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Microsoft: Because Bugs are Cool

Posted by chrisd on from the sigh dept.

h_orion writes "According to Mr. Gates, Microsoft recieves 'Less than one percent' call volume in relation to bugs. He also blames the users lack of knowledge as a cause of some of these bugs. He goes on to say that the feeling of frustration that people hold towards bugs is a sociological issue, rather than technical saying that people complain about software bugs 'Because it's cool.' Read more in this interview." Boy, where do you even begin...

23 of 759 comments (clear)

  1. Closed source.... by CyberSlugGump · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Although the MS Knowledge base is good a resolving lots of questions/bugs I wish it were more like Bugzilla....

    1. Re:Closed source.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      ...I just wish there were less bugs.

      Why, if you'd only RTFA, you'd know that Microsoft has granted your wish. Any remaining bugs are a matter of faulty perception - yours. Find the interface convoluted? Maybe it's your BRAIN that's convoluted. Why, you're lucky they deign to allow you to purchase and use licences for their software at all.

      Just as In Soviet Russia, when the system fails to work it's ALWAYS a matter of the inadequacy and weaknesses of the human users.

    2. Re:Closed source.... by Oculus+Habent · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Now, perhaps Bill is a bit overzealous in his statements, but it's a combination of bad questions and bad answers.

      Bill said the don't release new products for bug fixes, and they don't. They release patches and service packs for that. He never said they don't fix bugs, and he was never asked.

      His percentages are probably right - If I find a bug in some MS software, I might to a search for it on the Microsoft Support Center, or I might just let it go. I wouldn't call Microsoft to report it. Do you call them when you find what you think is a bug?

      Saying that it's frequently user error probably comes from the support centers as well. Plenty of vendors and ISPs are happy referring people to MS because it's not something they support, and Microsoft probably will. I'm sure a large percentage of their calls are new users who just aren't familiar with the programs or interface, and call complaining about errors they cause through ignorance. I am not saying those people are stupid, they just haven't learned yet.

      Macs used to come with a nice thick manual telling you about files, folders, windows, menus, and more. It also had two tutorials for people who hadn't used computers. Those things have been lost because "everyone uses computers" which makes learning the new systems harder. Windows XP has a "Learn XP" link on the desktop of XP Home on a Dell I purchased recently.

      As for complaining about bugs being "cool" I think Bill has taken the word too far. "En vogue" perhaps, but I think it's a product of the problem - there are either a substantial quantity of reproducible bugs, or a quantity of reproducible design/function flaws that make using the programs hard. Maybe both.

      Also, the "Executive Summary" is a vicious twisting of Bill's words. The truth in the article is sufficient for me. My summary goes this way:
      - Users calling support often don't know what they are doing.
      - New releases aren't for bug fixes. (Repeat a few times for full effect.
      - Not many people are reporting bugs.
      - Bill's interpretation of why people complain about bugs is very unique.

      Hopefully you will look past any ill will you harbor toward Microsoft or Bill himself and see the interview is poorly executed, and that is as much to blame for the responses as Bill himself is.

      --
      Think for yourself. If people spent as much time learning as they do criticizing because someone else did...

      --
      That what was all this school was for... to teach us how to solve our own problems. -- janeowit
    3. Re:Closed source.... by JohnFluxx · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Maybe people don't report bugs because they don't want to pay MS to report bugs?
      Have you seen how expensive those phone calls are..

    4. Re:Closed source.... by smagruder · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I think people don't report bugs to MS because the support reps are "programmed" to deny real bugs one way or another, so it's not really worth the effort. In my own experience in reporting problems to MS, I've had support reps do one or more of the following:

      1. Play dumb through many discussion iterations, pretending not to understand where the issue lies. I say "pretending" because it's easy to tell that they are twisting the words of my problem description on purpose, when if they simply took my words and test examples at face-value, they would clearly see the issue.
      2. Pushing a workaround on me as if it were a wonderful solution (so perhaps I can go and leave them alone). I'm sorry, but a workaround is usually *not* a solution.
      3. Even if they acknowledge there's an issue, they act as if there's nothing they can do--not even report it internally. Even when it's a super-obvious bug in their product.

      It seems to me that the role of the MS support rep is to ensure that bug reporters come to realize the futility of bug reporting, apparently so that MS can keep its stats looking pretty.

