What Do You Get When You Buy a CD?

Wiseleo asks: "What is the full value and meaning of the entire transaction when someone exchanges money or its electronic equivalent for a new sealed CD?Notice that I am being extra careful to say that someone actually acquires anything of value in the deal. I am not claiming that anything is bought in the traditional sense either. I am in fact not claiming that any value whatsoever is procured through the transaction. Can someone actually answer this question? I would really love the RIAA to do so, and in fact, I intend to contact them for this purpose. This question is surprisingly complex. I first attempted to get it answered some 10 years ago by several music stores and they could not answer it. I guess I should have talked to attorneys, but I was a teenager clueless of such an avenue. I tried again late 90s and again I couldn't get the question answered. In other words, any 'commercial' CD that is produced by a RIAA-affiliated CD manufacturer clearly states that it is not to be loaned. If I 'buy' a CD, what am I actually paying for?"

Wiseleo adds:

• Am I paying for the CD media itself?
• Am I paying for the right to play that particular CD media?
• Am I paying for right to listen to that particular recording without relying on mass media outlets that already paid RIAA copyright holders through ASCAP?
• What happens if I own the same recording in multiple digital formats?
• What happens if a particular copyrighted material is on several of my media and comes from same master source?
• What if my media is damaged, should I not be able to request replacement?
• If I already own let's say Metallica S&M DVD set, am I legally allowed to borrow a friend's S&M CD set, since both media are mixed from the same source [and possibly covered by the same license]?
• What are the quality tolerances and who sets them? At which point is the original recording no longer subject to copy limitations? What happens if my used media is scratched?
• I am inclined to believe that the acquiring party simply acquires a license for a particular recording. It is currently implied, at least in my understanding, that the license is perpetual and as such a license holder is entitled to the ability to use the licensed object perpetually, regardless of the media it was originally supplied on or the media player of choice at the moment. If my understanding is correct, and the content is licensed to the consumer, then where is the full license agreement?
• By the [above] argument, should we not consider it to be a shrink-wrap and thus largely unenforceable EULA?
• Is it not true that shrink-wrapped software is not returnable to the retailer but it is returnable to the manufacturer upon termination of license? Should not music be under the same category?

What exactly do the RIAA's customers actually pay for? Until this question is answered, how can we possibly hope to communicate with the organization unless we know our exact terms and conditions that accompany the entire term of the transaction?"

Comments

Copyrights?

[W33dz]

You are asking an interesting question, but I think you are getting too far into the trees and missing the freaking forest.

1. You own the materials that take home with you. If someone steals it out of your car, it is theft. You own the physical medium. Sort of like the difference between hardware and software. . .you own what you can touch.
2. You own the right to listen to and enjoy the product on the cd. It is yours to use as you see fit as long as you do not violate #3.
3. You do not own the right to edit, copy or otherwise distribute the product. The product is a copyrighted material. If you edit the song to use at a dance party you MUST get permission from the holder of the copyright.
4. You might argue that you expected more in the transaction, but in reality you are buying the medium and then buying the rights to use the product. You are not buying the product.
5. Fair use? Fair use regards using PART of the product in a way that is non-commercial. It is defined differently depending on who is using it as well. There is quite a bit more leeway for a teacher in an educational setting.
I need a prozac.

Re:Copyrights?

[parliboy]

But to what part of these are the costs attributed. Since the physical media has a retail value of pennies, if that, then the value of the purchase is in the license itself. Therefore, if I steal 1,000 RIAA CD's from your house, I have not actually stolen enough to cause a felony, yes?

Re:Copyrights?

[BobTheLawyer]

the value of something in a market economy is simply what people are willing to pay for it. In the case of a CD, that's $12 or so.

Re:Copyrights?

[dafoomie]

3. You do not own the right to edit, copy or otherwise distribute the product. The product is a copyrighted material. If you edit the song to use at a dance party you MUST get permission from the holder of the copyright.


I don't see how editing fits in with distribution. In fact, I can do whatever I want with the song, if its personal, non-commercial use. I would have the same rights to play an edited song at a party as I would a non-edited song. Whether its adding my voice, or bleeping out certain words. Now, if I tried to call it my own work or the author's work and sell it, thats against the law.

the way I see it

[phantomlord]

you're paying for personal use of the content of the CD. This allows you to use the content in a non-commercial manner and to convert it to other formats to suit your own needs (ie, I find it much easier to have a bunch of ogg vorbis files on my hard drive than to pull out a cd every time I want to listen to something). You can give the CD away (either through sale or lending it), but you must destroy any of your alternate formats when doing so.

It does NOT allow you to receive or distribute alternate formatted music, even to other people who own the CD (or tape or whatever), as the purpose of copyright law is to give control over distribution to the copyright holder (IANAL, but IMO, it's NOT fair use). That is, if you want a mp3, you need to create it yourself from your own source. Your right to use the content for your own purposes only extends so far as the original is intact in some form (ie, if you crack your cd, you still have a right to the content. If you throw it out or burn the CD beyond recognition, you don't... same as with a book.)

The EULA

[NickMc2000]

The closest thing that I can find to a licencse agreement on the actuall product is "all rights reserved. Unauthorized duplication is a violation of applicable laws." That really says nothing. If all I am buying is a license for the right to listen to a cd then I want that in writing with the cd. There are EULAs with software, why not music? I want to know my rights and have the ability to return the cd if I do not agree with them.

Oh for the love of Christ.

[cpt kangarooski]

When you buy a CD in a normal transaction you own to the full extent such things are ownable by anyone, the CD and its contents.

Simple as that. There is no license at all. You just own that copy of the creative work. Note that ownership of a particular copy of a work is distinct from whether or not you hold a copyright. Selling you a copy doesn't mean you were sold a copyright.

What you're allowed to do with the CD is regulated by law, much as what you're allowed to do with your car is regulated by law. The law might say you can't make copies and sell them, just as the law might say you can't drive 200 miles an hour in a school zone.

Under certain circumstances, the regulations you're subject to might not be relevant. The most significant example is probably when a certain period of time -- the copyright term -- expires, and the law basically no longer regulates at all what you can do with the work.

Where people come up with this license bullshit is totally beyond me. There just isn't one.

What if

[Anonymous Cowdog]

What if someone bought the LP, then bought the tape, then bought the CD? They have now paid three times for the same music. Are we buying a license to listen to the music, or not? I've always thought that this situation was somewhat ridiculous and that one should only have to pay once, especially with the prices of CDs as high as they are.

There is..

[GiMP]

There is at least one valid question here. Many are claiming that the ownership of a CD is not a license.

Many say that you buy a CD and you simply have the right to play that cd with a cd player. Others claim it is legal to copy it under fair-use to your computer as long as you don't play both copies at the same time. Furthermore, some believe that it is legal to make a copy for the car and one for home; as long as only one is used at a time and is for your personal use.

My questions are:
A) What if I bought a CD, ripped it to my computer, then destroyed the CD ?
B) What if I did A and then sold the digital media online and then destroyed my copy of the media?
C) What if myself and a friend both buy identical copies of a CD, but mine gets lost in a fire.. can I legally make a copy of my friend's CD?

For question A, I believe it should be certainly legal.

Question B would be legal with the possible exception that there MUST be two copies of the media to transfer it via the internet, thus it may violate copyright law, even if the second copy is deleted immediately afterward.

Question C may not be the most legal of things, but given sufficient evidence would any judge really convict one of this? If it is a license of any sort, this should be legal.