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Syllable - The Little OS with a Big Future?
Vanders writes "Tired of endless Windows security problems? Intrigued by Linux's power but discouraged by its complexity? Tempted by Mac OS but not thrilled with the hardware cost? In an OSNews article, Michael Saunders takes a look at Syllable, the OS that picked up where AtheOS left off over two years ago. Michael takes you through Syllable and shows you what we have been doing these past few years."
As to the complexity of Linux issue. It appears to me that Syllable is a Linux based system
Incorrect.
using Gnome
Incorrect.
and it looks similar to Fedora in some ways.
Probably superficial.
So I ask you, how can a Linux system be less complex than Linux?
Because it's not Linux. They swiped the icons. IIRC, AtheOS was written in 100% assembler as a pet project by the guy who wrote it. He (and others) later built some POSIX, KDE and GTK API mappings so that Linux and Unix software could be compiled and used.
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
Question: Is there any way to use Linux device drivers with this os?
Almost all of the drivers are Linux drivers, originally. They have been ported to use Syllable API's, but they're not that different. If you know enough about device drivers you can port a driver from Linux in a couple of days. Some people have ported drivers in a matter of hours.
Syllable : It's an Operating System
AtheOS was written in 100% assembler as a pet project by the guy who wrote it
The kernel is written in C. The high level stuff is written in C and C++.
He (and others) later built some POSIX, KDE and GTK API mappings..
The AtheOS kernel has always been about 95% POSIX compliant. There are no KDE or GTK API's for Syllable; it has always had it's own C++ API and appserver.
Syllable : It's an Operating System
Software installation is Linux is a breeze. It's so simple that a Windows or Mac user will have difficulties adapting to it. Instead of Googling for a utility, download it from Fileplanet or worse (alright, not worse, but maybe from Fileplanet), double-clicking on the .exe and clicking yes and next a couple of times, unchecking all the obnoxious 'default to this application for whatever you don't want it to do' and finally pressing OK, you just simply type 'apt-cache search $whatever' to find what you need, and 'apt-get install emacs21' to install it.
Of course, you need to know that you should do that, but I've already told you now, haven't I?
As for the graphics, I'm sure Linux can handle 1600x1200 and 16M colours, just like Windows. I'm also sure that KDE looks much better than all default XP themes (but not better than Aqua).
IIRC, AtheOS was written in 100% assembler
not exactly. Generally low level stuff is C, everything else is C++. The API to write gui apps is C++.
He (and others) later built some POSIX, KDE and GTK API mappings so that Linux and Unix software could be compiled and used.
nope, not at all. Syllable has always been a posix OS, so posix apps generally compile effortlessly. But part of the raison d'etre of syllable is to create a more BeOS, Mac, or Amiga inspired OS. This means no X, GTK or QT (a subset of QT was ported to port KHTML, similar to what Apple did for Safari), and these toolkits will never be ported to Syllable. At least not by the core devs.
Schrodinger's cat is either dead or really pissed off...
I would have also liked to see information about what would be involved in developing applications for Syllable. Is there a well-documented API? What about support for multiple languages?
All the information you'd like is on the website but we're Slashdoted, so I can only ask you to try again in a few days time. The API is documented, there are some tutorials, example code is abundent and we're happy to answer questions in the forums and mailing lists. Multi-lingual support is currently in the CVS version which can be compiled if you want it, and will be officially available in the next release of Syllable.
Syllable : It's an Operating System
It's not, at least not where it matters to the user! Consider:
/etc/conf.modules. In Syllable, just copy the driver into a directory.
Driver installation. In Linux, mess around compiling your kernel and/or modprobing modules and editing
User-interface: single toolkit and desktop, sane design. Consistency is the result.
Plus, there are other things. The initscripts are cleaner and shorter (one of the factors involved in the sub-10-second boots), the GUI subsystem is like X and a toolkit all-in-one, and others.
So install it, and you'll see that it's not as complex at all!
Huh? It was suggested as an alternative OS, not a Mac OS replacement, you cretin! As for QNX, I like the way you say it "didn't survive".
That's the QNX used in millions of embedded devices, is making a profit, and doing very well eh? http://www.qnx.com
You are astoundingly ill-informed!
