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Japanese Videogame Market Declines Further

Posted by simoniker on from the further-down-the-spiral dept.

Thanks to 1UP for its note discussing a report on the state of the Japanese videogame market in 2003, as tallied by the CESA (Computer Entertainment Software Association) trade body. The result was an "11% decline in total hardware and software sales in Japan, to 446 billion yen ($4.1 billion), in the past year", and apparently: "2003's sales figure represents a slide of approximately 40% since 1997, when the Japanese games market last peaked at the height of the PlayStation's popularity." The news story author goes on to suggest: "CESA's report blames a significant loss of audience for the continual decline of the Japanese games market, partially thanks to the increasing complexity of big-ticket games. The upcoming debut of new handheld platforms from Nintendo and Sony represent the industry's next chance to bounce back and regain their audience in Japan." What's the difference between the Japanese experience and the relatively buoyant Western gaming market?

58 comments

  1. Hentai by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    What's the difference between the Japanese experience and the relatively buoyant Western gaming market?

    American geeks would rather spend their hard-earned money slaughtering hideous monsters rather than sitting back and watching said monsters ravage nubile young women.

    1. Re:Hentai by nomel · · Score: 0

      The US is huge...we obviously have more people. So, maybe it's our population acting as a buffer.

  2. Culture by Qwaniton · · Score: 0, Flamebait

    The difference is that of culture. In America, the gaming industry is quite buoyant because the typical American gamer is simply different than the typical Japanese gamer.

    The typical American gamer is not "hardcore"; he is a casual gamer who plays with friends, or simply for light entertainment. He isn't "into" games like the typical Japanese gamer, who is, for lack of a better term, a nerd. He simply wants to play his Madden 2004 on his X-Box with his homeez.

    That's also why the X-Box never took off in Japan. The demographic the X-Box is marketed to in America simply doesn't exist in Japan.

    (oh and first post propz to gnaa etc)

    1. Re:Culture by GoatPigSheep · · Score: 1

      Actually most japanese kids are too busy with school to actually have video games play more than a very minor role in their lives...

      --
      GoatPigSheep, the 3 most important food groups
  3. Saturation by Svenheim · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In my opinion, this is obviously due to saturation of the market. The japanese gets a lot of games, a lot more than we get in the west, and they always have. If you look at the market as a whole, there are also far more consoles and games sold per person than in the US or Europe. Even tho the market in Japan is declining, it's still much bigger than the US or European market when you take the population into account. Nintendo is worried about this, and they are partially trying to rectify this with the Nintendo DS: A handheld that does things differently than the traditional consoles or handhelds. It also be exiting to see what they're new console, ambitiously named "Revolution" will add to the gaming experience. Sony's solution just seems to be "same formula, better hardware." We'll see if that will work in the long run, maybe the japanese decline is indeed a sign that gamers want something completely different.

    1. Re:Saturation by Qwaniton · · Score: 0

      Good point. I think it's the constant flood of unimaginative sameness that's burning gamers out.

      Sony seems to be successful with that formula, however. And Nintendo's struggling despite all their innovations. I think it's not as much saturation as it is simply lack of Great Games.

      Let's face it. In recent years, the amount of Great Games released has dropped. I can't remember the last time we got a game like Zelda 3 or FF7 or Super Mario World or Secret of Mana or Chrono Trigger or all the other masterpieces we've seen in the history of console gaming. The GameBoy hasn't seen a new Super Mario game since the mid 1990s, and does Wario Land 1 even count? We've had rehashes, rehashes, and more rehashes. I'm worried that Nintendo is about to do the same thing with the DS, reading about Super Mario 64X4.

    2. Re:Saturation by sien · · Score: 2, Interesting
      Doing the numbers, the Japanese population 127M, the US's 293M. So the population ration is 2.3.

      From the figures given, the Japanese spend 4.1B on games, with 1.27 or 30% on hardware.

      The US spends 7B on software, assuming the same breakdown that means about 10B on software.

      Now, if Japan were as large as the US and the amount spent on games increased similarly they would spend 2.3 * 4.1B or 9.4B on games.

      So actually, both markets are about the same at the moment. However, if Japanese spending is down 40 percent then years ago this was true.

      Of course, all this neglects age distributions which would be crucial.

      Perhaps the game companies should take note, perhaps people will get bored of games and their sales are set to fall. After all, what is the difference between great looking Fifas or Maddens?

    3. Re:Saturation by AliasTheRoot · · Score: 1

      Rubbish, the Japanese economy has been trashed for a long time.

    4. Re:Saturation by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Perhaps the game companies should take note, perhaps people will get bored of games and their sales are set to fall. After all, what is the difference between great looking Fifas or Maddens?

