Worst Terms of Service Ever

Popageorgio writes "Yale's Lawmeme features the most oppressive, paranoid web site TOS ever, found at the Central Pacific Railroad Photographic History Museum. 'Additionally, in the event that your actions in violation of this User Agreement result in our being deprived of our exclusive rights . . . you agree to pay us liquidated damages in the amount of five million U.S. dollars . . . . You agree to use only the provided permissions e-mail address (or other e-mail links on this website, as appropriate) and not to telephone us or content contributors with permissions or other requests, nor to attempt to circumvent the provisions of this agreement, and telephone calls placed in disregard of the foregoing will be charged at two hundred fifty dollars per telephone call.'(Emphasis theirs)." The museum acknowledges this is crazy, too -- read on for more.

The legal birdseed here (appropriately and manically illustrated in the manner of The Secret Guide to Computers) makes the copy on Dr. Bronner's Soap look sane; the user agreement ("Click on any link or image to indicate "I ACCEPT" the USER Agreement.") begins with a little blurb about why it's necessary, and asks you not to be put off by the legalese. That might seem disingenuous at first, but buried in the text is this note, too: "[Yes, we know that you think that all this legalese is completely ridiculous, and we think so too, but we also believe that current law unfortunately requires that it be done this way; So if you know of a better, simpler 'legally correct' way, do tell us how!]"

(Besides this amusing legal stuff, the site is actually very interesting, at least if you enjoy U.S. history and trains.)

Comments

Oh, The Temptation

[The Dobber]

Think I'll call em from a pay phone, just for shits and giggles

Re:Oh, The Temptation

[Gothic_Walrus]

No...you're doing it all wrong.

Want to call? Call collect from a pay phone. Now that would be fun...

:)

Re:Oh, The Temptation

[identity0]

No no no, don't pay the bills yourself - have someone else do it!

Call up SCO, and tell them "I want to tip you off that there is a large number of unlicensed SCO/Linux boxes at the Central Pacific Railroad Photographic History Museum. Call (phone #), and ask them for licenses - in fact call them repeatedly, they may pretend to not know what you're talking about."

Hilarity ensues.

Hrmmm...

[Ooter]

Are you sure this isn't the SCO Museum (which is hopefully soon to come)?

Reporting Errors

[osmodion]

"You agree to immediately notify CPRR.org by e-mail of any errors, ... or any other defects or deficiencies which you discover on this website . . . ."

Should I tell them about the TOS?

Too much time on their hands

[tscholz]

That is the longest TOS page I have ever seen. Looks like they have used more time on the TOS, than on the rest of the site.

Re:Too much time on their hands

[zurab]

They definitely spent more time on TOS than creating "original works" from public domain pictures from 19th century claiming copyright.

If you read the "ORIGINALITY" section they claim it requires artistic and original skills to scan the images and save them as JPEGs; not only that, but in the process, an original piece of art is created (a requirement for copyright). Therefore, even though the original images are 19th century and public domain, they are holding copyright on their scans. By agreeing to their TOS, you agree that that's the case.

I don't see how scanning public domain pictures calling them your own qualifies as an original work. It qualifies for extortion though:

- get hold of a rare public domain document/picture/book/etc.
- scan it and save scans as JPEGs/PDFs/whatever;
- lock the original public domain work in a safe;
- you've got a brand new never-expiring copyright and you didn't even have to produce anything!
- sell the art and PROFIT!!!

Re:Too much time on their hands

[dvdeug]

Ever buy a print at the store? A reproduction of a work is a copyrightable work in of itself.

No, it's not, not in the US. BRIDGEMAN ART LIBRARY, LTD. v. COREL CORP says that a reproduction of a work does not get a new copyright, because copyright is given for creative works, and reproduction, especially an accurate one, isn't creative; it's merely a reproduction.

don't visit! scary!

[Anonymous Coward]

I read through that and at first thought, that's pretty funny, I've been
thinking of putting stuff like that on my own web site .. something about
50,000 words long and at the end say "or you may simply ignore the above and
choose the following Creative Commons license instead". The fact that it's all
old public-domain stuff, hilarious!

