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Best Buy Says Customers Not Always Right
linuxwrangler writes "Best Buy is one of the retailers that has now decided that the customer is not always right. Best Buy consultant Larry Selden has identified "demon customers" like those who file for a rebate then return the item. OK, I get that one (hey Best Buy: dump those customer-despised rebates and you won't have that problem...). Other categories like customers who only buy during sales are more interesting. Best Buy declined comment on how they are dealing with those customers. Some stores have actually "fired" customers. Welcome to the end result of all that customer information data mining."
You will always get scammers, like people who the article description described (send rebate, then return), as well as people who purchase extended service plans, then static zap their video card, hook it up to 110 AC, or otherwise kill it after a couple years, and get a much better card in replacement. At least with data mining, you can identify suspect customers instead of just going on the manager's whim.
Pretty much all rebates are on the condition that you send the box's UPC and your original receipt, right?
How are the customers returning goods that 1) are not fit for resale if they're non-defective (cutting the UPC pretty much does exactly that), and 2) don't have the original receipt of sale?
It would seem to me that the individual stores need to lay down the law on their return policy--and stick to it ridgidly--before they have any right to complain about their customers.
Constitutional rights may be respected, repealed, or modified; but they must never be ignored.
Argh... I *hate* the way they aggressively push that damned ripoff service plan. I once bought a TV at Worst Buy, and the last thing the clerk said to me wasn't "Thank you", it was "You realize that if it breaks you can't bring it back here."
Honest to god I was told by a Best Buy sales associate that "If I didn't like the mp3 player, I can return it, file for rebate and come out on top." I think Best Buy needs to invest in employee training first before moving on to "firing" customers.
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One is born into aristocracy, but mediocrity can only be achieved through hard work.
My suggestion is shopping clubs.
Get together a group of good consumers, mums on the school run is a prime recruiting ground. Organise until the number of participants is significant; and issue a membership card.
Then visit the shops.
Tell them that the group will promise to use a particular store for a particular type of shopping in exchange for a discount off all elements in store on production of the membership card. Organise an auction process for a type of shopping for an entire quarter and get the shops to bid against each other.
Providing the manager sees the take goes up for those stores in that quarter, everyone wins.
That way you can exercise the power of the mass market in the same way the shops use their marketing size to drive down supplier costs - the enticement of the large numbers with the threat of losing those numbers if they don't play ball.
In fact, since one thing Slashdot does have is size, that model would work well for Slashdot membership and computer goods...
I see that Royal Bank of Canada sends wealthier customers to the head of the phone queue, while making ones with smaller accounts wait and wait. This is a classic example of abusing the facelessness of phone transactions, leveraging it to their advantage. Could you imagine customers putting up with this kind of stuff in a face-to-face setting? You walk into the bank, and they tell you to go to the "poor people" line? Or say you go into a department store, only to be told that you will have to let other customers cut in front of you, because they are buying more expensive items? That sounds almost like it should be illegal. But hey, what do you expect for a gigantic, faceless corporation?
I worked as a Tech at Blue&Yellow Hell a few years back, and I ended up quitting after getting into it with the weasly little sales manager over screwing over the customers with that ripoff service plan.
Hell, if you think the company is customer-hostile OVERTLY, you should see the kind of crap they tell the employees at those micky-mouse-micromanagement "Huddles" every morning before opening.
I don't have any sympathy for bad retailers who offer ridiculous deals to customers, with profit margins based on the fact that customers will not exercise options (eg, rebates) or will buy accessories to supplement the original sale.
:).... And *all* my problem customers left me, taking up the offer.
They deserve what they get.
On the other hand, I did run an ISP, so I know what it's like when you give a customer an unlimited account, based on a pool of bandwidth, only to discover they are a leech, and bring down the quality of service for all customers.
Still, they purchased the service legitimately, so I wasn't going to ban them...
So I sent them 3-month gift certificates from a competing ISP
My competitor wasn't too happy when he found out years later, but I was left with a pool of good customers, and those customers I didn't want respected me also, and often recommended me to their friends, many of whom weren't leeches.
Overall, I didn't abuse the customer rights, and I still managed to offer a premium service at a reasonable price. And at better profit margins than my competitors. Not once did I have to make excuses like fair-use policies do.
The moral of this tale? Treat your customers with respect and they'll respect you in return.
GrpA
Enjoy science fiction? "Turing Evolved" - AI, Mecha, Androids and rail-gun battles. What more could you want?
Watching the show Airline on A&E is a great example of that same kind of aspect.
"What do you mean I'm 20 minutes late?! I need to get on that plane [insert drunk hiccup here]!
I'm never buying another ticket from southwest again!"
It always seems that everyone thinks something corporate is trying to suck them dry, but the truth is its a two-edged sword: We need to be happy as customers, and they need to turn a profit.
Just whatever hat you appear to wear at the time dictates whether you feel for the customer, or for the poor soul that has to tell someone that their part is still on backorder, or that your baggage got lost...
oh god, don't get me started.
one day I went in to get a replacement xbox. No one wanted to help me, but thats cool cause I didn't need help. As soon as I picked up the xbox box, a salesperson came up to me to pitch the product replacement plan. Then, after she left, another salesperson came up to pitch the same thing. After I explained that I had already been approached, she told me that I should probably get a memory card and xbox live, and that the console only came with one controller. Politely I declined and headed up to the register. At the register, the clerk again asked me if I wanted to buy the product replacement plan (honestly, I expected the lady at the register to ask me, so that didn't bother me). Then the door greeter leaned over and told me I should buy a product replacement plan. Then the manager of the store came over and told me I should buy the product replacement plan.