      Well, you know Fifa and Madden are games about DIFFERENT SPORTS! One is called American Football (just Football in the states), and the other is Soccer.

      Yeah...the two sports are mostly the same, with only small technicalities separating them, like the one that specifies that you cannot use your hands to move the ball in Soccer and the such.

      In conclusion. Fifa and Madden are two very different games...What? you mean the difference between Fifa 2002, 2003, 2004, etc, and between Madden 2002, 2003, 2004, etc? There is none, is always the same shitty game, year after year.

  4. YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Qwaniton · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Good troll, you'd win my mod points, but it also brings up a good point about culture. The demographics are simply different.

    Gaming in America simply doesn't take the same cultural role as it does in Japan. Gaming here is largely casual. While I woed the death of the "hardcore gamer" and the overrun of Joe Schmo with his X-Box into the gaming world, the casual Joe Gamer is by far the largest market. Japan really doesn't have a casual Joe Gamer, thus they don't really release "casual games". Most, if not all, Japanese games are deep, engrossing, and masterpieces in their own right. When they come over here, they get the "hardcore gamer" market, since the average American gaming nerd scoops this stuff up, whether it's a masterpiece or simply mediocre. Plus, there's the fanboy effect.

    However, in Japan, the quality will make or break the game, and their tastes are much more discriminating. It seems that Japanese gamers are simply burning out of the latest round of less-than-wonderful games. Maybe it's a retro thing. Who knows. I suppose Japanese gamers are burned out of the latest fare in gaming.

    This is a problem America will never have, because America is much more casual in this respect. The Japanese gamers are quite serious about it, while American gamers aren't. Thus, the Japanese market is much more vulnerable to losing ground because of sheer mediocrity.

    As an aside, even as a Nintendo fanboy I'm starting to doubt their latest developments, and I'm quite skeptical that the Nintendo DS will save Nintendo. Nintendo has suffered from games built around gimmicks lately, like Luigi's Mansion for the GameCube controller, the E-Reader, the GC-GBA connectivity, and now the "dual-screen" gimmick. It's starting to get old.

    1. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Svenheim · · Score: 1

      I wasn't aware Nintendo needed to be "saved." Sure, they haven't neem quite the cash machine they used to be the past few years, but they still make very good profits, have huge franchises that continue to sell in the millions. I wonder why everyone thinks that you _have to_ be number 1 in the console business to survive. Why can't there be 2 or 3 large console manufacturers? Of course they can't all sell equally, but if one sells 50 million and the other two sell 15-20 million each, why have they lost? If you make profit, you haven't lost. I find it hard to believe that a market share of 20-30% cant be profitable. (And, Nintendo still has 100% marketshare of the handheld market.)

    2. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Qwaniton · · Score: 1, Interesting

      Their control of the handheld market is the only thing keeping them alive. They've made horrible decisions with the N64 and GameCube. They're killing themselves!

      I think I'll be in my corner hugging my Super NES and weeping.

    3. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Svenheim · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If you can actually back up with FACTS why they are killing themselves, please tell me. N64 was the 2nd largest console worldwide at the time. Gamecube is still 2nd on the market worldwide, slightly ahead of XBox.

      I am not saying they havent made several bad decisions, they have, but "killing themselves" is such an overstatement. Financially they are a much healthier company than Sony, for example.

      And they still make several million-selling console games every year. As far as I see it, Nintendo's biggest problem on the console side is that several of the 3rd party games very well on their systems, because Nintendo owners tend to spend their money on the 1st or 2nd-party Nintendo franchises first, and then buy 3rd party games if they still have money left. This has been improved lately tho, they are slowly gaining better 3rd party support, by working closer with big companies like Namco and Capcom.

    4. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by bigman2003 · · Score: 1

      Why is it that you portray Joe Schmo as having an XBox?

      If Joe Schmo is your 'casual' gamer, then he would own a Gamecube.

      The Xbox has the largest amount of software sales per console. So I would say that those are the most 'hardcore' of the console games. Xbox owners also buy more games than PC games.

      So, Joe Schmo with an Xbox turns out to be at least the most dedicated financially to games.

      I am one of those Joe Schmo gamers with an Xbox. And !GASP! I buy/play a lot of sports games. I'm not a 'casual' gamer, it is my primary hobby- and I buy about 2 games per month.

      I'm not looking for those 'deep, engrossing masterpieces' of games. I want games that are fun, have a lot of action, and keep my attention. In fact, I don't think of most Japanese games as 'masterpices', I think of them more like 'massive pieces'...of shit.

