balam

Speaking of trademarks... by Anand_S · 2003-01-06 21:49 · Score: 5, Funny

Since Hormel Foods owns the name "Spam," couldn't they force Network Associates to call their product "Nasty Synthetic Luncheon Meat Assassin"?

Re:Speaking of trademarks... by Rhinobird · 2003-01-06 22:08 · Score: 2

would that make it NaSyL Asassin?
A-CHOO!

--
If Mr. Edison had thought smarter he wouldn't sweat as much. --Nikola Tesla
Re:Speaking of trademarks... by ensignyu · 2003-01-06 22:11 · Score: 2, Informative

I think Hormel said that it's OK to use spam to refer to unsolicited email, but not SPAM (all caps), which refers to the canned food product.

I don't know about the legal status of it though. Probably just a courtesy.

SpamAssassin by fishbert42 · 2003-01-06 21:52 · Score: 2, Insightful

Assuming McAfee wants to use the SpamAssassin name, and assuming they try to make the open source project find a new name...
wouldn't the open source project benefit greatly just by the exposure and publicity gained through such a move?

Ok, we're not talking a CNN breaking news story here, but I'm sure I'm not alone in saying that I had never even heard of SpamAssassin until just now via /. -- that's an increase in public exposure already. For a typical open source project (meaning: advertising efforts rely mainly on word-of-mouth and product reviews), there's the potential for great benefit here. If the open source SpamAssassin project makes a good product, nobody will remember a name change controversy one or two years down the line; but there's no doubt that more people will have been made aware that such a project existed in the first place.

OMG! by Anonymous Coward · 2003-01-06 21:53 · Score: 1, Funny

They killed SpamAssassin! ;-)

Re:SpamAssassin by PigleT · 2003-01-06 22:00 · Score: 2

"but I'm sure I'm not alone in saying that I had never even heard of SpamAssassin until just now via /. "

You must be new around here or filtering out interesting articles... It's been around for ages, I've been using it now myself for nearly 18 months or more in varying guises.

I guess the latter would make it rather hard for them to force us to change the name for the thing, too.

--
~Tim
--
.|` Clouds cross the black moonlight,
Rushing on down to the circle of the turn

Kill the product? by snol · 2003-01-06 22:03 · Score: 2, Informative

Some would say it's already dead. In any case, Spybot Search and Destroy is better for now.

pre acceptance filtering vs post acceptance ? by Indy1 · 2003-01-06 22:03 · Score: 2

Personally, i prefer to use RBL's and block the spammers so i dont have to fill up my server's hdd. I tend to suspect that RBL checks are less computationally intensive then content filters.

Besides, if the ip keeps tripping my rbl check, i can add it to the firewall and waste about zero cpu time on em : )

--
Lawyers, MBA's, RIAA? A jedi fears not these things!

no thanks by Anonymous Coward · 2003-01-06 22:19 · Score: 1, Informative

Requirements

* Windows 98 / NT / 2000 / XP
* Outlook 2000 / XP
* 1mb disk space

Um. Yeah.... Now all I need to do is get a Windows box and then install outlook. Think I'll stick to SpamAssassin, Procmail and POPFile.

Existing customers? by KeyserDK · 2003-01-06 22:19 · Score: 3, Insightful

Q. What will happen to existing Deersoft Inc. products and customers?

We will take the existing product off the market immediately and will launch an enhanced version in the second quarter of 2003. Network Associates has assumed all support obligations for Deersoft customers. Existing Deersoft customers can contact a technical support representative at 1 800-722-3709.

YES US TELEPHONE SUPPORT! it's *SO* cheap calling from Denmark to US.

Anyway as happy user, I seriously doubt anything worthwhile for existing customers will come out of this.

--
still reading?

Re:Existing customers? by m1chael · 2003-01-06 22:50 · Score: 1

dont get too angry at Network Associates. im sure deersoft didnt have existing customers support on their minds when they signed the deal. if they did well that would have been a con now wouldnt it.

