Slashdot Mirror
Justice Department Censors ACLU Web Site
phr1 writes "According to the Washington Post, the ACLU was forced to remove a paragraph from their online press release, that specified what kind of information FBI agents could request under the Patriot Act that the ACLU has been suing over. "
I can't wait to see how the Bush babies try to spin this one. I expect a flood of right-wing apologists to appear in the thread soon telling us that a) it isn't that bad, and b) somehow, Clinton was worse.
Think about it. Not only do we have a law which allows secret investigations and arrests, and prohibits the accused from telling anyone about what's being done to them -- but apparently, the powers granted to the government by the law are themselves state secrets! This has gone beyond evil into insanity. When did my home become the Unites States of Kafka?
The correlation between ignorance of statistics and using "correlation is not causation" as an argument is close to 1.
The idea that our government is 'protecting' us by feeding our culture of fear and banning legitimate free speech...from the frikin' ACLU!!! [Yosemitie Sam mode on] %#@$#%$
No matter how many of my rights are taken away, somehow I still don't feel safe.
"It's all just meme meme around here"
I did. The ACLU web site accepts donations.
I've never done something like this before. I rarely write letters to politicians, and I don't make donations to political parties. But as I get older I realize that if I don't start putting my money where my mouth is, I may not be heard.
Take back your country.
Also, how can it be illegal to disclose the types of things that may be requested under the law? We can't be subjecting people to laws they are not even allowed to know about now can we? This sounds more like the behavior of a certain former leader the US just ejected from Iraq. Say it ain't so.
Just think what they (the Bush regime) could accomplish with another 4 years. Scary thought isn't it.
Win a signed Stephen Carpenter ESP Guitar from the Deftones: http://def-tag.com/?r=0008781
I must have missed the news about the government rounding up Jewish people.
It won't be the Jews this time. It'll be the Muslims. Or maybe just the "potential terrorists".
"They redundantly repeated themselves over and over again incessantly without end ad infinitum" -- ibid.
It is goddamn scary that a U.S. citizen even has to consider posting information on foreign ground to acheive freedom of speech and press. What has gone so wrong...? Are there no longer visionaries in government?
FFS, if you do have such a page, host it in the U.S.A. Don't run off to India with your tail between your legs. Chrissake, take over a government website and host it there, then print out a copy, walk up Capitol Hill and tape it to the wall.
As a Canadian, I'm proud our country maintains relations with Cuba.
:(
As a Canadian, I'm sorry to say that our greatest friend and ally is responsible for the greatest human rights abuses occuring in Cuba at this time.
Fortunately I have great faith in individual American citizens...but frankly your government blow...and sucks at the same time.
John Maynard Keynes: "When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do?"
True, and while I don't love Kerry, he is the lesser of two evils. I don't doubt for a minute that voting for the Patriot Act was largley due to political pressure. That seems to be the case for most Democrats. Voting against the "Patriot Act" would have been political suicide at the time.
Time makes more converts than reason
I can't wait to see how the Bush babies try to spin this one.
Who says it will make news at all? Somewhere there's an unexplored angle of Michael Jackson or Kobi Bryant's trials that has not received full media saturation.
I've never been so ashamed to be American than now. It really upsets me that Donald Rumsfeld can go to Abu Graaib and make jokes about not reading the newspapers any more. Boy, that's real funny Don. It's like Bush making the "funny" video about not being able to find any weapons of mass destruction. Not everything is a laughing matter. There are some things which aren't laughing matters: our civil rights, the respect and trust of the rest of the world, and the lives of American soldiers and innocent Iraqis.
From the article:
The ACLU first filed its lawsuit challenging the constitutionality of such demands, known as national security letters, on April 6, but the secrecy rules of the Patriot Act required the challenge to be filed under seal. A ruling April 28 allowed the release of a heavily censored version of the complaint, but the ACLU is still forbidden from revealing many details of the case, including the identity of another plaintiff who has joined in the lawsuit. The law forbids targets of national security letters to disclose that they have received one.
So, this law is so secret that even challenging it must be done in secret, and if the law exercised against you, that must also be kept secret.