      Really- getting deep into some Japanese adventure game does not mean you are a 'hardcore' gamer, well above and beyond us average Joe Schmo's. It just means you like a different type of game.

      --
      No reason to lie.
    5. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Idealius · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Actually it usually does.

      People who are socially inept find they are usually very game adept. Naturally they will lean towards a genre that has much more depth for it to provide a happiness games ultimately can't give them.

      2 cents..

    6. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Rayonic · · Score: 3, Informative

      > Japan really doesn't have a casual Joe Gamer, thus they don't really release "casual games".

      This is lunacy. What about all those laid-back dating sims, farming games, and the like. Almost all rehashes, mind you. The actual innovative games (like Pikmin) don't tend to sell well over there.

      > Most, if not all, Japanese games are deep, engrossing, and masterpieces in their own right.

      Oh. My. God. Did you just say that?

      --
      [PowerPoint] is a tool for capitalist presentation
    7. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by buffer-overflowed · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Umm, the XBox is third when it comes to game sales(overall, sales per console, and number of games in top 10[they're number 3 on each]). The PS2 is first and the GCN is 2nd.

      If MS were even close to #1(or even #2), considering they claim to make $10 per game in liscensing fees, and nintendo says they sell 15 games per console, they would not be burning through cash like it's going out of style.

      --
      The key to the enjoyment of pop music is to replace any instance of "love" with "C.H.U.D."
    8. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Qwaniton · · Score: 1

      Ha! Maybe that's why I stopped playing video games when I met my girlfriend...

    9. Re:YUO STOAL MY FRIST POST by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Wha...?

      Those farming games are extremely engrossing. You aren't a Harvest Moon player. These things are RPGs, you know. The latest GameCube iteration spans generations.

      Pikmin 2 is currently topping charts in Japan, just like the first one did. Prior to release, it regularly placed in the top 10 most anticipated games.

      Come correct, fake ninja. You're blowing gunpowder in your own eyes and stepping on your own tetsubishi. Mods, one of this guy's points is correct (that casual gamers exist in Japan), but his examples prove otherwise. THERE'S the lunacy.

  5. How are you all missing the obvious?! by Sangloth · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Clearly this is about the Japanese Recession. Japanese have less spending cash, and are hoarding what they have.

    Here in the US, we had fairly mild down-turn which is already reversing itself.

    Japan's Recession(Which basically amounts to stagflation) has been going on for 10 years, and is not turning around.

    Sangloth
    I'd appreciate any comment with a logical basis...it doesn't even have to agree with me.

    1. Re:How are you all missing the obvious?! by Corngood · · Score: 0

      Mod parent +reality

    2. Re:How are you all missing the obvious?! by Colazar · · Score: 1
      Hmmm. My impression was that the Japanese economy was better now than it has been for a long time. Not that I'm saying that it's good. Just that it seems better than it has been.

      But even if it's been horrid for 10 years, and is still just as bad, why would that make game sales fall *now*? You'd think they'd be staying about the same, wouldn't you.

      --
      He decided to just watch the government, and kind of scale it down to size, and run his life that way. --Laurie Anderson
    3. Re:How are you all missing the obvious?! by bugbread · · Score: 1

      You're right. Living in Japan, I can see that the economy is indeed on the rebound. People are no longer losing their jobs, you don't hear the word "restructuring" whispered in the hallways anymore, and, whether or not the economic upturn is "real", the feeling among Japanese is that things are getting better.

      This is ultimately what affects retail sales. While underlying economic conditions in a country may be good or bad, it's the feelings of consumers that determine their purchasing habits. A country badly in debt with a happy, secure consumer base will still spend more money on luxuries, while a positive economy where people are scared (for whatever reason) about their finances will result in less spending on luxuries.

      To tell you the truth, I don't know why sales are slipping. But I do know that it isn't because of the state of the economy.

    4. Re:How are you all missing the obvious?! by badasscat · · Score: 1

      Clearly this is about the Japanese Recession.

      This might be plausible if Japan were actually in a recession. It is not.

      Japan's Recession(Which basically amounts to stagflation) has been going on for 10 years

      Two big problems with this sentence. First, recession is not "stagflation". That is not what a recession is. A recession is two or more consecutive quarters of negative growth. Japan has had several recessions in the last ten years; the US has had one, but it's not unusual for us to have several recessions in a ten year period either. It's not unusual for any part of the world, actually.

