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Japanese Inventor's Motor Uses 80% Less Power
novakane007 writes "A Japanese inventor named Kohei Minato has created a new kind of motor. It uses magnetism to perpetuate the motor motion. As a result the motors uses 80% less energy than a conventional motor, while still maintaing the same horsepower. "Minato assures us that he hasn't transcended the laws of physics. The force supplying the unexplained extra power out is generated by the magnetic strength of the permanent magnets embedded in the rotor. 'I'm simply harnessing one of the four fundamental forces of nature,' he says."
On top of the energy savings the motor runs cool to the touch and is significantly quieter than a tradtitionally powered fan. Sound to good to be true? Well he's already started selling the fan to a chain of convience stores in Japan. Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter."
Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter."
The noise in your pc is caused by air turbulence caused by the fan blades. Even if the motors inside your fans were 100% efficient, your computer would not be significantly quieter.
Life is too short to proofread.
Cheers,
Justin
question: wouldn't the magnets de-magnitize after a while? isn't that what physics would predict? good business opportunity tho. exchange the cost of electricity for the cost of buying a new motor, when the magnets stop working any physicists out there who can comment?
"Mention of Over Unity devices in many scientific circles will draw icy skepticism."
Hmm.. Simple reason why. If you supply power to the motor using a carnot engine
and use the power from the motor to drive a carnot refrigator.
Then there will be an overall flow of heat from cold to hot..
Breaking the second law of thermodynamics..
Bullshit is word of the week.
Simon.
Amazingly enough, if you had read the article before posting, you might have gotten your answer:
That alone makes it sound fishy to me, but IANAP.
Forget the whales - save the babies.
Hopefully soon the design will make it in to your home PC, allowing them to run much quieter
... oh yes, and it will make your case mods mad 31337.
Actually I find it odd that this is the first application that occurred to the poster.
Gentlemen, this new motor design will make battery-powered cars a reality, reduce industrial energy consumption by a third, possibly save the world from global warming
Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
Absurd claims are the hallmark of junk science. Impressive though that this guy managed to dupe people long enough to sell many thousand units.
/. nuke.
I'm curious if the motor IS better than usual, just not to the extent claimed, or if it's ALL hoax. I cannot get to the site myself... japan.com surrendered to the
"I will trust Google to 'do no evil' until the founders no longer run it." Hello Alphabet.
This would not work in a traditional cumbstion motor but im sure there are was to implement it into large electric ones...imagine a fully electric car with 4 of these (one for each wheel) about 25 hourse power each and have them cmputer controlled for traction...imagine the performance ...and this type of car would probly run 3 times the distance of current electric cars ...then maybe alot of people would consider replaceing there current cars.
Still incorrect though. Using this logic, you could hook one motor to another, using one as a generator. Take the power from the generator, and use it to power the first motor, which makes more wattage than you put in, which spins the armature faster, which makes more current... Until you have an infinitely fast spinning infinite energy generator.
It's fake if this is true, I can't get to the article to verify myself.
-Jesse
Nothing says "unprofessional job" like wrinkles in your duct tape.
I can't be the only Slashdotter to have cracked open a dead hard drive. Those magnets are very very strong. Could someone with a better physics background than I please explain how a drive based on tiny fluctuations in a magnetic field can operate next to such a powerful magnet?
-B
motors uses 80% less energy than a conventional motor
A conventional electric motor motor uses at most 1.6 Joules of electric energy to produce 1 Joule of motion energy (German Wikipedia). If you reduce that by 80%, you use only 0.3 Joules to produce 1 Joule... nice perpetuum mobile.
I have seen a few posts about "basic physics" and how the magnets would have to "demagnetize" to do work. But in actuality, basic physics says that magnetic forces can do no work. Why? Force = v x B (velocity of charged particle cross magnetic field) and work is the integral of Force dot dr. v cross B dot dr is 0 (because v and dr are in the same direction and the cross prod. of v and B will be perp. to v).
So the permanent magnets don't do ANY work. They can accelerate charged particles by changing their directions, and maybe they can increase efficiency by reducing friction somehow (like maglev trains). But they are not putting work into the system.
Greg
Ok, if the input is less than 1/3 of the output, then he just discovered a machine that, if the output was looped to the input, would create infinite energy in theory. That is obviously impossible. It sounds interesting, that input and output ratio is not possible. Just because the guy gives you a reason why it's possible doesn't mean that it's true.
And did you read the claims of >100% efficiency? As soon as you see such claims you can stop. Period. It's a fraud. End of story.
This is the exact same argument every peddler of perpetual motion machines uses to claim that his invention is not a perpetual motion machine, but is somehow harnessing external power which is just hanging around out there to be used.
The Earth's electromagnetic field is a popular choice among these hucksters. With this guy, it's magnets.
The very fact that this showed up on the front page of /. shows that they've given up all pretense of caring what they publish here.
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
Why the fuck is this crackpot on slashdot?
The claim that the extra energy is coming 'from permanent magnets' is risible. It's like claiming to extract energy from the gravitational field of the earth.
MAYBE he has a very efficient motor (though I haven't seen any independant evaluation of that claim). But he certainly doesn't understand how it works, and his claim that he can extract more energy from a motor-generator configuration than he put in is obvious fraud.
I'm not sure what's worse, that the journalist who wrote the article is so credulous, or that the people here (who should damn well know better) are.
Yes, I read the article. It has all the signs of something that needs justly debunking.
The 'no formal training' genius.
