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THG Linux Migration, Part Two
LqqkOut writes "Tom's Hardware Guide has posted part 2 of their Windows->Linux migration article. This time around, we're presented with some nifty divx screen caps that make life look oh, so easy. The Tom's crew packed a lot into this article, but did they sacrifice some essentials like 'RTFM' and other sage advice? This follows up their first article where users were shown how to choose and download a distro, back up some important data, and check for HW compatibility."
1. Move from MS Office to OpenOffice.org (cost: 2 weeks to settle down, 1 month to adapt fully)
2. Move from MSIE to Mozilla (cost: 2 hours to settle down)
3. Move from Outlook to Mozilla Mail (cost: 1 week to settle down)
4. Switch the OS when no-one's looking (cost: $40 for Xandros, 1 hour per PC).
Seriously: the key to migrating is to start with the applications.
Ceci n'est pas une signature
I just recentally installed Fedora with out a problem. Every thing works great except my 3d card. I have installed WineX and am able to install games but they run slow due to the fact my card doesn't seem to be supported. I have had a good linux experience so far and hope to never have to use Windows again. I wish this guide would have been around before I got started to answer some of my questions. Escpecially on installing applications.
As a person who mainly cut his teeth on Windows and DOS-based PCs, this series of articles helps out a bit. Sure, it's fun to figure things out yourself, but I'm not always in the mood to have to reference Google every time I try something new and exciting. Now only if they had something that would remember all those console commands so my stupid brain doesn't keep filling up. =P
I'm not just piping in on this topic, I have had to deal with dependency BS just like the rest of anyone who hasn't had some obscure perl module.
Thank microsoft's installapp creator (visual studio) for alleviating this problem on the Win32 side of things. Linux is left to flounder without, since there's no real way to baseline the needed dependencies and install them with the application across multiple Distros/versions easily.
Automation is what makes computers useful, big round buttons make them usable by the avg.
Oh I dunno... my understanding is the article's written for Windows powerusers who have never bothered with Linux. And yeah, plenty of fairly savvy Windows users still use IE, and being knowledgable about Windows doesn't necessarily imply any knowledge of what it really means to have the source code for your OS.
I will say that I thought the comment about GTK+, though seemingly only there to illustrate the point that some software will require other software to run, was badly phrased and probably should have just been left out. Its not like either RedHat or SuSe are going to do a graphical install *without* GTK+, and the article reads something like "Oh, by the way, you should have already installed GTK+. There'll be big trouble if you didn't!" And of course the newbie has no idea whether he did or didn't at this point, so he panics.
Other than that one sentence though, I thought the article was pretty good.
I know this was geared towards newbies, but I was hoping for a little more about the software. I never had a problem with linux, but I still think the software I use in windows is better than that available in linux. Yeah there's more choice, but all those options never seem to cut it for me. Actually, I think the only things holding me up are photoshop and windows media player and lack of printer support. Oh well, maybe next year...
If you don't have any questions, then no one will tell you to RTFM.
If you have a question, then you RTFM.
If your question is NOT answered in TFM, then you ask it.
Actually, lots of people have thought of using a GUI to put together a command line statement. Lots of people have even thought of using a GUI to import/export text based config files.
They missed out hardware, i think its important for them to mention that most hardware manufacturers are bitches when it comes to supporting, or even being in support of linux or any other OS than Windows, If you're switching to linux make sure your hardware is fully supported, its not enough that there are 'drivers availiable' you have to be ruthless and only buy the most popular and known to be supported stuff, make sure you search the forums and dont waste your time on anything thats not used by less than 30% of the linux community or anything that people complain about because its going to cause you grief.
let me just add to the list:
-Sagem f@st 800 ADSL USB Modem and PPPoA, just hassle
-ATI All-In-Wonder Pro dual screened with a 9200SE - if you get this working ill grovel down to you.
-Diamond S90 (vortex) sound card - shove it up your ass, you'll get better performance
and unrelated - IBM Deskstar harddrives - if you hear that grinding noise your screwed.