      Second, even if Japan was in recession for 10 years, that still doesn't explain why game sales peaked in 1997 (less than ten years ago) and have declined a massive 40% since then. Typically, in recession, consumer spending is part of the cause, it's not a trailing indicator (though it can be; it was in the most recent US recession). And a 40% decline is extreme; a 40% decline across all industries would be an extremely severe economic depression, far worse than even the Great Depression in the US in the 1930's. You cannot explain away a 40% decline with a simple recession; even an industry reliant on disposable income. (Explain why Hollywood movie ticket sales in Japan have increased over the same period, for example.)

      Here in the US, we had fairly mild down-turn which is already reversing itself.

      Here in the US, we had a recession. By definition. Japan doesn't have recessions while we have "down-turns". A recession is a recession.

      As for what is the difference between the US and Japan video game markets, there is not nearly as big a difference as some make it out to be. I say this both as someone who worked in the game industry until about 2 months ago and someone with a set of Japanese in-laws (and you can read into that that I shuttle back and forth between countries fairly often - in fact I just got back to the US from my latest trip earlier today).

      You can mark my words, what's happening in Japan will happen here. Maybe not to the same extent, but the natural life cycle of the current game systems is expiring, which in itself is generally good for a 10-20% yearly decline after a system's been on the market for four or more years. In Japan, that's combined with a general malaise about the current state of gaming - casual gamers have become turned off by the more modern and complex games, hardcore gamers have been turned off by what they see as a lack of recent innovation. The US has always (well, since the 1980's) followed the Japanese market by a couple years, and I see a lot of the same things happening now to the US market as happened in Japan in the late 1990's.

      Will we have a 40% decline in the games market? I think that's unlikely, unless all these forces converge in exactly the same way as in Japan (again, unlikely, just due to the laws of randomness). But I could see a 15-25% drop in the overall industry over the next two or three years, easily. Enough to make developers stand up and take notice, that's for sure. And it could be bigger than that.

      The crash of 1984 was brought on partially due to a glut of games and systems on the market; too much overhead, too many production lines, not enough consumers. Well, in the next two years, we will likely have the PS2, Xbox, GameCube, GBA SP, GBA DS, PSP, PS3, Xbox 2, and the Nintendo "Revolution" all on the market at the same time, at least for a year or so. If that's not a glut, and a recipe for disaster, then I don't know what is. I think I'm being conservative in predicting a 15-25% decline in the market.

  6. Correction by Svenheim · · Score: 1
    A couple of words missing, it was supposed to be:

    ...Nintendo's biggest problem on the console side is that several of the 3rd party games don't sell very well on the system.

    1. Re:Correction by xenocide2 · · Score: 1

      Maybe that's because they keep monkeying around with the controller and marketing themselves as a family oriented company, while families across the world are strapped for cash in the middle of a global recession, while 3rd party games are continuing to fight over the few segments of the market that seem to purchase.

      If nintendo really wants to break a mold, they'll have to start actively advertising to women and girls without patronizing them. I'm not sure its possible (the subject came up at a GDC lecture, with no answer) but its nessecary for a company who aims broadly to land some broads =0.

      --
      I Browse at +4 Flamebait

      Open Source Sysadmin

  7. Games Damnit by jdubois79 · · Score: 5, Informative

    In my experience....

    Actually, I find the biggest problem to be not a lack of audience (Every child that I teach owns at least one system. More common are 2 or three systems). There just aren't any drop dead amazing games out right now for the big contenders (GameCube and PS2). And there really hasn't been for a while.

    I always ask my kids what they're playing, and the answer is always Kirby AirRide or Mario Party. Both of which came out over a year ago. One few kids who are playing recent games (mostly all TV show based) say that the games were fun, but too short, too little to do, etc.

    The biggest/best game I saw come out here lately was Ninja Gaiden. Unfortunately at 7000 yen when it first came out, in addition to NO ONE owning an Xbox (I'm the only person I know with one), I can't imagine the sales were very good. Onimusha 3 was a huge hit. But then again, that was also last year.

    --
    --------
    Nothing can be done before the tremendous power!
    RabidComics
  8. Tentacle-rape games by c0d3h4x0r · · Score: 1

    Clearly this is due to a shortage of tentacle-rape games.

    --
    Moderator hint: a comment is neither "Flamebait" nor "Troll" if it is true.
    1. Re:Tentacle-rape games by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Come on! Mod this up as Funny. Sheesh.

