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U.S. Funds Anonymizer for Iranians

SiliconEntity writes "British online rag The Register is reporting that the U.S. Government is funding anonymizer.com to provide anonymous browsing services to Iranians. Using U.S. funding, the company created a special version of its anonymizing proxy which has instructions in Farsi and only accepts connections from Iranian IP addresses. The service defaults to the Voice of America web site, but users can input any address and browse free of (Iranian) government censorship."

45 of 498 comments (clear)

  1. It's understandable by mao+che+minh · · Score: 4, Interesting
    I would imagine that there will be a widespread knee-jerk reaction across America to this news. Afterall, our government is using tax dollars to deliver privacy and freedom to a member nation of the "Axis of Evil". I, however, do not mind one bit: You have to capture the hearts and minds of the people that your enemies hold sway over. You know full well that a government such as the one in Iran is doing everything possible to spread lies about the West. If the people remain closed we could end up with a populace similar to North Korea. Those feelings will be passed along to successive generations, and perhaps some day in the distant future, could lead to war - or worse.

    Propaganda both prevents and wins wars. Propaganda can serve as a tool of persuasion in trying political struggles between two or more nations. In the case of Iran, it is imperative that we win a large portion of mindshare to use as security in the future. For it would seem that the possibility of armed conflict with Iran is a reality, and we should do what we can to avoid it, considering the implications of such a thing.

    1. Re:It's understandable by cayenne8 · · Score: 5, Insightful
      I don't mind it at all...

      I do fine it ironic and irritating, though, that our own country (US) doesn't seem to like for us to do the same...trying to pass laws where anonymity, or falsifying online id in order to hide ones identity...

      If its good enough for US to pay for them to do it...should be open and good enough for us to use it in all our communications.

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
    2. Re:It's understandable by (54)T-Dub · · Score: 3, Informative

      You have to capture the hearts and minds of the people that your enemies hold sway over.

      I wouldn't say the Iranian government holds sway over it's people. My best friend is Iranian and he tells me that people are sick of the current regime and love america.

      --

      "I can not bring myself to believe that if knowledge presents danger, the solution is ignorance" - Isaac Asimov
    3. Re:It's understandable by garcia · · Score: 4, Insightful

      eh.

      First of all, they want us here in the US to abide by their bullshit (DMCA and the two sons of Satan (Patriot I and II)) yet we are in another country blasting radio stations and FUNDING (at an undisclosed amount) a free proxy to *circumvent* another countries security. We should put the government in jail for violating the DMCA.

      Second, we shouldn't be funding shit (not Iraq, not free proxies for Iran, nothing), we should be funding the fucking Americans without jobs (I don't know if /. has heard about the ever increasing length of the food lines in more rural areas of Ohio, etc).

      Third, I wasn't aware that we were back in the 1950s and 1960s where we feel the need to stop the possibility of the spread of communism, I mean the threat of terrorism. I get those ism's confused.

      Let's fucking work on freeing our own country first TYVM. I would PREFER that our own people are fed, clothed, covered, and paid, rather than worrying about 10s of billions of dollars being sent overseas to countries that (for the most part) don't want us there.

      Remember who is funding this funding.

    4. Re:It's understandable by ncc74656 · · Score: 4, Interesting
      I would imagine that there will be a widespread knee-jerk reaction across America to this news. Afterall, our government is using tax dollars to deliver privacy and freedom to a member nation of the "Axis of Evil". I, however, do not mind one bit...

      I think it demonstrates that we have no quarrel with the people of Iran. It's the regime whose jackboot they're under with which we take issue. With access to outside news/information sources, maybe a few of them will learn that (1) we're not the Great Satan the ayatollahs told them about and (2) maybe they'll give the ayatollahs the heave-ho and make available to themselves the choice to live in the 21st century instead of the 13th.

      --
      20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
    5. Re:It's understandable by Sphere1952 · · Score: 4, Interesting


      I've been watching Iran long enough to know that the parent is correct. the 65%+ of the population who are under 30 have no use for their government at all. The joke at the beginning of the Iraq war was "Good, we're next."

      --
      Big Brother Bush is doubleplus ungood.
    6. Re:It's understandable by Vlad_the_Inhaler · · Score: 4, Insightful

      It should be quite easy to avoid war with Iran - simply don't invade.

