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Napster Sells 5 Million Songs

mattmcal writes "CNet reports that Napster has already sold 5 million songs. The number is impressive despite lagging behind Apple which maintains a 56% market share according to SiliconValley.com. The integration with portable devices must play a key role in the download volume which Apple has also developed for the mini iPod."

31 of 340 comments (clear)

  1. Apple surely have this one sewn up by Space+cowboy · · Score: 4, Insightful
    • They're running at a low cost (at least in their terms :-)
    • they've got a reputation for 'cool' design
    • It's easy for them to match the h/w and s/w
    • They were there first, at least with a viable legal business model


    Everyone else is an also-ran for the forseeable future, IMHO. It'd take a pretty big hitter (and Napster aren't big enough) to break it, with a significant investment. Frankly Apple are doing what the RIAA etc. should have paid someone to do a long time ago...

    Simon.
    --
    Physicists get Hadrons!
    1. Re:Apple surely have this one sewn up by OmniVector · · Score: 3, Insightful

      and apple also claims they make no money off iTMS, but use it as a way to sell iPods which they do cash in on.
      companies like napster have quite an uphill battle.

      --
      - tristan
    2. Re:Apple surely have this one sewn up by TedCheshireAcad · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I don't see how Napster (Roxio) is making any money on this. Apple breaks even with the iTunes Music Store, and they just use it as a vehicle for selling iPods.

      ...Of course, Napster is into the college student extortion program now. It's odd, everyone tries to screw college students, and our niche was being able to screw the recording industry, oh, how the tables have turned.

      ...where is that Pepsi cap?

  2. Not from me by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    They did not sell any to me. I was looking to buy some songs, but Napster's meagre catalog did not have them. They were only available via "outlaw" p2p.

    If the RIAA is going to stem piracy and make money, they should actually take some effort to sell the music.

  3. Re:purchase songs? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Why buy a car? There's loads of them in the street - take whichever one you fancy!

  4. gripes. by DarkHelmet · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Sorry, but I'm still not turned on to the idea of online music downloads.

    1. To me, $0.99 per song is still a jack. If a track has 13-15 songs per album, that's $13 - $15 for all the tracks on the CD. Considering that I get no artwork, no packaging, no permanent format, that's a rip off.
    2. The file format is lossy. I'd be paying for a lower quality representation than what I could buy at a store for the same price.
    3. DRM is a bitch.
    4. I can get the same thing, or a higher quality version online.

    Sorry, but there has to be some more incentive for me to buy into the system.

    1. $0.50 a song is a good starting point, $1.00 for a FLAC version of the song.
    2. Printout art available when purchasing all the songs on the CD.
    3. ISO downloads. A lot of CD's come with extra's for the PC. Quite simply, it's one of the things that makes me buy the CD rather than just donwload the song (other than actually liking the band). Add this, and I'll start reconsidering.
    4. Stop being a bitch about giving this stuff to my friends. Do you know how many friends I've turned on to certain groups of music just by giving them a song? *cough* WeedShare anyone? Apple and Napster can learn from this.

    Yeah, yeah, yeah, the arguments are very old in this post, and it's all been said before. But nothing's being done, and I'm still not being converted over. Considering how much of a computer user I am, this is rather surprising.

    --
    /^[A-Z0-9._%+-]+@[A-Z0-9.-]+\.[A-Z]{2,4}$/i
    1. Re:gripes. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You say "converted" like you need to choose between the two. What is the problem with buying full physical CD albums for when you want the whole she-bang, and going to iTunes when you want a one-shot song you heard on the radio for a buck? Physical CDs and digital music are not mutually exclusive, friend.

    2. Re:gripes. by millahtime · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Don't forget about the whole problem of if you cancel Napster you loose all the music you downloaded after a little while. I would consider that to be a big problem that iTMS doesn't have.

    3. Re:gripes. by wideBlueSkies · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Another point on this. In the case where I want to make a mix CD for the car I find that it's usually easier to rip mp3's back to CD (because the files are 'right there' on the computer than it is to find the CD and do a bit for bit copy.

      And I still don't really notice the sound difference. The way I see it, this is the equivalent of how we all used to make 2nd or 3rd generation copies of records back in the 80's. Or tape blocks of songs off the radio. (I still have a lot of these tapes (TDK SA/90's) and have been slowly converting them to .mp3.

      The sound may not be as good, but just as long as the song itself can still be hard and that song stirs some kind of emotion, then who cares if the quality isn't as good.

      wbs.

      --
      Huh?
    4. Re:gripes. by gnu-generation-one · · Score: 2, Insightful

      "DRM is not an issue unless you want to use a non-supported player or pirate music"

      Nice troll.

      DRM is the difference between knowing you'll be able to listen to music, and not knowing that you'll be able to listen to music.

      Know what hi-fi you'll have in 3 years time? Are you sure it'll be supported by your chosen DRM scheme? Howabout if you have the choice of one hi-fi that supports the scheme, and a better hi-fi that doesn't?

