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Archos Releases Portable Video/Image/MP3 Player
GregGardner writes "Archos is about to release the AV300 series, the next generation of portable video/image/MP3 player based off of the Archos Jukebox Multimedia discussed on Slashdot previously. Features include a 3.8" LCD screen for viewing movies and photos, FM tuner, MP3 playing and recording, 20GB or 40GB HD models, USB2.0 (optional Firewire) connection, TV-out, MPEG-4 encoding from a video/audio-in signal, digital photo (3.3 megapixel) and video camera, and much more. Looks like some of the features require add-on modules. I found a brief review on SF Gate which states that the 20GB model (AV320) will retail for $570."
Sounds great, but what kind of resolution are we talking about here? I wouldn't want to see fuzzy, pixellated video writ large on my TV screen, whether it comes from my VCR or a tiny MP3 player
a world in progress...
Plus, I want a spellchecker with that.
Features include a 3.8" LCD screen for viewing movies and photos, FM tuner, MP3 playing and recording, 20GB or 40GB HD models, USB2.0 (optional Firewire) connection, TV-out, MPEG-4 encoding from a video/audio-in signal, digital photo (3.3 megapixel) and video camera, and much more.
All those and it can't cook me a steak?
Bah, I'm not impressed.
Mike
was the piano wire and the snakebite kit.
Jeez, you can't buy any 'gadget' today without it having a mediocre digital camera built in.
The main product it self seem to be just a hub for joining together add on components. Its not really an all in one as it can only do one thing at a time dependant on what componant is attached. It seem very much like a marketing scam to me, why not put all the componants in the main product instead of selling them as extras. Without the extras it doesn't seem to do much at all.
You (and I) are the minority. I too am waiting for ogg support, but oggs aren't easily available on popular P2P networks yet, so nobody is in a huge rush to make a product that there's not much demand for.
Seriously, this sounds like a pretty cool gadget, but I'd like to see what kind of battery life this thing has, and it doesn't look to me like it'll stand up to being bashed around particularly well. The linked review didn't seem at all comprehensive however.
This article came out almost exactly a year ago and has an interesting quote regarding all the devices, including this one, that license MPEG4:
"The MPEG-4 compression has run into controversy regarding high licensing fees. So significant were the fees that Apple actually delayed the release of Quicktime 6 in protest. How this will all play out with users over time is not known yet, but unless this fee issue is addressed it may dampen adoption by users."
Also, the link above links to this article regarding the entire controversy. (It's kind of funny because the first article is dated before the second one, so obviously that article was modified to include the link after being first published without the date changing.)
I wonder if they've managed to knock down the price or if the license is a significant portion of the cost of the device?
Why do I h8 apple?
I can get a decent used laptop on eBay for less than the cost of the device, and I can also then do word processing, war driving, mild gaming, etc, and STILL do everything that this device can. Why should I buy it? Size? Size does matter, but cost matters more to me.
The IBM Thinkpad 240 series, the tiny sharps, the tiny Sonys, all available, of decent quality, and inexpensive.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
The big issue with this Archos will be whether its manufacturing feels as flimsy as their earlier models. Archos usually seems to be well ahead of the curve in features and price, but usually far behind in appearance, construction, and usability...
Now if this had a better price, I (along with most people) would buy one.
Dude, where's my packet?
One more item to carry around and brake the screen on. I'm still waiting for the PDA that can do anything fast and store a lot.
Ogg Vorbis is a niche format. It may be technically superior, but so was betamax. It's all about whether or not it gets player support. If it doesn't, all the superiority in the world won't save it.
You may want to keep this in mind while you're busily converting all your CDs.
--
the strongest word is still the word "free"
I'm wondering if when Ogg version 2 will be released you'll convert all your CDs into this new format or if you'll keep them on your "very old and bad" Ogg V1 format.
Industry needs to settle itself on a media, and MP3 seems to be acceptable. In 5 years, we'll have 5TB HDDs in these little devices and my 256kb MP3 collection will fit just fine into 5% of it.
And we'll also have Ogg V6 which will oblige yourself to re-encode for the 6th time all of your CDs (Or you'll be blamed to be such a retard for using OggV5)
My point being, who knows if there is a need for Ogg support on these things? Certainly not a commercial need...
Write boring code, not shiny code!
now if they add 10" or bigger screen, wouldn't it be called PC?
How about a PC with 3.8" screen, without CD/DVD, very few ports..? It should be possible to manufacture one much cheaper than USD 570 (the list price for 20 GB).
