Posted by
CmdrTaco
on from the and-it-fits-in-the-palm-of-your-hand dept.
FTL writes "Turn an ordinary wheel mouse into a 3D pointing device. All one needs is some string, some hot melt glue, and a lot of math. 3D mice have been floatingaroundforawhile, what will it take to get people to use them?"
what's the purpose?
by
softwave
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
what will it take to get people to use them? seriously, a purpose? I remember that Logitech had a pointing device that would allow 3D-movement, that was like 10 years ago. Can't remember the name though. I frankly don't see in what niche there would be a use for a 3D-mouse. Not even gaming, not even 3D-development (such as CAD/CAI). But I'm curious to hear it from other users...
6d mouse more useful
by
XavierXeon
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
Re:6d mouse more useful
by
mt-biker
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
Absolutely. I use a space-mouse at work (VR), but I guess relatively few people on slashdot know about them?
You don't move it around like a regular mouse, rather you hold the hockey-puck sized control in your hand and push/pull it _gently_ in one of 3 directions. Being able to twist the puck gives you the other 3 degrees of freedom.
The device is sprung and returns to center when you let go. The total movement of the puck is only about a centimetre (0.393700787 inches;) in any direction.
When you're used to using a normal mouse, it takes a while to get the feel of the relatively sensitive spacemouse, but since your hand remains stationary on the desk while using it, it's not tiring.
Drawbacks: Cost - the things are EXPENSIVE! Also I doubt it would totally replace a normal mouse - with the speed turned up high it wouldn't be accurate enough for fine tasks, and with the speed lower it'd take you forever to get from one side of the screen to the other. The space mouse is intended to manipulate models in 3D space.
Re:What's the point?
by
dirty
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
Possibly, but for general use, there is no reason for people to start using them. Not to mention, think of how tired your arm would get after hours of work on your computer.
I'm sure for specialized tasks 3d mice make perfect sense, and are probably already in use. I just don't want to have them shoved on normal use.
Why don't we use wheel as "depth" (zoom) command for 3D navigation in "world behind the screen"? That seems so obvious...
Those devices from TFA are more like "make your computer read your hand's 3d motion", which is IMHO too anti-ergonomic to be useful (except maybe for some kind of workout).
just two nights ago I wondered whether I should post "ask/." on how to make a 3d mouse. Such device will be very useful for debugging my CAE program (calculating concrete) that I write for my PhD.
now I'm off to make this mouse and see how it works.:))
Re:What will it take?
by
fuzzix
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
As with all technologies: A killer app.
Perhaps a desktop environment like Sun's Project Looking Glass in conjunction with a 3D output device (like a VR helmet or 3D monitor) could make such an input device feel more natural.
I haven't used Looking Glass yet so I'm not sure how well suited it would be...
Re:What's the point?
by
tciny
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
On the other hand it'd be pretty comfortable for using a software like Maya or 3dsmax where you currently have to use those transform gizmos in order to move objects in 3D space.
I think tho, that it'd need another solution than just giving 2d mice a third axis.
I'd rather have something like a glove you put on where you can then pick up objects, point at them, etc. It'd just make it far more intuitive and flexible to use... and of course far more expansive, that is:)
Re:What's the point?
by
dirty
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
I'd really love to see some statistics proving that point.
Web development isn't real work? Video production isn't real work? Audio editing isn't real work?
Those 3 items are 90% of the work I do on a computer, and I'd love to see you do any of them with a pen and paper. Not one of them would be simplified with a 3d mouse, or even a 3d desktop. Extra monitors on the other hand, provide a great benifate to all of those areas. And all a second monitor does is extend your 2d work area.
I can't back this up at all, but I would imagine that true 3d applications are nothing more than a small percentage of work done on computers. I'd say the vast majority of all work related computer use is office applications. Yes a good deal of it could be done on paper, but with a lot more effort.
--
-matt
Re:Interesting concept
by
Twinbee
·
· Score: 3, Interesting
Even in 2D programs, this would be useful. Think of simple controls like moving a slider or zooming in/out. There are plenty of other program specific functions too. For example, in paint programs, it could represent the opacity (translucency level).