      Going to be on Windows/MacOS all your life? Howabout at work? Good luck listening to crippled music when you start using XMMS.

      Ever plan to get an in-car CD player?

      A decent jukebox? (Nomad Zen plays just MP3)

      Howabout your friends' systems? Can they still borrow your music?

      Want to put your music on a set-top box and play it in the living room? Did you check which formats MythTV supports?

      DRM means that in a few years, you'll be fiddling with an audio loopback cable and a copy of Audacity trying to retrieve a copy of your music, while anyone who's insisted on a readable format for their music will be happily converting to whatever portable or hi-fi device they buy next.

      p.s. go and read about piracy before you continue comparing murderers with people who share music

  5. That is theft. downloading is not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    Taking a car like that is theft. Downloading (creating a duplicate of something) does not meet the definition of theft.

    If you want a comparable situation, why don't you find a nice shiny Porsche parked along side the street. Build an exact replica of this car, and drive off in the replica.

    1. Re:That is theft. downloading is not by good(k)night · · Score: 2, Insightful
      If you want a comparable situation, why don't you find a nice shiny Porsche parked along side the street. Build an exact replica of this car, and drive off in the replica.
      .unless they have a patent for it...
      --
      my endian is bigger than yours!
    2. Re:That is theft. downloading is not by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      That would be insightful, but there is no valid patent on the Porsche design. There's a copyright on the logos and name, but there is no essential part that is patented. If you changed the logo to Porshe or something of that nature, you'd have something quite analogous to an MP3 that had been renamed and the owner of the original could care less if you drove away in your copy.

  6. Re:Subscription? by pixelbend · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Apple == You own data.
    Napster == Your rent data.

    Who want's to do that?

    --
    Prospective station wagon buyer: "I know what you say is true...but...er...I don't know how to maintain a tank!"
  7. Competition is good by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Competition is a good thing, because is should lead to lower prices. Unfortunately, when there are only a few suppliers, collusion, rather than competition, is more likely to happen.

  8. Paid individually or University subscription? by GuySmiley · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Did each song generate 0.99$ or are these from the University contracts allowing all students to download at will. This is a huge difference. Does anybody have the contract details of the University deals? Is it a blanket fee or reduced charge per song? If students get 'free' unlimitted downloads and are all on T1/T3 lines, of course, 5e6 songs are easily downloaded. This is not surprising.

    --
    Hey, leave comments about my mother out of this!
  9. Re:define "viable alternative" by Dystopian+Rebel · · Score: 1, Insightful
    You know, I don't care as much who comes out ahead in the online music store wars, just as long as they are seen as a viable alternative to purchasing shiny plastic discs at the mall.

    What isn't viable to me is paying for poor-quality sound. Music with a full dynamic range (classical, some jazz) suffers from lossy compression.

    Online music stores will be viable to me when I can download the same sound quality that I can buy on a disc from a meatspace establishment or from Amazon and MyMusic.

    - - -

    --
    Rich And Stupid is not so bad as Working For Rich And Stupid.
  10. iTunes is wonderful, but... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I can't use it here in the UK (*). Napster is ok, but I still find the depth of tunes is not really to my tastes, plus I own and iPod, so WMA files really don't float my boat when it comes to music on the move.

    Add to that the DRM issues and to be honest, I don't really want that much hassle when I decide to upgrade/reinstall my PC, so in the long term, both iTunes and Napster won't do it for me I'm afraid. Call me a stick in the mud, but I'm not supporting anything that deprives me of my basic consumer rights.

    So, I tend to support smaller non-DRM'd operations like Bleep, which is worth checking out if you like your coffee table electronic music...

    (*) I've always wondered why global record corporations have so much problems sorting out global rights, which is apparently why iTunes is not happening outside the US.

  11. Re:Great! by nicedream · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Ok I'll try to look over the simplistic nature of your comment and explain why:

    1. Ease of use - No more trying to track down songs and not being able to find them for months. If I see it on iTunes, I can have it right then. This is especially good for full albums.

    2. Good quality - No more 56kbps mono files mixed with 192kbps stereo files. No more shitty rips with skips in them.

    3. Uniform ID3 tags - Nothing pisses me off more than opening up an MP3 I just downloaded and seeing the album name or artist name is "++{Ripped by tHe eNfOrCeRz}++" or something equally lame.

    4. Probably some other stuff that I can't be bothered to think of at this time.

    In the end, it's worth it to me.

  12. Re:question.... by pikkumyy · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I disagree. Average three songs per user is a huge amount when considering that probably all of these songs are available via eMule and others for free.

    Also the "7-day free trial" must have made a number of curious people register without purchasing anything. So I'd say an average *money paying* user has purchased an album's worth of music.