Power out > Power in
Use of the words 'over unity'
A tale of skepticism from scientists
Little guy vs. big guyes woes
Failing to identify the 'fundamental force of nature' that is being harnessed.
But in the end, you don't need to look futher than the violation of the laws of thermodynamics.
Evil people are out to get you.
That just goes to show how slow technology adoption rates has become. Ever since compact flash's invention and continual adoption in hardware, Hard drive volumes have increased amazingly. We went from densities of around 10gb when CF became mainstreamed to now having 250GB hd's ship in computers, and 350GB hd's available for purchase.
That being said, none of the flash memory densities have really scaled like this, and are just being left in the dust, sadly. I'd love to have an iPod with a SD/MMC card reader so that I could exchange songs with a friend at school if they wanted me to listen to something really quickly, or so I could pull data off the iPod and put it into a computer.
Speaking of putting an SD/MMC card into a computer, when will Dell start shipping memory card readers in their machines that have dumped floppies, or are they just going to chalk it up to rewriteable CD drives and abandon solid state memory cells altogether?
"Victory means exit strategy, and it's important for the President to explain to us what the exit strategy is." G.W.Bush
1. Conservation of energy is not true. Highly unlikely.
2. The energy stored in the permanent magnets is being used up. This is the most likely (and probably actual) phenomenon. Any magnetic field has stored energy. You can get this energy out by demagnetizing the magnet. I don't know how much energy is in these magnets, and as I can't read the article I can't see if there are any comments on the longevity of the magnets. My guess is these motors would "work" for a while, then suddenly drop down to worse than normal functioning electromotive devices (due to adverse effects of eddy currents, etc). I'd put my wager here. (Especially since it sounds like it only works with large (i.e., lots of stored magnetic energy) magnets.
3. The device somehow draws energy from the environment in some new, undiscovered manner. The combination of moving electromagnetic fields could somehow convert some other energy source (i.e., background radiation) into mechanical forces. Highly speculative and unlikely. If the device were really "creating" energy from the magnets, you could start one up, turn a generator, start another one up, then chain the output of the generator to the input of the motor, then keep them going forever. That would be a neat experiment.
In summary, there is probably a well-understood phenomenon here, and it's nothing out of the ordinary. I applaud the marketing prowess of the "inventor" here, in any case. If the device does work, I look forward to seeing the interesting results as the basic conservation laws are reexamined and we end up neat things like warp drives, levitation, and all the other stuff I've wanted since I was 4!
"There are a dozen opinions on a matter until you know the truth. Then there is only one." - CS Lewis (paraprhase)
By "very high likelihood" I mean "near certainty." Free energy... riiiight. :D
I claim first use of "Error No. 0B" - or "No. 0B error." It'll be the new ID 10T!
4. Someone doesn't know how to measure actual power correctly.
5. Someone is deliberatly measuring actual power incorrectly so he can sell crappy motors for more than they are worth.
Magnets, to many people, can explain anything, becuase they do not understand them properly. Just as you can not construct a perpetual motion device using magnets, however, you cannot raise efficiency using magnets as an energy source. Magnets can only raise efficiency by acting as frictionless bearings, but that is not the case for these motors. This is blatant fraud, and I cannot believe these people fell for it.
Even those who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress at this period in history.
Or they think that pointing out incredible claims for scrutiny is a good way to test them. Note the "from the skeptical-eye-on-the-science-guy dept." tag on the article rather than, say, "from the holy-shit-give-this-guy-a-Nobel-quickly dept."
http://alternatives.rzero.com/
The claim is that the new motor uses 80% less energy (I assume they left out per unit of power). Ergo, an electric car would need 20% of the a current model's energy storage. If that is true, since a modern electric car is almost viable, then one built with this motor will absolutely be practical.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
And for this you got +5 Informative?? Are there actually that many people on /. that would for even one moment believe that this device actually does what the "inventor" claims.
There have been hundreds of these bogus devices trotted out in the past. They never quite seem to work, but the inventor always promises that it just needs a little more tweaking, once he gets enough investors lined up. Not one has ever accomplished anything beyond emptying the wallets of the suckers that invest in these scams.
Minato doesn't sound like he's just made a measurement error, he sounds like a fraud. The fact that he fooled the reporter doesn't make his invention any more real.
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Slashdot insults Einstein's memory by regularly posting junk science articles with his image attached. But of course, they don't actually write the articles .. or submit them .. or proofread them .. or fact check them ..
What do they draw a paycheck for again?
I've finally had it: until slashdot gets article moderation, I am not coming back.
Just because the US Patent office issued a patent for this nonsense doesn't mean that the underlying physics is sound... After all, the US Patent office will grant a patent for anything as /.'ers are well aware.
Of course there's always a change something we don't know is going on, but the unfortunate fact is that 999999 cases in a million it's a crook. Besides, it's very easy for this guy to prove his claims.
If he hooks up the miracle motor to generator and uses that generator to power up the motor and it keeps running (should be easy with 330% efficiency, you can also draw infinite amount of energy from the circuit while at it) then he has either found the invisible and so far unexplainable power source or has proven that laws of thermodynamics don't work and perpetual motion machines are possible, you can bet that million physicists will swarm in to observe it and everything we though we know will be turned upside down. He'll also be worlds richest person in no time.
Carefully observe how he fails to do that, and instead relies on (probably wrongly calculated or rigged) simple electrical meter. Now ask yourself why? Simple answer: because it doesn't work, and this is nothing but a con.