--
I know you are psychotic, but please make an effort.
Re:Existing customers? by balamw · 2003-01-07 06:37 · Score: 1

Last I checked most 1-800 numbers are only directly accessible from within the US. From outside you have to dial up some other local access number that takes you to the US e.g. AT&T and then dial the "free" 1-800 number, which is now no longer free. Balam
Re:Existing customers? by patter · 2003-01-07 06:42 · Score: 1

YES US TELEPHONE SUPPORT! it's *SO* cheap calling from Denmark to US.

What happens when you dial TOLL FREE numbers over here? Do they charge you??

Man, it's almost like a tax to own a phone in some parts of europe. Friend of mine called me from London once. He plopped in 10 Pounds and we got to talk long enough to say hi, and for me to say hi to his wife or something (like about 3-5 minutes maybe?). That's insane. I called a friend in Italy nearly 10 years ago (when long distance was more expensive in NA) and a 20 minute call was only 40 bucks.

--
-- If at first you do succeed, try to hide your astonishment. -- Harry F. Banks

Re:RPN haiku by Wrexs0ul · 2003-01-06 22:20 · Score: 1

Comments follow swiftly
Response flows from fingers:
"acronym means nothing to me"

-Matt

--
--- Need web hosting?

They won't want to use the name SpamAssassin by zoward · 2003-01-06 22:32 · Score: 4, Insightful

From a marketriod standpoint (IANAM), the word "Assassin" is too heavily conotated with the deliberate forcible termination of human life to be effective as part of a product name (unless you make assassination products!). Also, while SpamAssassin has great market penetration amongst the Slashdot crowd, I don't think it's so well known with the general public that they'll keep the brand name for recognition value.

--
"Can't you see that everyone is buying station wagons?"

Re:They won't want to use the name SpamAssassin by balamw · 2003-01-07 06:30 · Score: 1

So they're integrating it with their kindler-gentler SpamKiller software? ;-) http://www.mcafeeb2b.com/other/jump/deersoft-homeu ser.asp. Balam

call... by m1chael · 2003-01-06 22:52 · Score: 2, Funny

it spamo-blamo!

--
I know you are psychotic, but please make an effort.

Re:call... by m1chael · 2003-01-07 04:05 · Score: 1

exxxcelllent, the clogging process is nearly complete.

--
I know you are psychotic, but please make an effort.
Re:call... by CerebusUS · 2003-01-07 06:09 · Score: 2

I vote for SpamNinja.

"The spam never saw him coming."
Re:call... by m1chael · 2003-01-08 04:06 · Score: 1

spameater, the other dead meat.

--
I know you are psychotic, but please make an effort.

I really need to wake up... by ItsBacon · 2003-01-06 23:10 · Score: 2, Funny

I first looked at the headline and thought it said Network Solutions acquires Deersoft, Inc...

Article to clear it up by sheriff_p · 2003-01-06 23:14 · Score: 2

This article on VB looks at the history of SpamAssassin and SpamAssassin pro, and conflicts of interest this might create; a neat summary:

http://www.virusbtn.com/news/latest_news/spamassas sin.xml

--
Score:-1, Funny

Whats in a name? by TerryAtWork · 2003-01-06 23:33 · Score: 2

Who cares what they call it?

--
It's Christmas everyday with BitTorrent.

Prior use is a valid defense by kramer · 2003-01-07 00:12 · Score: 3, Informative

Assuming anything happens on the trademark front Deersoft owning the SpamAssassin trademark is relatively pointless. IIRC Spamassassin was called spamassassin long before deersoft registered the trademark, or even considered a windows version. Use of a trademark prior to it being registered is a vaild defense against a trademark infringement cliam, and can actually should the spamassassin folks choose be grounds to have deersoft's trademark squashed.

Re:Prior use is a valid defense by sheriff_p · 2003-01-07 00:52 · Score: 2

Except the person that came up with the name is now employed by DeerSoft, and they have the right to it.

