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AT&T Wireless Fumbles Number Portability
cloudscout writes "The FCC is demanding that AT&T Wireless Services explain their number portability failures. Apparently, tens of thousands of customers are having their number portability requests delayed because of computer system problems at AT&T Wireless. Sadly, the FCC did not say they were going to be imposing fines for this breach of regulations yet but I'm sure that will follow if things don't improve quickly." Reader (54)T-Dub adds: "As many of you already reported on wed, there have been some pretty serious delays for people switching cellphone providers according to this NYTimes article (free reg required). Most notably former AT&T customers can expect to wait up to a week for their number to switch."
Most notably former AT&T customers can expect to wait up to a week for their number to switch
Why wait when you have Captain Crunch?
When anger rises, think of the consequences.
Confucius (551 BC - 479 BC)
I've personally been very happy with my service from AT&T overall, but still have had a couple complaints. So I considered switching to verizon because they seem to have a very good reputation. I went to the verizon store the other day and the sales person was surprised that I hadn't had more problems with AT&T and mentioned that most of the people trying to use number portability were coming from AT&T. But you know what, verizon doesn't have a single phone with bluetooth and only one known option that works with apple computers. AT&T has several that do both and thier internet access doesn't use airtime (verizons does). So, I'm sticking with AT&T but still wish someone had the ultimate phone- bluetooth, mac and the ability to use ssh without spending $500+. I don't want a camera or to even browse the web, just give me mail and shell and I'd be extremely happy.
My ex-roommate had sprint and his calls to report dropped calls would get dropped all the time, but he got it because he could talk for free to other sprint users. another friend just signed a two-year contract with sprint and I hope she has better luck- there's no way I'd go with sprint.
Now, when will they finally let you transfer the phone you like to a different service provider?
Creationists are a lot like zombies. Slow, but powerful and numerous. And they all want to eat our brains.
AT&T Wireless has some serious customer care issues right now, whatever the actual reason. Hopefully, everyone will be compensated for this bullsh!+, but probably not.
-- PhoneBoy
The views expressed herein are not necessarily those of anyone, including the poster.
If you want to be the very first to try the hot new stuff, be prepared for things not to always go as planned.
This problem relates both to people trying to switch FROM AT&T and to people trying to switch TO AT&T... while it may be a stalling tactic on AT&T, it seems unlikely and they wouldn't want to give themselves such a PR black eye.
All the major carriers except AT&T are using one portability company. Looks like AT&T ought to explore using that same firm.
There are more horror stories at Wirelessadvisor.com.
Zaphod B
When duplication is outlawed, only outlaws will have
There's someone on here (can't remember who) who's tagline goes something like 'Never ascribe to malice what can be satisfactorily explained by incompetence'. I doubt this is really a 'policy' by AT&T ...
Simon
Physicists get Hadrons!
If they're fined, they'll just increase their rates, perhaps they'll add another 10 cents to everyone's "Number portability surcharge". It will cost them nothing.
Click here for your reg free linkage.
I don't think that having trouble doing this means they're "completely technically incompetent on a fairly amazing scale". If you've ever designed a software system, you know it can be difficult when the base assumptions you designed against change: in this case, the assumption that you would be assigning new numbers from an existing pool of numbers. Having to add in any new number from like any zipcode could be a hassle, and I'm sure there are other infrastructure issues that they have to sweat.
They may have known for a year that this was in the works, but they were fighting it, and hoping it wouldn't come to pass. No sense paying your techies to undermine the moral of your lawyers by assuming the latter were going to fail to prevent it, eh?
That said...I would consider leaving Sprint, but the reception just really improved at my house, and I think it's still super crappy with some other people's phones on other networks...
SO YOU'RE GOING TO DIE: The Comic for Dealing with Death
It's not a stalling tactic on their part. I'm about 95% sure of this because of some unrelated problems I've been having with AT&T Wireless lately.