      --
      Steve Magruder, Metro Foodist
    5. Re:Closed source.... by zaphod110676 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The reason people don't report bugs is because people expect their computers not to work correctly all the time. I've met a number of people whose computers lock up on a daily basis. They think nothing of it. They just cycle the power and continue on their merry way. Bill's right. It is a sociological phenomenon. The PC industry with Microsoft at the center has programmed consumers to think it's okay when their product fails. It's far more cost effective than fixing the problem.

      --
      To Do: 1. Take over world 2. Pick up Milk and Bread on the way home
    6. Re:Closed source.... by peg0cjs · · Score: 5, Insightful

      A lot of it has to do with how long it takes to report bugs. I had to contact one of their tech support lines for a server-product related item. I am totally not making this up:

      1. I waited 92 minutes on hold before giving up and passing the call over to one of our project managers to make.
      2. She waited 75 minutes on hold before being disconnected.
      3. She called back and waited 91 minutes before reaching a person, who told her to call back later!

      I completely believe that 1% of calls are bug reports. Who would bother waiting through this kind of shit to report a bug that has almost 0 chance of actually being fixed. Not to mention that intermittent (i.e. non-reproducable errors) will NEVER be reported, because MS will tell you it's your fault.

      --
      Karma: Excellent (Mainly due to Bill & Ted's Karma Adventure)
  2. Im shocked by bdigit · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Its actually hard to believe this interview is real. Actually is there any proof that it is? Gates sounded very unprofessional and not like himself in the interview, almost like he was attacking the FOCUS interviewer. Anyone else care to comment on this?

    1. Re:Im shocked by The_dev0 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I agree. It doesn't seem like his usual smiling, patronising marketspeak. It's also dated from October 1995. Looks pretty dubious to me...

      --
      Never fight naked, unless you're in prison...
    2. Re:Im shocked by acedeuce · · Score: 5, Informative

      Please note the date of the interview. This is almost 8 years old.
      If I were paranoid, this sounds like a MS troll to elicit uneducated, kneejerk reactions to ancient history.
      Beware, some of the comments will appear in MS press releases in order to show the "infantile" level of OS supporters.
      geo

    3. Re:Im shocked by PhilHibbs · · Score: 5, Informative

      He was interviewed by Jeremy Paxman on the BBC a few years back, probably at about the same time as this interview. Paxman asked him something like "Why is your software so unreliable?" and he answered, "Maybe you aren't using it correctly". So this interview is spot on about Bill's attitude to bugs back then.

  3. Hey what's that sound? by ObviousGuy · · Score: 5, Informative

    Nobody demanding to see the original transcript?

    No, those links at the bottom don't lead to the original transcript, only some German "analysis" of the original transcript.

    Because of this blatant lack of evidence, everything else is suspect.

    --
    I have been pwned because my /. password was too easy to guess.
  4. I get it by Gyan · · Score: 5, Funny

    that people complain about software bugs 'Because it's cool.'

    That's why they create so many of them. It's all for the customers.

  5. Kind of Old.... by Euphonious+Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting
    As the host for that page (which is getting hammered nicely now, as you might guess) I should point out the date of the interview.

    Funny, I used to get lots of letters from irate fanboys who asserted that it was an obvious fake. Not one of them could spell.

  6. What the hell? by kaosrain · · Score: 5, Insightful

    How did this even get posted? It's obviously complete satire. Click here to see all of the websites that link to this...they're all TECH HUMOR. If humor was the intended goal, it'd be responsible to make note of that in the summary. Please correct this in the dupe.

  7. /. editors got duped again !!! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative



    How do /. editors know that this was a real interview ?

    This link is not even on FOCUS magazine's website

    This post fooled you all
    The interview link in the post is on The Cantrip Corpus
    website

    cantrip: (kän tRip), n. (Chiefly Scot.)
    1. a magical charm or enchantment; 2. an elaborate deception or prank.
    corpus: (kôr pus), n., pl. -pora,
    1. a complete set of writings; 2. a dead body.

  8. Re:Give me ten programmers... by _xeno_ · · Score: 5, Insightful
    First of all, the interview is about seven years old, so think in terms of the newly released Windows 95. Those statistics are quite old, and since then I think that Bill at the very least has had to change his view of the importance of bugs in MS software over the past few years...

    Secondly, I'll bet from looking purely at support calls, he's correct. How many people are you aware of that are willing to spend money to be told "yep, that's a bug"? When Word just disappears altogether, how many people think "hmm - I'll call MS and tell them about it" and instead just throw up their hands in dismay, mutter ... something, reboot, and try again? Not that this is anything against your post - yeah, MS software is known to be buggy. But I'll bet that the metrics Bill was talking about were correct - and completely misleading.

