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RFID Casino Chips
scubacuda writes "Could casinos be the next Gillette or Wal-Mart? New Scientist and others report that casinos could soon start using RFID tags to spot counterfeits and thefts, and also to monitor the behaviour of gamblers. Embedded RFID tags should make the chips much harder to counterfeit, and placing tag readers at staff exits could cut down on theft by employees.
(With companies like Infosys helping clients identify and plan pilot RFID projects, we'll no doubt be seeing more and more companies dabbling in this area. Those interested in reading objections to RFID use should check out the position paper issued by CASPIAN, EPIC, Privacy Rights Clearinghouse, Junkbusters, ACLU, Meyda Online, EFF, and PrivacyActivism.)"
They can more easily monitor your swing of bet levels......
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
As soon as you walk into a casino you're already under the eye of man many cameras monitoring the place. What will this add? I mean Casinos are already Big Brother incarnate, All RFID chips will mean is that you can't cheat.
This is a great use for RFID tags. Watch all the chips, watch where the move, and track which ones I have.
I love to go to the casino and play card games like Blackjack or more importantly Craps. Accurate tracking of chips tagged to me would mean two things: accurate comping and the ability to have a technical solution to ensuring payouts are correct.
Those of you who have played craps at a busy table will know what I mean -- the accuracy of your payouts when you win is always in the hands of the "dealer" working your half of the table. I've been payed wrong many times, sometimes in my favor, sometimes not. Sometimes money comes in from bets I forgot I had on the table, sometimes I wonder if I got missed on a payout.
If this means that questioning a missed payout can be more accurate or means at a minimum the casino can see in aggregate when they have someone working the table who consistently makes payout errors, more power to them.
This isn't a privacy issue. If you think you have one spec of anonymity or privacy in a casino, you're nuckin futs.
As such, they are free to do whatever they like to stem losses, gain advantage over customers, etc.
If you don't like it, you can go to another casino that doesn't use RFID chips. Ain't America grand?
It's finally happened. The SlashThink phenomenon of "RFID is bad" has officially deteriorated into irrelevancy. This time, we're apparently supposed to think that RFID in casinos has something to do with our rights. It doesn't, and shouldn't. Nobody goes into a casino against their will, and nobody should be surprised that casinos exist for the sole purpose of tracking and taking money. For casinos to *not* use RFID to their advantage would be stupid and irresponsible.
I doubt they care too much if you take the chips out of the casino. After all, chips that go away don't have to be converted back into cash -- it's just that much extra profit.
What they don't want is for you to walk out the door with a stack of $1 chips and bring them back made to look like $100 chips. Presumably the RFID would also make it easier for them to detect fake chips that had never been in any casino before.
(Posting anonymously under fear of karma loss from that knee gently jerking back and forth in the Slashdot community. "Ahhhh! He's not agreeing with my anti-RFID stance! Heretic! Mod him down!")
How does this even remotely relate to "your rights"? Casino chips are the equivalent of "disney cash" in theme parks, IE under normal circumstances they are only used within the casino itself. Preventing loss would make the casino more money, and they might even use that to raise your pay tables when you're gaming.
The articles mention monitoring gamblers, but come on... you're in a casino! Your movements are tracked by a hundred cameras from the time you walk in to the time you walk out. Casino employees on the floor are designed to monitor your movement and habits and either 1) ask you to leave or 2) give you a free buffet coupon, depending on what you are doing. You have no privacy whatsoever and very little anonymosity in a casino. Sometimes that works out to your advantage.
Yes, there are bad uses for RFID. I don't see this as being one of them. Next thing you know people will be crying out because a warehouse wants to use RFID on crates for inventory control.
Oh, wait...
And also watched by the government gaming commissions closely, lest their gambling license get taken away or worse.
And you're worried about fucking RFID technology in their chips?
Casinos are one of the few places you should absolutely stay away if you are so paranoid like that.
SIG:Slashdot: indymedia for nerds.
"Sorry sir this is not our chip, I going to have to confencate it."
It's not like they'll be tracking you with their chips at the grocery store.
No, they'll be tracking you at the tables. "Comps" are bestowed based on how much money you wager. If the chips are associated with you when they're sold, then they can track where and when you wagered it and comp you accordingly.
One man's -1 Flamebait is another man's +5 Funny.
So, say you have a really good night...you cash out $9999, walk out with the rest...cash it out in small doses over time so you stay under the $10K radar. That way, all cash.....hard to track that.
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
File-sharing: Sure there are illegitimate uses for the technology, but there are a few legit uses. DON'T BAN IT.
RFID: Sure there are a few legit uses for the technology, but there are illegitimate uses. BAN IT!
I manage to avoid the surveillance problem and keep all my money by the simple expedient of not entering their establishment.
OK, they're using RFID tags in their own property to at the very worst, track your behaviour while on their property.