If 1 simple 'no' would have sufficed, having 5 people confront me probably wouldn't be so bad. But when you have to tell each person no at least 3 times, it gets a little old.
So, I promptly chewed out the manager for having pushy employees, cancelled my sale after the credit card transaction when through, and vowed never to return to another Best Buy. Only once have I slipped up, and that time the same shit happened. My buddy was buying two DVDs, and got the store manager to come up to say "Hey, looks like you are buying PS2 games. You probably want a memory card to go with that."
My only regret is that I didn't adequately express my disgust to the store manager. I have a feeling that she liked the fact that her employees were pushy. I'm guessing for every person like me that walks out, there are 5 that cave in and buy that damned PRP.
I've delt with drug dealers that were less pushy then Best Buy employees. Now, I drive the extra 30 minutes to go to Fry's where no one bugs me until I ask a question.
"However," replied the universe, "The fact has not created in me A sense of obligation."
From the article: Anderson said Best Buy was tightening its rebate policies in the case of customers who abuse the privilege, but declined to say what else his company was doing to discourage its most costly customers.
There is a simple way to stop mail in rebate fraud. Give the rebate when the sale is made and record it on the reciept. But computer stores will never do this because of how many people forget to mail in the rebate in time. I for one hate mail in rebates, and think it is deceptive for stores to list the price of a product as the price after the rebate (with the rebate listed in small unreadable font). On second thought, I wonder if what he really means is how to screw people from sending in the rebate, like forcing them to print out their own rebates from some website or shortening the time window.
Now while Circuit City is no better with the rebates, at least there they really try and help you with what you buy. I purchased a laptop from them, saw 2 weeks later it was $100 less at another store (on-sale), and went to get the price match. The manager gave me the money plus 10% of the differance with no problems. She told me she was happy I was a customer and looked forward to servicing my needs again. That was good service.
Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."
Even worse - when I bought a Playstation 2 there, The clerk gave me her pitch and said multiple times that she doesn't get commission. Then after I told her I wasn't interested, she let it tip over and fall on its side as if she was emphasizing how easy it was for it to break. Yeah, they know how to treat their customers right.
I worked at a very small specialized retailer (running store) for about three years.
We had our normal "problem customers". People who would buy a pair of shoes and then bring them back after several long runs on the shoes and try to exchange them. People that would complain about our prices, and so on.
The fact that the owner of the store was there most times to make the final decision, what helped more than anything was having firm, clear-cut policies on things.
If you never took back shoes that had obviously been run in, then the person who was always trying to bring them back worn was going to have a problem. And, I admit, sometimes that meant calling the customer a liar, sometimes to their face.
The customer was always free to go elsewhere. There were even times when I would give directions to another store.
We would never refuse to sell someone a pair of shoes, and we would never treat a customer any differently than any other person off the street. If someone came in trying to return his tenth pair of shoes, I could objectively look at him (and the shoes) the same way as someone who was coming back for the first time to return something. Had the shoe been obviously worn outside? Would I feel comfortable selling this shoe *as new* to another customer? Would I feel comfortable buying this shoe myself, as new?
If the shoe passed those tests, I would take the shoes back, tenth pair coming back or first.
And I will add something on about the rebates - others posting are correct. If you have problems with rebates, *get rid of them*. No one likes them except the retailer, and if the retailer is having problems with them, then no one will be stopping them from getting rid of them.
Now, I also see a difference between a retailer rebate and a manufacturer's rebate. I dislike them both, but the retailer rebate is the worst.
SprintPCS, for example, is making a big deal about this new promotion for existing customers. If you have been a customer for over 18 months, you can get a new phone.
Fine print: SprintPCS will send you a rebate check for up to $150 if you buy the phone, even if you buy is straight from Sprint! So I give SprintPCS my money, and then I have to prove to them I gave them my money, and then 6-8 weeks later they will return *my* money to me?
Insane! Just give me the stupid phone up front!
- (c) 2018 Hank Zimmerman
I'm an Australian and I went on a trip to the US not so long ago for only a week on a business trip.
My first impressions of service in the US (other than the really fancy joints, and the customers on the business trip) was pretty appalling. People talk to you as if you, the customer, are a problem that has to go away.
Let's see... well apart from certain airline stewardess being a bit careless about which passengers they make fun of about on a flight, to the endless cancellations from hotel to hotel and at short notice.... to the rude replies when you ask a simple question:
"Excuse me, can you show me where the bathroom is?"
"Huh? YOU WANNA KNOW WHERE THE BATHROOM IS? WELL! IT'S STRAIGHT DOWN THADDAWAY!"
Oh yes... the image of the bored-out-of-her-mind angry waitress I saw in the movies actually existed!
Then some woman decided she'd check my ID for beer (I'm creeping up on 30 if you don't mind. But hey, nice to feel under 21 again), in a manner which made me feel like I did something wrong.
The taxi driver tried to rip me off, which reminded me of a similar experience I had in a third world country (Well the driver WAS from a third world country), but I'm not sure that this is the kind of experience vistors to the US should be getting. Made more sense to fork out for a limo.
I only tipped for good service (and believe me, it wasn't that often!).
I dunno, but maybe this talk down to the customer thing is just the way of life over there. Maybe you guys are all as tough as nuts and don't get easily offended - but the ordeals were a bit uneccessary. Everybody seems to be competing to be the alpha-male... for some reason.
Makes the RIAA spats against customers seem a little more realistic in my mind.
Oh yeah... and what the hell is it with you guys and Atkins anyway?
READY.