  9. Could it be by foidulus · · Score: 3, Interesting

    that the long-sagging birth rate in Japan has really taken a bite out of game sales? The Japanese birth rate is only about 1.4 or so, compared to the US's 2.06. Thats pretty significant(and has long term implications for the country as a whole). Also note that 21.25% of the American population is under 14, versus only 14% of the Japanese. Now I realize that there are adult gamers, but a large chunk of the video game market is to kids and teens. In both raw numbers and percentages, the US has a much larger market, and the Japanese market is, and has been for a while, falling.
    Sources:
    US Demographics
    Japan Demographics

  10. They need to get back on track by Mike+Hawk · · Score: 1

    I think Nintendo has the right idea. According to Yasuhiro Minagawa (PR boss of NCL) they plan to, "offer an experience that can be enjoyed by adults, children, or women." I think that sort of thinking will work well in both Japan AND America. Rumor is that they plan to unveil this console, dubbed N5, at E3 2005. I know for sure that all the women I know will enjoy being targeted specifically since they belong neither to the group of adults or children. That's exactly the kind of thinking that will definitely turn them on to games, and Nintendo's offerings in particular.

  11. "Obvious" by talaphid · · Score: 4, Interesting

    My reason for the downturn is that we're at a lowpoint on the console replacement treadmill. Everyone's GOT their Xbox and Halo, PS2 and FFX/X-2, Gamecube and Mario Sunshine(Look, Miyamoto, the problem isn't 3d, the problem is outrageous difficulty/essentially arbitrary success)/Crystal Chronicles... when were each of these systems released?...

    We've also got everyone waiting on their flagship sequel / major sequel for the next gen... no duh sales are down. I'm not going to buy the same TV every year guys, what makes you think I'm going to buy 5 Xboxes when one plays my Halo just fine?

    (Yes, I saw it was a combined total, but go watch the history of video games special - the Xbox's limited success (the success portion) is due to it being the Halo-player)

  12. Here's the thinking... by RyoShin · · Score: 3, Funny

    Japan game market
    Kinda like a dating sim
    A whole lot of curve

    U.S game market
    Kinda like an action game
    Take a hit, move on

    </haiku>

  13. To the moderators who modded this -1, Troll by Qwaniton · · Score: 4, Insightful

    While I do, on occasion, troll, whether out of boredom or chemical means, this was not meant as a troll. This is too nerdy a subject to troll about.

    Let me elaborate on my previous comment.

    When I suggest Nintendo shot themselves in the foot with the N64, I simply think it could have been so much better. Losing Final Fantasy VII due to their stubbornness on media type was a horrible decision. Likewise, the sound capabilities of the N64 are almost inexcusable[1]; whether this was the fault of the sound hardware or the simple lack of storage space on the cartridge, I don't know. The N64 had framerate and memory issues too--the expansion pack solved some problems, but should not have been needed in the first place. (Don't get me started on Nintendo's add-on gimmickry...)

    The Nintendo 64 could've rocked the PSX's world if it was done right, but sadly it wasn't. We got our kickass first/second party titles (even though I never liked Rare's 3D platformer offerings) but got lackluster third-party support, which plagues Nintendo to this day.

    The GameCube overcame the technical limitations of the N64 but by that time it was too late; Nintendo had firmly wedged itself into its current reputation. The sheer quantity of third-party titles that we had with the SNES is gone. And let's not get started on Rare[2].

    I've always been a Nintendo fanboy--I'll admit that. But lately, Nintendo is starting to wear me out. Once, we were a Nintendo-only house. NES, SNES, N64, GameBoy, you know. Nowadays, we gave a PSX, PS2, and a Dreamcast along with our GameCube. I've been losing my dedication to Nintendo lately, seeing all the Great Games on the PS2 I was missing out on. Now, I've sold out. So shoot me. Or Nintendo.

    [1] And if it wasn't for the Great Games of the N64; i.e. Super Mario 64 (still one of the greatest games of all time), Zelda 5 (the GameCube port kicks ass, by the way), StarFox 64 (one of the greatest games made), Paper Mario (say what you want but I still enjoyed it), GoldenEye (BEST. CONSOLE FPS. EVAR.), Superman 64 (I'm kidding); it would have been completely inexcusable.

    1. Re:To the moderators who modded this -1, Troll by default+luser · · Score: 1

      Likewise, the sound capabilities of the N64 are almost inexcusable[1]; whether this was the fault of the sound hardware or the simple lack of storage space on the cartridge, I don't know.

      I'm confused, I was of the mindset that the N64 had excellent wavetable synthesis, better than the SNES. If the music is terrible, that is the fault of the game maker.

      On the other hand, if you're simply whining about the fact that the N64 didn't use CDDA for music, you've got to face the facts: typical cart size for the N64 was 32MB, and that's hardly enough to hold a whole digital audio soundtrack.

      The N64 had framerate and memory issues too--the expansion pack solved some problems, but should not have been needed in the first place.

      Are you kidding me? The N64 was basically a $199 SGI Reality Engine desktop configuration in a box. The N64 could handle much more complex scenes than the PSX, and even came with double the memory standard.