It is a cool device but at that price point, it will compete with sub-notebook PC and people will compare with it. Other than small size and touch sensitive screen, it has nothing extra but has lot less than PC.
Hmm... so I can spend around $550 on this thing, which, with all the extras is much mre likely to be around $700.
OR
I can spend a little more and get a nice iBook [or insert your favourite budget notebook here] which is a thousand times more capable.
I don't think the features vs price really pays off to be honest. Things like the iPod/MP3 players work because they offer an awful lot your PC can't (portability, battery life, simplicity, PRICE).
This device would be a pain in the ass to look at for 20 mins let alone an entire movie! The battery life isn't all that great, the HDD space is only acceptable - nothing stellar, and the cost is really pretty damn high.
Can you see Joe Public or your boss ripping and encoding his own DiVX's from his DVD'a? I can't... I love DiVX but I'm a geek, this just doesn't seem to appeal to the masses.
I think these guys are afraid that the iPod got a jump on them in the MP3 arena, and now they're trying to enter/create a product a couple of years before the stability and market is there to support it ut of fear from being left behind again.
-Nex
This sig has been deprecated.
Well I was so looking forward to buying this thing.
When i first read about it in Wired , It said, it would retail about 350-375 $. But 570$ give me a break.
Plus add another 70-80 bucks for firewire cable and 50-70 bucks for the compact flash adapter. Thats too much price to pay.
Besides archos JBM 20 had some serious design flaws like plastic buttons etc. And archos is not exactly known for after sales service.
for the last time people, I am "frodo from middle eaRTH", not "middle eaST".
This will go nowhere until Apple does something like this, and then everyone will say Apple has innovated yet again.
Hell, I bought a secondhand Compaq Armada M700... for $500US That's a PIII, with 256Meg of RAM, a DVD drive and a 20Gig Hard Drive, with all the ports you could want (Except Firewire)...
So, cheaper, probably as good battery life, and a FAR better screen for watching movies (14.4"), and it's got TV out just like this...
Just doesn't appeal at this pricepoint.
I own one of their MP3 players. It worked briefly for me, and when it broke I was never able to get them to answer me, either via phone (no call back) or e-mail (and a lot of those).
I'll never buy a product from this company again.
When those guys made the Rockbox for Archos Jukebox 6k, I was modded up for lambasting the poor quality of their software... And for good reason, v0.1 sucked cock, they shouldn't have released it in such a sorry state... BUT! You might want to go back and check it out again, it kicks serious butt.
If Archos dropped the Rockbox guys a copy of their new hardware, Archos wouldn't have to invest in a software dept... ^^;;
[o]_O
So, with the AV300, I worry whether or not we'll see a version of Rockbox or something similar, or whether the firmware that comes in box will be at least serviceable this time around. If not, at that price tag, this device will try and fail to compete with both the smaller laptops and the portable DVD players.
The following may sound like a flamebait, but it's not. I am not making any statements to you in particular, or to anybody. I am just making a general observation.
I'm wondering if when Ogg version 2 will be released you'll convert all your CDs into this new format or if you'll keep them on your "very old and bad" Ogg V1 format.
What I am wondering instead is - when, in the future, MP3 replacement is spoonfed to you with the same or even harsher restrictions that MPEG-4 currently enjoys, will you simply bend over as usual, or will you demand and use something standard that works better and bears no cost to you, or anyone, to use in any way they please?
And we'll also have Ogg V6 which will oblige yourself to re-encode for the 6th time all of your CDs (Or you'll be blamed to be such a retard for using OggV5)
Actually, it is MP3 format that is fast reaching its end of lifecycle. Start off, it is inferior to other current formats, including Vorbis (which you call Ogg). It already has bunch of unclean "hacks" for variable bitrate support, as well as multiple ways and versions to store information about the audio - ID tags. Combining MP3 with another such patented "standard" - SBR - already led to a disaster - nobody actually uses it.
Vorbis, on the other hand, has a cleaner upgrade path; starting from that the encoding algorithm may be improved in the future AND remain backwards-compatible.
I'm not saying that Vorbis will rule the world, but discounting its capabilities is not looking at a full picture.
Then Apple will wait and then deliver what we are really looking for in this package. Not to say that this AV Jukebox is a slack product, quite the contrary, its actually almost feature bloated. That and its size, weight (big weight, tiny screen),and cost are going to turn many off besdies early adopters.
t m ). Apple has had products like this in the skunkworks for a good while, but it seems after the Newton panned and Palm took over that Apple has switched to a "wait, see, and capitalize" approach (see also flagging tablet PC sales).