PRINT ""+-0
This is not an article about Best Buy practices. Its about how companies are coping with "Demon" customers. We have a "demon" customer that is slamming our tech support with questions unrelated to her service, but they will argue about the tie in and we need to keep our relationship. Its tough when people are trying to exploit your weaknessess. When the time it takes to patch the holes is time taken away from serving those who deserve it.
I was actually assaulted at a Best Buy for refusing to purchase a PSP (pushed), and then they refused to bring my item to the front register to purchase saying "You can't buy it now"
The operations manager was in the store so I found him and I told him what had just happened (had witnesses, and they have video surveillance) and I said I wanted an assurance that the two employees you assaulted and insulted me would be reprimanded, we went over to where they were and essentially I had to argue with them and the manager just to get the manager to get them to say they shouldn't have done that. I wanted those people fired after having been treated that way, I didn't want these two jerks bullying people there ever again. In the end the manager said "We will deal with them as we see fit" and after all that he says, well you can buy the TV if you want.
I said if you aren't going to fire two employees who assaulted and insulted a customer than I'm not buying anything from your store.
I never went back to that branch again, MAPLEWOOD MINNESOTA, I have had enough experiences with Best Buy that intrestingly enough I still am a customer... I did specifically spend money elsewhere for a few years after that experience however.....
There is evidence to prove both Democrats and Republicans are lying cocksuckers. Vote independently.
I once worked in a department store in Australia. I sometimes performed the role of "door greeter", the person standing at the front door, the first point of contact for customers to ask directions etc. Part of this role was to immediately pick up the phone and contact security whenever one of a small number of "problem customers" walked into the store - known shoplifters, fradusters or problem customers who were rude or abusive towards staff.
...to which the manager replied "If you ever step foot in this store again, you will be asked to leave by our store security, or will be removed by the police if necessary."
On one occasion, such a person was in the store and started to argue and yell at the checkout staff, because she wanted prices from a sale that ended two weeks ago or something. When the manager arrived, this customer started to argue with him, and made one critical mistake:
Customer: "If you don't do what I want, I will never shop here again!"
Realising the error in her line of reasoning, the abusive customer simply turned around and left immediately.
At the store, the clerks look up up the printer and then they tell him they wouldn't let him exchange it. The printer he had had been discontinued for years and there was no way Best Buy could have sold it to him. Basically they tell him tough luck.
Now in Best Buy's defense it looks like he's trying to scam the store, but my buddy asks them two questions. 1) If they can look up the printer, can they not look up if the box had been returned previously. 2) They can certainly look up his purchase history and see that he was a good customer.
After some reluctance and some heated words, they find out that the box had been returned 2 months before my buddy bought it. My buddy had bought thousands of dollars of appliances, electronics, movies, etc with almost no returns.
In my buddy's case they let him exchange the printer, but wouldn't had they not had the data and if he hadn't been so persistent.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
I've had staff members RECOMMEND that I do those things and take advantage of those annoying Best Buy "perks" that they are instructed to pitch at you.
Best Buy is totally aware that the customer would quickly think of ways of abusing the policy. But they already figured that would happen. They're banking on the gobs of people who are trying to be "decent", and Best Buy is just abusing that goodwill. Same thing with rebates. They assume (correctly) that most will forget about it, or not photocopy your UPC, then return the product.
The problem is that now, with the internet, these notions have spread far further than they projected. People do it out of spite, even if they end up wasting time and money doing these things.
So Best Buy could either demonize these customers who are acting just as they predicted we would, or adapt (maybe they could just provide better customer service?)
I guess customer profiling is the next best thing. It's like... you asked for it. Be prepared to fight for your right to abuse their policies... or get used to shopping with Amazon or Circuit City.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
I was looking for a second TV but I was being as frugal as possible, but I also wanted to get the highest quality I could afford. I was working with a Female sales associate who treated me just fine, I had some question she couldn't answer so she went back to ask a co-worker when she came back out two gentlemen (or not so gentle actually, as it turns out.) started to help me, I explained what I was thinking and that I had my eye on an open box Toshiba, they suggested the PSP and I said 'It's an analog TV it only needs to last me 2-3 years (till HD) and if it dies I don't really care as this is a secondary TV for my house) and if I buy that TV I can't afford the PSP.
Then (I shit you not) the one I had been talking with said "Well, you can't afford this TV then, you should get one that is cheaper so you can afford the PSP." I again politely said I am not interested in the PSP, I used toe work at Best Buy (yadda ya) I don't by a warranty unless it is 10% or less than the cost of the item because less than 10% of the electronics I buy either obsolete themselves or don't break within 4 years. The he was like "But do you know that the PSP covers.... I cut him off and said Look I don't want the PSP so please stop talking about it, I'm feeling harassed right now please stop asking me to buy it because the answer is No. Then I said I'd like this open box TV can you have it brought up to the register please. He said, "You should really buy the PSP." Then I calmly said "Do not mention the fucking PSP again, this is abusive, I have stated clearly 3 times that I am uninterested and have also kindly asked you to simply just stop talking to me about it at all. You don't seem to get it.
Here can you understand this "I don't want the fucking PSP"
Then quicker than lightning the other guy who was working with him was standing with his face less than 1/2 inch (really) from mine and said if you are going to swear I'm going to have to ask you to leave, you can't swear here. I said "I'm trying to leave but he won't stop badgering me about a PSP, he crossed the line and is being a jerk" - then the guy in my face pushed me, and I restrained myself entirely and said "Are you going to help me take the TV up to the front? He said "No." and then I said okay then I'll get a cart and do it myself, thanks for nothing. "He then said, you can't buy it" "I thought about engaging him in debate but said you don't have the right to tell me I can't you have assaulted and insulted me, you are not doing you job at all. Then I turned around and walked towards the operations center and talked with the manager we all went back to Home audio where they were now and I had to argue with them because all they would talk about was the fact that I swore (as a defense to the abusive tactics they were trying to employ). You know the rest I stated it above.