      In fact, memory was perhaps the single most expensive component in the entire system. You may not recall, but mainstream memory prices in 1996 were still around 5-10 bucks a MB, and performance memory could run you even more. While there is little doubt that more games would have taken advantage of the extra ram if it had shipped with 8MB, it would have been prohibitively expensive.

      If you're bitching and moaning about the lack of 60fps at super high-resolution, you'll have to remember that the N64 was released in 1996, and there was no consumer-level solution capable of reaching such high performance until the Voodoo 2 SLI. 15-30fps was considered quite playable on both the N64 and PSX.

      --

      Man is the animal that laughs.
      And occasionally whores for Karma.

    2. Re:To the moderators who modded this -1, Troll by Qwaniton · · Score: 1
      I'm confused, I was of the mindset that the N64 had excellent wavetable synthesis, better than the SNES. If the music is terrible, that is the fault of the game maker.

      On the other hand, if you're simply whining about the fact that the N64 didn't use CDDA for music, you've got to face the facts: typical cart size for the N64 was 32MB, and that's hardly enough to hold a whole digital audio soundtrack.

      It does. The N64 wavetable synth owns all. I'm talking about the digital audio effects, voices, etc. I always thought they were quite lo-fi, and I believe I stated that's probably due to the limits of the cartridge.

      If you're bitching and moaning about the lack of 60fps at super high-resolution, you'll have to remember that the N64 was released in 1996, and there was no consumer-level solution capable of reaching such high performance until the Voodoo 2 SLI. 15-30fps was considered quite playable on both the N64 and PSX.

      GoldenEye/Perfect Dark. 'Nuff said.

      Well, I'll elaborate. 60fps on a TV is ridiculous. The TV is interlaced, yielding a net 30fps. No one wanted 60fps super-high-res graphics on a console either. That's not the point. I'm talking about the slowdowns you get, like in Perfect Dark. Perfect Dark is INCREDIBLE, barring the FPS flaw.

    3. Re:To the moderators who modded this -1, Troll by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Are you kidding? The N64 is *arguably* better than the Playstation, but not decidedly so. I'd argue that in the end, the Playstation ended up delivering better graphics on average. The N64 just blurred and fogged the hell out of everything. And the textures were typically really really really bland.

      I won't argue the fact that some great games were delivered on N64, but it had it's fair share of crappy titles. Similarly, the Playstation had its share of great titles, but it had more than two games a year worth playing so I give it the edge.

  14. We're always a few years behind them. by Mirkon · · Score: 1

    The reason, clear and simple, is that - as always - we're a few years behind the Japanese. Video gaming will never go away, but the mass-market penetration boom of a few years ago was bound to end sometime, when people start realizing they're playing the same games they played a decade ago.

    It's happened in Japan, but still pending in America. At least, that's my take on it.

    --
    Glog!
  15. They don't like realism? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I have a theory. The Japanese are so into cartoons, and weird abstract or cartoony cutesy things that the consoles' march towards more and more realism just goes contrary to what appeals to them.

  16. EA by xgamer04 · · Score: 1

    American gamers buy shitty sports games with updated stats every year. This makes EA a cash cow, along with the systems needed to play the games.

    --
    When you look at the state of the world, how can you not become a radical, liberal anarchist?
  17. Re:How are you all missing tsarkon reports JPN eco by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I realize you're just being a jackass but you do realize the irony that if we were to take your post at face value you'd be a walking and talking arguement ***FOR*** gun control. Also don't put down ham, it's really quite tasty if you baste it with honey mustard and brown sugar ... mmmmmmm ham.

  18. Video-Gaming post-modernism by Neo-Rio-101 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    I think that video gaming has reached a kind of "post-modernism" these days. That basically means that everything than can be done with a screen and a controller has already been done - which leaves very few original ideas left to develop on.

    Maybe this is just a pessimistic view, but I just tried to think up a new game idea and realised that I'm coming up short.

    Most of the other posters make the right comments though. I'm in Japan. There are fewer children. The adults that are here work long hours and have no time to play. The country is slowly recovering from recession, but the fact that there are few new Japanese kids means it won't get too far. The pension system is a mess... people are hoarding cash (I know I am).

    The fact that new consoles don't offer anything new that hasn't already been done (can't rely on fancy graphics anymore), so there's no incentive to buy. Maybe when the PS3 comes out everyone will jump out to get one and we'll see renewed interest... but I don't know. Xbox in Japan is DOA now... VERY few titles on the shelves. Nintendo is losing their target market to a low birth rate.