      Saddam Hussein is a homicidal maniac, but he was bending over backwards to avoid war - doing all he could to comply with UN demands. The trouble was, the US and Britain were not prepared to consider any outcome other than war. A war which killed tens of thousands while doing damage which Paul Bremer indicated a couple of days ago, was almost impossible to overestimate. Now countries which see themselves as threatened by the US know that behaving rationally will get them nowhere. The way to go is to accumulate nukes and point them at an ally of the US. At the time, I thought the N Koreans were insane. It took time to work out what they were up to.

      To go back on-topic, it is rather ironical that the US is against anonymous browsing at home (or have I got that one wrong?) but supportive when it can cause other people trouble.

      So what is the next stage? Given a proxy web-server in Iran (is there one there?), surfers in other countries can also make use of this service. Iran is a semi-open country nowadays, there won't be a similar service available in N Korea any time soon for obvious reasons.

      --
      Mielipiteet omiani - Opinions personal, facts suspect.
    7. Re:It's understandable by ReconRich · · Score: 3, Interesting

      I used to work with a several guys from Iran. I was talking with one of them about religion one day when he said, very softly, "Sometimes I think, Fuck the Prophet". I told him that this was America, he could say "Fuck the Prophet" as loudly as he wanted to. His response "No I can't, I may have to go back to Iran someday".
      This guy, as well as the other Iranians that I worked with both hated and feared the government of Iran. But mostly feared.

      --- Rich

      --
      Free your mind and your Ass will follow -- George Clinton
    8. Re :It's understandable by Black+Parrot · · Score: 5, Funny


      > I don't mind it at all...

      > I do fine it ironic and irritating, though, that our own country (US) doesn't seem to like for us to do the same...trying to pass laws where anonymity, or falsifying online id in order to hide ones identity...

      > If its good enough for US to pay for them to do it...should be open and good enough for us to use it in all our communications.

      As Jay Leno said about the US plan for Iraq (paraphrasing) -

      We're going to fix them up with fair elections, good education, and sound healthcare.

      And if it works for them we'll try it over here too.
      --
      Sheesh, evil *and* a jerk. -- Jade
    9. Re:It's understandable by Vlad_the_Inhaler · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Given what the Allies have found there over the last 4 months (nothing), it remains to be proved that they actually had anything.

      There were those short-range missiles which were designed to be within the permitted specs, but were capable of flying beyond their nominal range (nothing unusual, remember when the Ukranians shot down an aircraft at around twice the distance they thought their missiles were good for) and the Iraqis had started destroying those when the Allies invaded.

      Exotic claims are easy to make, the US, UK and Australian Governments all made hysterical claims over Iraq before the war.
      They have had 4 months to provide proof. Are you still holding your breath?

      --
      Mielipiteet omiani - Opinions personal, facts suspect.
    10. Re:It's understandable by netruner · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I find it quite disturbing that Anonymizer and the gubmint are in bed. Don't think that dubyah and co. aren't keeping tabs on what the Iranians are looking at, if for no other reason than to figure out where their "hearts and minds" are.

      --



      DISCLAIMER: This post was not checked for speling and grammar- if you complain- you're a whiner
    11. Re:It's understandable by Valdrax · · Score: 4, Funny

      [W]e should be funding the fucking Americans without jobs ...

      Now, now. The current administration's new "Fucking Americans Without Jobs" initiative has been doing quite well for itself.

      --
      If it's for-profit but free, you're not the customer -- you're the product (e.g., the Slashdot Beta's "audience").
    12. Re:It's understandable by Noah+Adler · · Score: 3, Informative

      I have an Iraqi friend who said the same thing with respect to Iraq. It's since become clear that not everyone in Iraq shares her view.

      Maybe the people your friend surrounded himself with hate the Iranian goverment and love America, but,as crazy as it may seem, that doesn't necessarily mean it's the universal opinion in Iran.

      Of course, it may be entirely different in Iran, but just remember, it's probably not as simple as it seems...

    13. Re:It's understandable by HeghmoH · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Saddam Hussein is a homicidal maniac, but he was bending over backwards to avoid war - doing all he could to comply with UN demands.

      Playing shell games with inspectors and flagrantly violating UN resolutions for ten years is "bending over backwards"?

      The trouble was, the US and Britain were not prepared to consider any outcome other than war. A war which killed tens of thousands while doing damage which Paul Bremer indicated a couple of days ago, was almost impossible to overestimate.

