Slashdot Mirror
TiVo Goes After Sites Hosting Image Backups
TiVo User writes "TiVo has apparently decided to come down on sites that hosted 'image backups,' essentially tarballs of the OS for the machine, which just happens to be Linux. TiVo owners use the images to install on new, larger hard drives (increasing the recording capacity of the unit) or to recover a dead system. Why TiVo has a problem with this, but allows others to sell the same images for profit is beyond me." Read on for the rest of TiVo User's comments.
"The images are not used to create pirate TiVos (as a subscription service, TiVo justifiably controls access to their database tightly), so there wouldn't appear to be much harm in allowing them to be hosted. TiVo has always walked a fine line in allowing the user community to mod their units, perhaps they have finally stepped over that line, considering there are free alternatives that are less restrictive. To their credit, the legal mumbo jumbo in their cease letter is non-threatening compared to most other of this type, but it's interesting the letter draws no distinction between the portions of the software that are Linux, and therefore expressly distributable, and those that are proprietary to TiVo."
If they are allowing other sites to sell their images for a profit, presumably they are getting royalties, and would therefore want to encourage the growth of this market by stopping people doing it for free. Follow the money...
If I seem short sighted, it is because I stand on the shoulders of midgets
1. If Tivo has commercially-sensitive proprietary kernel modules, they are not obliged to distribute them, and AFAIK, the Tivo filesystem code falls into this category
:-) If I can do it, a lot of others can too...
2. They're bound to get a lot of people jumping on them "you must distribute", etc. See (1).
3. They're walking a fine line. I'm setting up a Mini-ITX/Hauppage 350 PVR with MythTV as a front-end. It looks cool, and it'll have a lot more features (like: burn a DVD as well as the normal PVR stuff
Simon
Physicists get Hadrons!
I know this is slightly offtopic, but what hardware is required for the free alternatives (MythTV/Freevo) to work smoothly?
Will a 1GHz VIA MiniITX board be able to do simultaneous encoding/playback (timeshifting) in MPEG2 or is an Athlon XP 1800+ necessary?
What hardware do YOU use?
I don't know why you would link directly to sourceforge project page for Freevo when they have a much nicer homepage, including screenshots, at http://freevo.sourceforge.net/
TiVo themselves have already posted their kernel modifications on the web site. They're Good Guys, usually. They have no obligation to let the rest of their code be tossed around the internet.
I suspect their concern is that someone will figure out how to hack their way into their servers or steal DirecTV service or eventually manage to run the whole image on "stock" hardware.
Much better for them to nip this copyright violation now than to try to stop it in a year or two when they'll annoy even more people. It may be harder for people to fix "hacked" TiVo's, but you take your own chances when you break that warranty seal...
For those GPL whiners. It took a whole 30 seconds to find this:
http://www.tivo.com/linux/index.html
The email from TiVo itself:
Your website (ftp.abs.net) has recently come to our attention. We appreciate your enthusiasm for the TiVo(R) DVR and we have some specific requests regarding your website.
We request that you cease hosting backup images of TiVo's proprietary software. The software represents valuable intellectual property of TiVo's, and making it available for copying and distribution is a violation of TiVo's copyrights. Such use is without our consent and is illegal under US federal copyright law. In particular, we are requesting that all of the files and directories located at ftp://ftp.abs.net/tivo/Backups/ be removed.
If they are correct in their statements, then this does indeed suggest that there is some proprietary code in addition to the GPL'd kernel in there. I suppose the best thing to do here is verify what can be distributed (under the GPL) and what can't, from the TiVo package.. (But I don't own a TiVo, so that may not be possible)
They aren't - the GPL doesn't specify how the code must be made available. They simply have to make the source available somehow, and are entitled to charge the cost of providing it.
The GPL DOES specify how the code must be made available, either by using a or b:
a) Accompany it with the complete corresponding machine-readable source code, which must be distributed under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above on a medium customarily used for software interchange; or,
b) Accompany it with a written offer, valid for at least three years, to give any third party, for a charge no more than your cost of physically performing source distribution, a complete machine-readable copy of the corresponding source code, to be distributed under the terms of Sections 1 and 2 above on a medium customarily used for software interchange; or,
Someone figured out if you restored image from a standalone Series 2 to a HD for a DirecTivo, you could get the full range of Tivo Series 2 functionality (USB Networking, etc.). The 'second generation' DirecTivos do not have a number of features that the standalone Series 2 Tivos have (DirecTV has chosen not to enable them).
It also caused problems with DirecTV's over-the-phone software update, as every night the machine would attempt to get new software but fail after applying the patch, tying up lines for several hours.
If I remember correctly from my Business Law courses, it doesn't matter if the warranty has expired. They never fixed the problem satisfactorily and therefore are still legally obligated to send you a working product.
Now once you have a working TiVo, they may be able to say to hell with you, but until then they are still bound by the original warranty, no matter how much time has passed.
And for a perspective from the other side of hardware reliability; I've owned a DirecTivo unit for going on 3 years and I haven't experienced any reliability problems with my unit at all. And believe me, it gets a workout! ;)
G