Slashdot Mirror
Russian Rovers on the Moon
An Ignorant American writes "Perusing an Air & Space magazine the other day, I came across an article about Russian Moon Rovers during the space-race era. Thanks to my American science education, I had never heard of this feat. I asked around (friends and coworkers) and nobody else I've talked to has heard of them either. They were called 'lunokhod', and were the first of their kind. Unmanned, remotely operated rovers with basic instrumentation. Two were successfully landed on the Moon, each driving for many miles on the Moon's surface, returning tens of thousands of pictures. You can do a Google Search to start your education, or read what they have to say at Wikipedia on the subject (Wikipedia also has some external links.)"
An interesting fact is that while the Lunokhod robots transmitted more than 20,000 TV pictures and more than 200 TV panoramas and also conducted more than 500 lunar soil tests, their actual purpose was to try and find US made robots and/or buildings(!) on the surface of the moon.
This was done under a program name of "Timofeev". Timofeev is just a common Russian last name and seems to have no special meaning (not referring to a lead scientist/government official, etc).
I wonder what else american public schools forgot to teach me...
Also look at the pictures (images.google.com)
candidly
They were pretty successful. The last pictures showed something like this on the lunar surface. After this, transmissions were cut off.
Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
the most interesting thing about all of this is that they remodeled the rover for earthside use under the brand name lada.
2 1337 4 u!
I'm not going to try and defend the US Education system for it's lack of bias, but I doubt that you learned about any US Mars Rovers in school either - even if they were current events. We have yet to talk about the Spirit and Opportunity rovers in my school... it's a shame really. :/
I can't believe that the Russians beat us there. To think that they could have been the first to build a movie set and fake a lunar rover landing! I'm glad we were first to think of putting human actors on the set, though!
Not A Sig
in czech republic (fromer soviet ally) was a small model lunokchod with remote control. all people in eastern europ know lunokchods. i am surprised it is not known in usa, because american exploration of space was well known in the eastern block.
by th way, Lunochod means Moonwalker
SHE does throw dice.
"the most interesting thing about all of this is that they remodeled the rover for earthside use under the brand name lada.
Tested on the moon? This must explain the "bounce 20 feet in the air when you roll over a pebble" suspension.
Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
I can't believe you've never heard of this (even if you are American). Ever wonder why so many of the features on the dark side of the moon have Russian names? It's the same with many features on Mars, too.
10 Bits= $.25
100 Bits= $.50
110 Bits= $.75
1000 Bits= 1 byte
In America we tend to forget that we are far from immune from 'evil socializing school.' I remember hearing about flying Russian dogs but never moon rovers. In fact, come to think of it I never knew we landed on the moon more than once until I saw Apollo 13.
It reminds us that our history books stilled talked about manifest destiny in grand terms until the mid 70s and how the genocide of indigenous peoples in our own country was conveniently brushed aside at the same time. Politicians here love to criticize Japanese teachings about WWII, but this is a good reminder that us Americans should temper our supposed superiority from time to time.
--Chag
I went to American public schools.
I knew that Russians had put rovers on the moon.
School's job is not to tell you everything that's ever happened. School's job is to give you the tools you need to find things out. I got those tools. You did not. The fact that we both got an "American" education is irrelevant.
Quit blaming your ignorance on your teachers. Start paying more attention to what they had to work with.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
When the Soviet Union wad ruled by Leonid Brezhnev, an extremely elderly person not capable of any mental activity furing his late years, there was a joke about Lunokhod and Brezhnev.
Airport in Germany. Soviet and German leaders meet. As the Germans come to the Soviet airplane, Brezhnev comes out, sniffs everyone from the German delegation, picks up some dirt off the ground, puts it in his pocket and returns to the airplane.
Few minutes later a Russian scientist apologizes: "We messed up and instead of Presidential visit program loaded up Lunokhod program".
And if you are in Kansas, you can see them st the Kansas Cosmosphere and Space Center.
www.eFax.com are spammers
Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
If you go to Viet Nam, you'll find a lot of people who believe that:
1) The Soviets landed people on the moon;
2) The US moon landings were faked.
They learned it in school. I've even heard that from some of my in-laws there, and I'm far from sure I've convinced them it isn't true. Heck, some Americans even believe 2.
I remember the whispering propaganda of the 60's and 70's. "The soviets all use crapy electronics", "The soviets rockets all crash or explode", "The soviets are way behind the USA", etc. In reality, time has revealed that whatever their politics, the soviets showed great economy and resourcefullness (at a time many US rockets blew up, too but were less publicized) and succeded in many ways. That their information has been so overlooked rather underscores a propaganda war on the part of the USA (and make no mistake, since the day Kennedy launched the Space Program, there was a huge propaganda onslaught to make US look good, inspite of setbacks and disasters.)
I've never met an astronaut, but have met a cosmonaut, an intelligent and personable fellow, who was mercilessly grilled by a college professor on politics rather than the space programs.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
No disrespect to the soviet space pros, but I gotta call BS on 2 counts here:
1) On several occasions, launches were made LONG before ready, for political reasons, risking lives (not that this is a soviet only thing)
2) US failures were less publicized? We had rockets blowing up on LIVE TELEVISION, whilst the world found out about russian flights after splashdown 1/2 the time. The failures we only know about (until recently) because we found massive craters from exploded rockets.
The entire space race was an exercise in propaganda, anyway.
"Faith: Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel." - A.B.