Almost any type of program could benefit from the extra dimension. In fact, the mouse wheel on a lot of mice already counts as this 'extra 3rd dimension'. But unfortunately, it uses discrete steps to funtion, rather than a smooth continuous movement (one would think there'd be a market
for analogue mouse wheels, but no company seems to produce them... shame...).
He's holding it wrong! (UI ideas)
by
argent
·
· Score: 4, Interesting
What you need is to put the ring on your finger, then get one of those laser-pointer mice and hold it: now you get:
3d position of your hand. 2d attitude of your hand (pitch and yaw). 2 or 3 buttons.
Now let's pretend you have a device like this that's light enough that you can wear it like a glove (no Nintendo jokes, please) and it's wireless. Add "roll" input and implement the buttons using something like midi drumsticks based on finger movements.
Now, what's the user interface for this going to look like?
Let's avoid the gorilla-arm problem by making a state change when you rest your hand on the table. On the table it acts like a mouse, except you're not holding a mouse you're just moving your hand or finger on the desktop and tapping it to click.
So, if you're used to a mouse, you can use it like a mouse.
Next, add gestures. Thumb and forefinger together and you're dragging. Curl your fingers into a fist and you just cut (grabbed) what you selected. Open your hand wide and you paste (drop).
Now, move your hand off the desktop. A couple of inches away and you shift to 3d mode. Gestures work the same way, but now you can drag windows forward and back as well as up and down.
Next, move your hand near the actual screen. Now it works like a light-pen with gestures, so you really can move that window out of the way by reaching up and dragging it. Why, you could even apply virtual white-out on your monitor!
Finally, curl your fingers around like you're pointing at something. Now you're using a virtual laser-pointer... the mouse moves wherever your finger is pointing at. This extends the "light pen" mode back away from the screen, so you can rest your hand on the desk without breaking that metaphor.
I'm sure that not all of these modes will end up being useful, but it wouldn't take much of a change in our existing user interfaces to find something that would work better than the mice we use now.
Re:He's holding it wrong! (UI ideas)
by
Solder+Fumes
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
I like how you think. Now here's another wrinkle: make sure the pressure sensors in the fingertips have high enough resolution, and/or have a pressure sensitive pen that communicates with the glove while you're holding it. Now, you have a full-featured graphics tablet (pressure, position, tilt, rotation) where the only size limit is your tabletop. You could even use the third dimension to get an accurate simulation of airbrush spray at different heights.
One more idea: Curl your fingers into a fist and place the edge of your hand on the table. You now have a virtual joystick. Squeeze fingers to activate trigger buttons, move your thumb around for hat switch etc.
Logitech had a '3d' mouse back around, oh, 1995 or so. It had a stationary base and a mouse shaped handle. The whole thing moved in an XY space, and you could roll-pitch-yaw the handle. It 'emulated a mouse' so that you could use it to replace one - or so the box said.
The REAL end result was hand pain the likse if which you've never seen. I had it back in the box and returned to the store in under 30 minutes.
-- "Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus."
What will it take to get people to use them?
by
Oligonicella
·
· Score: 2, Interesting
Slashdot Mirror
what will it take to get people to use them?
seriously, a purpose?
I remember that Logitech had a pointing device that would allow 3D-movement, that was like 10 years ago. Can't remember the name though. I frankly don't see in what niche there would be a use for a 3D-mouse. Not even gaming, not even 3D-development (such as CAD/CAI). But I'm curious to hear it from other users...
a space mouse has 6 degrees of freedom and is very useful when working in a "3d" environment such as CAD http://www.3dconnexion.com/products.htm
Possibly, but for general use, there is no reason for people to start using them. Not to mention, think of how tired your arm would get after hours of work on your computer.
I'm sure for specialized tasks 3d mice make perfect sense, and are probably already in use. I just don't want to have them shoved on normal use.
-matt
Why don't we use wheel as "depth" (zoom) command for 3D navigation in "world behind the screen"? That seems so obvious...