They recently switched to a new management system for their GSM phones, and they're having a very difficult time getting everyone up to speed on it. Their website has been broken for accessing account information for a while, and their retail folks barely have a clue what they're doing when it comes to GSM stuff. I was trying to get a credit for a promotion recently, and it took over 3 months, and several different people, before it was done without using the GSM management systems at all.
So, while it doesn't seem that they're screwing up number portability deliberately, they do have some other problems going on. You don't introduce a new system to service without making sure that everyone that needs to use it is already trained on it. And, of course, that it works and interoperates with the rest of your systems properly.
-Todd
"The details of my life are quite inconsequential..."
'fumble' implies that at&t didn't mean for it to happen.
====
Crudely Drawn Games
I've been waiting a few days for ATT to release my number to T-Mobile. I don't mind the wait, a week is not a big deal so put away the worlds smallest violin, I'm just enjoying my new SE Z600.
What is bothersome though is that even if a week is not bad, many can do it it hours and sometimes minutes. If a Verizon to T-Mobile port can be done in a day, the ATT to T-Mobile should not take much longer. I hope the FCC does fine them. If ATT is using this as a stall tactic they are nuts as people who might not think about LNP might read about this in the newspaper and figure, "Wow, ATT is bad, maybe I should change."
AT&T has a reputation with pulling this crap. It might not be with everyone, but it happens more than it really should.
I've known a few people who've worked for AT&T who claim some of the stuff they do is no good.
For example, when I switched long distance carriers from AT&T, I *knew* I'd have some kind of issue with it. Lo and behold, 2 weeks after terminating service with them, AT&T mysteriously accepts an order "placed by me" and reactivates my service through them. I call back to cancel and to make sure it's cancelled and they tell me I was removed from the system.
A week later, it happened again. I guess I must be sleepwalking or something, because, again, they claim I place a service reactivation order.
In the end it all got straigtened out, but after hearing from people who used to work there that they practice some shady business tactics, it doesn't surprise me in the least bit that the number switching would "mysteriously" fail.
We have secretly replaced these Slashdot mods' sense of humor with a rusty nail. Let's see if they notice!!
Everything. AT&T has gone to hell in the past few days. I've been trying to upgrade my calling plan and order a couple of new GSM phones including the slick Siemens SL56. None of the local stores have the phone nor can they order it, and even if they could the price is $200+, even though it's only $99 on their web site.
So I ordered it yesterday but had a question on the order process, as it appears they've signed me up for a whole new line of service instead of changing my current plan. I waited on hold for TWO HOURS yesterday before giving up. Waited another 45 minutes this morning before the call (over a land lane) was inexplicably dropped. The local stores "can't help me" and keep directing me to customer service.
And all day Wednesday their phone system informed me they couldn't take any phone calls and I should "call back later". If I had any self respect I'd cancel my account at the first opportunity. But AT&T is the best we've got in my rural area, so if I want a cellular phone, I'm stuck.
As of now I'm patiently awaiting delivery of two new phones along with two more service plans that I don't want.
-Ryan, with the unoriginal sig
It's called Local Number Portability for a reason. As of right now, if you move out of the area, then you can't port that number to another carrier.
ie: If you move your landline to your wireless phone, then move from Los Angeles to San Francisco, you can still use your wireless phone up there. However, you cannot port that number to another carrier or landline...
Doh!
That one company was found to have purposely *caused* a 3 day delay, and was bombarding customers with ad pitches hoping they'd stay.
Guess we know who it is - and these days I'm not surprised. (I'm a former employee)
I abhor AT&T wireless, they have been a constant source of grief for me. Recently they have placed their own towers in the San Luis Obispo, Californa area that can not handle the load of their customers. It usually takes about 8 attempts to make a call before I can get out. Calls to AT&T Wireless resulted in the Customer Service representative yelling at me and treating me with a complete lack of respect. Once I re-finance my car, I'm going to cancel my 2-year contract and tell them to go to hell when they try to collect the early termination fee. If I wasn't a college student, I would love to be involved in a lawsuit against them.