But looking around I began to wonder.. is it a joke or not? I'm not seeing any
punch-line.. Maybe this guy is *serious*.. but how can you take it seriously,
it defies logic. It's already illegal to make unauthorized copies, so what's
the point? And he admits that it is ridiculous.. should I agree to anything
"ridiculuous"? Would it stand up in court?

If he seriously can't come up with a shorter agreement (hint: nothing gives
visitors the right to copy stuff that isn't PD, so you don't have to do *ANYTHING*).

Then I read his replies, and I'm starting to realize, this isn't funny like
the /. poster seems to think.. this is FUCKING CREEPY. This guy scares me.

Don't visit this site, this guy is probably collecting IP addresses and he's
going to start stalking you or something. I'm almost afraid to write this..

*shiver*

WHOA now everytime I press the submit button after visiting his site,
konqueror crashes .. he's got some weird browser-crashing code or something .. wtf!!!! I'm using
mozilla to post this now. ...

Re:Hold up

[Anonymous Coward]

I always "Tab" to the "Click Here to Accept" link and then press "spacebar", thus passing by the whole "clicking" issue altogether.

NBA Tickets

[herko_cl]

I bought NBA tickets a while ago via the web (for a team that shall remain nameless). I received an email with the transaction details, and below it says...
"This ticket is a revocable license.The holder, on behalf of the holder and any minor accompanying the holder (individually and collectively, the "Holder"), agrees to all of the terms hereof."
Then it goes on in excruciating detail about all of the stuff I can't do with the tickets I just purchased, and how by buying a ticket I grant them permission forever to use my image in whatever manner they see fit without paying a penny, etc, etc. By word count, that email is 19% transaction confirmation and 81% legalese.
The nice thing is that "This ticket cannot be replaced if lost, stolen or destroyed". WTF???? They made it patently clear I had bought a license...
Just thought it was sorta funny, in a sad way, and somewhat ontopic.

Re:Hold up

[jonfromspace]

I don't click links anymore, I type them into IE!

Sorry /troll

Re:stupid terms of service and the court

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm pretty sure your post was in semi-jest, and IANAL, but here's my $0.02.

Terms of service bind you in a contract with a company or individual. These terms, while defined by the company, need to be within reasonable limits and with a justification. For instnace, if you bail out of a cell phone contract early, it is reasonable that they charge you $200 for what you would have brought in over the next 2 years of your contract.

Also, and i may have seen this from watching too much Judge Judy, but because something is in a contract does not mean it is binding. For the obvious example, if someone had a contract that required an illegal activity (like human slavery or prostitution) that contractual agreement is non-binding. However, i am unclear if the entire contract becomes null and void; I believe soley that clause or agreement is voided.

As someone who hardly issues T.O.S. for client's websites, does anyone have a suggestion on a good medium point for T.O.S's?

No it's not..

[bcore]

They are serious, although it's written kinda tongue in cheek. They just didn't have a real lawyer available to write it for them, so they tried to make it all inclusive.

Re:That TOS is WEAK!

[Honkytonkwomen]

Actually, about a thiord of the way down, it says:

" Suddenly increased, excess web traffic on this website as a result of your actions, including but not limited to publicity, reporting, or recommendations to others regarding this website on network television or radio or national publications or media, of more than one gigabyte of additional Internet data transfer per month, shall be at your expense, and you agree to reimburse CPRR.org for the resulting costs at the rate of the then prevailing additional data transfer charge made by the Internet provider(s) hosting this website."

So I guess /. is screwed ;-)

Oh YEAH?!

[Hwatzu]

I'm going to change my hostname to "you_agree_to_let_me_take_any_image_from_your_site .by_including_this_host_in_your_logs_and_permittin g_me_to_connect". If it shows up in their logs, it's conclusive proof that they wanted me to take things from their site.

Re:Hold up

[Paradise Pete]

my Atari400 with that membrane keyboard finaly has one good point: it doesn't click. (of course I had to void my warrintee by disconnecting the speaker to get it to stop clicking

Oh man, just POKE 65, 0

Re:Hold up

[grammar fascist]

If you add on line 3,567 in comments.pl the following line:

#@*&^ if $#KDjk^es '+5, Nerd'

Then you'll have it!

And what do you call that language? "Cuss"? "Programming With Expletives"?

Oh, wait. That's perl.