    If we're talking casual gamers in Japan... well they use cell phones mainly. Others use Gameboys.
    The Japanese are more into fun cutesy games as opposed to the west where graphics and realism take a front seat.

    Still, Japan has plenty of nerds and manga never seems to bore anyone. And as long as you write a cheap game with little playability, lots of scantily clad ladies, and make it a complete rip-off of the "dead and alive" series (as one budget game company just did in Japan), you can score highly on the Japanese game charts.

    --
    READY.
    PRINT ""+-0
    1. Re:Video-Gaming post-modernism by Psychochild · · Score: 1

      I think that video gaming has reached a kind of "post-modernism" these days. That basically means that everything than can be done with a screen and a controller has already been done - which leaves very few original ideas left to develop on.

      Wow, talk about pessimistic.

      I'll give you one example of a game that's doing something intersting: Mario & Luigi Superstar Saga on the GBA. Sure, it's a Mario RPG, but it's also a good game. the interesting bit is the controls where each of the two buttons on the GBA controls one of the characters. An interesting blend of action and RPG in a portable title. You shouldn't write it off just because it's on a portable system.

      But, really, as a game developer I can tell you that there's still plenty of ideas that could be made into games. Ideas are cheap, and I probably have half a dozen good ideas before my first meal of the day. The problem is having the resources (time AND money) to make these ideas a reality. It doesn't help that the companies with the money to make innovative games are horribly risk-adverse. Not that you can blame them entirely, the market only occasionally rewards true innovation. The profit margins are easier to predict on games like "Half-Life 2" and "Warcraft 3" rather than back when "The Sims" launched. It's interesting to note that The Sims took a long time to make because most of the business suits didn't think the game would ever do well, so it had to be made "under the radar".

      I don't know the Japanese market as well as I do the US market, but I suspect that saturation is probably the biggest reason, as others have posted. We're getting to that lull between console cycles, and there's just not much to buy right now.

      Some food for thought,

      --
      Brian "Psychochild" Green
      MMO developer's blog
    2. Re:Video-Gaming post-modernism by Neo-Rio-101 · · Score: 1

      But, really, as a game developer I can tell you that there's still plenty of ideas that could be made into games. Ideas are cheap, and I probably have half a dozen good ideas before my first meal of the day. But my question is... how many of those ideas will rise above one of the genres that we're already familiar with? There's only so many RPGs and FPSs a person can take, for sure. Sure, you can get a new idea, change the themes, plot, storyline to something original... but will the gameplay rise out of the ordinary? The sims is completely abstracted from the gameplay of most other games, and I agree that original game concepts are usually chelved these days for what will sell. Very rarely a new game genre emerges to become popular these days. To me it feels that whatever could be done already has been done.... in one form or another. Not that it won't stop me playing games.... but it's getting a bit boring these days.

      --
      READY.
      PRINT ""+-0
  19. Overall novelty and quality of games... by blahplusplus · · Score: 2, Insightful

    ... has been going down for quite some time now. The only decent original games that have been released in the last 4-5 years you could probably count on both hands. All the others are re-hashes and re-treads of existing franchises because companies are so entrenched in making money its hard for them to invest money in original ideas and games that defy or invent new gaming conventions, in short they are afraid of losing money and not keeping investors happy about quarterly profits.

    I also think this has to do with the japanese gaming audience as a whole. Japanese gamers and gaming culture are more experienced and hardcore about gameplay then their us counterparts. They are really more hardcore about their games then north americans are. Why do you think that most games come with sissy difficulty settings or have been so easy in the last 4-5 years? To pander to a North american audience.

    I think this is a real problem is that games are being dumbed down to a point where theres no challenge and the japanese do not like unchallenging games that lack depth. This is what made Streetfighter 2 such a hit on both shores was its strategic depth and skill based gameplay.

    We saw more original games and content in the NES/SNES and Genesis era then in any other era in video game history (sorry to say it but pre-NES era of computer/console games had little diversity and lack of widespread adoption, the NES is what saved the industry).

    Look at Nintendo for instance, they had the balls to release a 2D game for the gamecube (Zelda: Four swords) although it plays and looks much like it's snes and GBA counterparts the game was still fun. There needs to be a willingness to try new things just like nintendo knew that all games don't need to be 3D to be fun, this isn't to say that companies should go back to making 2D games, just that they need to come up with original games once again and not be so focused on refining already existing genres, they should be enhancing existing genre's. There is lots of room for innovation in existing genre's they really have to take a long hard look and study what tasks or game mechanics are fun.

    There's always a market for fun games because the best games usually sell and gain their reputation by word of mouth anyway.