Only recently have I been able to get decent service. This was only after I mentioned to the rep that I has just submited a complaint to the FCC.
I've been waiting for the cell phone portability stuff to take effect for quite some time now. I've wanted to switch providers for awhile, but didn't want to go through the hassle of telling everyone about my new phone number. So, I went to talk the TMobile and they said I they could support my phone number. I was thrilled to say they least, so I started the process and signed the contracts and everything. A week later, they give me a call and tell me they can't switch my phone number because it is not in on of the governments top 100 markets - I will have to wait until May 2004 to switch my number.
I can cancel my new contract within 14 days, so that's not a problem. But, it is a hassle and it just a little shady on TMobile's part. So no I have to make the decision to go through the hassle of canceling my new contract and wait 6 more months or just go ahead and make the switch.
Back in the beginning of November my phone died and I went to the ATT store to try to buy a new one. I was told to come back the next day because the computer system was not working. I did, and the same thing happened for the next WEEK. That's right NO gsm phones were activated for a whole WEEK.
Once I did get a phone, I emailed their customer service and told them how badly they screwed up and wasted my time. This is the point where good companies realize they made a mistake and go out of their way to fix it, but instead ATT offered me a measly $5 credit. I found this insulting as a loyal customer for ~2 years who has just been given a huge runaround and inconvenience. So I replaied to the email saying so.
Now at the bottom of every email from ATT they append this:
" If you need to respond to this message, we suggest you reply directly to this email for the best service. Please remember to leave all documents attached for reference."
which I certainly did. So to follow the course of our correspondence, all you had to do was start at the bottom and read upwards (like any normal email thread). So about a week later I get this simple reply:
" Thank you for contacting AT&T Wireless regarding the e-mail you recently sent us. Unfortunately, we are unable to determine the nature of your request. If you would like to email us back with more detailed information, we would be more than happy to assist you further. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause."
So the point of this rant is that ATT is full of technically incompetant people, and this story does not surprise me one bit.
AT&T has started switiching its TDMA based network to GSM (before someone nitpicks, I know GSM is a TDMA based standard) and as such, has started offering GSM phones. They look like any other sim based GSM phone, and many of their phones are tri band, so they can be used all over the world. Small problem though, they are locked to only accept AT&T sim cards, so if you want to use a prepaid sim in Europe or Asia, your screwed. For Nokia phones, this isnt too bad, as their sim locking isn't hard to crack, and there are several programs out there that will generate unlock codes for them. Now Sony Ericksson phones are a whole other ball of wax, their sim unlocking goes to the point that the phones are setup to never accept an unlock code. To unlock the phone requires a service cable, and a phone log, or sending it in to someone with service hardware. T-Mobile will give you the unlock codes after your trial two weeks where you can cancel service with out penalty are up. As someone who travels alot internationally, and has seen what international roaming rates are like, I wont ever get another phone that is not easily unlocked.
"My head hurts, My feet stink, and I dont love Jesus." -Jimmy Buffett
jnichols@www jnichols $ host forums.attwireless.net
Host forums.attwireless.net not found: 3(NXDOMAIN)
jnichols@www jnichols $
I'm a former AT&T Wireless customer care employee. Oddly enough, it was the only call center job where I did *not* hear about people having problems getting through. At the very least, they didn't outsource all the staff to India or contractors.
A lot of the current problems are related to a massive switch to Siebel's backend setup. That could explain the excessive hold times.
In this morning's New York Post, John Podhoretz's column, Cell Hell, gives a good insight of what customers are facing switching from AT&T. I don't think I will be switching from T-Mobile, not because T-Mobile is a great cell phone company, its that all cell phone companies suck. I have learned to with the suckage of T-Mobile and don't want to waste my time relearning the suckage of another. It's really a sad state of affairs in the cell phone provider industry.
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
however, in raising rates they loose a small amount of competitive edge. so the fine would d something--minor, yes--but tangible.