      I'll overestimate it for you: the world was destroyed, and everyone died. There that wasn't so hard, you see?

      --
      Mod down posts with a "Free Mac Mini/iPod" sig, they're spam!
    14. Re:It's understandable by shigelojoe · · Score: 3, Funny

      IN SOVIET RUSSIA... wait, it *was* in Soviet Russia?

      Oh crap, never mind.

    15. Re:It's understandable by Malcontent · · Score: 3, Insightful

      "Playing shell games with inspectors and flagrantly violating UN resolutions for ten years is "bending over backwards"?"

      Israel violates UN resolutions how come we don't invade them. The US violates UN resolutions or just ignores them and invades other countries.

      "I'll overestimate it for you: the world was destroyed, and everyone died. There that wasn't so hard, you see?"

      This is a very handy thing to fling out when you can't dispute somebodies facts or arguments in a rational way.

      --

      War is necrophilia.

    16. Re:It's understandable by HeghmoH · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Are you deliberately trying to be obtuse?

      Various UN resolutions were passed regarding Iraq, and weapons inspectors were sent there.

      Iraq continually violated those resolutions and was as uncooperative with the inspectors as it felt it could get away with without provoking another war.

      Iraq at the present moment does not appear to posess WMDs.

      Those three statements can logically exist together in the same universe without any self-contradictions.

      It seems to me that you're like most anti-Bush fanatics out there, trying to paint anyone who disagrees with you as a pro-Bush fanatic. That's wrong; I can disagree with you and him at the same time. The fact that Bush was wrong about WMDs and lied in his case for war does not change the fact that Iraq was extremely uncooperative in every way with the UN and with the weapons inspectors. Are you capable of understanding this?

      If you respond to this post, please try arguing with the points and opinions I have actually expressed, rather than the points and opinions you imagine I should hold.

      --
      Mod down posts with a "Free Mac Mini/iPod" sig, they're spam!
  2. freedom as tool by gokubi · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Why does our government work for the freedom of others, while chipping away at ours daily? Has freedom been reduced to a tool to pry open restrictive regimes to the point where our system can rush in and clamp things down in the "correctly" restrictive ways?

    sigh.

    -sarcasm-

    And now that our tax dollars are being used to allow members of a radical Islamic regime (one that harbors terrorists and has WMDs) to anonymously look at all the bomb plans burried in steganographied images on eBay, aren't we opening ourselves up for more terror?

    -/sarcasm-

    Makes you wonder if anyone believes that Axis of Evil crap.

    --
    I'm much funnier now that I'm a subscriber.
    1. Re:freedom as tool by phliar · · Score: 5, Funny
      Why does our government work for the freedom of others, while chipping away at ours daily?
      Well, where do you think that freedom we export comes from? It doesn't just grow on trees you know!
      --
      Unlimited growth == Cancer.
    2. Re:freedom as tool by donutello · · Score: 3, Insightful

      And now that our tax dollars are being used to allow members of a radical Islamic regime (one that harbors terrorists and has WMDs) to anonymously look at all the bomb plans burried in steganographied images on eBay, aren't we opening ourselves up for more terror?


      The members of the regime already have the ability to do this anyway. What the US is funding here is the ability for the people being oopressed by that regime to do so. There's a big difference. You show your ignorance by not recognizing the difference.

      Makes you wonder if anyone believes that Axis of Evil crap.

      It's the Iranian government that has been branded dangerous, not the Iranian people. It's hard to expect you to believe something if you're too ignorant to understand what is being talked about.

      --
      Mmmm.. Donuts
    3. Re:freedom as tool by gokubi · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The members of the regime already have the ability to do this anyway. What the US is funding here is the ability for the people being oopressed by that regime to do so. There's a big difference. You show your ignorance by not recognizing the difference.

      I put my statement inside -sarcam- tags for a reason. Or government doesn't believe all the WMD and nuclear capability stuff any more than I do.

      Iran is a potential threat much in the way that France is or the soviet union was--they present alternatives to our system of running things. The soviet union had to be destroyed because it was a competing system, not because it was evil. The US is much like MSFT in this way. Who cares if other options are better, worse, or indiferent--if they are an option other than ours, they must be destroyed.

