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The Step-By-Step DIY Approach To The X-Prize
HobbySpacer writes "According to this article, John Carmack's Armadillo Aerospace team is making steady progress towards a X PRIZE rocket vehicle. Playing the tortoise to Burt Rutan's hare , the Texas team just might win the race to 100km altitude. At least if some of the other teams don't get there first."
...should have his lower horn removed.
How long can this take? How hard can it be? There are just a few simple steps:
1) Build spaceship.
2) Fly it up to 100 km.
3) Come back safely.
4) -> 2)
A good afternoon's work, damn slackers..
Trolling is a art,
Does slashdot need SCO to spread SCO FUD?
(From the days when astronomers ground their own mirrors).
"The fastest way to grind a large mirror is to first grind a small mirror, then grind the large mirror."
In other words, some problems are so complex that you can only solve them one at a time.
Ceci n'est pas une signature
Mom: That's a spaceship son. Son: Kewl!!! Can I ride in a spaceship one day? Mom: If that's what you want to do, go right ahead! Spaceship: KABOOM! Son: Mommy!... nevermind, I'll be a police man again.
I light a YODA bottle rocket in that flamers ASSHOLE!
It always makes me laugh when I see this comment about letting the private sector take over space exploration.
How would you feel if for the sake of arguement the eventual winner of the X-Prize were to become the MS of space exploration, with almost total control over who does what in space. The private sector is not about bettering mankind, its about profit and many private sector companies are not averse to using very dubious, and in many cases downright criminal methods to achieve their aims. Suppose they discover valuable caches of materials. Do you think they are going to share them with the rest of the world or make us pay thru the nose ? What will the visa requirements be for landing on Planet Microsoft I wonder ? Suppose you are vacationing on Mars and disaster strikes, what do you reckon the odds would be the highest bidders get the first seats off the planet.
In typical fashion the private sector will not become a serious player in space travel until NASA and the other space agencies have made serious reductions in the cost of entry with lots of tax payer research dollars. The private sector will then demand access and want to cherry pick the most lucrative aspects. Remember, there was a time when Bill Gates was an entreprenuer.
The linux hacker
Rocket technology aiming at supersonic suborbital flights built by privateers using off-the-shelf components? Sounds more like Darwin Awards, especially after you take a look at the level of technology. How do they even know that their rocket is aerodynamically stable? Building robust, real-time control systems to adjust the attitude during flight at a sub-millisecond rate can't be that easy either.
BOO! TERRO
Sir Haxalot is a karma whore troll. He is currently trying to gain Karma by posting google cache links in various articles all over slashdot so he can later use his karma-enhanced account to post trolls later on without worrying about killing his karma and having the added bonus of posting at +1 or +2 while doing it.
The sad thing is that when he posts links, he posts the same links that were in the article summary and violates copyright law by copying the article text verbatim. He even posts links to outdated Google Cache copies of the articles, even when the article links STILL WORK!
So moderators, I ask that you review his Posting History and see that what he does is nothing more than plagarism, trolling, and blatant karma whoring.
Did the article totally ignore the whole "the X-Prize contenders must repeat their success within 2 weeks by using the same vehicle?" aspect, which in my opinion isn't exactly a minor point.
A one-off launch is one thing, but to return the craft to service within 14 days is something else entirely.
Not trying to nitpick, but how many truly positive monumental advances in the human condition were made by a government entity? Mass production? The Industrial Revolution? The cure for Polio?
To paraphrase the parent post:
The Government sector is not about bettering mankind, its about power and many public sector bureaucrats are not averse to using very dubious, and in many cases downright criminal methods to achieve their aims.
A benevolent Gov't may sponser and fund the private sector if the advances are in the interest of the Gov't. Remember that just 100 years ago, every government on this earth knew, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that Horseless carriages and the Aeroplane were nothing more than rich man's toys. The Railroad was all that was needed to tame the wild frontiers, and even that was private enterprise.
Ingredients
... Now Fly, Baby Fly !!!
1. Old paint bucket
2. National Geographic issue with space photos
3. Pair of safety scissors and some tape
4. Large bottle of Vodka (plastic bottle variety, 100 proof)
Using the scissors cut out some pictures of space from the magazine and tape them inside the bucket. Drink the entire bottle of vodka and then put the bucket on your head
If Microsoft tried this, the stratosphere would be on fire by now.
Terrance: Beans, lots of beans.
Phillip: But Terrance, no one has ever tried this before!