I did contact a Lawyer because I was so upset at how things had happened, however since it was at night I left a voicemail for him. I never got a call back and I just kinda let it go, knowing that people who act like that will eventually get theirs or learn to not act like that (either case is fine with me)
There is evidence to prove both Democrats and Republicans are lying cocksuckers. Vote independently.
I can't speak for the original poster, but 99% of the time I don't want to be bothered by the sales staff. If I have a question, I'll ask. Otherwise, I'll go in, get what I want, and get out. On the handful of occasions that I've had a question to ask or needed other assistance, I've not had trouble getting it. Maybe Fry's Las Vegas store is better than some of their others...at least compared to some of their other stores, the Vegas store looks better-maintained.
I used to work at Best Buy (1994-1999, about 4 years at #289 and a bit less than 1 year at #122, both in Las Vegas). When I first started there, I thought it was cool that we were aiming to provide more or less the kind of shopping experience I'd prefer. Things stayed that way for maybe the first couple of years, but then there was a push from corporate to get more aggressive with accessories and extended warranties. (You know the deprogramming is complete when you no longer refer to extended warranties as "PSPs" and "PRPs.")
I think I continued picking up the odd gadget or two for about a year after I left, but a bad experience with customer service at one of the local stores has kept me away from Best Buy ever since. (They wouldn't exchange a book I had received as a Christmas present, even though I had purchased the exact same title there a month earlier as a Christmas present for somebody else. I wasn't even seeking a refund; I just wanted to turn it in and get something else. The Barnes & Noble two doors down had no problem taking it on exchange.)
Since then, I've had no use at all for Best Buy. Most of the time, the prices aren't that different going from one store to the next and there's nothing at Best Buy that I can't get elsewhere.
20 January 2017: the End of an Error.
At the end of 2002, I was delighted to find a pair of CDJ-1000 CD players on sale at bestbuy.com for the ungodly low price of $800 and change each. I bought two immediately. Then I received an email indicating that they were revoking the offer. That's not allowed under the law, so I called them up and offered to file for fraud with the FTC.
They treated me like shit, and refused to honor the price. I filed against them at the FTC (yeah, a lot of good that did me--ho hum). I also demanded that they not process the charge on my card.
Not only did they charge my credit card, they double-charged it to the tune of $4000! Consequently, I spent the week Christmas 2002 with my credit card maxed out for a pair of turntables that I wasn't getting.
Obviously, Best Buy should be shot dead on the spot and dragged through the streets like the scum-sucking frauds that they are.
I (unfortunately) work at an Office Max, and we have some customers who habitually try to abuse the system. We have one person who buys a printer, then wants to return it just before the end of the return period. After, of course, using up ALL the ink. Needless to say we no longer accept returns from him. Another went through 5 Palm Pilots, in about 10 days. I'm not sure what she did to break them, but these are the only five allegedly "defective" Palms we had all year. It's hard to believe it was just bad luck. When she returned the fifth one we told her that we wouldn't take any more Palms back from her, she'd have to go through the manufacturer warranty if she bought another Palm from us and had problems.
Then of course there's the "vultures" who come in every Sunday (arriving about an hour before we open and banging and kicking the doors because we won't open early for them) and get everything that's "free after rebate". They'll get things like Hard Drives but don't even own a computer, they just plan to sell them. Thank God we stopped doing "free" stuff.
On the other hand, we are FORCED to try to sell protection plans (and lose hours if we don't sell enough) and pester people to buy extra stuff. It's one thing to offer a USB cable when they buy a 3-in-1, but we're supposed to do it if they just buy ink or paper also. That radio in our ear is "reminding" us all the things that could possibly be associated with whatever your buying. At my store, at least, we make some attempt to have only one sales droid pester any given customer, instead of all of us one after the other.
BTW, the best way to keep the sales droids away is to hold a cell phone to your ear and pretend to be having a conversation. It's far from guaranteed, but it will help. And mail in rebates are, IMO, just a way for the store to make interest off your money. That's why they take 3 to 4 months to send the check. Wait untill the specified product is sold out and you may get (if it's a manufacturer rebate, not a store rebate) the substitute item at the "after rebate" price at the register. I picked up a DVD +-RW for $60 cash that way (list was $199).
Open Source for Open Minds
I found this article and all the comments really interesting.
Last fall, I needed a new refrigerator and saw one in a Best Buy ad that was at a decent price and was really just what I was looking for. I like it pretty well and had made up my mind to buy it, but then the Best Buy sales staff entered. I didn't *even* get to the arguing about the extended warranty part before their general rudeness had so thoroughly alienated me that I told them "I changed my mind; your bad service and attitude just blew the sale for you" and walked out.
I then drove a few miles to Sears, where I found a fridge with all the same features, and free delivery (which made it the same price as the one at Best Buy), and the sales people were great.
Best Buy's staff is the best advertisement their competitors could wish for. That would have been my first time to buy at a Best Buy store, and now I will not set foot in one again. I wouldn't care if they were beating Fry's, Circuit City, and everyone else on the price of every item, I'd rather pay more somewhere else than buy from Best Buy.
But then came the printers. Well, a local Staples was having a sale on a perfect unit. I'd charged $100 for them, and these Canon printers were normally $90 each. Taht would have been $120 profit on 12, but there was a $30 in store instant rebate, AND a $30 mail-in rebate on each one too, bringing my efective cost down to $30 per unit. I figured even if I never saw the rebates, it was still $40 profit per printer alone, not to mention the computers. I sent in all 12 rebate coupons with the receipts and serial number stickers (there were copies in the box for just such a purpose), and waited. A mere two weeks later I received a dozen $30 checks from Canon in my mailbox, all on the same day.