I say Apple not only because the iPod was the answer to the original Jukebox but also the Knowlege Navigator (see: http://www.billzarchy.com/clips/clips_apple_nav.h
---- The real Slashdot is still here. You just have to browse at -1 to read the comments.
Industry needs to settle itself on a media, and MP3 seems to be acceptable.
You are thinking small.
Why can't all the cool new devices support MP3 -- and Ogg Vorbis? Ogg is very close to free: no license fees for Ogg, free reference sources for Ogg decoders (including Tremor, the integer-math only decoder), a little bit more ROM space used on the device. There are already devices that decode both MP3 and Windows Media audio files.
If you had a small band, and you wanted to sell compressed songs online, which would you rather use: MP3, where you will have to pay a minimum of $2000 per year, or Ogg Vorbis, where you will have to pay a maximum of $0? (That small band may not have to pay anything this year since the MP3 licensing authority waives the royalty for "entities with an annual gross revenue less than US$ 100 000.00." But they could change the rules at any time. They own MP3 and they can charge whatever they want.)
People had to choose between VHS and Betamax because it is not possible to make a device that can play both. (Well, you could, but it would be large and expensive so few would buy it.) Ogg Vorbis may become huge overnight, or it may be a niche product forever, but the costs of rolling it out are so small that it will happen.
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
Why is there a $40 difference between the 20 and 40GB hdd's? They're both 2.5" laptop hdd's and if you look around both those capacities sell for around $80-85 bucks, so asking an extra $40 for the larger drive (or heck even offering the lower capacity drive) is kind of nuts. These are comodity components, use whatever best fits the price point of what the consumer want to pay, not pick a bunch of cheap crap and inflate the bigger sounding unit. That's one of the reasons I loved my iPod so much, the hdd seperatly cost nearly as much as the iPod so I knew Apple wasn't trying to screw me on the componenets.
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
The iPod is what, 2 years old? I thought we'd have some interesting "clones" by now, but I only know of one, and it's just as expensive as the iPod.
Dude: the Windows iPod came out months and months and months ago. And the current-generation iPod (the iPod G3, if you will) will work right out of the box with either Windows or a Mac.
The iPod is not a Mac-specific device.
But between you and me, you'd be better off getting a G2 iPod. It's got a built-in FireWire port so you don't have to diddle with that silly dock thing. And it's got better battery life. And (best of all) you can get them cheap. Well, cheaper anyway.
Eumm... Just a small observation to your observation.
Archos is hardly a "startup" company... I've got a harddrive interface made by archos from around 1993 - 1994.
And one of their first mp3 players with a 6 gig harddrive, bought around 2.5 years ago. Still one of the best players I've seen. No special software to access it, just a driver to mount it as a harddrive. Great. =)
And since they're established in both France and the US, It would be surprising if they didn't sell their products in at least Europe and North America.
/.Mattsson - My native language is not English, so please don't whine over linguistic errors. (That's lame anyway...)
NPR is good on FM but that's only one station.
Personally, I can see a definite desire for an AM receiver.
I love my Recorder 20 device from Archos, but, the quality of their products is deplorable. After convincing a friend to purchase an Archos, he returned 3 20s to Fry's as they were all DOA.
After hearing about 2 different 20 Recorders failing (on top of the three DOAs), I doubt I would trust Archos hardware any time soon.
In addition to the hardware issues, the software is not the best either. Look at some of the threads on this topic to hear about those issues. I love the recorder, but it fails more times then is succeeds. I have had to go back to CDR for my concert work as the Archos hard locks 20 minutes into most performances.
So Archos is 2 for 2. Hardware that fails and buggy software. Excellent ideas and great price, but you get what you pay for...
why doesnt anyone support it?
that is why i encoded all my (500) cd's at 256k mp3. not b/c its a better format or its lining frauhofer's pockets, but because i can listen to em anywhere.
let me see your:
dvd player, ipod, car cd player and home component cd player play an ogg and then i still wont change because in 5 years they still wont be making ogg stuff.
im osrry i wanted ogg to work too but its just not happening. that said apple telling me to encode my shit using AAC is about as likely as my using WMA.
mp3 may not be 'open' but its about as close as you can get these days and still actually use and enjoy your audio when/where you would like.
---- The real Slashdot is still here. You just have to browse at -1 to read the comments.