Terrance: That's why it's going to work.
thppppppbbbbt. eheheehehhehehheehhe.
It's neat that people are doing this, but as a booster, Carmack's rocket ranks roughly with a SCUD-B. A SCUD-B can reportedly reach about 78km with a payload of about 1 metric ton.
I am just waiting for the XXX prize, i hear that will be a hell of a lot better than the X prize.
Armadillo = bunch of ex-games developers who have managed to lift a couple of bits of scaffolding pipe to a couple of thousand feet..... ....
Scaled Composites = bunch of aero engineers with 20 years plus experience, including round-the-world flight (Voyager) who have already test flown the actual vehicle to 46,000 ft
Not to put the Armadillo guys down, but like writing software, you need a bit of experience in the field (...stands back in expectation of flames...)
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f
And good for us all that it is.
If you want to get truly screwed find someone that says theyr'e doing for the good of all humanity. Or better yet if you want that kind of space travel you can join the Promise Keepers or the Raelians.
Yes virginia men will go to space to make money and those that are successfull will get obscenely wealthy. The next wave of robber barrons may own planets.
The truly funny thing is that whiny loosers whose only real complaint is that its the other guy being successfull not them, will benefit immensely from the move into space.
If you feel that the people going into space to win the Xprize are morally bankrupt, do it yourself.
Dissertation on the uselessness of Linux zealots
A spectre is haunting the world -- the spectre of the Linux Zealot.
What the Linux Zealot is will appear evident to whoever has
experienced or came in contact with the discussions which daily rage
the Web disguised as news, e-mails, reference material, etc.
The Linux Zealot, is nothing but an animal wandering unceasingly in
virtual and true reality (which moreover he treats in the same way)
claiming to be an authority on the Linux operating system, an
out-and-out guarantor for everyone's freedom, opposed to any safeguard
of intellectual works (for a Linux zealot, the expression "copyright"
is tantamount to sin against the Holy Spirit: there is no kind of
expiation); in fact, he champions software freedom as a fundamental
point for world evolution.
But first and foremost, the Linux zealot is a deeply dangerous being
as he claims to be the guardian of truth, and looks with suspicion
(when it goes off well) or scorn (for the rest of cases, i.e. most of
them) those people who simply think differently from him.
But what's Linux? A Linux zealot will never give an authentic answer
to this kind of question. He won't, not because he doesn't want to
(even if this is the case), but because this question has been
answered already, somewhere else by someone else. Linux is nothing
but an operating system. The Linux zealot will claim that it is a
different operating system from all other ones. But this is not the
case. Because an OS is an OS, its main function is to manage the
resource of a machine we will call "computer" from now on, for comfort
of description. By the term "computer" we mean what is commonly meant
by this expression, i. e. the system of hardware resources which are
fixed to a certain purpose, be it home use, business use, or server
management. Linux is an operating system. Like Windows, MS-DOS,
OS/2, etc. There is no difference, in this sense, between Linux and
other operating systems. Linux manages a computer, no more, no less.
So do MS-DOS, Windows and OS/2. What the Linux zealot
self-importantly and arrogantly highlights, is the fact that Linux is
a free operating system, i.e., it is made available free of charge to
the end user. This of course isn't true at all, but the Linux Zealot
believes it. Linux is freely distributable, not free of charge. This
means that the kernel and everything included in the operating
system's minimal requirements can be freely distributed, not that they
must be distributed free of charge. This is the first great
misapprehension of the Linux zealots, who find their claim challenged
by facts: if the essential parts which make the operating system, and
some additional software, are freely distributable, they should
explain the reason of the costs -- not prohibitive but certainly
notable -- of the most popular Linux distributions, Red Hat and SuSE
foremost. And most of all, they should explain the fact that companies
like Red Hat are regularly listed on the stock exchange, and Mr. Linux
Torvalds enjoys a rather high standard of living. These benefactors
of mankind, these software alternatives, these computer
non-conformists (so much non-conformist as to be terribly conformist
in their non-conformism) naturally justify the distributing companies'
profits with excuses like "but there's a printed manual", "but the
bundled software is qualitatively and numerically superior compared to
the most popular distribution". "but it is easier to install" and
other unspeakable nonsense. "On the other hand" they say "if someone
wants Linux, they can just as easily download it from the Internet".