You'd be astounded how loose they are with checking multiple rebates. I just did it again a couple weeks ago with 4 Netgear wifi routers.
jX [ Make everything as simple as possible, but no simpler. - Einstein ]
I thought extended warranties ruined the consumer electronics market... Now I think rebates are taking it to a new low. Here's my story:
At an electronics store I worked at in 1985 and 1990, they were pushing "extended warranties" (essentially 2-year over the counter replacement plans), and were telling us they were over 90% pure profit for the company. These plans were about 8-10% of the purchase price.
I did my part as a salesman and always took the customer's word of a problem on any "replacement plan" return. I did have to see a demonstration of the problem (company rules), but once shown the problem I never argued about it and sided with the customer. One great example had a customer who bought a dictation recorder that had "auto reverse" when recording, so both sides of the tape could be recorded on without flipping the cassette. it was a very cool feature at the time and it cost a cool $99 back then. When it came back busted some time later, I told him that model was discontinued and we don't have any more. The only replacement was a $249.00 unit that was the only model that currently recorded in auto reverse. The customer balked and said he wasn't going to spend the extra money and the auto reverse was not that important to him. I gently reminded the customer that we are required to give him an "equivalent model" as a replacement.
He suddenly got a clue and said yes, the auto reverse is a very nice feature indeed. The manager came over and I told him this was the only model with the features of his broken unit. The customer got the $249 unit and left very happy (bought another plan too, at a prorated price). The odd thing is, management did not care how many replacements were done, they only wanted the number of plans SOLD.
That serves the company right for shoving these plans down the salespeople's throats, and I managed to do it all within the framework of the company's rules. My job was customer service and sales, and harassing customers over these things was not serving the customer. I thought replacement plans were very worthwhile on certain items only, such as cassette-type Walkmans (this was in the mid-late 80's). These saw tons of abuse by joggers and were lucky to last 6-12 months. I saw lots of these come back after a few months with unhappy customers and determined these were the only thing I ever thought a replacement plan was good for.
In 1990, the company switched to a 3rd party warranty provider that said basically said they repair it. If it breaks more than twice in a 2, 3 or 5 year period, it would be replaced. Then work really started shoving these plans that cost up to 33% of the product price down our throats. We were required to sell 5% of our total sales with these plans. Later, this rose to 8% then 10%. Failing to meet quota meant lowered commission percentages and possible suspension.
In the end I and another worker were suspended over not selling enough of these. I waited the full week, then called in to say I wasn't coming in anymore. My coworker did the same. It made no difference.
One year later there was an article in the paper over this 3rd party not honoring the plans sold by my company because the company failed to pay them their share of the warranty price.
For the last ten years, the big watch-word in IT was CRM - "Customer Relationship Management" - the idea that you had to really treat the customer right and constantly get in the customer's face with how wonderful a company you were so they'd all want to do business with you since you were such a great friendly place.
I knew it was a fucking joke the minute I read about it - because I KNOW management - and management's idea of CRM is dropping spyware on your computer so they can bombard you with crap advertising for products that don't work and nobody wants - and treating their employees - those people who are the front-line to their customers - like dirt.
"CRM" is a joke concept given the nature of business in this country (for that matter, in most of the world.)
The Corporation is NOT your friend any more than the State is.
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
In a situation like this you go and pull out our cellphone (you likely have one), or if you don't have one go get another phone, and call the police. When it's all an video, it's all nice and clear cut. You would be amazed at what the threat of jail time can do to attitudes. Don't wait until later to get a lawyer or some such, call the police then and there. You may have to wait an hour or so (face it, getting pushed in a Best Buy doesn't rate as high on the list) but they will come, and if you press the issue, those repsonsible will be charged.
Ok, since this is a Best Buy Bashfest, I'll spill my story (the short version).
Went into BB the day after Thanksgiving '03 to buy a doorbuster DVD for $20. 6am, got in, got the player, and was headed out. Guy at the door stops me, insists on seeing my receipt. I have always refused such requests (politely), just on principle (Don't treat your customers like shoplifters by default). Years ago, when I worked at Computer City, I was advised by the manager that while we could request to see receipts at door checkpoints, we had no entitlement to it. If someone refused, we had to make an instant decision if we really thought that they were a risk, and detain them for the police. He said if we detained, we better be right! Anyway, after politely refusing to show my receipt, I paused to dispose of my now-empty coffee cup in a nearby can, and when I look up, here's this guy again, now just inches from my face, and he has his hands on my package (the DVD, pervs!). I immediately requested the manager, my full intention being to show my receipt to the manager, and while we were both inconvenienced, to explain to her how offensive the checkpoint policy was. As soon as she approached me, she advised a nearby employee to call the police. I then released my grip on the package to retreive my receipt from my back pocket, when the employee decided he was going to snatch the box out of my hands. Well, since he didn't meet the same amount of resistance as he expected, his motion toward me was very exaggerated, and (this sounds funny, but just visualize it) in a downward motion, his head struck my hand. THey took my DVD player, and returned it to my credit card for me. (where I come from, we call that stealin'!). When the police arrived, I was charged with Battery. The police refused my request to review the Surveillance tapes, and just said to "tell it to the judge". I am still battling this thing, but I intend to win. The court offered me a simple $100 fine to plead guilty, but I have opted to pay the several thousand in attorney's fees to defend my good name (and to ensure that the status of my CCW permit is not affected). After several hearings where Best Buy has failed to provide the videotape that would corroborate my story, they have been threatened with Contempt of Court. Oh, and it is in the police report that the mgr on duty stated that there _was_ video coverage of the area in which the incident happened.