--
Score:-1, Funny
Re:Prior use is a valid defense by poot_rootbeer · 2003-01-07 05:33 · Score: 1

I'm guessing YANAL...

Explain how Microsoft was able to trademark the word "Windows", then.
Re:Prior use is a valid defense by belphegore · 2003-01-07 09:58 · Score: 2, Informative

FWIW, Deersoft claims ownership of the trademark through precisely the prior use argument you're talking about. Justin Mason, who originated the SpamAssassin open source project, assigned the trademark to Deersoft through me. As for NAI's intentions wrt the mark, I'm working on clarifying those now (just moved into NAI's offices yesterday and still don't know everyone's phone number/office location), and will let you all know what's going on as soon as I have definitive information.

Craig Hughes
Re:Prior use is a valid defense by kramer · 2003-01-07 13:00 · Score: 2

Not that it's germane to the discussion, but trademarks take into acount the field of endeavour for each trademark. There may be hundreds of different companies all trademarking the same word, as long as there isn't another company claiming prior trademark use within that field there's typically not a problem registering. The fact that Microsoft registered the Windows name in the computer software domain doesn't mean nobody else has used that word ever in the history of the world, instead that nobody else used that word to describe or name a product in the limited domain of computer software.

Further, Microsoft's Windows trademark is teneous at best, with at least one federal judge questioning the legitimacy of their trademark claim

And no, I'm not a Lawyer -- yet, although with my newly acquired LSAT scores I may soon remedy that.

damned if you do by SubtleNuance · 2003-01-07 00:29 · Score: 3, Insightful

wrt: SpamAssassin trademark was owned by Deersoft, so hypothetically, NAI could force us to call the Open Source project something else!"

...except that the previous owners did not vigorously defend the mark against the Free Software project, would NAI now have grounds at all? Selling the mark does not erase the actions Deersoft did/did-not make.

EXCEPT that there is no justice in the USA without $$$$ - so the mere threat of a suit from NAI would cause the F.S. project to freely walk away from the 'battle'.

Re:damned if you do by belphegore · 2003-01-07 10:02 · Score: 1

The open-source project used the mark under license from Deersoft. AFAIK Deersoft has always defended the mark when it thought the mark was being infringed.

Craig Hughes

wow by pummer · 2003-01-07 00:58 · Score: 1

wow, a spyware killer prog that's updated???

/confused

NAI ruins reputation of yet another product by Anonymous Coward · 2003-01-07 01:19 · Score: 1, Interesting

An NAI story

"Hello, we're using the free version of PGP in testing and have decided to use it in production, what do we need to license this from you?" Sales moron takes information and says, 'I'll get back to you in a bit.'

Guy calls back threatening a lawsuit if we don't buy the 'Enterprise' edition of the product that only runs on Windows (We needed only the version for Solaris). This continues with more and more strongarmed tactics including phone spamming all of our corporate directory with their threats.

It took telling the guy that he was too close to our office to keep running on at the mouth like he was and that he had better serve papers or look over his shoulder durning lunch hour if he continued calling.

NAI uses mafia tactics to sell their broken down product line, the faster people can boycott them the better off we all will be. I have never sold another NAI product to any of my clients as a result.

May as well change the name now just to avoid the annoying threats that will ensue. NAI you are despicable, a stand-out in a sea of detritus. Congratulations on what will be the ruin of another great product.

From the Press Release by jmkaza · 2003-01-07 01:31 · Score: 1

"The first product, McAfee SpamKiller(TM) Enterprise, will be delivered in the second quarter as a desktop solution."

Which means they're probably not concerned with who uses the SpamAssasin name.

Pah! They wouldn't do that! by Spoing · 2003-01-07 02:16 · Score: 2

Ask for a name change? Have lawsuits over names! Ridiculous!

Afterall, were talking about Network Ass...nevermind.

--
A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.

