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Fedora Core Doesn't Like to Dual Boot?

schwatoo writes "It seems Fedora Core doesn't like to boot alongside Windows 2K or XP. According to a bug first reported in February on Fedora's bugzilla site it has a tendency to chew up partition maps making it impossible to dual boot into Windows. No one seems to know quite what is causing the problem and a lot of people are ending up with unbootable machines."

26 of 608 comments (clear)

  1. Now by ArchieBunker · · Score: 4, Insightful

    if this was a Microsoft problem the amount of bitching and conspiracy theories would never end. Lets see how it plays out.

    --
    Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
    1. Re:Now by lazy_arabica · · Score: 5, Insightful
      if this was a Microsoft problem the amount of bitching and conspiracy theories would never end. Lets see how it plays out.
      Stop trolling, and let people speak. I am bored of Microsoft / Linux zealots bashing each other before they even post.

      By the way, there is a Microsoft problem, as the Windows installer destroys the MBR where lilo/grub is usually installed - at least, it was true in win2k and XP. And I didn't see any slashdot story about that.
    2. Re:Now by EpsCylonB · · Score: 3, Insightful

      if this was a Microsoft problem the amount of bitching and conspiracy theories would never end. Lets see how it plays out.

      I think we should wait to see how long until this bug is fixed before we accuse redhat of doing this on purpose.

    3. Re:Now by tolan-b · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Well XP won't respect an existing Linux install, if you install it after Linux then you can guarantee there won't be a Linux entry in your boot menu ;)

      Still, this is a very serious problem.
      From what I've heard it seems to be a problem mainly with dual boot where you have each OS on a separate drive, rather than both on the same partitioned drive.

      I finally got mine working by reversing the drives that grub thought everything was on. Windows was on primary master, and I installed Fedora on primary slave. Rebooted and it was dead. It turned out that setting grub to point at hd1 for Windows and hd0 for Fedora got things working. I have no idea why.

      Windows still doesn't work, I think the Wndows bootloader that grub forwards on to has been corrupted, but I haven't looked into this in detail yet, I was lucky that most of my data storage is on my house server.

    4. Re:Now by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Ever installed XP and lost your LILO? Is that a bug or a "feature"?

      What this story covers, is a bug.

      That's the major difference here.

    5. Re:Now by Graftweed · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Before installing Fedora everything's fine, after installing it people lose the ability to boot into windows. It's as simple as this really. How can you expect linux to take over the desktop with the kind of attitude you just displayed?

      Yes, MS is partly to blame, but joe user won't give a rat's ass about the finer points of booting operating systems, he'll just (quite rightly) blame fedora and be done with it.

      Furthermore this is a bug that's been around for a few months, even before the release of Core 2 so there's really no excuse for this sort of thing. If you're designing an OS to run alongside others it's your responsibility to make sure it doesn't break anything, even if the others are broken somehow.

      Please don't tell me 'Oh, but MS doesn't do this!', that's really no excuse is it?

    6. Re:Now by Jeehoba · · Score: 2, Insightful

      In response to - "If you're designing an OS to run alongside others ..."

      Isn't Fedora designing an OS to replace Windows and wouldn't it be the GNU Grub project who is designing an application to dual boot? I understand there might be a flaw in the Fedora install that manifests this problem, but the same problem in the reverse order has been there in Windows XP since the begining.

      If Fedora was only designed to be a second option OS then what would be the point?

    7. Re:Now by EvilAlien · · Score: 3, Insightful
      Please define "technically-invalid-but-working".

      Do you have a reference which describes what a technically valid partition table is, how the XP partition table is somehow "technally invalid", or anything else to support your assertions?

      --
      perl -e 'print $i=pack(c5, (41*2), sqrt(7056), (unpack(c,H)-2), oct(115), 10)'
    8. Re:Now by gwalla · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Joe User doesn't dual-boot. Joe User wouldn't even think of having more than one OS on his system. This is a problem for techies.

      --
      Oper on the Nightstar
    9. Re:Now by fulgan · · Score: 2, Insightful

      However, it does so by correcting a technically-invalid-but-working one to a technically-valid-and-working-for-everything-but-X P one.

      Well, I have experienced the problem and I can tell you you're wrong: Once Fedora Core 2 finished it's installation on my system, no other OS could sucesfully boot any more: XP (including the recovery consle), Mandrake, Red Hat (that's all I tried) all crash when they ennumerate the HDs. My Fedora install did go a bit further but crashed during USB enumeration (for whatever and possibly unrelated reason).

      So, I don't know if the partition table that XP writes to the disk is valid or not, but the one "fixed" by fedora certainly isn't.

    10. Re:Now by 13Echo · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Oh, what the hell ever. When has Windows EVER been tolerant of another OS on another partition? NTLDR and other Windows MBR loaders almost always rip the hell out of everything else in the MBR.

      At least with Fedora, it's an accident. It's hard to tell why this happened. It's very unlikely that it was intentional, and there is little reaon to make comparisons to typical MS behavior.

  2. Since Feburary?! by koniosis · · Score: 2, Insightful

    So much for fast turn around on bug fixes for linux suddenly Windows doesn't seem so slow, I'd consider this a serious bug, one that could lead to the loss of a lot of important data and should have been addressed by now. The fact that they don't know what causes it is just plain worrying. Although I have to admit you've gotta be pretty brave to install linux on the same disk as Windows, most distros make it all too easy to format the disk and re-create the partition tables.