Lastly, It should be noted that what started the whole thing was an accusation of shoplifting, but when they found that they were mistaken, they fabricated the battery story just to show me who was boss. If anybody has any similar horror stories regarding the LV locations of BB, I'd love to hear them.
A business is under no obligation legally to take back a returned item once sold, as long as it is not defective and was not sold under false pretenses. Businesses like BestBuy take returns in the first place as a courtesy to customers, because it's something people expect from large stores.
This is not true. Most states have laws on their books that say something to the effect of "Any buyer has the right to return an item within 3 days of purchase."
In addition, always buy with your credit card. Most credit cards have a 90 day return policy on any item you buy. They say, what they will do is refund your money if the merchant refuses to take the return back within 90 days. In actuality, they issue a chargeback to the merchant, and you get your money regardless. Of course the merchant is getting screwed, but remember folks, this is Best Buy. Fuck 'em. Until they stop using deceptive marketing practices like "FREE after rebate!". Of which, there are three rebates, and they purposefully disqualify you for some nitpicky reason like you forgot to dot an I on the rebate application, or each one of the 3 rebates requires the Original UPC code (not a copy), so you can only really get one of them.
The practices they have been engaging in for years are fraudulent and deceptive. They shouldn't be surprised to find out that some customers are manipulating these processes for their own gain (getting rebates after returning the items). The entire system would be far better if the FTC made rebates illegal. Everything would be one price, you would pay that price, and that's it. This will never happen though, because the government likes the higher sales tax they get, because customers pay the sales tax on the original price, not the price they get after rebate.
"When the president does it, that means it's not illegal." - Richard M. Nixon
This was pretty radical stuff back before 1998 - then Peppers & Rogers began pushing it in the CRM space.
Of course, this has nothing to do with CRM products like siebel, vantive, etc. But instead has everything to do with methodology - in this case Relationalship Marketing. In this methodology Peppers & Rogers are the thought leaders:
http://www.1to1.com/home.aspx?ItemID=548
As far as bestbuy identifying their worst customers. That's fine, nothing really that wrong with it. It will probably just result in them *not* sending promotions, sales info, etc to those customers.
I am an ignorant anonymous coward, you insensitive clod! ;)
Aight, I'll say this much for the PSP's - I bought a Sony Clie (NX600) from Best Buy, and didn't do all that much with it. But I did get a PSP for it. Two years later, the irreplacable battery dies, so I take my PSP and my Clie to Best Buy. (This is even in a different state.)
The Guy Behind the Counter (GBC): *looks at box*
GBC: What's wrong with it?
ME: Dead battery.
GBC: Hmph. Be right back.
ME: *waits*
GBC: We don't have anymore of that model.
GBC: Just want the $500?
ME: Duh... roger me with a spork!
GBC: Um... yeah.
So, I got the $500, but only as store credit. Which was okay, because I "cashed it in" by trading it for $450 cash with a friend who wanted something at Best Buy anyway, and got my sweet, sweet TH55. w00t!
So, it sucks how they try to shove the PSP's up your ass like that, but they *are* pretty good service plans.
Flamewar ensues...
-- GNU/Anonymous Coward
Unfortunately I was once a Best Buy employee and didn't like it. It wasn't that you were mistreated as an employee but you were just mentally abused by all the bullshit. Every morning you'd go to work and have to watch a movie and/or listen to a long speech of how terrible the "team" was doing. I got so tired of hearing the word team that I was ready to hit someone by the time I left.
Thing is though, after a while it doesn't just settle in. It nags at you worse as time goes by. I don't think it's the managers' fault though. They have a job the same as I did and they were just relaying their orders on to the employees. I don't know who to blame but it's rediculous how much they push you to sell the service plan.
You think the service plan is bad though? It IS! However, you should also take into account of all the other miserable means of sales you have to go through. There is a "process" in which you are required to sell things. This entire process is what you had to watch in those movies in the morning.
Anyway, you were required to great the customer, shake their hands, introduce yourself and your name, ask the customer his/her name, little small talk in between (even though they didn't "advertise" that), ask them lifestyle questions, find out what they were into, match them up to things that fit the style of the person (which never worked), start the sales pitch on the service plan or replacement plan early in the conversation. After getting the sale you were then required to "attach" at least 2 accessories because a sale isn't a sale unless they get the complete package. After that you were then required to try and finish them off on the service plan.
Upon succeeding or failing on the service plan sale you were then required to do even more. Now it's time to pitch the sale of services and subscriptions. That includes DirecTv, Satellite Radio, NetFlix, Msn, Comcast Cable, Reward Zone, Magazines (which were just coming into play as I quit thank god), and Rhapsody. Of all those mentioned, the only one worth a damn was Reward Zone. NetFlix was cool but it wasn't for everyone yet we were chewed out because of that. Satellite Tv and cable internet were things that most people already had or they didn't want anyway.
It's just a shame that Best Buy is the way it is. I told them the day I started working there that I loved their store. I also told them I was coming to work because I loved the environment and how things worked and that it wasn't because of the money. The day I left I told them that I wish I had never worked there because it made me hate the store with a passion that I'd have never had, or at least not for a good while anyway.
So the moral of my rant here is that Best Buy employees aren't always the prime reason of hte problem. You guys will never understand the pressure they put on you to sell something and how low they run you into the ground mentally if you don't get the sale their way.
You're not a very well educated consumer. At that point you walk out of the store and purchase your playstation 2 elsewhere. Or did you not know that it's available in about a thousand other places
Best Buy may not think the customer is always right, but you as a customer always has the last say.