Sure. Download it from the Internet. But how long must you stay
connected, if you regularly pay an Internet bill, to complete the
download of an updated version of a decent distribution of an
operating system? So what? Is Linux free? No. Linux is
http://www.xprize.com/images/teams/armadillo4_lg.j pg
"Don't fumble through boring man pages. Try my product!" - Richard M. Stallman, GNU Founder and CEO
GNU GVideo GProfessor is the leader in computer learning. We have taught over 5 million people, and we can teach you GNU/Linux, GNU/Emacs, GNU/gcc, and more! GNU GVideo GProfessor was founded in 1983 to provide consumers with training on software for their personal computers. Since that time, millions have successfully used and learned from GNU GVideo GProfessor's fool-proof "What-You-See-Is-What-You-Do" teaching method. The first lesson, GNU
It's FAST! You'll be up and running in an hour! Don't waste time sifting through man pages, commuting to classes or seminars. Just pop in the CD-ROM and you're learning!
It's EASY! It's as simple as 1-2-3! GNU GVideo GProfessor's straightforward "What-You -See-Is-What-You-Do" approach makes learning as easy as watching TV!
It's CONVENIENT! We're ready to teach you day and night! With your busy schedule, you don't have time to waste at classes or seminars. Don't fumble through boring man pages. Whatever your schedule, we're ready when you are!
It's COMPLETE! These aren't short teaser lessons. Each 60-minute lesson takes you from installing the software to more advanced skills. And they're not just for beginners! We'll surprise you with the knowledge you'll gain!
Why Am I Making This Incredible Offer? I'm so confident that once you try my exceptional " What-You-See-Is-What-You-Do" learning method, you'll turn to us for all your computer learning needs.
* How it works!
The bonus gift and ANY TWO of the three computer learning CD-ROMs are yours free without further obligation, PERIOD. Take 10 days to decide if you want to keep the complete set of CDs. After your 10 day free trial, if you decide to keep the complete set, we'll conveniently bill your credit card just $69.95. Or simply contact our customer care number at rtfm@gnu.org if you decide to return any one of the lessons, and you will be charged nothing more!
Every day hundreds of people just like you learn with GNU GVideo GProfessor this same fast and easy way. If you decide to keep all three lessons, every five weeks you will continue learning by automatically receiving other GNU GVideo GProfessor subjects you have an interest in, billed on the same exact terms as your first shipment. Or simply call and cancel. Everything is up to you! But most important, you are never under any obligation to purchase a subject that you don't keep. Best of all, the bonus gift, and your choice of any two of the three computer learning CD-ROMs are yours to keep FREE!
f
Especially if the pilot tries unsucessfully to perform a rocket jump.
From excellent karma to terible karma with a single +5 funny post...
the Texas team just might win the race to 100km altitude. At least if some of the other teams don't get there first.
In other words, they might just capture first place, if someone else doesn't.
Kind thoughts do not change the world
Just think, now those nice flight attendants will give their saftey lecture starting with... In case of an emergency your seat can double as an air helmet, suit, flotation and re-entry device... :-D
*There's Klingons on the starboard bow, scrape em off Jim!*
Is getting ALOT of undeserved publicity here.
I have seen his website and the photos of his project and all I can say is that I very unimpressed.
The rocket looks like something out of HG. Wells.
And very unaerodynamic.
My bet is on Ruttan's project.
Carmack I am guessing is getting all this positive press because he's a software programmer unlike Ruttan who has true aerospace credentials.
What people seem to forget is that there is not a linear increase in challenges between air travel and space travel.
;)
The reason is that the energy required to lift an object into or beyond earth orbit is incredible, which is why the Saturn V was almost nothing but a fuel tank (or the Shuttle for that manner).
That plus the materials science necessary to protect said object upon reentry.
The most reliable manned launch platform remains the traditional multistage rockets currently employed by the Russians (and soon the Chinese). These are cheap by aerospace standards but are never going to reach the volume of flights or pricepoint of the airline industry.
The privatization of space requires new methods to escape the earth's pull. I'm actually rather skeptical that any new method can be devised that will reduce the cost enough to make mainstream tourism possible.
Remember, they just retired the Concorde. If we can't even create affordable supersonic travel, what makes you think we can have space tourism?
That's not to say it can't be done cheaper; clearly launching a rocket off of a jet at high altitude is a proven technique (satellites can be launched this way). I also think there is merit to high altitude balloon launch platforms, but it sure sounds risky to launch a rocket near a fragile balloon.
How much cheaper remains to be seen.