    --
    I spent ages trying to think of sig, but never did :(
    1. Re:Since Feburary?! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

      Eh? So, let's recap.

      Install Fedora, and it MIGHT make your XP partition unbootable.

      Install XP, and it WILL DEFINITELY make your Linux/BSD/Syllable etc. partition unbootable (need to re-install LILO or GRUB).

      What's worse? You silly leprotard!

  3. Totally irresponsible by Turtlewind · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If a bug that serious has been known since February, it was totally irresponsible to go ahead with the release. It isn't just some nuisance you can work around - people have lost a lot of data from this.

    --
    --This is a self-referential sig--
  4. Not a problem by ArchieBunker · · Score: 1, Insightful

    its intentional and says so in the manual and alerts you during the install. This is supposed to work but fails randomly.

    --
    Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
  5. Re:Not comparable by DougJohnson · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I thought they'd straighten this out when it came out in February, at least I thought so enough to download the ISO's, but now that I see they haven't there's NO WAY I'm going to install Fedora on any of my systems.

    This is a REAL problem, and many people are going to end up losing a lot of data because they won't know how to fix their MBR's or their partition tables or whatever it takes. There's more info in the bugzilla report, but it only affects drives larger than ~120GB (or so) and SOMETIMES can be fixed with fixmbr in the windows recovery startup.

    I liked fedora, it was easy to use, and did what I needed it to do, but now they've shown that their "new process" for development doesn't work. I'll go back to trying out some of the other distro's to see who else can get my support.

  6. Here's your trouble... by MsGeek · · Score: 5, Insightful
    This article has more info:
    http://mailman.linux-thinkpad.org/pipermail/linux- thinkpad/2004-May/017754.html

    Here's a quick executive summary for those who don't want to read the thread:
    Linux 2.6 kernels started to report bogus disk geometries thus some unadjusted partitioning tools create bad partition table resulting unbootable Windows.

    --
    Knowledge is power. Knowledge shared is power multiplied.
  7. Re:Not comparable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful

    linux isn't the operating system every one seems to have to have. i mean linux is a luxury and not a "microsoft" product. if longhorn or whatever caused this the attitude is "you shouldn't have been playing with it" it will always be the underdogs fault when the attitude is "i can't live without windows because it is so much easier to learn or operate or whatever"

  8. No Firewire Either by Perl-Pusher · · Score: 2, Insightful

    There isn't firewire support compiled into the kernel. If you want to connect an iPod or use any other firewire devices you have to recompile the kernel. That is a really stupid omission especially when it was reported in bugzilla during test 2!

  9. Re:Not comparable by lessthanjakejohn · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Windows is installed on a 30gB partition I installed Fedora on a 512M swap and a 10G /ex2 partition I expected it to work so I had it configure Grub (or it didnt' give me a choice, I dont remember) Anyway, it rebooted and I saw that it didn't show my Windows partition like Slackware 9.1 before it, and Redhat 9, and Mandrake 10, and Gentoo 2004.0 Anyway... I didn't know a way to fix my problem so I quit Fedora, gave my CDs to a homeless man and installed good old Slack... Anyway, I'd have to say that Linux (Specifically Dropline Gnome 2.6 with Slack 9.1) still isn't close to XP for me as a Desktop operating system. I'm using XP now and have transfered some MP3s over to the space it use to inhabit.

  10. Re:My solution: by Not+The+Real+Me · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I like Win98SE. Win2K is pretty good. XP sucks donkey balls. I like RH7.3. RH8 and RH9 have a number of nagging problems. Fedora, for all intensive purposes, is Beta software at best, Alpha software at worst.

    That being said, nobody in their right mind is going to dual boot Win2K and Fedora on a production machine.

  11. Re:Not comparable by jrockway · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Yup. People should stop playing around with these toy distributions. Install Debian and you can forget about all of these problems. Easy updates, too. And, you can choose between stability and new-ness quite easily. I run "unstable" and haven't had a problem (and everything is nice and new).

    Also, my partition table isn't f00bar'd.

    --
    My other car is first.
  12. Re:... doesn't like to boot alongside Windows by jackbird · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I dunno, all the video toasters I saw didn't seem to be white boxes running cracked code. I think the problem was poor marketing, and being too far ahead of their time. I mean, you could EDIT VIDEO on the damn thing in 1992.

  13. Re:Not comparable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Insightful
    agreed totally. i've got "stable" on a server and never had any sort of problem and "unstable" on a desktop, and the only problem I ever had was that after one large update, for a day or so I couldn't get KDE and Gnome working at the same time. The next day, however, an "apt-get update; apt-get install kde; apt-get install gnome" fixed everything.

    Run debian stable and nothing will be foobar'ed
    Run debian unstable and you'll easily recover from anything that gets hosed.

    Fedora seems to me like the "demoware" versoin of all those shareware programs out there.

  14. report the bug to microsoft by lkcl · · Score: 2, Insightful

    you install linux, and window breaks. why are you hammering on linux developers' doors? go bitch at microsoft to fix the problem: you now have a genuine reason to waste that money that they forced out of computer manufacturers.

  15. recent boot problems by noldrin · · Score: 2, Insightful

    What is with bootloaders recently. 9 years of using Linux I never had a problem with bootloaders and now this weekend I haven't been able to get any to work. Why did Linux distros move to Grub from Lilo anyways?