They're NOT putting these in items you buy, they're NOT using them to track you out the door, and they DO have a very real need to prevent counterfeits. There's increased security for them, and no invasion of privacy for their customers.
Where's the problem here? Geez, between this and the "forged colour mars photos," it MUST be a slow news day.
Oh, wait--both of these were posted by Michael. Interesting...
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
And why do you think you'll only be tracked while on the casino property? Most people who go to Vegas stay there for several days, and keep their chips with them when they leave the casino for the night, until it's time to go home. They don't cash out at the end of every session. Most casinos will in fact accept chips from other casinos. You can use Luxor chips at Caesars, and so forth. You can bet that the Caesars will install the equipment to install Luxor's and everyone else's. So you'll be tracked no matter what casino you go in. For that matter, every local restaurant may also install equipment to read the RFID's and they'll track you too.
Worst of all, the local muggers may also get RFID equipment. Walk past one on the sidewalk on the way to a restaurant with $3000 in chips in your pocket, and the mugger will know the demonination, serial number, and issuing casino of every chip. It makes their target selection a lot more efficient. They could even give you an automatically printed receipt to file with your police report, but somehow I don't think they'll do that.
Sheesh.
Casino chips are not something that the casino sells to you. You borrow them as an alternate counting mechanism. Putting RFID tags on THEIR OWN PROPERTY that STAYS THEIR PROPERTY, and STAYS ON THEIR OWN PREMESIS to prevent theft is fine. I'd say the same about museums putting RFIDs on those portable audio players and headphones they give you to walk around exhbits with, or shopping carts at grocery stores. It's theirs, it stays theirs, it stays on premeisis, they have a right to protect themselves against theft.
That is NOT the case if something is being actually sold to me. Ownership is changing hands at WalMart or wherever you shop, and I don't want something that is becoming MY property to come with auto-tracking mechanisms. If I want an auto-tracking system, I'll damn well install it myself.
But at a casino, what is being sold is entertainment, not poker chips. The chips are on-premesis loaned use, and so tracking those against theft is perfectly legitimate. Ownership is not changing hands, so RFIDs are not infringing on my property or privacy rights.
--GrouchoMarx
Card-carrying member of the EFF, FSF, and ACLU. Are you?
between RFIDs in something I OWN AND PAID FOR, and RFIDs in something that I AM ONLY BORROWING.
Now, if casinos sell souvenir (poker) chips... hopefully those wont have active (rfid) chips in them.
Hell, they should put RFIDs in rental DVD/VHS cases, so they can track down the bastard who hasn't returned that one copy of THX1138.
Actually, inventory departments of companies might do well to RFID their equipment, especially with a wireless network full of floating laptops...
Terrorists can attack freedom, but only Congress can destroy it.
casinos and gambling can be entertaining and fun. if you sit down at a blackjack table with $40, a few people you know, and spend three hours there chatting with folks and having fun, thats not entirely bad entertainment even if you lose all $40. if you walk away with all your money you've gotten a few hours of free entertainment. if you're a little lucky and a bit smart you can make some pocket change or coffee money for the week. there's always the possibility you walk away with a few hundred dollars, which ads to the entertainment value.
always gamble responsibly though. the worst is people who get addicted and gamble away their family's food or rent money.
in a case like this, this is an excellent use for RFID. protecting your own property by tracking the stuff that's yours using tags that you put in your own stuff is a perfect way to cut down on theft. in a casino, this is especially important. and having an RFID detector when people cash in makes for a good way to make sure the proper amount of money is redeemed.
i still don't want these things in my jeans.grey wolf
LET FORTRAN DIE!
If all the casino chips have microchips inside them then the pick-pockets and muggers along the strip will be able to tell from a distance who has chips in their pockets and be able to home in on them! You can stand by the exit of the casino with a pocket RFID reader and when your PDA lets you know someone just walked by with $10,000 in chips in their pocket you can signal to your heavies down the street!
If intelligent life is too complex to evolve on its own, who designed God?
I submitted Gambling with RFID a day or so ago, but the accepted one is much better. Oddly enough, the company Chipco International makes no mention of RFID chips on their site. I wonder how unhackable those chips are?
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
The main flaw with RFID that retails haven't worked out yet is a denial of service attack. Broadcast lots of RFID signals, at something more than minor power, and you can cause real problems.
Blackmailers will love it
a situation where I think RFID is the Right Way To Do It(tm). If the casinos are using RFID to verify that the chips are actually thier chips before payout, and to prevent employees from walking out with stolen chips, then that's thier right and this seems a reasonably innocuous measure.
I'm sure that there's lots of people who are crying "invasoon of privacy", etc, but this is one situation where you truly decided to play by thier rules when you walked through that door, and keeping track of thier own property is in no way an invasion of thier employees or thier customers privacy.
Read, L
If people are walking around outside with casino chips, all a mugger will have to do is scan them to see which ones are worth the effort of a robbery. No more knocking over some old lady and just getting chump change.