There is a reason why I submitted this story in the first place. I have been trying to get my number ported from AT&T to T-Mobile for 11 days now with no luck. Yesterday afternoon I called their number portability group and sat on hold for 5 hours, 10 minutes before I finally gave up.
I have never before experienced such incompetence on such a large scale.
I work for AT&T Wireless, and have been right in the thick of things for about eight months. Let me tell you, it's far worse than what the press is indicating.
Apparently corporate favored hiring Deloitte consultants over their full time employees to save costs and to prepare for a possible buyout, and they simply didn't get the job done. Their efforts can be measured by the numbers I've gotten wind of. Wireless's passthrough rates for LNP are not even above 20% for port out, and they're logging about 10-15 thousand tickets per day at their help desks. That's right, per day.
Wireless also chose Siebel and Vitria to work out back end systems, and they were both pieces of hand-picked corporate garbage (and they were told way in advance by former full time employees, but were shunned as 'not being agreeable to the team') that have proven unscaleable, unreliable, and though modified incessantly, not up to the task of doing LNP. Apparently no one has any idea what we are going to do now. AT&T Wireless is stuck with a backend system that we're now locked into because of contractual agreements with the aforementioned companies.
IMO, Corporate has torn the soul and guts out of this company in order to turn a profit, and now their gonna reap what they've sown over the course of last year.
I just bought a new phone today... while I was in the wireless store, a man came in asking to switch from cingular to ATT. The lady at the counter said "we need a bill from cincular". The reason she said, was that the phone number is case sensitive. In the event that the phone number is not entered into their system correctly, the request to port the fellows request for porting will fail. He elected to go ahead and take his chances.
The URL you are looking for is at thestreet.com.
/me buys some SAP stock. ;)
[snip]
AT&T Wireless (AWE:NYSE - commentary - research) customers cannot activate new GSM cell-phone accounts or make changes to existing GSM service because of a glitch that a Wall Street analyst is blaming on an upgrade of software from Siebel Systems (SEBL:Nasdaq - commentary - research).
[/snip]
And related.
[snip]
An executive in charge of consulting services at Siebel Systems is leaving the software company at the end of the year, a representative for the San Mateo, Calif., company confirmed Friday.
[/snip]
And Siebel stock is now marked as a Buy. Go figure.
I did a brief stint at one cell phone company as a temp and noted that the sales people used a slow, buggy, web-based interface to process new accounts, change features, phone numbers etc. This interface would slow to a halt several times a day and there was no real way to know if your work actually went through until the customer reported problems with his service.
Everything else (billing adjustments, credit checks, etc) were performed using an AS/400 interface that could charitably be described as "confusing" and "cryptic" at first glance and even the more experienced people that I worked with made mistakes when trying to enter information.
I was always pleasantly shocked when something would work out right...
"Under the spreading chestnut tree, I sold you and you sold me."
Part of the problem with LNP is that many of the carriers are tied up in old processes for handling such things as NP. Having worked on a piece of software for LNP, I came to realize what a mess this was going to be. A great number of number "clearinghouses" still process number changes via fax (i.e. someone fills out a fax form by hand, although some are machine generated and then the faxed form gets processed by a human on the other side of the loop) There were even cames were corba request would result in a fax generation that would then be ocr'd into a system for processing. LNP as it is implemented today is a patch on top of a patch on top of a patch. Things actually looked better for wireless to wireless LNP since they had more up-to-date processes, but land line wireless looked to be a complete mess. Should be interesting to see how this all shakes out.
"Look Lois, the two symbols of the Republican Party: an elephant, and a fat white guy who is threatened by change."
It is important to note that AT&T has an opportunity to gain just as many customers as anyone else from this. People on other networks might be interested in switching to AT&T. From this point of view, dragging their heels would not make much sense. My guess is just that they are getting way more requests than they had expected, and are having huge technical problems.
Note that on their home page links to their wireless plan have been dead for the last two days. I doubt that is something they meant to do. My guess is that life over at the AT&T wireless offices for the last week have been a chaotic nightmare, with everyone getting about three hours of sleep each night. I bet it is just a big mess.