The KHTML port is a total dead end; maintaining it is a nightmare. I hope we'll have a port of Gecko within the next 12 months, which will hopefully be much easier to maintain as it is designed to be portable. Personally I think we need stronger debugging tools before anyone tackles a large codebase like Gecko, so I intend to work on the development toolchain some more and then maybe tackle Gecko.
Syllable : It's an Operating System
I know for a fact that apt-get works on fedora and urpmi works great on Mandrake. Their ease of use makes me curious as to how portage is better. A packaging system that solves dependencies as it installs is the goal of all three - so again why is it better? With portage, you wait for a compile. With apt-get/urpmi the package and it's dependencies are installed rather smoothly - I have yet to see a problem (as long as your sources are good). I rarely need to actually install an rpm as long as I have the plf sources, and I never have to wait for a compile. I also believe this ease of use would encourage the adoption of linux, as opposed to waiting for the app to compile... I think either you haven't tried these distros or you are clouded by gentoo groupthink.
ymmv
The old saw about Macs being expensive is old and tired.
It is more accurate to say that you cannot buy a "cheap" mac. That is, the lowest price mac you can get is more expensive than the least expensive PC you can buy. But those two machines won't wind up being even close to either other in features or TCO. This is particularly the case with laptops.
..so why wouldn't you start with a Linux kernel that supports just about every graphics and sound board on the planet...
Not to be too crude, but it is because the Linux driver model sucks large Dyson Spheres through capilary tubing. It has an extremely high Lovelace value. Anyway, the Linux and Syllable kernel APIs (I'm talking about the driver->kernel API, not the API's that define how a driver is managed) are very similiar, so much so that most drivers are ported from Linux in about a week or two. The SiS 900 NIC driver was ported by Michael Krugger in half a day. I ported the Ymfpci OSS driver in about a week of a few hours a day. Syllable has the advantage of being able to draw on a large driver codebase while at the same time totally avoiding what many of us see has the total sucktitude of Linux driver management in general.
Maybe gstreamer is a good support library for what you're doing, perhaps not.
Actually, ffmpeg drives almost all of the media codecs currently available.
Syllable did not spring into life from a total vacum. It was forked from AtheOS, when AtheOS was already at quite an advanced stage. Kurt wrote AtheOS for fun. I and many other developers thought AtheOS was very cool, and I created Syllable to keep it alive and keep it cool. If I were to sit down today, and AtheOS and Syllable did not exist, I would probably do exactly as you describe and start with Linux. I don't think it would be half as well designed as Syllable is.
Syllable : It's an Operating System
Try man portage.
/etc/portage that can contain a bunch of files:
a nd many others
:-/
There is a new overlay in
package.unmask
package.keywords
package.use
These files apply the USE flags and keywords to only the specific package every time you emerge.
Portage's greatest secret. If only because it didn't exist when people were looking for it
There are a bug report and comments at sourceforge, looks like there is something unsound about handling the cookies.
Maybe the new color scheme threw a bad spell...
605413? Yes, it's a prime.
Portage has had this feature for many months now. BTW, I assumed you're actually talking about links, because lynx has no X USE flag.
LOAD "SIG",8,1
Best of luck to the Syllable team though. Prove me wrong.
(I'm a member of the Syllable community.)
We are not trying to bridge any supposed gap between Linux and Windows. We're dissatisfied with Windows as a desktop OS, and we're dissatisfied with Linux as a desktop OS. So, we're working on a completely different OS that meets our needs.
We do not expect every modern home user to use Syllable.
I honestly find the final argument in thebdj's post humorous. It reminds me of the "Everything that can be invented, has been invented" argument, and reminds me of the arguments against Linux five to ten years ago, which suggested that Windows and MacOS were "enough."
thedbj's reading an awful lot into the Syllable project that simply isn't there. When I look at the tremendous amount of work being put into Syllable for such little reward, the idea that we're making Syllable simply to be cool is ludicrous.
There is no simple, standard way to distribute an application for each version of Linux that will install. Windows DOES IT. Linux DOES NOT.
Actually Windows DOES NOT. I have a windows 98 box sitting in the corner because there is plenty of software that I use (mostly games) that installs fine on Win98 but refuses to install on Win2k/XP.