The biggest tragedy and doom for Spamassassin by rw2 · 2003-01-07 02:51 · Score: 3, Informative

With apologies to the many who have contributed to SA in the past, Spamassassin was basically the work of three people. Craig, Justin and Matt. Between the three of them that's the *vast* majority of the work that was done on that project.

Here's the troubling part.

Craig and Justin owned the trademark and now work for NAI on the proprietary version (to be named "SpamKiller" apparently) and Matt's company has pulled him off because there is a conflict of interest in having him work on open source being fed back into NAI.

So the three captains of this project are now gone. This doesn't bode well for the future of SA.

Sucks.

Re:The biggest tragedy and doom for Spamassassin by Tony+Hoyle · 2003-01-07 03:28 · Score: 2

Presumably someone will take the code and make another project based on it. SA was too damned useful to be killed.
Re:The biggest tragedy and doom for Spamassassin by Anonymous Coward · 2003-01-07 06:09 · Score: 3, Informative

From the FAQ. Note the starred portion

Q. What will be the status of the open source product following the acquisition?

The SpamAssassin open source project will continue and *will be maintained by its current authors including Justin Mason and Craig Hughes*. Mason and Hughes will be employees of Network Associates and will devote their energies to the development of the proprietary McAfee product.
Re:The biggest tragedy and doom for Spamassassin by rw2 · 2003-01-07 07:56 · Score: 2

Read further down the threads. Matt has pulled out for at least the time being.
Re:The biggest tragedy and doom for Spamassassin by rw2 · 2003-01-07 08:06 · Score: 4, Informative

Mod the parent down, he highlighted the wrong portion.

The highlighted portion should have been:

The SpamAssassin open source project will continue and will be maintained by its current authors including Justin Mason and Craig Hughes. Mason and Hughes will be employees of Network Associates and will devote their energies to the development of the proprietary McAfee product.

Now having said that, Justin has posted saying that even for the last four months he's been working for Deersoft and still working on OS so there is some reason to hope. Craig's been pretty busy though and difficult to contact, so I wouldn't bet on him being able to spend much time on the OS portion going forward and Matt has officially dropped out.
Re:The biggest tragedy and doom for Spamassassin by belphegore · 2003-01-07 10:24 · Score: 1

All negotiations with NAI during the merger, and all evidence I've seen or heard since arriving at NAI's offices to start work yesterday, are that both Justin and I will still be working on the OS stuff in the same way we were for the last months while we were employed at Deersoft. I haven't heard the official word confirmed from the right people definitively yet, but that is my expectation at this point. Justin and I will let you all know exactly what the 411 is once we know ourselves.

Craig Hughes
Re:The biggest tragedy and doom for Spamassassin by rw2 · 2003-01-08 04:23 · Score: 2

I suggest that we wait a few days. I'm sure Craig and Justin will let us know how they stand.

This is indeed the salient advice. I've not once, but twice in the last week been overcome by fear and paranoia when sitting back and being calm appears to be the correct behavior. What Craig and Justin have said publically at this point is that they both anticipate continuing there active involvement in the OS project.

SPAM luncheon meat ingredients by yerricde · 2003-01-07 03:07 · Score: 1

SPAM is an acronym for Squirrels, Possums, and Mice

More like Spiced Pork and Ham or (later) Specially Processed Assorted Meat. SPAM® luncheon meat by Hormel Foods is pork shoulder and ham, salt, water, sugar, and sodium nitrite. (Read More...)

Why does a hamburger sandwich have beef?

--
Will I retire or break 10K?

A pink meat eater by buss_error · 2003-01-07 03:36 · Score: 2

NAI could force us to call the Open Source project something else!"

A Pink Meat Eater by any other name doth smell as sweet.

Interesting trend here. OS projects getting bought out by private industry. While lots to be said about that, and the quality of OS vs. Closed Source, I don't see that this could change anything other than the name.

Yes, it is terrible to see the three original authors go, but there are many in the OS community that are willing to pick up and carry on. And once OS, always OS, right?