While I might not have the educational system of the USA (in a general sense) in the greatest regard (relax, I don't hold my own in high regard) this apparent lack of knowledge is rather general. I remember Lunokhod very well but I was a) very interest in spacial exploration when I was a kid and b) most of the books I had were from the USSR (or from Novosti Press editions in Portugal).
The thing is, most of my classmates were not even interest in the whole subject, so for them Lunokhod or Appolo didn't meant anything. In the USA it's obvious that people have knowledge (or should have, it is after all a great thing to be prouf of) about their own space missions, but beyond that it's really down to curiosity and personal interest.
I would argue that most knowledge of this kind that people have is not directly derived from taking classes at school but it's a result of curiosity and self-reading. And perhaps rightly so.
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. - Edmund Burke
The rovers were driven in real time, using a very low quality TV- no half-tones, one frame in several seconds. One day they drove Lunokhod-2 into a crater, and had troubles climbing out. The drivers decided to back off a little. Lunokhod-2 had no rear- view camera, and they collided with a rim of the crater. The solar battery was covered in dust, reducing it's output. They try to clean the battery by flipping it, but the dust wouldn't come out, and what would got on a heat radiator surface, which lead to overheating. The drivers got the rover out of the crater, but it didn't wake up after next lunar night. Source (in Russian): http://www.space.hobby.ru/projects/lunochod1.html
The Russians beat the US a very large number of firsts in space. First satellite, first animals in space, first human in space, first safe landings from orbit, first spacewalk, first to the land a probe on Mars, first probe to Venus, first orbital station, first flight around the moon.
The whole notion that the US "won the space race" is an interesting bit of spin. The fact is that the USSR notched up a very large number of firsts and could equally argue that they won the race if the finishing line hadn't been arbitraly decided to be a manned mission to the moon (and you can bet that it wasn't the Russians who decided that that was the only feat which mattered).
The US won the cold war over the USSR, or more to the point, outlasted the USSR, because the USSR ran out of money. Ultimately the Soviet system was a poor means of running a country, so they lost their super power status... but that hardly means they lost the space race.
As Napolean said: history is a lie made up by the victors.
"...so rather than risking dnagerous human mission on the moon, they only sent robot, while astronauts stayed safely at home."
What's the point of exploring space if we don't go there? The Europeans (and unlucky Africans) that settled North and South America didn't send something to report back saying, "Oh, that's nice", they went there. The U.S., Canada, Mexico, and all of Central and South America as they are now is the result. Yes, negative ramifications abounded, but the collective we wouldn't be where we are today if it weren't for those circumstances. Humanity is stronger because we are spread out, and if we actually get the guts to try to go into space permanently we will be stronger still. I'd like to hope that all of the work we do isn't for nothing in the long haul. We're the most versatile living thing to come about in known history. Let's see what we can really do.
Do not look into laser with remaining eye.
The Wikipedia page has been slashdotted.
Under a list of protected pages, the Lunokhod program page is listed because page was listed on a /. story 26 minutes ago, has already been vandalized half a dozen times including insertion of goatsex links. Pakaran. 23:06, 10 Feb 2004 (UTC)
Go read who's real history?
Which author's/publisher's version do you accept as gospel? The one that says slavery? The one that says state's rights? They both have some truth in them.
I was taught in the public schools that Lincoln was trying to preserve the union. Abolishing slavery in the states in rebellion was a carefully considered wartime economic and political move that Jefferson Davis himself considered. Yes, it was hugely symbolic, but that doesn't mean it was *only* symbolic. The preservation of the union was the main thing as at that time in history England and France both had reasons for wanting us divided, weakened, and were really hoping for a divided union for obvious reasons.
I was also taught by my teachers that I would never learn everything in a few hours a day. That the teachers had enough time to cover only very monumental events and that it was the responsibility of ME AND MY PARENTS to make sure that I took the basic tools they gave us in school and go out in the world and read, question, and learn. And, to attempt to synthesize the various slanted historical perspectives before coming to my own conclusions.
Russian rovers! Bah! What monumental historical event should this displace in a curricula that can only cover a finite amount of material?
Stop blaming the system for everything they didn't teach you.
Thank a teacher that you've the wit to get in a flame war here on slashdot!
Don't forget Luna 16 which had a descent and
ascent stage and retrieved a lunar soil sample
which it brought back to Earth in Sept. 1970
Luna 16
Also don't forget Luna 15. Just two hours
before the Apollo 11 Eagle was due to lift
off from the Moon, Luna 15 crash-landed
into the Moon's surface. It's job had been
to robotically retrieve soil samples which
could well have trumped Apollo 11 in doing so
and without risking human lives.
Those old of us to vividly remember the
Apollo 11 landing will also recollect the
drama surrounding Luna 15 right up until the
last moment.
There is an unused Lunokhod rover here in the states. Here is a color picture I took a few years ago. The rover is/was at the Kansas Cosmosphere. The Cosmosphere is a wonderful place, and well worth making a road trip.
The top of the rover popped open lengthwise to reveal the solar panels. The long nose looking thing on the front was the antenna. There are rumors that these rovers did sample returns even. Havn't seen any proof though.
Here's to losing my Karma Bonus again....
Here is an interesting tid-bit: to remotely drive the rovers, the russians selected people who did not have driver licences.
The idea was that they would not have driver's reflexes they would have to unlearn in order to drive a vehicle with a 1 second lag in response thanks to the Earth_Moon gap...