The above post is an editorial, the poster cannot and will not be held responsible for all or in part for it's contents
After a few more problems with the way BB treats its customers I don't shop there anymore. There is a Circuit City right across the street.
My family has had several great experiences with Circuit City. We bought an open-box big screen TV (for a good bit less than a new one), which promptly broke a week later. As frustrating as that was, Circuit City delivered a brand new one the next day, at no cost to us. When this same TV broke again a few years later (bad model, i suppose) we called in to have it serviced under the extended warranty. Also another poor experience at first, as the repairman seemed relatively clueless and couldn't fix the TV, but a few weeks later when the TV still hadn't been fixed, Circuit City gave us store credit for the full price (unopened box) of the TV when it was new. That let us upgrade our 4:3 standard resolution TV to a bigger 16:9 HDTV for something like $60 more.
As much as I hate those 'extended warranties', Circuit City's definitely turned out in our favor.
Yep. They are used to being able to gouge the customers. My father wanted to buy a truck, and unlike the rest of us, he has enough money he can just up and pay cash for it. He went to the local Toyota dealer, negotiated a price on it, and then the guy comes back "oh Im sorry, this model has such and such, its a little bit extra" ($1200!), so my father renegotiates, they shake on the deal again, the guy comes back, "I'm sorry my manager won't let me sell it at that price, he says it has to be at least..." At which point, My father says something like "fuck you" and the salesman looses the easiest sale of his entire life.
Religion is a gateway psychosis. -- Dave Foley
We just ordered a table and chairs. The sales guy was really pushing the "fabric protection" crap that they spray on for another $45. I declined several times and he went ahead with the sale. We were sitting on a couch waiting for him to do paperwork when the store manager came by and said "whenever someone declines the fabric protection I have to find out why." We explained that we don't feel the need. I said I'd get it if they waived the sales tax (which they do for larger purchases). They ended up taking off 3 percent (tax is 6) which made it about the same price WITH the fabric protection. I spent the whole trip home trying to figure out why that's so important. My conclusions is the manager must get a bonus for selling this stuff and did so at the stores expense in this case - We paid the same price and got the stuff in addition to what we were willing to take home for that price.
At least you won. I purchased an open-box Viewsonic monitor years ago, with the promise (printed on the box in huge letters) that Best Buy would honor the manufacturer's warranty. Six months later, the monitor went Kaput. Best Buy no longer carried it, or ANY monitor that met the specs it had-- and refused to replace it. I was offered store credit only. Nothing they had would match the refresh rate and resolution of the broken monitor. I went around and around with them for months, finally receiving an email from customer service that "this was the last email I would receive on the subject."
While I'll admit to having bought a DVD or two there in the intervening four years, they haven't seen a dime for hardware or software. Which, as in your case, has been a significant amount.
The problem, though, is that there is no real alternative. When BB screwed me, I tried other stores-- but when my HDTV failed it took HHGregg (local electronics chain) 4 house calls followed by SIX WEEKS in the shop to diagnose and repair it, despite promising 1-week turnaround. They missed four promised delivery dates to return the set after that.
Circuit City hasn't done it yet, but I can't imagine they're any more honorable than the rest.
What do you do when ALL your choices are like that? Stop buying, I guess.
Read my story. After being chased into the parking lot for failing to be searched by their door nazi and threatened with police action, Best Buy has guaranteed that I won't be back.
-- Mark Lyon http://www.marklyon.org
First off... here's something I usually do at Best Buy (when I'm not just going there because I want to buy "something").
:)
I go to BestBuy.com and find everything I want and order it for In Store Pickup. You pay for the merchandise online, an employee will walk around the store and pick out everything and bring it up to the customer service desk. Then they e-mail you saying your order is ready. You just show up at best buy, show them the printed e-mail and the card you used to purchase it and be on your way. This is *wonderful* to do at Christmas time. I love walking into Best Buy, walking right up to customer service and leaving while watching the wrap around the store line. And I didn't even have to find any of my items. Use it!
Last time I went to Best Buy I bought a logitech wireless keyboard/mouse combo that cost me about $100. I'm used to the first thing out of my mouth being a "no" once I hit the cashier. It went something like this (keep in mind I worked customer service at a store for about 2 years so I know what goes on).
Rep: "Would you like to buy the service plan for $10?"
Me: "No."
Rep: "Well I work at customer service too and I see these come back a lot and if it breaks you'll need the service plan."
Me: "No, if it breaks due to it being faulty you'll exchange it without the service plan."
Rep: "Well... some people find that the range isn't long enough on this product so you'll need the service plan to bring it back if it's not good enough."
Me: "No, if it's not good enough I have several days to make that call and bring it back for a full refund."
Rep: *blank stare*
I really don't get what he was getting at. From past experience in customer service I know I probably could have returned the keyboard and mouse to them covered in peanut butter without a receipt and gotten my money back and a $25 gift card. Being persistent and pleasant tends to get you results. I almost wanted to not buy the product on the basis that if it was that bad of a product I should probably get something else... although I've yet to have problems with it.
The only two things I do have their service plan on is my TV (the tube did go out and the model was discontinued so I ended up better off for it anyhow) and my digital camera because I bought the display one (which was discontinued anyhow) and since they knocked a decent amount off the price it made up for the purchase of the service plan. Plus the plan entitles me to new free batteries for 3 years after I got the plan and the plan was $40 and the batteries cost a good $30. I've already gotten one new battery. Both of my service plans have been useful for me.
Now to go place an order on the BestBuy web site to pick up after work...
Okay, we all know how annoying BB is about the PSPs, but, having worked there for extra cash a couple Christmases ago, I would like to speak in defense of the sales associates.