      --
      I'm much funnier now that I'm a subscriber.
  3. Awesome! by Lane.exe · · Score: 5, Insightful
    So potential Iranian terrorists can now go snooping around the net anonymously while the average American citizen is liable to be scrutinized by John Ashcroft... all courtesy of the American government! I'm so glad I live in a world that makes sense!

    --
    IAALS.
  4. When will Americans need it for copyright? by Thinkit3 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If a country decides to abolish copyright, we'll be forced to block all traffic, right? So we'll be the ones needing anti-censorship proxies then.

    --
    -Libertarian secular transhumanist
  5. Fight the system. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    Could some Iranian please set up a proxy so that we can bounce back and use anonymizer for free. Thanks :-)

  6. Topsy Turvy. by Malcontent · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The US is going to institute a national health care program for Iraq, a nationalized educational system for iraq, govt controlled water and power monopolies for Iraq, anonymous surfing for the Iranians.

    How come these things are not good enough for US

    --

    War is necrophilia.

  7. privacy for US users? by cpeterso · · Score: 3, Funny


    We now need someone to create a system that lets US users tunnel INTO Iran so we can use Iran's privacy protection (funded by the US gub'mint) to protect US users from the US gub'mints warrantless TIA Big Brother spy programs.

  8. Dancing with the devil by lildogie · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It amuses me that, while anonymizers would likely be condemned as a tool of terrorism by the National Security State in the US, the same spooks use anonymizers as a weapon against their counterparts of old Iraq.

    On second thought, it depresses me.

  9. Re:iran can just block the service... by KjetilK · · Score: 3, Insightful
    In fact, Anonymizer.com is/has been on their blacklist for some time.

    Also, when I renewed my EFF membership, the first thing I did was to drop anonymizer.com a note asking if it was anything they could do to undo the damage of the block.

    I haven't had a lot good to say about the current US administration, but funding anonymizer for Iranians is a very good move, in fact, I think it is the best thing the US administration has done for Iran and iranians for a very long time.

    --
    Employee of Inrupt, Project Release Manager and Community Manager for Solid
  10. And it's **STILL** censored! by morcheeba · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Mostly unfettered. Like the Iranian filters, the U.S. service blocks porn sites -- "There's a limit to what taxpayers should pay for," says Berman.

    So, the object is to provide Iranians with access to political sites that the Iranian government wants blocked. As a taxpayer, I want to know what filter is being used, and what political sites are still being blocked.

  11. Iran...view from a Barskahye by Shant3030 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Some interesting observances about Iran:

    In the late 70's, students were protesting the overthrow of the Shah because he was corrupt, pro-West, etc.

    Now, in Iran, the children of the students who were protesting in the 70's, are the same people who are protesting against the corrupt Ayatollah and his cronies. The students as well as the majority middle class is aching for Western reforms. They overthrew the shah because he was corrupt, but only a handful of the government owns the majority of the wealth in the country. Essentially, they have turned into a socialist nation and the people are fed up.

    It is only a matter of time they will be a more moderate nation again, sharing with the world the beauty of the nation. The US's persistent feeding of western ideas is only fueling a fire of revolution that the Iranian people (sidenote: being of Persian-Armenian descent, we hate referring to ourselves as Iranians, sounds so 1980...) will take part in.

    What does this have to do with the /. post, probably very little... Just wanted to throw in my two cents about Iran.

    --
    100% Insightful
  12. That'll last all of two seconds by bugnuts · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If the Iranian gov is censoring the web, do you think this would be an exception?

    It'll last until the Iranian goverment puts blocks on their border routers and then it's case closed.

    China has followed and blocked all such services from their country and in some cases has recorded what the people were doing through those sites first (IIRC).

  13. wow talk about irony by jtilak · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "We're providing a system whereby the people in the countries that are suffering Internet censorship can bypass the government filtering and access all the pages that are blocked," says Cottrell.

    DECSS... hello????
    pretty soon i will have to use a foreign system like this and i live in MICHIGAN!!

    since i am not sure if its legal to link to this site i will just post the URL

    http://raisethefist.com/index1.html

  14. Re:What about China? by Shenkerian · · Score: 4, Informative
    This comment isn't interesting; it's ignorant. From the article:

    The service is similar to one Anonymizer provided to Chinese citizens under a previous government contract that ran-out ended earlier this year.

