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To Recertify, or Not Recertify?

mckeefarley asks: "What is an out-of-work networking guy to do? Almost three years ago I worked for a systems integration company as a Senior Network Technician (with the help of an A+ cert). Two years and many certifications, later: "I am five months away from the expiration of my CCNP/DP and I question whether I should even spend the money to recertify." Would you spend the time and money to recertify, when every cent may count, and all of those pieces of paper still might not get you a job?

"The real fun and excitement was in the engineering department, and I was told the sure way in was to get my CCNA. Well I got my Sybex book, and with the help of our small lab (two Cisco routers and a catalyst switch) I received my CCNA with a [score over 90].

Thrilled as I was, the engineering department was taking some hits, and I couldn't get in. Instead of remaining stagnant I took it on myself to get my CCDA, which I got a month later. Engineering department still going down, me still wanting to rise, I looked for something else. At about this time my company was trying to get a contract working with Nortel routers and switches. 'This is my chance!', I proclaimed.

One and a half months later I was a NNCSS (Nortel Networks Certified Support Specialist), but then contract fell through. The engineering department was taking BIG hits (as was the rest of the networking industry), but I was determined. We only had one CCNP in the company, and my goal was set. With the help of the lab, and some determination, after three months I became a CCNP and CCDP.

Did I get in the engineering department?

Nope.

Did I give up?

Nope.

I got my CCIE study guide, and was all ready to rent time at a major Cisco lab at The University of Colorado, in Boulder (I am not even sure that they have this lab anymore). A month later there were two people left in the engineering department, and then was laid off.

After six months of unemployment checks and sending resumes, I gave up and decided to go back to school and do some independent consulting for some small businesses in the Denver metro area. Now, I am again looking for a full time job, and I am dealing with the same problems that I dealt with, two years ago.

I am happy to admit that all my hands on Cisco experience have not been in a production environment. I understand that the difference between the lab and the real stuff is huge. But the certs didn't, and still don't even get my foot in the door. My resume has been critiqued by many people, and is in tip-top shape. I do have experience on Gateways (Nomadix) and many switches (SMC) and have worked on some MDU engineering projects.

Any suggestions?"

7 of 557 comments (clear)

  1. If you don't have a C/S degree, get one by tjstork · · Score: 4, Informative


    One C/S degree > many certifications, and probably cheaper over the lifetime.

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    1. Re:If you don't have a C/S degree, get one by Trevin · · Score: 3, Informative

      I would have to disagree with your disagreement; I think things are slightly different in CS than EE. I've been hunting jobs for the last couple of years, and the vast majority of them want N years of work experience with X language on Y systems using Z tools. The degree requirement is usually there, but not as often as the experience requirement.

      Let's look, for example, at the first five companies listed in my daily Dice search:

      • 3+ years of specific recent experience in HRMS version 8.x, in-depth knowledge of PeopleTools, PeopleCode and SQR. Strong knowledge of SQL a plus. Bachelor's degree or equivalent education and experience.
      • Current or very recent experience at major mortgage lending institutions; Software Development P.M. Experience. No mention of a degree.
      • BS degree and 8-12 years engineering experience, including Quality Engineering, and direct experience with medical device or other FDA regulated environment. Also required is knowledge and experience with electromechanical and software intensive devices.
      • Must have at lease 5-10 years of experience in Mentoring and true ETL work. Experience with Cognos validating catalogs, cubes and customizing the visualization. No mention of a degree.
      • At least 3 years of experience required. Extensive experience with IBM 30xx mainframe using MVS/JES2 operating system environment. Knowledge of the CA-7 job scheduling and CA-1 tape management subsystems. Strong operations background in JCL, CICS, VTAM, TSO, ISPF, and SDSF. No mention of a degree.

      Add just one more generality: nearly every single job listing I've seen for gaming companies has a line like "You must have over 2 Years Video Game Programming Experience and some strong titles. This position is only for experienced video game professionals."

      With requirements like these, it seems impossible to get a job unless you've already worked there before.

  2. Educational expenses deductible by chopkins1 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Remember that expenses for education to get yourself re-employed (books, classes, certification testing, etc.) are all tax deductible.

    Recently I was unemployed (given I already have a 4-yr degree and 10+ years of experience) and decided to re-up my MCSE. I spent $7000 and 2-weeks to go to one of the many MCSE bootcamps (http://www.intenseschool.com). I got a job immediately following signing up for the class and the company paid me while in class.

    The kicker here is we recently went to the family CPA and he said all $7000 was tax deductible plus all the materials needed to complete any certification.

    Just my $.02. Good Luck

  3. Dupe, or comment promotion? You decide... by utahjazz · · Score: 5, Informative

    This episode of Ask Slashdot brought to you by this (Score: 1) comment

  4. Re:Hang in there.. by n4vu · · Score: 3, Informative

    I have to view certifications as neutral. While reviewing thousands of resumes in the course of screening hundreds of candidates for clients over the past three (lean) years, one trend is clear: employers are hiring for work history, not certifications. I even had one manager tell me not to bother sending him anyone with more certificates than years of experience.

    People who have the work experience might better take the time they would have spent cramming for certs, and spend it in developing a really door-opening resume, full of accomplishments, as opposed to just job descriptions.

    The question a hiring manager tries to answer in the first 20 seconds of viewing a resume is, "what can this person do for me," not "what were this person's job descriptions."

  5. Re:Pack your bags... by univgeek · · Score: 3, Informative

    This is bull-shit, please point to some references. All you need to work in India, is a letter of invitation from a company and a work visa. Sure you can't come in on a tourist visa and work. But it is much easier to get a work visa in India than in the USA.

    http://www.indianslivingabroad.com/resources/vis a- guide.asp for guidelines.

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  6. Re:Don't fool yourself by nelsonal · · Score: 5, Informative

    Exchange rates move a little each time that $8k salary is paid, as well as everytime you buy a Nokia phone, or other foreign made product. In the US we have (for the past 30 or 40 years) bought significantly more than we exported, but that is only half the story, a big part of our imports are oil related. What has kept things in balance (and even driven the dollar up) is that foreigners have generally wanted to invest in our financial products (equities, Treasury and Corporate debt, physical plants) this is what economists call the capital account, and has run a surplus (roughly balancing with the current accout deficit) until very recently after the bubble popped that cut some investment, but over the past year or so, money has been moving to europe because interest rates were significantly higher. The exception to this is Asian exporting countries that wish to prolong their export growth, who have been buying financial products here (mostly Treasury debt) if they stop, the dollar will fall significantly (bringing those $25k salaries a whole lot closer to the $8k salary (in dollar terms).
    Business follows things in trends, and just like railroads, the internet, Japan, and many other huge changes, there will be significant production developed there, but right now it is a bubble and it will pop eventually. The good news is that this will significantly reduce the excitemet assocated with India, the bad news is that something like 90% of the investmet in a bubble change occurs after it pops (just at a much slower rate).

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