    1. Re:Overall novelty and quality of games... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I know I'm a Anonymous Coward/Troll, etc., but it must be said that it is, in fact, the case that some games are released in Japan and then when brought over to the US the difficulty/added challenges are boosted.

      Examples I can think of are: The two added (Emerald and Ruby weapons) in FF7, and the re-release of Final Fantasy X (International version, with added features) and Kingdom Hearts as well. (Maybe just Sqaure does this..oops!)

      I'm sure there are others, I just can't think of them off the top of my head right now.

  20. Come Back, Miyamoto-san [OT] by X-wes · · Score: 1

    This post is only on-topic to the parent post.

    Super Mario Sunshine was a game that didn't quite hit the expectations of many people; its quality is quite consistantly rated as very low. In fact, many people think of the jump from Super Mario 64 to Super Mario Sunshine to the jump from Super Mario Bros. to Super Mario Bros. 2 (USA), minus the revolutionary changes. This is, in fact, because Shigeru Miyamoto did not oversee the design of Super Mario Sunshine. This task was taken over by a student of Miyamoto, Satoru Iwata.

    Rest assured though; Super Mario 128 (code-named) is being designed by Miyamoto. Hopefully, though, revolution and innovation won't get in the way of some good old retro fun.

  21. Interesting Conundrum - (SP?) by TJ_Phazerhacki · · Score: 1
    Wonder why the game companies still pander to the Japanese market. The only reason the US market isn't more responsive is that they are treated like second rate consumers. But the market here is growing, and there it is declining.

    Mebbe we've become too cooperative...

    Come on - seriously. The PSP and DS released 3-6 Mos earlier in Japan, FFXI released earlier to the point where Jap. players control the economy simply because they had more time. Thank God for Microsoft - did I just say that? Probabally lost Mod points on sight, But realistically, they are the only company that delivers home first on a console on a regular basis....

    --
    Physics is nothing like religion. If it was, we'd have an easier time trying to raise money!
    1. Re:Interesting Conundrum - (SP?) by Nakamiya · · Score: 1

      Maybe because those things are made by Japanese companies, where Japanese people work, whereas Mircosoft is an american company? And you can just buy things from Japan if you don't like to wait.

  22. No great mystery by RogueyWon · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I don't see any great mystery here, nor do I see any particularly complicated factors or dark forces at work in the background. It's unlikely to be related to the Japanese recession; as I understand it, the Japanese economy has now very much turned the corner and was actually more severe in 1997, when, according to the article, the market was at its peak.

    I just see this as a natural return to the norm from an absurdly high peak. The market's previous strength reflected a depth of obsession with gaming that was unlikely to be sustained. For a long time, the industry has talked about the Japanese game market on the same level as the US and European markets. When you consider the population of Japan (127 million) compared with the population of the United States (293 million) and Europe (200 million for just France, Germany and the UK, which is excluding a lot of big nations), this begins to seem absurd. I suspect we'll see the Japanese games market continue to "decline" until it reaches a level roughly proportional to the US and Europe.

  23. Re:How are you all missing tsarkon reports JPN eco by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    ill carve you with a knife.

    take my guns away, and i will hunt you. ill capture you and get a searing hot sword and cut your legs off and eat them in front of you. but ill never kill you. i want you to live as a legless fucking gimp.

  24. ExActly by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    UK gamers buy shitty sports games with updated stats every year. This makes EA a cash cow, along with the systems needed to play the games.

    You are correct, but is there a Japanese equivalent?

  25. *ahem* Clarification by Qwaniton · · Score: 1

    Relatively, that is.

  26. Maybe the Japanese are getting burned out by cryptochrome · · Score: 1

    I mean here we have an entire generation that has been relentlessly consuming expensive games that have long since solidified into predictable formula. Maybe they're just not interested anymore, and are spending their time and money (recession) on other things.

    Well, that's just pure speculation, but I can honestly say it's happened to me, at least. I just don't buy games anymore.

    --

    ---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?

    1. Re:Maybe the Japanese are getting burned out by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Hey, are you the Cryptochrome that did the CHAR review site? That was an awesome site BTW for anime fans. Sadly, Geocities no longer supports it. But for anyone out there running review sites, CHAR would have shown you how it should be done.

      (apologies for offtopic-ness)

  27. Revolution without dance? by tepples · · Score: 1

    It also be exiting to see what they're new console, ambitiously named "Revolution" will add to the gaming experience.

    How can Nintendo's next console be called Revolution when Nintendo's current console is the only current console not to have a decent port of Konami's Dance Dance Revolution? The PS2 has the DDRMAX series, the Xbox has the Ultramix series, the GameCube has what? DDR for Game Boy Color?