AV320 is 4.4 x 3.2 x 1.2 inches, 12.5 ounces
palm tungston is 4.8 x 3.1 x 0.7 inches, 6.3 ounces
apple ipod is 4.1 x 2.4 x 0.6 inches, 5.6 ounces
playing movies is nice, but not at twice the depth and weight.
sorry, that's too heavy and too deep.
all i want is a touchscreen, good sound output, and 5+gb storage.
manage it with a real OS (like palm, linux, even winCE) and you'll have my money.
Use my userscript to add story images to Slashdot. There's no going back.
it's called a LAPTOP. My Sony Picturebook can do all that and more, I got it used for not much more than the Archos unit and it's MUCH more functional. I use somewhat souped-up older used or low-end laptops and PC's for everything computing-wise and can do 99% of my friends that insist on the latest and greatest over-modded bling-bling and the latest marketroid eye candy can do, for about 1/3 to 1/2 the cost. Isn't park of the hacker ethic doing more with less, nbot just throwing you're hard earned dead presidents at the latest trend?
[what?]
The hardware is ruggedly built, and I'm pleased with it.
But the Archos firmware is wholly disappointing. Even the Archos font is lacking -- it's got no true descenders ("g", "y", "p").
There's an excellent GLP'd replacement, Rockbox (rockbox.haxx.se). It's literally an order of magnitude faster in displaying directories, and has a plethora of additional features.
The only "problem" with the GPL'd replacement is that, due to Archos's paranoia over its IP, the replacemnt had to be built up by labourious reverse engineering.
I'll buy new products from Archos when they release their specifications and sample code. Not before.
Opinions on the Twiddler2 hand-held keyboard?
I sig, therefore I was.
Sure I did. Did you read what I wrote?
So -- you can use MP3, and pay whatever Fraunhofer decides to charge you.
Or, you can use WMA, and pay whatever Microsoft decides to charge you.
Or, you can use Ogg, and pay $0.
Your choice.
It's nice that Vorbis is there. Even if few adopt it, it will keep Fraunhofer from jacking up the price of MP3 because they know they would just drive customers to Vorbis.
steveha
lf(1): it's like ls(1) but sorts filenames by extension, tersely
I harddly see any enthusiasm in here. Though I think this Archos product is the greatest gadget ever made. Let me write obvious facts about the amayzing AV340:
It playsback 640x368 resolution DivX. It records 320x240 video at 25 frames per second. This means you can take your 100 favourite DivX movies with you in your pocket. And watch them in your video-glasses while you drive.
I do have a couple concerns about this player. Though following concerns probably won't stop me from selling my Archos JBMM20 on ebay (which I own since August 2002 and use very often) to buy the awesome AV340 instead:
1. Texas Instruments, who is making the processor which you find inside the Archos AV340, it's the DSC25. The DSC25 seems to be old. This might be sad, cause a 720MHZ DSP processor is available. (and a 1GHZ processor will be available in a few months) - Such 720MHZ or 1GHZ processors definately would perform better than 640x368 playback and 320x240 DivX record. Though Archos might get some help from DivXNetworks optimizing the DivX-support using the DSC25 inside the AV340 to the maximum and a firmware upgrade might be released to support better resolutions.
2. The Batteries. One can only get 3 houres of video-playback on the 3,8inch LCD. And Archos might again not provide an easy battery change possibillity. I wouldn't mind carrying around a couple extra batteries in my other pocket to swap into the player every 3 houres.
Archos here, developing portable DivX player designs since the beginning of 2002, definately has a knowledge in Portable DivX Player/Recorder manufacture. Which I think it is possible even Intel and Microsoft with their media2Go cannot equal. The Media2Go which might even not be available before christmas (picture of Media2Go).
A question I would like to ask all the other companies (Sony, Casio, Panasonic, HP, Philips..). Why don't you put a harddrive and a 720MHZ processor in your Cameras and PDAs! (up to 80GB 2,5" IBM pixie-dust harddrives are available that can fit in such portable design, IBM promizes 150GB). But somehow, I might be ignorant, it seems no one cares or knows how to put 720MHZ and a harddrive in the pocket. Only Archos can do it!
I currently own the Multimedia 020. It's great, but you have to downconvert all your DivX files to their preferred resolution. It's a limitation of the chip they use... looks like the 340 will be better in that regard, but what's really needed is somethign where you can take any DivX file straight of Kazaa onto the JBMM and have it play correctly at the resolution they need for the their screen.
--D