Phew. And here I thought the War on Terror might cause us to compromise the principles we're fighting to defend.
A forthcoming addendum:
"..with liberty and justice for all who having nothing to hide, and so, nothing to fear."
They are NEVER the bad guys. Simply because you don't like the form of speech or the civil right that they are defending at any given moment doesn't make them good or bad. They are, de facto, good. Please keep in mind a quote by Supreme Court Justice William Brennan: "If there is a bedrock principle of the First Amendment, it is that the government may not prohibit the expression of an idea simply because society finds the idea itself offensive or disagreeable."
This applies to flag burning (as a veteran, I'm for it as valid political speech). It also goes beyond the First Amendment to ALL the other Amendments. Separation of Church and State is and must remain a solid wall. Offensive speech must remain protected regardless of your (or anyone else's) sensibilities. The ACLU is there to ensure this for the most offensive to the most inoffensive. There is no such thing as an OK and minor violation of Constitutional principle or of ANY Constitutional Right.
In Bushworld, they struggle to keep church and state separate in Iraq as they increasingly merge the two in America.
The National Rifle Association does.
More music, fewer hits
"True, and while I don't love Kerry, he is the lesser of two evils."
I hope you're not basing that on 20/20 hindsight campaign promises intended to earn votes. The truth of the matter is that the country is so divided about what's happening here that either way, a large number of people are going to be unhappy. Either they'll do too much to stop terrorism, or they won't do enough. Niether situation is ideal, and the bitching will not die down.
You wanna be mad at somebody? Point to the asshole that thinks the right way to express himself is to brainwash people into flying planes into buildings.
"Derp de derp."
If you think that freedom to practice religion means that you are free to infringe on other people's religions by placing your God's image and commandments in public arenas, you aren't thinking hard enough. The only way that a society can exist with freedom of religion is if every religion's philosophies are treated equally in the eyes of government. If you expect your ten commandments to be posted in a courthouse, you should expect the religious laws of every other person in the community to be given equal time. And how hypocritical would that look, when the first of said commandments is "Thou shalt have no other Gods before me?"
The ACLU is doing what it always does: it's trying to protect the rights of the minority from being squelched by a well meaning but misguided majority. There is no shame in having a secular government. After all, government is about keeping things in order right here and right now. Religion's about the afterlife. If you think the two should be mixed, then mix them in your church -- and expect the Jews, Hindus, Muslims, Ba'hai, and Zoroastrians in your neighbourhood to do the same. Render unto Caeser what it Caesar's, man.
Hey freaks: now you're ju
There are a lot of ways to spin it.
On is to use a headline that says:
"Justice Department Censors ACLU Web Site"
Another could be:
"Court Rules ACLU Violated Anti-Terror Law"
What's important is being able to recognize when somebody's spinning you.
You whittisism is in vein of the single most important and overlooked idea behind the second amendment. The amendment was not only for defence against a British invasion but also for defence against a tyrannical federal govt. Jefferson wanted more than a right to bear arms, he wanted a constitutional right to revolution. The current form is just a PC version of his idea.
There is nothing wrong with being gay. It's getting caught where the trouble lies.
Personally, I'm voting for Kerry because he's from a different party than the majorities in Congress and the Supreme Court. I'm counting on political gridlock to prevent the Democrats AND Republicans from achieving anything close to their goals. Kerry supported PATRIOT and the Iraq invasion. If the Democrats were in charge of Congress, I'd be campaigning for Bush.
hmmm, fair enough. We do seem to get screwed least when neither party has enough power to push through something without help from the other side.
Twenties Retirement
2) Most politicians didn't even read it before they voted on it, which is why there's a minor backlash against it now from both parties.
Yeah, that's partially how the unconstitutional redistricting in Colorado got through last year; a lot of republicans realized after the fact how bad it was, but they were told it would help them and didn't bother to read it before voting for it.
Personally, I think anybody who votes for something without reading it first (or at least, having a staffer read it and tell them what it does) ought to be voted out of office.
Twenties Retirement