But since the X-Prize is for suborbital flights that require little heat shielding and less involved life support, I don't think it in itself is a good metric for the privatization of space. It's "space lite", not really the real deal.
If the challenge were to launch a craft that could dock with the ISS, that's a different story. I know Nasa could use a vehicle like that right now
I guess that's better than the DUI approach.
Would drunken engineers plummeting from the sky in homemade missiles be considered weapons of mass destruction? I guess it depends on whether or not they crash into either the ACLU building or the Halliburton executive parking lots.
From a very reliable source in the aerospace industry, Scaled Composites is the group most likely to produce a successful project:
:-)
http://www.xprize.com/teams/scaled.html
http://www.scaled.com/
Sweet looking rig to boot
Buttsex.
I don't need to fix lines 0 or 4, because I made a subroutine like this:
0) $maxTrips = number of trips you want to take; $numTrips = 0;
:= new Object();
1) Build spaceship.
2) Fly it up to 100 km.
3) Come back safely.
4) if ($numTrips <= $maxTrips) {$numTrips++; goto 2;}
101) Define "Build spaceship.":
102) ) $numTrips++; # make code confusing
103) ) import store;
105) ) global $spaceship
106) ) for each i in parts:
107) ) ) tell $spaceship to add i
104) ) let parts = store.buy(spaceship parts);
Maybe "$" means global variable, so I don't need the word "global" on line 105. Now, if more Slashdot users post the rest of the subroutines, we'll have that X Prize very soon, after we put the lines in order.
==========
There are two types of people: those who are in the world, and those who aren't.
It's just as easy as making a working time machine.
1) Resolve causation paradoxes
2) Master physics to manipulate time as degree of freedom
3) Build time-travel capsule
4) Send humans out in time, and have them return safely.
5) Don't kill or have sex with your ancestors.
There was a U.S. project in the 1960s (IIRC) called Rockoon. They lifted fairly large solid-fuel rockets to high altitude with big helium-filled balloons, then fired the rockets right through the balloons. No problem with balloon fragility...
For the love of sanity, the parent post has to be the stupidest one I've ever read!
"How would you feel if for the sake of arguement the eventual winner of the X-Prize were to become the MS of space exploration, with almost total control over who does what in space."
What you're describing, of course is NASA, an agency founded to beat the USSR and establish a monopoly on all space activity. Guess what? NASA succeeded! The only thing it failed to do is die gracefully when it accomplished its mission.
"What will the visa requirements be for landing on Planet Microsoft I wonder ?"
One hell of a lot less stringent than the process of getting into the Astronaut Corps. Americans have been paying billions a year for this elitist little club to play with food in space. When do we get to go? For 40 years, NASA has not reduced the price of manned space access by one blue cent, not that you could buy a ticket at any price. Dennis Tito tried. NASA laughed him off. So he went to the only place that believes in private space enterprise - Russia! And guess which agency fought him tooth and nail every step of the way? NASA!
Don't kid yourself. NASA has no incentive to make manned space flight cheap because that would weaken the barriers to competition - making their political mandate to control the space frontier that much less defensible.
If you want a visa to anywhere else in the universe, you'd better hope the private sector wins this battle against runaway bureaucracy. Just like a century ago, when you would have done well to place your transportation bets on greedy bastards like Henry Ford or the Wright Brothers.
The Concorde went out of service because it had to compete with other flights that did the same thing, except slower and cheaper. So the 100-km-reaching manned vessels could retire the orbit-reaching manned vessels, because they do the same thing, except lower and cheaper.
Today we can no longer reach the moon but we can send more people into space (as ISS shows). Soon we may not be able to reach ISS, but even more people will reach space (by passing 100 km).
It might have a low probability of happening, but the X-Prize could finish manned orbits.
==========
There are two types of people: those who are in the world, and those who aren't.
- Driving while Imitating Yogi?
- Drunk In Yodel-land?
- Dropping Intensive Yello?
- Drinking and Imitating Yogi?
- Derelic Iconic Youngster?
- Desperately tryIng Yapping?
- maD mIcrosoft preY?
- Disparate Idolised rocketrY?
No, no matter how mych I try I can seem to find "space", "rocket" or anything related to fit this TLA. Anyone?
What the X-Prize and the whole low-cost access to space race need is an M$-class war chest. If Bill Gates and Co. started spending their research billions on the development of space technologies, rather than on selling the next pathetic version of Windows, we'll have a permament moon base in five years. Now, imagine if the other infotechnology companies started spending their billions, too.