Those devices from TFA are more like "make your computer read your hand's 3d motion", which is IMHO too anti-ergonomic to be useful (except maybe for some kind of workout).
just two nights ago I wondered whether I should post "ask /." on how to make a 3d mouse. Such device will be very useful for debugging my CAE program (calculating concrete) that I write for my PhD.
:))
now I'm off to make this mouse and see how it works.
#
#\ @ ? Colonize Mars
#
Perhaps a desktop environment like Sun's Project Looking Glass in conjunction with a 3D output device (like a VR helmet or 3D monitor) could make such an input device feel more natural.
I haven't used Looking Glass yet so I'm not sure how well suited it would be...
On the other hand it'd be pretty comfortable for using a software like Maya or 3dsmax where you currently have to use those transform gizmos in order to move objects in 3D space.
:)
I think tho, that it'd need another solution than just giving 2d mice a third axis.
I'd rather have something like a glove you put on where you can then pick up objects, point at them, etc. It'd just make it far more intuitive and flexible to use... and of course far more expansive, that is
I'd really love to see some statistics proving that point.
Web development isn't real work?
Video production isn't real work?
Audio editing isn't real work?
Those 3 items are 90% of the work I do on a computer, and I'd love to see you do any of them with a pen and paper. Not one of them would be simplified with a 3d mouse, or even a 3d desktop. Extra monitors on the other hand, provide a great benifate to all of those areas. And all a second monitor does is extend your 2d work area.
I can't back this up at all, but I would imagine that true 3d applications are nothing more than a small percentage of work done on computers. I'd say the vast majority of all work related computer use is office applications. Yes a good deal of it could be done on paper, but with a lot more effort.
-matt
Even in 2D programs, this would be useful. Think of simple controls like moving a slider or zooming in/out. There are plenty of other program specific functions too. For example, in paint programs, it could represent the opacity (translucency level). Almost any type of program could benefit from the extra dimension. In fact, the mouse wheel on a lot of mice already counts as this 'extra 3rd dimension'. But unfortunately, it uses discrete steps to funtion, rather than a smooth continuous movement (one would think there'd be a market for analogue mouse wheels, but no company seems to produce them... shame...).
Why OpalCalc is the best Windows calc
What you need is to put the ring on your finger, then get one of those laser-pointer mice and hold it: now you get:
3d position of your hand.
2d attitude of your hand (pitch and yaw).
2 or 3 buttons.
Now let's pretend you have a device like this that's light enough that you can wear it like a glove (no Nintendo jokes, please) and it's wireless. Add "roll" input and implement the buttons using something like midi drumsticks based on finger movements.
Now, what's the user interface for this going to look like?
Let's avoid the gorilla-arm problem by making a state change when you rest your hand on the table. On the table it acts like a mouse, except you're not holding a mouse you're just moving your hand or finger on the desktop and tapping it to click.
So, if you're used to a mouse, you can use it like a mouse.
Next, add gestures. Thumb and forefinger together and you're dragging. Curl your fingers into a fist and you just cut (grabbed) what you selected. Open your hand wide and you paste (drop).
Now, move your hand off the desktop. A couple of inches away and you shift to 3d mode. Gestures work the same way, but now you can drag windows forward and back as well as up and down.
Next, move your hand near the actual screen. Now it works like a light-pen with gestures, so you really can move that window out of the way by reaching up and dragging it. Why, you could even apply virtual white-out on your monitor!
Finally, curl your fingers around like you're pointing at something. Now you're using a virtual laser-pointer... the mouse moves wherever your finger is pointing at. This extends the "light pen" mode back away from the screen, so you can rest your hand on the desk without breaking that metaphor.
I'm sure that not all of these modes will end up being useful, but it wouldn't take much of a change in our existing user interfaces to find something that would work better than the mice we use now.
Logitech had a '3d' mouse back around, oh, 1995 or so. It had a stationary base and a mouse shaped handle. The whole thing moved in an XY space, and you could roll-pitch-yaw the handle. It 'emulated a mouse' so that you could use it to replace one - or so the box said.
The REAL end result was hand pain the likse if which you've never seen. I had it back in the box and returned to the store in under 30 minutes.
"Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus."
A reason.
Look, just for the screw of it doesn't suffice.