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My first reaction when watching the videos was duh, but then I realized what a great job he had done. We are a culture that flat out doesn't like to read instructions, having it done in a visual manner was a smart move. Also seeing something done right before your eyes is a much bigger confidence builder then just reading a quick howto on the internet. Look at the Outlook migration video. How nice is it to just say "download the video on it" and know that they probably won't need much assitance beyond that. People and companies especially pay big bucks for videos like this which train users how to install or use a product. While they are not the most comprehensive Linux video training out there and I have a few minor nitpciks, its Free so how can you knock it? Tom's has done a real service to the community with these articles and videos and they deserve our thanks.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
This bothered me too, but maybe that's because I've been using Debian for so long. Seriously, do Linux users really work like this? Hunting after the right RPM's and such? I mean... I remember doing that in 1999 (and it was a solved problem even then) on Mandrake, but they had already begun work on urpmi or something similar at the time. Honestly, I haven't dealt with a real dependency issue in half a decade and I haven't had to compile an app that I didn't write in years (unless I wanted to package it myself for some reason). I thought this was long solved for all distros now.
Do you guys really live like this? If so... why?
"I may not have morals, but I have standards."
Evryone made this whole Migrating from windows to linux thing such a big deal i dont know why...anyone who ever installed windows all the way...i mean setup for a blank hd then drivers then updates then some tweaking like turning off services and disabling and enabling some stuff can install any redhatish distro without a problem...but most people belive it or not can't do that with windows...i see many people who cant right click the right way ....those people need service with anything and i think more than half of computer users are like that that ive seen...migration is hard because its not in the OS...OS dosent even matter...if i put anyone with windows experiance in front of my Gentoo box they would not have a problem with my KDE they chat and browse just like on windows....but what if somoene needs some app thats not there for linux...I use Autocad for exaple to do work and i need it...same gouse for ALPHACAM and Cabined Vision and those are not avalable for linux ...now until they i have to work with windows cuz there are no viable alternatives for those apps....but for the basics like office stuff and browser multimedia OS or migration is a no issue...just choose whatever u like best and go for it.
A. If he had an MS bias, this article would have been posted. Unless I missed the law which says that all sites must cover switching from microsoft to another OS.
B. Since when is there a "simple Win-to-*nix install"? Admins and techno-junkies _still_ have problems with this. It almost never works correctly the first time and then once you have it up and running, there is a huge learning curve on how to use it for anything beyond OOo and mozilla.
C. He had problems? It looked sucessfull to me.
Tom's was clear -- they promote that the new linux user install EVERYTHING.
The GTK comment just hammers this home.
Until the new user KNOWS what they want, they can try it all -- especially the target user here (knows Windows, and is curious).
The data migration tips alone make this an article worth reading -- how to move your IE bookmarks and PST mailbox over...
And "Oracle, Apache and SMB" come later. First, convert, bringing over your data, and start exploring the new environment.
I give Tom's a really big "Two Thumbs Up" for this article -- good to get more hobby users into Linux!
Ratboy
Just another "Cubible(sic) Joe" 2 17 3061
"Thank microsoft's installapp creator (visual studio) for alleviating this problem on the Win32 side of things. Linux is left to flounder without, since there's no real way to baseline the needed dependencies and install them with the application across multiple Distros/versions easily."
Do you complain this loudly when your Win95 software doesn't work In W2K, or XP?
Does anyone complain that their Mac software doesn't work under Windows?
Pick a distro that has the majority of the software you like and be done with it. Some people just can't handle having to make a decision.
BTW Yum and Apt do just fine dealing with dependencies, but don't tell a Winvocate that, or their heads will explode.
You are on the spot with the key issue; to start somewhere and start in smaller scale with the apps.
:)
There are several apps that can live side-by side with MS products without major harm done; Mozilla, Mozilla Mail, OOo as examples.
But before the migration is complete:
1. Don't underestimate the power of MS Office macros, VBA-scripts and specially the users that made them. They can be hard-necked.
2. Don't forget about the ActiveX components and other "MS standards", XML parsers etc. too often with connections to business apps that needs to be rewritten. (Of course they should have been industry standards from the start, but most corp. environments aren't.)
3. The PIM's from PocketPC's that people are used too synch with Outlook is also an issue. Yes, there are FOSS alternatives for synching, but you have to take that into the equation aswell, adding complexity (and cost!) to the migration.
4. I like the idea of guerilla migration when no-one's looking
All in all, the business case, with a clear budget for migration costs including and all the marketing, education (end-user, sys.mgr.) and communication efforts needed, must to be committed to be able to migrate successfully.
The more you know, the less you need. [Admin added: from me.]
I think this guide is too much lacking in specific details to be any use to some one who's migrating, for instance some advice about apt-get and where to find rpms would be useful.
I have just switched myself. One of the most fustrating part of it is installing apps, not because of the dependancy problems that's easy to solve. The real problems occured for me because you need to use two user accounts, one to install and one to run the app. Windows users aren't used to this, so get it all mixed up and end up with half the configuration settings in the root directory and half in their regular home directory.