While it's true they don't get commission, they WILL get fired if their personal numbers don't look good enough, and the main consideration there is how many PSPs they move. Increasingly, the only people who can move those damned things are the ones who are willing to outright lie about them. I sucked at it, but it's either that or get fired.
So although associates are supposed to offer it 3 times and let it go, it sometimes gets belligerent if their numbers are looking bad. That's one response to customers who aren't willing to throw their money away. The other (that I reluctantly started using) was just abandoning customers who wouldn't buy one. If you're finding that you are being hot-potatoed from one associate to the next, it's because no one's numbers are good enough that day to afford selling you that naked laptop (BB makes almost nothing on laptops if you don't throw a bunch of accessories and the PSP on it).
It's an extremely high-pressure job, which can be terminated at any moment, so please keep that in mind when you go there.
Here's how you get around the mess, though: If you're buying computer products, don't talk to an associate if you can help it. Look around the department for where the item is kept, and if it's accessible, pull it from the shelf yourself and take it to the front. The people on the front registers don't have the time or the sales experience to push the PSP more than one time.
If the computer product is not accessible in the department, look above the phones and TVs in the right-back corner. If there are some up there, you can ask one of the TV guys to get it for you. They don't know anything about the computer stuff, and your sale won't affect their departmental or personal numbers, so they will probably just get it for you to get you out of the way.
And regarding rebates, I think someone else already said this, but PHOTOCOPY EVERYTHING. Keep your own copies of everything, because the companies need the originals. Keep accurate records. Neither BB nor the manufacturer is going to be terribly proactive about GIVING you money, so you very well may have to fight them.
And finally, my thoughts on the BB business model: It's fucking doomed. Fewer and fewer people are willing to buy PSPs and ridiculously overpriced accessories--the only things BB makes any money on. BB is going to have to find a way to make money ON THE ITEMS IT SELLS. I kicked ass at loading customers with every cool gadget under the sun, because I knew about every cool gadget under the sun. But then I had to switch from "Isn't this cool?" to "Now I'd like to talk to you about our PSP," and sometimes the customer would just walk. As the business model is set up now, that customer walking is not seen as a bad thing, because the store is losing money on them. But what the model doesn't take into account is that that person probably never shops there again. And tells his friends. BB is flushing their reputation down the toilet, and they don't see it yet. They used to make money with volume and low overhead, but they are increasingly raising that overhead with pretty stores, resulting in them having to find products that don't exist, but that people will fork over money for. It's a crazy system and it's doomed to fail. People go to a store to buy SOMETHING, not NOTHING. If you can't make money on what people come to buy, you're fucked.
I must be a "demon customer." When you think about it, most often electronics are "want items" not "need items." This means that you can afford to wait for the really good deals and this is what I do. When the big day to buy the new electronic item comes, I'm up early and hit the store just as the doors open. I walk directly to the department and try to locate the item. If I can't find it I ask a salesperson where it is. If I can, I simply ask them to point me in the direction of it and I get it myself. I try not to get "sales person assistance" if I can help it. I then take my purchase directly to the check out and I decline any "service plan" that is offered me.
If a sales person pushes, I tell them in no uncertain terms that I am not interested in plans, accessories, or other things. If they push a second time, I tell them I will not be pushed and that I do not appreciate their interference. That always stops them. If they make a "final comment" I will either abandon the purchase or ignore them (depending on how bad I want it).
When I have to make a return, I try to be as perfect as possible. I save even the plastic and the tiewraps and put the package back exactly as it was when I opened it. I return the bag and even the plastic outer-wrap. I never make up excuses, if it quit working, I'll say that. If it didn't meet my expectations, I'll say that. If I am making a return, only rarely will I accept an exchange. If the return is not going smoothly, I will give the clerk two choices, either immediately accept the return or call the manager. If they call the manager, I will tell him/her there are two choices, either accept the return or I will cancel the transaction on my credit card. That always works.
As far as I am concerend, I am the customer. In a sense I vote with my money. I am free to spend it where I want, when I want. If you want my money, you will do it my way or I will go somewhere that they will.
I guess that makes me a demon customer and damn I am proud to be one. It is what makes good companies profitable and bad companies go out of business. Businesses need to compete for my money. They need to offer products at fair prices, provide a good shopping experience, and give great customer service or I will vote them off the island. I am a demon and am proud of it!
You know, I started doing this in 1992 when I started college. This was before the BB days, but I went to a HiFi Buys (which subsequently became Tweeter) and bought a receiver. It was cheap, but they still offered the PSP... I declined, but then got the idea to just take that $40 or whatever it was and stick it in a savings account. So, for the past 12 years, for big ticket items like TV's and Laptops and other stuff that would suck to have to replace, I've declined the PSP, but put the cost of the PSP in that savings account. Whenever something has broken beyond repair, I've used that money to replace it.
Today, 12 years later, I'm SO ridiculously far ahead of the game. By simply self-insuring on breakage, I've managed to amass about $4K in that account (and a lot of it is interest).
Just think about all of the cell phones, TVs, appliances, CD players, and other crap the average person buys in 12 years... a PSP is usually about 25% of the cost of an item, so you can well imagine that can add up to a large sum. With a failure rate of around 3% (infant mortality excluded because it's covered under manufacturer's warranty), that's a gigantic profit...
Thanks for bringing this up since I intend to buy an HDTV in the nxt 6 months and planned on getting the PSP (If I'm dropping ~2500 on a TV, I don't want to drop another ~2500 once the warranty runs out). I will read the extended warranty info VERY carefully now.
-truth
I had a steady B+ in my AI class until I failed the Turing test...