Money Problems May Derail First U.S. MagLev Train

PSaltyDS writes "The Virginian Pilot is reporting on the trials and tribulations of what was supposed to be the first MagLev train in regular use in the U.S. The MagLev Project was to cover a portion of the Old Dominion University campus, and start service in 2002, but after $14 million spent, it has yet to carry a single passenger. In the article, several engineering types seem to say the same thing, something like 'A great idea that is just too hard to do without an unlimited budget.' Is a maglev train an impractical fantasy like the personal flying car?"

Comments

If I'm Not Mistaken

[FractusMan]

Don't the Japanese already have one? What do the Japanese have that the US does not, to allow them to create a MagLev?

Re:If I'm Not Mistaken

[mcpkaaos]

An economy.

Re:If I'm Not Mistaken

[MoonFog]

They do, check out this link.
The japanese definately have the economy to do this, like has been mentioned. From the page:
A landmark for Maglev occurred in 1990 when it gained the status of a nationally-funded project.

Re:If I'm Not Mistaken

[Fnkmaster]

Very high population density and relatively small distance between urban centers combined with a willingness to throw away old conventions to make way for progress?

For example, here in the Northeast, the Boston-New York-Washington DC corridor would be a prime target for a Maglev train - the passenger volume is there, the airports are a huge hassle with congestion, weather problems in the winter, and massive traffic issues (driving to Logan in Boston or JFK in New York - ugh). Instead, we have legislation in Connecticut that prevents trains from going faster than 75 miles per hour for "safety reasons", so Amtrak blows a couple billion dollars on the sleek looking "Acela" trains, which go barely faster than the normal old fashion trains running the express routes. You shave about 30-40 minutes off of your travel time Boston to New York, and pay 3 times as much.

So instead they've had to market it as business class travel and sell it based on amenities instead of speed. Pure insanity. What we need is legislation and engineering working together to get a real high-speed train system down this heavy traffic corridor in place as a proof of concept AND proof of economical viability, so the price per mile can come down enough to build similar capability for longer runs.

Maglev or no, there's no technical reason that I'm aware of that high speed trains aren't running this corridor, just a lack of creative problem solving effort and cooperation between government and industry to get the damned thing built.

Re:If I'm Not Mistaken

[SuperMo0]

Because they've been building useless things like MagLev trains.

Re:If I'm Not Mistaken

[benmcgruer]

While I'm not familiar with the demographics of the trial area in the States, the Japanese has three major points which allow them to utilize high-cost public transport effectively.

1) V. High Population Density. This allows you build public transportation routes at a low distance (cost) per passenger.

2) Public Transport Culture. They are used to public transport as a reliable, effective and convenient method of travel. As in Australia, the US still relies a personal cars as the most convenient method of travel.

3) There's already huge overhead on materials and other expenses in Japan, such that the cost of additional technology becomes less significant. This is the same reason why your mobile phone has so many features, while you're lucky if your landline phone has caller id.

Re:If I'm Not Mistaken

[Neon Spiral Injector]

But it is a Japanese crapper, it plays music and has a motorised seat.

Re:If I'm Not Mistaken

[kryonD]

Hmmm...me thinks this guy has never been to Japan.

Nobody!, and I mean nobody spends money like the Japanese. Primarily from aspects of their culture such as usually holding parties in restaurants rather than the home like western countries, the sheer number of occasions where gift giving is appropriate, and no less than a dozen major festivals held each year. Japanese economy problems are mainly stemming from corruption in the major banks that is still being cleaned up and an overly inflated cost of living that drives down tourism.