  13. Re:define "viable alternative" by bay43270 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Don't fool yourself into thinking CDs have 'full dynamic range' of sound. CDs are a compromise, just like anything else. No, they don't have lossy compression, but they do have limited range. While the AAC files on Apple's music store use lossy compression, it's a much better technology than the 10 year old mp3 format -- and the recordings are made from the original tapes (they are not CD rips).

    Recording sound is all about compromise. Don't base your judgment of one format over another based on a single word like 'lossy'. Listen to a few songs on the music store and let your ears be the judge.

  14. Bad catalogs... by mtrupe · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The great thing about the heyday of Napster/Kazza/others was the great availability of rare recordings-- Live Rush stuff, really old Pink Floyd, hard to find CSNY. The record companies have made it so, once again, we are not "allowed" to listen to this great stuff.

    I checked out Napster just today. $9.99 a month and $.99 for a download. Big whoop. If I want to buy an album its still going to be $10-$20, depending on how many songs are on it, but now I get to pay an extra $9.99 a month to have the privilege to download.

    IMHO, if you only download a couple of songs without getting the album, you are missing some great traks (b sides). Of course, this is only true to real music, not the boy band and rap crap that is popular these days....

    1. Re:Bad catalogs... by SomeOtherGuy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Amen. I always looked at online music procurment as a way to get the songs that I could not purchase off the top 40 rack at my local target. Yet any "modern", "legal" -- file sharing service assumes that I would want to buy crappy top 40 of today or yesterday.

      --
      (+1 Funny) only if I laugh out loud.
  15. Re:question.... by hpavc · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Agreed, its well known ITMS doesn make money *PROFIT* on its music sales directly. If this is true and volume doesnt matter. Napster has to be bleeding.

    Frankly I would think ITMS would have better negotiation ability for costs as wel. Napster just doesnt seem to me as having the ability to get a the best deal. Given their history and all.

    --
    members are seeing something, your seeing an ad
  16. Define "sold" by SuperChuck69 · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Does their definition of "sold" include "comped"? It usually does.

    Crapster has been trying to get me to download "5 trial songs" ever since they got back into business. If I downloaded these, would they count toward Crapster's running total? That's not a terribly fair assessment if you ask me...

    --
    :wq
  17. A battle that cannot be won by kd4evr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I view this pay-per-download thing just as a painful transition to a better world.

    The technology has advanced enough to enable any Johnny B to make as many copies of digital anything as he wants. No RIAA, DMCA, CIA, or YMCA is going to stop the inevitable.

    Wrong strategy: Instead of pursuing those who try to profit distributing fakes to people and are the big players costing the consumer as well as the author rights owner, the reseller and the producer big bucks, companies try to maximize their current net gain by restraining the choices of the regular Johhny B. As if the mainstream and biggest selling hits were immortal works of art that need to be treasured in vault rather than a day-to-day fad, only to be forgotten if not accessed in the same month.

    Right strategy: Adapt. Face the fact that for a product to succeed, it must be cheaper and better than something one can-do-himself in his home.

    The age of expensive CDs is over. Vynil was cheaper to buy than to copy, but people always liked to use cassete tapes for copies - who was nuts enough to pursue that?

    Customer will, eventually, stop at some point to let themselves be squezzed out of every penny. Not to mention the third world who is quick to pick on some of the technology, but much less willing or able to follow royalty and copyright practice.

    Prices will have to fall, be it media sets or download options. High prices and limited access are only a road to oblivion. Furthermore, new inventions may well push current technology out of the market.

  18. Re:I have tried both Napster and iTunes by MacDaffy · · Score: 2, Insightful
    If you format your computer and did not back-up your downloaded music you have to PURCHASE it again.
    Translation: If I do something completely idiotic, there's no one and nothing to protect me from myself.

    What you describe is not like someone breaking in your car and "jacking" your lifelong CD collection. It's like you got high, took it to the dump, and threw it in.
  19. Re:Samsung Napster mp3 player by Durandal64 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    No one's forgotten that, because they never knew about it in the first place. People do know about the iPod. See the difference?

  20. Not going to happen. by autechre · · Score: 2, Insightful

    You can download music from a service like eMusic in VBR MP3 format. However, the first half of your point 2 negates point 1. Record labels who own "popular" music will not, in the near future, offer music on the terms that you want. You have to stick with labels who still value music more than money.

    As for point 3, your "or better" stipulation is silly, as most music from the past 30 years was not mastered in anything higher than CD quality.

    --
    WMBC freeform/independent online radio.
  21. Sold songs? by Rogerborg · · Score: 2, Insightful

    What they've been selling is revocable licenses to decrypt. When they go belly up, a lot of people are going to find that out the hard way.

    --
    If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
  22. Re:Samsung Napster mp3 player by Pieroxy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The problem is different. If you want to get the best out of iTunes, you have to buy an iPod. For Napster, any MP3 player will do. So a customer for iTunes means almost invariably an iPod sold. A customer for Napster doesn't mean anything for them in terms os hardware.