Unless we see massive leaps in nanotechnology (or perhaps psychokinietic research), information technology isn't going to lead us anywhere but The Matrix, a dystopian, jack-me-in future.
Insightful, aint it?
n/t
Forget reusable, nuclear rockets, space elevators; although all of these tricks work, and will help and doubtless will be used, but they are one-time tricks and the trick that has the biggest effect is simply to launch, and launch a lot. Economies of scale.
Now, NASA cannot and will not be allowed to launch a lot. NASA takes a small(ish), relatively constant chunk of the American tax each year, and launches some stuff with that. There's a limit to what they can do with the money they have; which they reached about 2 decades ago. NASA as a government department cannot sensibly take a profit, and has built the wrong rockets for making money with anyway. That means that, unlike a business, they won't grow exponentially. Even if NASA were to be given more money, they still can't grow manned space flight- it would be a flat one-time increase. Only continuous growth works, and NASA can't do it.
That means that they will only launch a fixed number of rockets per year, and hence the economies of scale cannot be utilised more than they are at the moment. Since economies of scale are the most powerful way of reducing the costs of spaceflight, this means that NASA cannot take us to space; it can only take a lucky few chosen by a bunch of bureaucrats to be termed 'elite'.
-WolfWithoutAClause
"Gravity is only a theory, not a fact!"I find it odd to call Rutan the Hare? He has designed many airplanes over the years from small but very cool homebuilts: the VariEze, Long Eze, and the Quickie. He got out of that because of the lawyers. He also built the first plane to fly non-stop around the world with out refueling. He is without a doubt very good at what he does, make flying machines. Rutan has already built stuff that flys into space. Look on his page www.scaled.com they help design and build the Pegasus. I am sure that John Carmack himself does not think that Rutan is rushing his program unwisely. My money is on the Rutan team. If they can get the stability issues solved quickly they have a good chance to win. No matter what they will have a good craft that can do the job.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
"the Texas team just might win the race to 100km altitude. At least if some of the other teams don't get there first." .. Isn't that what a competition is? If I don't win, somebody else will?
Online Starcraft RPG? At
Dietary fiber is like asynchronous IO-- Non-blocking!
where's the news here? Um, no new info at all.
Its a puff piece basically saying only that "John Carmack is trying to build a spaceship"
We already knew that.
This space available.
> Playing the tortoise to Burt Rutan's hare [...]
...typical fscking moric ./ trying to put the "geek spin" on everything... Rutan's the geek here, not Carmack.
What a load of pseudo-journalistic crap.
If you knew *anything* about Rutan, you'd know that he's been pursuing records and innovation for decades (probably while Carmack was still running around in dipers).
If anyone is the hare, it's Carmack. If he has any sense of responsibility at all, he'll ride his own death trap instead of foisting the risk off on some well paid "crash test dummie". crushable nose code and peroide tanks... jesus christ... why doesn't he just used a fscking rocket launcher stuffed up his arse.
Just because someone is ahead becuase of decades of long hard work doesn't make them a "hare".
Paul Allen, the second largest MS stockholder and founder of MS is the major funder of Rutan's space plane. This one is considered the best candidate to win the X-prize.
So the 100-km-reaching manned vessels could retire the orbit-reaching manned vessels, because they do the same thing, except lower and cheaper.
If it's not reaching orbit, it's not doing the same thing.
The Concorde wasn't replaced by a plane flying three-forths of the way from New York to Paris. Nor will heavy space launch systems be replaced by the new '100-km' class of vessels.
The Matrix has you ... in the worst way possible
)o(
"Ten years later, this country---the original advoceas of the peaceful colonisation of space---decide to build giant space weapons. Strictly for defense, of course. One of their space flights blows up, killing---among others---a female teacher.
Their space weapon shield proves to be impractical, and so they change the focus of their research... developing a weapon capable of causing large disturbances in the heart of the sun... disturbances large enough to wipe out the planets closest to her.
They hold the world hostage to their threat to reduce Earth to a cinder. A conflict isn't settled to their satisfaction. Many buttons are pushed.
A hundred million years afterward, a blue-green fungus appears spontaneously on one of Jupiter's moons. It dies out within a week.
And that's it for life in this solar system."
--The Judge, Cerebus: Church and State pp. 1207--8, by Dave Sim
Laws do not persuade just because they threaten. --Seneca