The reason why Japan is in the lead for a useful Maglev, is because they already have a society built around the reliable usage of trains. I've been to Tokyo at least 15 times and I couldn't even imagine trying to get around that city without trains. The same deal applies to cross country travel. The shinkansen (bullet train) is at least 5 times faster than driving a car and slightly cheaper than flying. Everybody uses them. In the US, I'd bet money that 9 out of 10 average Americans couldn't even guess at the cost of a train ride from New York to D.C. The reason why is because most Americans first learn of passenger travel on a train when they see than Amtrack has derailed once again and dozens of people are dead or in the hospital. Plus in most major cities, I'll cite L.A. and Dallas for examples having been to both, you'll never hear someone respond to a complaint on the terrible traffick jams by saying, "yeah, but you can just take the train/subway, it's faster anyways." I'm 29 and most of my friends in Tokyo don't even own cars....they don't feel the need to.

America is fighting a cultural battle on this one. Gas is dirt cheap compared to just about anywhere else in the world and it's just more convenient for every average joe to have a car and drive everywhere. Until this changes, there's not going to be a lot of interest in riding a new high speed, low drag, sexy maglev. Well, other than the geek in all of us wanting to do it once so we can say we did.

Stupidity is...

[FFFish]

...ignoring the existing half-dozen working solutions in preference for pissing millions of dollars on a homebrew solution.

Even more stupid is insisting on a maglev solution when there are equally fast and substantially less-expensive traditional solutions, aka the French and Japanese bullet trains. One of those puppies just broke the 500kmh barrier with passengers.

Is a maglev train an impractical fantasy?

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, yes it is. Someone better go tell the Japanese that their train doesn't exist...

Re:Trains are obsolete

[Tyketto]

This is a bit out of context. It is not because no-one wants to use them, but a clash of availability versus American culture and lifestyle. For the past 50 years, automobiles have been the core of transportation for Americans, from teenagers on up. But that does not speak the same for the rest of the world.

In my time in Australia, I was WELL introduced to their mass transit systems, in both Sydney and Melbourne. For both cities, Trains, as well as Trams and buses, are their main modes (yes, MAIN) modes of transportation. Yes, people have cars there, but more than 100 million kilometers were travelled by train in 2002 alone; the bulk of it being in New South Wales, and Victoria (44 million and 32 million, respectively) alone.

Trains are very much alive, and will be for a very long time. It is just the United States, which has lacked in picking up on a trend that transports hundreds of thousands of people, in favour of polluting the air with carbon monoxide gases from car exhaust.

Maglev Good!. This project, Really Bad.

[strangedays]

Ok, so I forced myself to read the entire article, not easy, its a collection of confused finger pointing, and poor journalistic sound bites, sole intent to fill a news article. Zero Meaningful Content..

To summarize :
They are concerned about how the project was managed.
Concerned that the investment may not get repaid.
There are problems with the control system (not the magnetic levittation system itself note)
The assets are apparently a series of patents. Thats odd really, considering this is a tewenty year old technology.
The board and the university may have screwed up, they didn't put appropriate bonds in place, so now they are all nervous as to who gets blamed.
A board member now blames the technology, saying that others (Japan) could not make it work. This is incorrect.
Another guy refused to invest because of problems with the company (not the technology).
Maglev trains are described as "floats on a cushion of air". Duh. Fine journalism.
FRA has issued a stop work order, as usual asleep at the wheel. Way way way too late IMHO.

Overall, they all completely mismanaged this, tried to invent new stuff that doesn't work, and now need another two million dollar handout to get out of the hole they dug for us, the victim taxpayers.

Oh, and in the process they tarnish the reputation of a transportation technology we actually need.

Thanks for nothing ODU and FRA guys. Do us a favor, go fire yourselves.

Re:Just like the flying car...a loser?

[PSaltyDS]

I would like to add two interesting links pulled from other posts:

Birmingham International Airport in Britian used to have a MagLev running from '84-'95. It was shut down due to high maintenance cost and replaced with a cable-drawn rail system.

The Shanghai Transrapid looks at first blush like a running passenger service, but look closer and it is a "Test Facility" that gives guided tours and "Demonstration Rides".

There can be no doubt about the technical capabiltiy to build these things, but the practical viability has yet to be seen.