    Cottrell and Berman agree that it's only a matter of time before the Iranonymity service winds on the official blacklist. But Berman hints that the U.S. is ready for a prolonged electronic shell game with Tehran. "In China we're continually monitoring the state of the proxy, and when we see the traffic drop off, we change the proxy's address, usually within 24 hours," says Berman.

    RTFA.

    --
    You tell me how "whilst" differs from "while," and I'll stop calling you a pretentious jackass.
  15. So let me get this straight... by lightspawn · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Thanks to the U.S. government, Iranians can now view material blocked in U.S. libraries after being categorized by a private company as violence/profanity, alcohol/tobacco/drug related, satanic, sexual, or otherwise containing information which may be considered harmful or offensive?

    Why are Iranians entitled to view more of the web then Americans?

  16. Re:We are past this point with China by leviramsey · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Bzzt. Wrong.

    If anything the Chinese were pulling for us in Vietnam. Who was the next country to declare war on the Chinese after the US? That's right, it was the PRC.

    People have this illusion that the various Marxist nations were lovey-dovey as part of the quest for International Socialism. The reality is that, while most were Soviet satellites, the Chinese were displeased with the USSR for a long time. There are dozens of recorded instances of territorial infractions, shots fired, and planes shot down between the PRC and the USSR. The Chinese basically took a neutral position on the issue of a NATO vs. Warsaw Pact war; their hope was that both sides would nuke each other into cinders.

  17. hmm anonymizers are not so anonymous by jilles · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Last week a Dutch guy was caught who bribed a producer of yoghurt products. He threatened to poison products that were placed in the super market and as a demonstration placed a few poisoned products in a supermarket.

    He used a US based anonymiser service to cover up his contacts with the police. He was caught because the anonymizer sevice in question happily cooperated with the legal forces, after some pressure from the dutch police and their US counterparts.

    I don't approve of this guy's actions. He actually poisoned someone (who survived) with his actions. Apparently he actually tried out the poison on his goat to make sure the stuff wouldn't kill anyone. However it's a clear demonstration that anonymizers are just as anonymous as the FBI/CIA wants them to be. Anyone using the anonymizer.com services can be sure someone is watching what they do.

    --

    Jilles
  18. Triangle-boy by IvyMike · · Score: 3, Informative

    Here's a whitepaper on Triangle Boy, a solution to allow users to circumvent a censoring firewall (with the help of an external network of proxies, of course).

    It's a little complex, so I advise you read the article to get the details, but here's my take: The general idea is the user behind the firewall doesn't connect to a single proxy; instead, it connects to any one of a network of ever-changing mini-proxies. These mini-proxies forward the request to the real proxy.

    The mini-proxies can be blocked, but you just switch to a different mini-proxy. In order to reduce load on the mini-proxies, the real proxy returns data directly to the user, but with a spoofed ip address of the mini-proxy.

    Pretty cool.

  19. Land of the free? by ChaoticCoyote · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Let me get this straight -- if I go to a public library, my browsing is censored by mandate of the U.S. government (unless the librarians are rebels, of course).

    But an Iranian can browse the web free of government-imposed censorship?

    Aarrrgggghhhhhh!

    Actually, the dichotomy makes sense: the U.S. government wants to control its own populace while mucking about in the politics of other countries. The U.S. government doesn't care about the freedoms of the Iranian people; it just wants to undermine the Iranian government.

    Well, I hope those Iranians enjoy their freedom now; as soon as the U.S. trumps up enough false data to "liberate" Iran, they'll be in the same boat we are in terms of censorship and spying.

    "May you live in interesting times", indeed.

  20. Double standard by Baki · · Score: 5, Insightful

    As much as I think Iranians deserve privacy and personal freedom, I think it is incredibly hypocrit that the USA is doing this, against the will of another government, while at the same time it is bullying around individuals denying them other freedoms and privacy.

    When it comes to so called economic self interests, nothing goes too far, such as procesuting russians for violating absurd laws such as the DMCA, allowing industry lobby groups such as the RIAA to deny people the right to share files and make personal copies, removing the right to reverse engineer, removing the right to invent because of software patents (which it is trying to push through worldwide).

    In short: the USA government also is restricting a lot of people (their own and elsewhere), not representing the people (as should be in a democracy) but instead representing those who have the money to bribe the politicians and to buy laws.