SpamAssassin code seems fairly stable. All that's really needed at this point are updates to the matching rules IMO. At some point, yes, the code will need a bit of work, but it's not the same level of job to maintain code as it is to create it. I'm not saying it's easy...

--
Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.

NAI plans to call it SpamKiller by Mithrandur · 2003-01-07 03:40 · Score: 2

According to the article at Infoweek, NAI plans to call their product SpamKiller, not SpamAsassin. Looks like the OSS version may be ok name-wise after all.

--
vi is my shepard, I shall not font.

IANAL either, but... by poot_rootbeer · 2003-01-07 05:30 · Score: 2

Who says that the name of the software would be protected by GPL?

The software name is trademarked. GPL is based off of copyright. Completely separate concepts.

Not spurious removal by phorm · 2003-01-07 06:34 · Score: 2

Ad-aware spuriously removing these programs however, it's tagging them as evil spam/porn/popup/spyware, telling you about them, and giving you complete choice of what files are deleted.

If it automatically went through and sliced'n'diced apps that would be bad. By giving the users the choice, it's their decision as to what to remove - right down to the registry entries and individual files - and a user has a right to remove whatever he/she damn well wants from a personal computer.

Wow. I think we need a new license then! by iamacat · 2003-01-07 07:27 · Score: 2

A new way to make money on free code:

1. Release your own program under GPL
2. Wait until people start using/extending it.
3. Sue them for patent and trademark infrigement.
4. Profit!!!

Shouldn't we have GPL+ license that also makes people who write/extend the code give up any patents or trademarks that they put there? Just wait until Microsoft hears this and starts releasing shared source under "GPL".

Re:Wow. I think we need a new license then! by cyberformer · 2003-01-07 12:35 · Score: 2

The GPL already protects against patent abuse. It doesn't protect against trademark suits, which is probably for the best: People who buy Red Hat (to take the best-known example) Linux do have a right to expect that the program they're installing is actually Red Hat Linux, not some other version.

The SpamAssassin "brand" by belphegore · 2003-01-07 10:39 · Score: 1

SpamAssassin has *great* brand name recognition. Yes, it is heavily amongst slashdot-like crowd, but it's also been featured a lot in the press, plus there are many /.ers who run open-source SA on their boxes at home, but would just love an Outlook/Exchange version to purchase for use at the office where Mr PHB wants something which runs on Windows, or where they don't have the time/personel to install/tweak/maintain/update the open source version.

Deersoft's aim was to provide nicely packaged, GUI-ized point-and-click products for the Windows market, driven by the same high-precision engine that's available to the open-source enlightened through spamassassin.org

Craig Hughes

AbiWord vs. AbiWord Personal by yerricde · 2003-01-07 11:19 · Score: 1

As for NAI's intentions wrt the mark, I'm working on clarifying those now

Here's how Abisource handles it: AbiWord refers to Abisource's binary distribution, and AbiWord Personal refers to the GPL version.

--
Will I retire or break 10K?

Name change? by zcat_NZ · 2003-01-07 12:35 · Score: 1

If it gets to be a problem, I suggest ANSA's Not Spam Assassin.

Another suggestion; we get to keep the name for the GPL's *NIX version as long as we continue to not release a free (GPL or beer) windows port.

--
455fe10422ca29c4933f95052b792ab2

More spam from NSI, film at 11... by Snover · 2003-01-07 12:38 · Score: 2, Funny

"YOUR DOMAINS ARE EXPIRING! RE-REGISTER THEM NOW WITH NETWORK SOLUTIONS! ONLY $35/YEAR! THAT'S LESS THAN $($) PER DAY! ...if you do not wish to receive these messages, please purchase SpamAssassin. Now available for only $250."
And then, of course, NSI is whitelisted in the SA database through some "mysterious corruption".

--

[insert witty comment here]

Re:Disturbing attitude may bode ill for future by Ogman · 2003-01-08 01:02 · Score: 1

What a load! Did they cover their ass enough different ways?

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But Officer, I DID read the f**king article!

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Network Associates Aquires Deersoft Inc.

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