    However, what Bill was really trying to do was argue that when Microsoft releases a new version of one of their products (Word was the example given), they are not releasing a for-pay patch. They are releasing software that contains more and better features! At least, that's his argument. The whole point of his argument was not that MS software does not contain bugs - is what that new releases aren't just expensive patches.

    Whether you agree or not...

    --
    You are in a maze of twisty little relative jumps, all alike.
  9. It was a VERY long time ago ... by SimonInOz · · Score: 5, Interesting
    Actually, this interview - or presumed interview - dates back to 1995. Let me repeat that - 1995.

    That is 8 years ago. 8 years ago Microsoft was positively pleasant compared with current behaviour.

    So who cares what Bill said (or maybe didn't say) back then?

    --
    "Cats like plain crisps"
  10. I can fill the page with my tech support stories.. by 1000101 · · Score: 5, Funny
    i work in tech support and here are some of my recent favorites:

    1. Me: Turn on your computer and when it is finished loading wait about ten seconds

    Her: How long is ten seconds?

    2. Me: Enter your 10 digit customer id (supposed to enter into box on screen).. i then hear him entering the 10 digits into the telephone

    3. Me: What version of Windows do you have?

    Her: What's Windows?

    Me: You know, Microsoft Windows. What version of the operating system do you have?

    Her: I've never heard of Windows

    4. Me: Put the floppy disc into the drive

    Him: Ok, let me open it noises...noises..noises

    Him: This disc is round but the slot is a rectangle. I don't think it will fit.

    Me: Um, did you actually take apart the floppy disc and remove it from its shell?

    Him: Oh, yeah, was I not supposed to do that?


    Above stories are all true and have happend within the last three months. Ah the joy of college part-time jobs as tech support.

  11. Re:You begin by asking questions by beaverfever · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I had the same questions you asked, and I wanted to add:

    Even if this is a real interview, we are only being given a snippet, not including what led up to the dispute between gates and the interviewer. It is not uncommon for interviewers to back interviewees into a corner and make them look like idiots. We're not being shown if that's what has happened here (even though it sounds pretty damning anyways).

    then there's the fact that it is from a German magazine. Was this published in english or was Gates originally translated into german and then back into english for us to view? That could make a difference too.

    Also, this interview is over seven years old. Haven't we all figured out that Gates is evil already? Just look at the little Gates/Borg icon - evil! Is this article really news?

    I never thought I'd defend Gates over anything, but I'm more interested in accuracy and truth than having a lynching party.

    --
    RTFM; please, I beg you.
  12. Re:Uhhh, date? by cheezedawg · · Score: 5, Informative
    Sort of like the embarassing quotes about 640k.

    http://www.usnews.com/usnews/biztech/gatesivu.htm
    Q. Did you ever say, as has been widely circulated on the Internet, "640K [of RAM] ought to be enough for anybody?"
    No! That makes me so mad I can't believe it! Do you realize the pain the industry went through while the IBM PC was limited to 640K? The machine was going to be 512K at one point, and we kept pushing it up. I never said that statement-I said the opposite of that.

    http://www.urbanlegends.com/celebrities/bill.gates /gates_memory.html

    QUESTION: I read in a newspaper that in 1981 you said, ``640K of memory should be enough for anybody.'' What did you mean when you said this?

    ANSWER: I've said some stupid things and some wrong things, but not that. No one involved in computers would ever say that a certain amount of memory is enough for all time.
    --
    "The defense of freedom requires the advance of freedom" - George W Bush
  13. Re:Im shocked (are you joking) by UcensorMe · · Score: 5, Informative

    Gates has been known to attack interviewers in the past. In recent years he has been trying to clean up his image a bit and not seem like the huge ass hole that he really is. I think Gates is so insulated from the real world that he suffers from Michael Jackson syndrome, where he is able to create his own reality. When he is confronted with the truth he becomes defensive.

  14. Re:it looks more like a satire by Bunji+X · · Score: 5, Informative

    The interview was published in October 1995, maybe Bill G has learned beeing more polite in public since back then. IIrc, he used to be a bit more arrogant.

    They say you grow older and wiser, after all.

    --
    ---
    The combined human population is enough to feed every living tiger for app. 28000 years.