On another note, it seems that if there is going to be true number portability, there should be some sort of national database that is shared. Who would administer this, I don't know, but having each carrier have separate databases gives me some hints as to how much of a technical mess this system could turn into.
I've had AT&T Wireless for about 4 years now and have had no complaints about them. When I started, I bought a nokia 5165, got some minutes, and 6 months of free text messaging. When I called after the 6 month period was up, I asked for them to drop the messaging service since I didn't use it that much. Their reply was "how about another 6 months free?" This continued each 6 months for about 2 years. All good things must come to an end though, and they finally started charging a couple bucks (since then I have learned that I cannot live without text messaging).
The reception has been the best I've encountered, experiencing it for 2 years in the SF bay area, and the previous 2 years in Nevada. My employers have bought me other providers, but none would work as well as AT&T, so I kept my personal phone with them. (If you must know, cingular's reception was horrible for me. Of course your mileage can and will vary. Sprint works okay for me, but AT&T still works better.)
As for service... I've only had to call maybe a dozen times in 4 years. All of the times I've been impressed with their service. Or should I say, while my view of the world's customer service is at an all time low, AT&T has provided some of the least crappy customer service, irregardless of industry. They've reversed late charges just because I've asked, and I don't recall ever being on hold a long time.
The last time I called was about 3 months ago. My 5165 died (4 years for a cellphone is impressive, these days a cellphone's lifespan seems to be about 6 hours), so I bought a nokia 3360 online, called customer service up, was on hold for about 3 minutes, and it took maybe another 4-5 minutes to get the new phone activated.
So I'm happy. But I'm also knocking on wood, since the last company I praised on slashdot was my SBC DSL, and as a result, my DSL line went down about an hour later. Heh. Also, as it's been mentioned before in these comments, the problems with number portability are probably not some evil scheme by AT&T Wireless. Their problems are affecting both switchovers TO them as well as FROM them. Remember, being evil means screwing the customer AFTER they become a customer of yours, not before.
Standard disclaimer: All corporations are evil. Some are just not as evil as others.
I don't understand why people put up with the phone companies in the USA.
In the UK, nearly all phone contracts are for one year. After a year, the customer only has to give one months notice to leave - none of this crap about being locked in for another year unless they take a new handset and sign a contract.
We can also change tariff mid contract, and it doesn't affect the contract end date.
We have had number portability for years now, enforced up by OFTEL the telecomms watchdog.
All phone companies have to unlock phones at the end of the contract if the customer asks, again enforced by law.
I don't understand why in the USA, phone companies get away with extending contracts by another year at the slightest excuse, locking customers into 2 year contracts, refusing to unlock phones for new SIM cards, putting extra "taxes" on the bill with no real basis, and dragging their feet over number portability. Why does the general public put up with it???
Steve.
A latent existence
I went into t-mobile on Monday the 24th and filled out all of the paperwork. 12 days later, 10 hours of hold time, and several nasty calls later, my phone still isn't ported.
ATT's system keeps coming back with some "Not Authorized" message when they try to port it. I'm pissed.
I wouldn't be switching, but ATT's coverage map says they have native coverage where I work, but they don't. I roam on t-mobile for 69 cents a minute. That's bullshit.
T-mobile customers don't pay anything to roam on ATT's network either. ATTWS's GSM network was slowly getting better until they signed the roaming agreement with t-mobile. Now they really have no incentive to keep building their network when they're sucking down 70 cents a minute from their customers that roam. To make it all worse, they TDMA network has gone to hell for some reason, and there are huge dead spots now where there used to be full signal. With all of the IT problems that I've heard about over there, I think they are in deep trouble.
Too bad, I've been with them for 7 years, and was happy until about a year ago. Now that I started a new job a couple of weeks ago and don't get coverage where they say I should, that's the last straw. I've complained several times and they just tell me they'll send me a new phone, even though I've tried using 3 different ones. They told my friend when he complained that he should just switch providers. ATT Wireless sucks now.
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