  21. Re:Hell yeah... by mentin · · Score: 5, Funny

    After U.S. goverment approved so-called "Patriot Act" which allows it to spy what you write in your e-mails, what you read in a library, ...
    I'm waiting for Iranian goverment to fund Anonymiser for U.S. citisens so they can browse the Web anonymously without fear of being spied by U.S. goverment.

    --
    MSDOS: 20+ years without remote hole in the default install
  22. Young Iranians are rebels by tarp · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I'm a half-Iranian American and I have a lot of Iranian friends, some of whom came from Iran just a few years ago. I've yet to meet a single person who supports the regime in Iran. People want their freedom. The women pull their scarves high and show a lot of hair, they wear makeup and jewelry. Protests are a constant occurence. People won't put up with the Islamic republic for much longer.

    I wonder how effective the actual blocking within Iran is. I know that many Iranians can be found on Yahoo Chat. Iranians also download mp3's and porno. I doubt the filesharing services and chat would ever be effectively blocked by the Iranian government. Nevertheless, the anonymizer should help Iranians read western media and get a more accurate report of the world's news.

    Imagine if most of the rich and educated Iranians had't fled to places like Los Angeles, Toronto, Dubai, Washington, D.C., Paris and London. The Islamic government would have been dead by now.

  23. Why start at '79 by ziriyab · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Let's go back to 1953. Back then Iran was a moderate democracy (not the pretend-democracy it is now). They decided that the 16% of the oil profits they were getting from the Brits for extracting oil was a bit low. The brits balked. Iranians nationalized their oil. Brits and Americans overthrew the democracy and installed a dictator, the shah, who was corrupt, pro west, etc.

    So the students rebelled thinking they were going to get a democracy, but instead got a dictatorship that was even worse than the previous one. One that saw as its mission the export of islamic fundamentalism and the funding of terrorist groups.

    Skip many years. Fast forward through Iran-Iraq war and our role in helping both sides with intel so that neither side would wons, etc...

    Now we're sponsoring freedom and democracy. About 50 years and hundreds of thousands of lives too late, but better late than never, right?

    If all of this anonymizer shit means the people of Iran will get some help freeing themselves from a group of bloodthirsty fundamentalist fuckwads, great. But let's not delude ourselves about our real motivations. We use lofty language about democracy when it suits us, and just as easily discard it to support dictators.

    By the way, there hasn't been a Persia for a long time. It's been "Iran" since 1935. If you want to make yourself sound like a rug or a cat, be my guest.

  24. Notes from a months' travel in Iran... by chathamhouse · · Score: 3, Informative

    I spent a month travelling in Iran last December. I have a few observations that may surprise some:

    1- Internet access is unfiltered, from what I could tell. From pr0n to sites advocating political dissent, people where happy to show me that things weren't blocked in Internet cafes. Since most people access the net from these cafes, they benefit from a layer of anonymity assuming that they can afford the $0.50-0.80us/hour rates.

    2- The government is a complex machine. THE PEOPLE VOTE for their elected representative. Mr Khatami, the current president is a reformist. However, he cannot push reforms through too fast for a host of reasons, the first being that the country's spiritual leader, Ayatollah Khameini holds veto power over all decisions made by the elected government. Khameini also controls the military and the police. The conservatives, on their part, cannot block all reform, for the knowledge that reformists get violent if there's no progress. The end result is a country that's slowly moving towards reform. Conservatives think things are moving too fast, reformists think things are moving too slowly, but most people agree that the last thing the country needs is another war or revolution - far too many people die then. From my visit, I'm steadfast in my opinion that Iran will sort itself out on it's own, but it will take time. Sort of like Turkey, which has gone from an Islamic Monarchy in the 1910's to a democratic state today.

    3- America's allies in the Middle East, such as the United Arab Emirates (spent 2 weeks there), do have filters, and nasty ones at that. There is only one ISP in the UAE, the governements, and it filters lots. I could frequently reach a blocked site when following links in slashdot stories, and there's nothing that you can do about getting those sites unblocked. The government of the UAE is a big-time monarchy, but is Open for Business. Will the proxy be available to the UAE? I don't think so.

    4- Iran isn't as isolated as you would think, and a lot of this is due to the Internet and the availability of cheap international phone calls. For example, I was in the city of Qom, some 180km south of Tehran on the 17th of December. This is the conservative hub of the country. Ayatollah Khomeini was born and operated from there, and the city is home to the important Shiite shrine of Fatimeh's tomb. Through a long sequence of happenstance events, I found myself touring a school, and was amused when a teacher gave a copy of The Two Towers on vcd to the vice-principal who was showing me around. Information flows...

