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New Satellites of Jupiter Discovered

dss902 writes "The discovery of 18 new satellites of Jupiter, bringing the total of known Jupiter satellites to 58 were made using the world's two largest digital cameras at the Subaru (8.3 meter diameter) and Canada-France-Hawaii (3.6 meter diameter) telescopes atop Mauna Kea in Hawaii. Recoveries were performed at the University of Hawaii 2.2 meter with help from Yanga Fernandez and Henry Hsieh also from the University of Hawaii. Brian Marsden of the Harvard-Smithsonian Center for Astrophysics performed the orbit fitting for the new satellites. More info here." We ran a story on the first eight, but now... eighteen.

67 of 105 comments (clear)

  1. Great! by Treeluvinhippy · · Score: 5, Funny

    Some new worlds to explore with my starship made from a floppy!

    --
    >
  2. To think.... by The+Original+Yama · · Score: 3, Funny

    ... that all this time Jupiter has been mooning us 58 times simultaneously. That cheeky devil!

    1. Re:To think.... by cjellibebi · · Score: 1

      58 moons? There must be one hell of a lot of werewolves on Jupiter for sure!

  3. Other uses for the powerful technology? by Mattygfunk1 · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Would you rather have powerful telescopes pointed at Jupiter looking for more moons, or looking nearby for potential "dinosaur style" human-killing asteriods?

    I know which I would prefer.

    ___
    bump bump bump cheap web site hosting

    1. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by AndroidCat · · Score: 3, Insightful

      IANAA, but I thought that you don't really want to use the most powerful telescopes for spoting comets and asteroids. You want something that can see a relatively large area of the sky, and when you spot something moving, you zoom in with the "big guns".

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
    2. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by machine+of+god · · Score: 1

      So we can do what? Look at it while it comes down on us? While it'd be nice to know, if there's nothing we can do about it, knowing serves no function, and would be a waste of resources, I think.

    3. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by manonthespoon · · Score: 1

      Oh come on! Have major hollywood crapfests taught you nothing. There are at least TWO courses of action assuming we get a heads up on the imminent impact of a life-ending asteroid. 1: We send oilmen into space to blow it up.(Armageddon) 2: We stoically stand on the beach and wait to die.(Deep Impact) I mean, just imagine how long it will take congress to decide which we're supposed to do. Advance warning would be quite useful.

    4. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by Cyno · · Score: 1

      I'd rather hear about a new moon on jupiter before I die.

      We're all going to die someday. I'd rather not know about it before hand and be disappoint by my government one last time.

    5. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by barakn · · Score: 1

      ....unless you have a fairly good idea of where your "comets and asteroids" are going to be in the first place, like stuck in orbit around Jupiter.

      --
      "I'm so moist I'm sticking to the leather." -Kermit the Frog on The Late Late Show
    6. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

      Of course. My point was that we're not slowing down spotting Earth-intersecting objects by using powerful scopes on Jupiter and friends.

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
    7. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by cmacb · · Score: 1
      How about telescopes spotting new moons containing man-eating dinosaurs. Let's just look for those!

      OTOH I bet we COULD do more than one thing at a time.

    8. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by mikerich · · Score: 1
      Much of the risk from comets comes from short period comets that whip around the Sun in a few tens of years. And guess which planet produces short term comets?

      Yup, Jupiter.

      A comet comes in from the Oort cloud and makes a close approach to Jupiter. Jupiter's gravity turns that highly elliptical orbit into a much less elliptical orbit with its aphelion somewhere around the orbit of Jupiter. That comet then spends its time whizzing around the inner Solar System - which includes us.

      Having a look at Jupiter space could be interesting, we might see something that wasn't there before and we can take a look to see what Jupiter is catching. If we can calculate how often Jupiter picks up satellites, we can help calculate the risk to Earth.

      Best wishes,
      Mike.

    9. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by Trogre · · Score: 1

      Apparently it's a big-ass sky.

      --
      "Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
    10. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by EvilBastard · · Score: 1

      Lets see...

      They went to a small area of known volume and gravity conditions where noone had been able to see small asteroid-type bodies, and promptly went and found 18 of them.

      Sounds like a perfect proof of concept test,which is then followed by calibration, and is then followed by upscale to production.

      The techniques being developed here are *exactly* what you are asking them to do.

    11. Re:Other uses for the powerful technology? by jqpublic · · Score: 1

      IAAA and you are exactly right. For asteroid searches you want a smaller telescope with wide
      field of view. You want to cover large swaths of
      sky quickly and frequently, returning to those same areas to see what has moved.

  4. Re:Subaru? by s20451 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I don't know if the telescope is associated with the company. However, in Japanese, "Subaru" is the name for the the Pleiades star cluster.

    --
    Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
  5. Do any of the new ones look like black slabs? by happyhippy · · Score: 3, Funny

    In the proportion 1:3:9?

    1. Re:Do any of the new ones look like black slabs? by sprouty76 · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Shouldn't that be 1:4:9 - the squares of 1, 2, 3?

      Been a while since I read it so I may be mistaken.

      --

      No, I don't want a free iPod

    2. Re:Do any of the new ones look like black slabs? by inode_buddha · · Score: 1

      you may be correct; 1:4:9 was the proportions of the mysterious monolith described by Arthur C. Clarke in 2001: A Space Oddessey.

      Strangely similar to the Golden Mean.

      --
      C|N>K
    3. Re:Do any of the new ones look like black slabs? by g00z · · Score: 1

      We just picked up a transmission from jupiter:

      "All These Worlds Are Yours Except Europa. Attempt No Landing There. Use Them Together. Use Them in Peace."

      --
      "The Wright brothers were the first to fly with a heavier-than-air machine, but boy did they have a lousy plane"
  6. You mean by pardasaniman · · Score: 2, Funny

    You mean the Canada-Freedom-Hawaii!! Silly Americans! Tricks are for kids!

    1. Re:You mean by Drakonian · · Score: 1

      Hehe, as a Canadian I was expecting something more along the lines of Freedom-Freedom-Hawaii.

      --
      Random is the New Order.
    2. Re:You mean by Zaak · · Score: 1

      Hehe, as a Canadian I was expecting something more along the lines of Freedom-Freedom-Hawaii.

      No, most of Canada can stay. It's just Freedom Canada that has got to go.

      Darn Freedomians.

      TTFN

  7. Those guys a start a company by arvindn · · Score: 4, Funny
    Jovian satellite naming services Inc

    Get your own Jupiter moon NOW! We offer to name any newly discovered satellite of Jupiter with a word of your choice. Rates starting at just $100/moon! For satellites up to a diameter of 500 km we charge only $100, and $50 extra for every 200km of additional size. You can pre-book a name for yet to be discovered satellites up to 3 years in advance! We have exclusive contracts with international astrophysical society. So hurry!!

  8. Ramblings by ticklemeozmo · · Score: 1

    The dept line says "jupiter's-a-daddy"..

    Who is the mommy? Mother Earth of course! Why not Venus? Although hot, she's deadly.

    The only problem is that Earth has things that can be transferred from planet to planet.. humans! A cosmic STD if you will.

    --
    When modding "Informative", please make sure it both has a source and IS actually informative.
    1. Re:Ramblings by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

      Hmm... You never know with these god types. Bulls, golden showers, making it with swans.. As well as the more common sort of thing.

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
  9. Why? by A+nonymous+Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

    What's the difference between a moon and a lump of rock? Why catalog rocks at Jupiter and let all the rocks in Saturn's rings go uncatalogued? Where is the dividing line?

    1. Re:Why? by hobbesmaster · · Score: 1

      Notice they said "Satellites" not moons. More or less anything in orbit of a planet counts as a Satellite. Earth has two or three natural satellites (including the moon) and several thousand arteficial satellites, IIRC.

    2. Re:Why? by Theodore+Logan · · Score: 4, Informative

      First off, note that the write up mentions only satellites and says nothing about moons.

      But as for your question: historically there hasn't been a need for a hard definition, and hence there isn't one. At this point in time, however, with 118 official moons in the solar system and a whole bunch of candidates, lines need to be drawn.

      You may want to read this article for details.

      --

      "If you think education is expensive, try ignorance" - Derek Bok

    3. Re:Why? by imsabbel · · Score: 2, Informative

      well, it is true that these new moons arent very large, but saturns rings are 99% little more then dust (the roche-threshold is a bitch). There are a few very large "rocks" in the rings, but they are reckognized as moons.

      --
      HI O WISE PRINCE. WHT TOOK U SO DAM LONG?
    4. Re:Why? by hesiod · · Score: 1

      > What's the difference between a moon and a lump of rock?

      What's the difference between a planet and a lump of rock? Nothing except scale. Take into account Pluto & the Kiuper belt. There are rocks bigger than Pluto orbiting the Sun but aren't classified as planets. It's only because humans have a tendency (arguably, a "need") to classify everything that we argue about if something is a planet, moon, rock, whatnot. They're all rocks (some of them very large rocks, mind you), regardless of size or what it is orbiting.

      Aha, I knew those books on Zen would come in handy... The planet does not really exist.

  10. Re:Subaru? by worst_name_ever · · Score: 4, Funny

    Yes, they make a telescope, and it transfers power from the moons that slip to the moons that grip!

    --

    In Soviet Rush, today's Tom Sawyer gets high on you.
  11. definition by VanillaCoke420 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    What is a moon? We don't even have a definition for a planet yet.

    1. Re:definition by B3ryllium · · Score: 2, Funny

      A moon is when you bend over and show Uranus to someone.

    2. Re:definition by Amon+Re · · Score: 1

      I thought a planet was just some object that orbits a star.

    3. Re:definition by VanillaCoke420 · · Score: 1

      When is it a planet and when is it a star? As far as I understand, there is no established standard for what exactly is a planet. If a planet is "some object that orbits a star", then the Kuiper belt objects, asteroids, Oort objects and comets would all be planets? There is a discussion going on whether or not Pluto is a planet or a KBO, for example.

  12. Re:I doubt that the observations are correct. by AndroidCat · · Score: 1
    I doubt that they're in close. If they were they'd be perturbed by the major jovian moons and probably bumped out of orbit. And they would have had to have a cloaking device to remain hidden from probes orbiting Jupiter for years.

    Cloaking device? "That's no moon..."

    --
    One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
  13. Re:I doubt that the observations are correct. by CheshireCatCO · · Score: 4, Informative

    Please explain the logic that lead to your conclusion that these moons are so close to Jupiter? Smaller has NEVER meant closer to the primary. Mars is smaller than Earth. Saturn, Uranus and Neptune are smaller than Jupiter. Kuiper-Belt and Oort Cloud comets are smaller than nearly anything else. I could go on with this listing for quite a while, but you get the point.

    If you check the database, all of these newly discovered moons are outside of the orbits of most of the heretofore known moons. Well, well outside, in fact. These irregular moons are probably captured asteroids.

    For your calculation to be right, by the way, the moons would be orbiting Jupiter 35 meters from it's barycenter. I'm going to question your orbital semi-major axes. (Also, your mass of Jupiter is incorrect. It's 318 times the mass of Earth.) Also, moons don't rotate about their planet, they revolve. Rotate means to spin.

  14. Strange by Timesprout · · Score: 4, Insightful

    to think that given the size of the universe we are still discovering things that are practically on top of us. Makes you wonder what else is out there.

    --
    Do not try to read the dupe, thats impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth
    What truth?
    There is no dupe
  15. Thanks God by BohKnower · · Score: 2, Funny

    I always use Jupiter's satellites to name my servers and I was getting out of options.

    1. Re:Thanks God by B3ryllium · · Score: 1

      Heheh ... I suppose "Io" is a very appropriate name for a server.

    2. Re:Thanks God by tom420.com · · Score: 1

      Now you have 18 new names: J-1 through J-18 :)

  16. Re:Important information by manonthespoon · · Score: 1

    I think someone should mod the parent poster up. Even if this is a serious attempt to criticize linux, it's more funny then a troll. I guess it is sort of off topic though.

  17. Re:I doubt that the observations are correct. by Wyatt+Earp · · Score: 1

    Many of Jupiter's moons have distant orbits.

    Thebe, Amalthea, Metis and Adrastea are small and close in, then Io, Europa, Ganymede, Callisto. The rest of them are in a mess of orbits going out quite a way.

  18. 58 satellites? Appropriate. by Brown+Line · · Score: 1

    Well, it's only appropriate that Jupiter have such a harem of consorts. Any idea what they'll be named?

    --
    [this .sig for rent]
    1. Re:58 satellites? Appropriate. by Anonymous+Cow+herd · · Score: 1

      They will all be named "Monica Lewinski". :-)

      --
      Ita erat quando hic adveni.
  19. Why is this a big deal? by Cyno01 · · Score: 1

    It says satellites, not moons, big difference. It was my understanding that jupiter, along with all of the gas giants, each had inumerable satellites, they're called rings.

    --
    "Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
    1. Re:Why is this a big deal? by tom420.com · · Score: 1

      In most documentation I've been reading (including from the Nasa and some simplified scientific readings) 'moon' is used as a synonim, a simpler word to explain quickly what is a satellite... are they really 2 different words?

  20. Naming of moons by Shanes · · Score: 1
    Those guys are of course free call the moons whatever they want, but the official names are assigned by WGPSN (working group on Planetary System Nomenclature) and finally aproved by the International Astronomical Union's General Assembly.

    And they tend to stick to mythology names... Last October 11 Jupiter moons discovered 2-3 years earlier were assigned names from the Greco-Roman mythology.

    1. Re:Naming of moons by AndroidCat · · Score: 1

      By now they must be down to Hum, God of Things That Were There a Moment Ago.

      --
      One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
  21. I Propose a New Icon by use_compress · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If scientists want to find 100 moons orbiting Jupiter, there are going to be many Slashdot articles on new Jovian moons. Thus, I propose we create a new icon for all of these articles.

  22. Mass of Jupiter. by Eevee · · Score: 2, Funny

    You know how it is with those crash diets. First you cut back until you're only 254 times as massive as the Earth. Then, you get a sudden craving for a frozen treat and have a couple of comets and bam! You're up to 318 again.

  23. Galileo by dsfd · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Galileo discovered only four but this (among other reasons) was enough for Roman Church to prosecute him. The existence of objects moving arround Jupiter was a serious problem for the official geocentric model of the universe, and therefore, a challenge to the authority of the Church. Only recently, the Pope apologized for that.

    I wonder what would they think of the existence of 58 Jovian satellites, just to mention one of the wonders that science has discovered.. Can we reach conclusions from the past history and apply them to the present ?

    1. Re:Galileo by rcw-home · · Score: 1
      Can we reach conclusions from the past history and apply them to the present?

      No. The heretical principles of Separation of Church and State and Free Speech must not be allowed to threaten the authority of the church.

    2. Re:Galileo by axxackall · · Score: 1
      Only recently, the Pope apologized for that.

      "Oops. Wrong guy. Or wrong reasons. Or wrong methods. Or concepts. Whatever. Sorry."

      Every church is a political organization fighting to have more followers, who is willing to pay more money for support the curch or whose mind is desired by the big paying guy. Every religion is a tool of such mind control and it is usually a very dogmatized philosophy (with God faith most likely).

      Our souls is a very internal matter and it does not require any political infrastructure to improve it. One teacher at most. But even that is not necessary. All we need is just to work (mentally and spiritually) to discover it. We have all needed information deep inside us, including meta-information about how to work. The will to find it is enough.

      --

      Less is more !
  24. Re:Subaru? by The+Dobber · · Score: 2, Informative

    Actually its owned by the Japanese goverment. As I recall, the prime contractor was Mitsubishi. That was a long time ago (10+ years) though, so I might be wrong. Big ass piece of glass though. 30+ tons, shipping box weighed another 30 tons.

    Little background on the scope

    http://www.corning.com/discovery_center/subaru_i nd ex_content_pop.asp

  25. Re:Yep while by tom420.com · · Score: 1

    so, everything smaller than us doesn't worth existing?

  26. How Jovian are they really? by dspeyer · · Score: 1

    The article says that the orbits they'v calculated are only preliminary. I wonder if, when other gravitational fields are taken into acount, they're really closed around Jupiter. The satellites are orbiting backward, which sounds a lot like they used to orbit the sun forwards a little clsoer iun than Jupiter.

    I wouldn't be surprised if they become sun-orbiting asteroids within 100 years.

    1. Re:How Jovian are they really? by mikerich · · Score: 1
      If the satellites are in retrograde orbits they're certainly captures from somewhere.

      Retrograde orbits are not stable in the long term. The tidal effects of Jupiter will cause the satellite's orbit to decay; the satellite will drift ever-closer to the planet with an accelerating rate of decay.

      Jupiter has got 'em good and hard and will eventually pull them apart.

      But not for a few million years.

      Damn, I evolved too early!

      Best wishes,
      Mike.

    2. Re:How Jovian are they really? by CheshireCatCO · · Score: 1

      Yep, they're almost certainly captured. But their lifetimes are probably a lot longer than you think. Tidal effects depend on the mass of the moon creating the tidal bulge and the proximity to Jupiter. Small, distant moons don't raise much in the way of tides and feel little in the way of higher order gravitation moments from Jupiter. So they don't evolve tidal very quickly at all. I'd guess that it would take billions of years to get them in close to Jupiter. In fact, the effects of other bodies (moons, other planets, etc) probably overwelm the tidal effects.

      Without tides, retrograde moons are a lot *more* stable than prograde moons. Hamilton and Krivov have a paper where they discuss some of this, but retrograde moons are stable out to about a Hill radius (half an astronomical unit, in the case of Jupiter), while prograde moons are only stable out to about half of a Hill radius.

      This points to a pretty good test of whether these are Jovian moons: are they inside the Hill sphere? If "yes", then the are probably fairly well bound. Since I seem to recall Scott Sheppard is searching the Hill sphere (this is from a talk at a meeting, so I'm relying on my memory, here), I'll bet that these fit the bill.

    3. Re:How Jovian are they really? by mikerich · · Score: 1
      Oooh thanks for all the extra information. And who said Slashdot wasn't educational?

      Best wishes,
      Mike.

  27. Re:I doubt that the observations are correct. by tom420.com · · Score: 1

    So, you are better then them? What are you doing here on /. then? Why aren't you at the observatory providing us with better figures than they did?

  28. I wonder... by Trogre · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...how long it will take for these moons to appear in Celestia.

    Quaoar and 2002 MN were added only a few days after being discovered.

    --
    "Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
    1. Re:I wonder... by Gruuue · · Score: 1

      You can already get a Celestia add-on with the new moons:

      http://shatters.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2112

      --Chris

  29. Re:Subaru? by k-0s · · Score: 1

    Why would Mitsubishi make a telescope named after a rival, Subaru? That seems like a bonehead move.

  30. Re:And then? by GeekDork · · Score: 1
    Of course hippie-slackers such as yourself will proably lay about in traffic (not a bad ideal actually) and whine about how we are depriving the asteroid of its rights and blah, blah, blah.

    Ah, the sweet smell of prejudice. First off, I wouldn't think that I'd meet your definition of "hippie-slacker" all too well (whatever that might be). If by hippie-slacker you mean "CS student with a basic understanding of physics that shaves regularly and is just a little sceptical about governments going gung-ho", then yes, that's about me.

    Second, I'd like to know what rights an asteroid has in your whacky little - and certainly interesting in case of a hit - world. That's a problem a lot of people would certainly love to see answered. I can imagine a dialogue going like this:

    Operator: "Incoming asteroid! Stop in an orbit and cease all hostile activities. You have the right to remain silent. You also have the right to be strip-mined into oblivion. Please stand by until the chinese shuttles arrive."
    Asteroid: "..."
    --

    Fight hunger. Filet a politician and send him to a 3rd world country of your choice.

  31. Subaru company logo by John+Bayko · · Score: 1

    In addition, the logo you see on all Subaru cars is a set of stars - a stylized version of the constellation itself.