    Iran does still leave a lot to be desired, but people seem generally happy, the standard of education is high, and there's universal medicare for citizens... but most medical drugs have to be purchased from smugglers because of some country's trade embargo. Certainly the lifting of the later wourld be a much better perceived sign of goodwill than an unnecessary proxy.

  25. Obligatory Conspiracy Theory by MotherSuperior · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Maybe they all got modded down, but I'm noticing a disturbing lack of conspiracy theories, for the slashdot crowd.

    Personally, I see this as more of the same TIA/PATRIOT nonsense we've been enduring since 9/11. I find it far more likely that the GWB / Ashcroft crowd is using this as a tool for our own 'National Security'. Of the following 2 scenarios, which seems more likely given the practices we've seen from the current US administration?

    A> Washington truly and deeply cares for the plight of the Iranian citizen, and the censorship they're subjected to by their oppressive government, despite showing no such concern for its own citizens.

    B> Washington provides 'anonymous' internet access, in order to monitor the browsing activities of 'potential terrorists'. (Read: Everyone in Iran). All in the name of national security of course.

    Considering the US's track record on things like this, I'm personally voting for B. Total Information Awareness really said it all for me. The United States Government has decided that privacy is the antithesis of freedom and security. I find it really hard to take this act at face value, considering the US's current stance on Internet Anonymity.

    --
    This is my sig. There are many like it, but this one is mine...
  26. grow up by Ender+Ryan · · Score: 3, Insightful
    was almost impossible to overestimate.

    This is the nonsense rhetoric I and him were referring to, and it is absolutely ridiculous. The damage caused by the war was quite mild as far as wars go, and the number of dead was remarkably very few civilians, and the fact is, the naysayers predicted a lot more death and destruction than actually happened. "Impossible to overestimate" is ridiculous.

    Furthermore, the Iraqi regime is responsible for far more deaths than were caused by the war, so for all this anti-war talk, within a year or two the war will actually result in a net reduction in the number of lives lost. And THAT is a fact. Just look up the number of deaths in Iraq that were the result of the Iraqi regime, and consider the torture and fear caused by the Iraqi leaders.

    Oh sure, you can blame the U.N. sanctions for the deaths related to poor drinking water quality, but the starvation and malnutrition is purely the result of the regime abusing the food for oil program and generally not caring about their own populace. But now that the country is no longer controlled by a dangerous regime, things can be restored, and lives can be saved.

    I'm not even saying the U.S. had pure intentions, but this cry me a river nonsense is ridiculous. Boo-fucking-hoo, people died. People always die. The actions of the U.S. will eventually result in far fewer deaths, so what's the problem? You don't like the current U.S. regime? Fine, but you're working the wrong angle.

    And if you point out that the Iraqi people don't have electricity and running water currently... Yes, that is pissing me off too, so save it. The U.S. needs to get its act together and show the Iraqi people that they're making a good faith effort to improve their conditions. I don't care how much it costs, get it done! Otherwise, it casts a shadow on everything they've done up to this point. If you want heads to roll, it should be for that!

    <snip - of course it's not fun... *rolls eyes* />

    For every israeli killed by a palestenian three palestenians are killed.

    1. Most Israeli deaths are the result of suicide bombings, meaning at least one Palestinian dies in every attack.
    2. The Palestinians are far weaker than the Israelis, therefore their attacks are far less effective.
    3. The Palestinians have turned down every chance for peace, and the offers have been good compromises on the part of Israel, I've read them.

    And I never said that I support the position of the U.S. w/regards to Israel, nor do I support the Israeli attacks on Palestinians, as they more often than not result in nothing but the deaths of innocent people. However, the Palestinians are FAR from blameless, and are in fact more to blame for the continuation of the violence than the Israelis are.

    Now if you were to ask me who I feel the most compassion for in the whole mess, I'd say the innocent Palestinians, because there are many of them, and they're living in very poor conditions. But I feel it's their own leaders who are mostly to blame at this point.

    Try looking at both sides of the issues, because there are two sides, and more often than not, the truth is somewhere in-between.

    Cheers.

    --
    Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden