Slashdot Mirror


Amateur Revolution?

Ant writes "Fast Company's article mentions that networks of amateurs are displacing the pros and spawning some of the greatest innovations from from astronomy to computing. Rap inflects global popular culture from music to fashion. Linux poses a real threat to Microsoft. The Sims is among the most popular computer games ever. These far-flung developments have all been driven by Pro-Ams -- committed, networked amateurs working to professional standards. Pro-Am workers, their networks and movements, will help reshape society in the next two decades."

29 of 320 comments (clear)

  1. Corps will continue to rule, people are sheep... by garcia · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Rap, for one, started as do-it-yourself music among lower-income black men from distressed urban neighborhoods, recorded by artists on inexpensive equipment and distributed on handmade tapes by local labels. Yet within two decades, rap has become the dominant popular music across the world. In league with Pro-Am music distribution made possible by Napster and Kazaa, it has turned the entire record industry on its head.

    And it has now become the same money-hungry scheme that the rest of music is. Silver teeth, 80 gram bling, expensive cars, big houses, "hoes", problems with the law, etc. I don't see the difference between rap stars and more "traditional" music. I give this one 0/100.

    Likewise, according to one estimate, 90% of the content in The Sims is created by a Pro-Am sector of The Sims ' playing community, a distributed, self-organizing group whose players are constantly training one another and innovating.

    I suppose you could say that's why it is successful. I honestly believe that Quake was so very successful because people could play it the way they wanted to but I still think that the original game had a lot to do with it. If the base gameplay isn't all that great why would people be interested in building on that? I give this one 50/100.

    Some professionals will find that unsettling; they will seek to defend their monopolies. The more enlightened will understand that the landscape is changing. Knowledge is widely distributed, not controlled in a few ivory towers. The most powerful organizations will enable professionals and amateurs to combine distributed know-how to solve complex problems.

    More importantly the corporations find this unsettling and they have the backing to make it financially impossible for the "amateurs" to compete.

    Pro-Am activity will continue to expand. Longer healthy life spans will allow people in their forties and fifties to start taking up Pro-Am activities as second careers. Rising participation in education will give people skills to pursue those activities. New media and technology enable Pro-Ams to organize.

    Perhaps it has to do more with intelligent people understanding that they don't appreciate what's going on in the coporate world and they realize that they can at least do a little bit to start change in motion. I am not saying that they will get very far before the corporations do what they can to make the "amateurs" lives miserable but at least it gets the ball rolling.

    Pro-Ams could fuel mass participation in formal politics and in social entrepreneurship.

    No they most certainly will not. Not unless these "amateurs" get the election process changed to a reality TV style format. People just don't care enough about politics and social entrepeneurship. They want to sit at home and drug their brains with TV. That's all they want out of life. House, two SUVs, a jetski, and 2.75 kids.

    Plus, if amateurs were so great the flood of high quality home-made porno would be a ton better than what Vivid puts out. Personally, I'd rather watch the oversized men fuck women with over-sized Nip/Tuck'd boobs and airbrushed looking bodies than watching a fat, hairy, man fuck some underaged looking dark-circle eyed skank on the floor of a Super8 hotel room. That's me though ;)

    From the blurb:

    Pro-Am workers, their networks and movements, will help reshape society in the next two decades.

    Corporations, their money, and their slaves will continue to reshape society via their direct control over multiple media outlets (solidified TV/news, radio, Internet) not the public. Grass-roots campaigns have always existed on the fringe and while their causes are noble the masses love to be sheep while thinking they aren't.

  2. It's about passion by thesuperbigfrog · · Score: 5, Insightful
    People who are passionate about their work and love what they do aren't working, they're doing what they love.

    It just goes to show that while money can motivate people, passion for the work is a better motivator.

    --
    42
  3. Professional by stevie-boy · · Score: 5, Interesting

    For me the difficult part is this - how do you define "professional" and "amateur"? Do you have to be an MCSE to be considered a computing professional? Do you simply have to be paid to do something to be considered a "professional"?

    1. Re:Professional by GoofyBoy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      If I've learned anything from slashdot, an amateur is one who begins with "I Am Not A Laywer/Doctor/Baker/Candlestick Maker" and then proceeds to pretend that he is.

      --
      The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
    2. Re:Professional by generic-man · · Score: 4, Funny

      If you have a .pro domain, you're a professional. If you have a .am domain, you're an amateur. It's that simple. :)

      --
      For more information, click here.
  4. Apparantly Amateurs are producing content too... by FatSean · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ...where does this guy pull this crap? A few isolated events and he's predicting a world-changing trend? Geeze...

    --
    Blar.
  5. Possibly but... by DarthStrydre · · Score: 5, Informative

    I realize that many fields are easily accessible to amateurs, yet others remain obviously out of reach. Compare this to selling lemonade on the street corner.

    In many fields there is independent innovation. In electronics, for instance, people have been home-brewing radios, amplifiers, computers, etc.. for seemingly forever.

    Hoewever, it is technologically and physically impossible to build a cyclotron in your back yard. (Though if memory serves me properly, people have tried to build nuclear reactors from smoke alarm materials in the past).

    As always there is a limit to what independents can do by themselves, but that limit is always expanding with newly available tech.

    - Strydre -

    1. Re:Possibly but... by Viking+Coder · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Hoewever, it is technologically and physically impossible to build a cyclotron in your back yard.

      No it's not.

      --
      Education is the silver bullet.
  6. The Sims by generic-man · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The Sims is created and supported by EA, a company which has become like the Microsoft / Cisco / Computer Associates of the gaming world: they buy up as many companies as possible so they can profit off the licenses.

    The Sims is an excellent game and has a very large fanbase, but don't discount the influence of its very powerful parent company.

    --
    For more information, click here.
  7. The amatuers are pros though by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The article says that in the past a lot of amatuers where displaced by people who had the right bits of paper to say they could do it. Today a lot the amatuers actually have those bits of paper, for example how many Linux programmers have computer science degrees or even some lower level computing qualification.

  8. Re:Corps will continue to rule, people are sheep.. by goldspider · · Score: 4, Funny
    "Corporations, their money, and their slaves will continue to reshape society via their direct control over multiple media outlets (solidified TV/news, radio, Internet) not the public. Grass-roots campaigns have always existed on the fringe and while their causes are noble the masses love to be sheep while thinking they aren't."

    Jon Katz? Is that you in there??

    --
    "Ask not what your country can do for you." --John F. Kennedy
  9. Re:Corps will continue to rule, people are sheep.. by Swigger · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And it has now become the same money-hungry scheme that the rest of music is. Silver teeth, 80 gram bling, expensive cars, big houses, "hoes", problems with the law, etc. I don't see the difference between rap stars and more "traditional" music. I give this one 0/100.

    It doesn't matter what genre you're talking about, there are going to be groups that exploit their popularity the way you said above (bitches and hoes), and there are going to be genuine artists. My roomate forced me to listen to one of his favorite hip-hop groups last weekend. Their entire album was freestyle, but I didn't hear anything about "bling", "ho's" or cars. He was a genuine artist more interested in the realities of life than hip hop fame, which is what it boils down to for every genre.

  10. Re:Stupid by justkarl · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This story is the product of what we in the journalism industry call a "slow news day".

    But seriously, what I think the article is hinting towards(although masks it through mountains of hype) is that there is a lot of undiscovered talent in the world - across industries. These people are like the underdogs now, but with help from middle to upper management, can bring their new ideas to life.
    So let's not jump to conclusions about who is and isn't going to shape society, hmm?

  11. Amateur do have some edge by ancice · · Score: 4, Interesting
    An edge which an amateur has is that he/she is not ingrained with the "standard" -techniques, -thoughts and -perspectives. This nonstandard way of thinking is by definition "unique". And more often than not, a quantum leap in any field is done from a different viewpoint.

    But of course, amateurs do at times spawn some totally unfeasible and fairy-tale like ideas.

  12. The miracle of deflation. by G4from128k · · Score: 5, Interesting

    That amateurs can contribute is, in large part, due to the steady price deflation of equipment, especially equipment based on semiconductors. Declines in the cost of a near-studio quality audio rig, software engineering workstation, or a good quality CCD astrophotography camera make these tools accessible. Low cost chips that enable the networking of the amateurs (remember when 2400 baud dial-up was charged by the minute?) so they can work together.

    Thank You Gordon Moore!

    --
    Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
  13. Re:Corps will continue to rule, people are sheep.. by gosand · · Score: 4, Interesting
    Rap, for one, started as do-it-yourself music among lower-income black men from distressed urban neighborhoods, recorded by artists on inexpensive equipment and distributed on handmade tapes by local labels.

    And it has now become the same money-hungry scheme that the rest of music is. Silver teeth, 80 gram bling, expensive cars, big houses, hoes, problems with the law, etc. I dont see the difference between rap stars and more traditional music. I give this one 0/100.

    I was just thinking about this yesterday, when I didn't recognize 1 of the top 5 songs in the country. A radio show was listing them and playing clips, and I knew a couple of the names, but the songs didn't ring a bell. I thought they were all terrible, and I happen to like nearly all kinds of music including rap.

    But here is my take on rap - it is in its "disco era". Think about it - Rock and Roll had its roots in the 50s. The 60s were rebellion, and what some consider to be the heart of rock music. The 70s started to slide, we then got Disco. The 80s was an attempt to rebound from that, and alternative music was born.

    Rap has its roots in the early 80s. I would call the late 80s/early 90s the "60s" of rap. It really showed that it wasn't going away and made a mark on the world. But I think that we are now in the Disco age of rap, where it is all just posing and people trying to cash in. For the most part, the art and creativity is out the window. I just wonder what the "80s" of rap will bring.

    But you cannot discount rap any longer. It truly comes from the grassroots and I think fits the intent of this article. Now the STATE of rap is questionable, but I don't think you can question its legitimacy and power.

    --

    My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.

  14. Article is way off base... such as... by Rahga · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "Rap, for one, started as do-it-yourself music among lower-income black men from distressed urban neighborhoods, recorded by artists on inexpensive equipment and distributed on handmade tapes by local labels. Yet within two decades, rap has become the dominant popular music across the world."

    Two decades ago... when Run DMC "walk this way" with Aerosmith, right? Can't get much more amateur than that.

    Rap? "... the dominant popular music across the world." I don't think so. Maybe if you include the various ins-and-outs of hip-hop and pop-hop, you get closer... but still, I wouldn't call it dominant.

    "Likewise, according to one estimate, 90% of the content in The Sims is created by a Pro-Am sector of The Sims ' playing community."

    I'd guess at least 90% of the worlds video games are created by amateurs. Doesn't mean that they have 90% of the audience, not by a long shot.

    It doesn't help that the article's author is a one trick pony... For months, years, whatever, Charles Leadbeater has been doing this "Amareur Revolution" crying, just check google. I'm not sure what would make this article stand out.

  15. Make every vote count. by Colin+Smith · · Score: 4, Insightful

    "People just don't care enough about politics and social entrepeneurship."

    I think you'll find that's because their voices are unheard. In America, in Britain, your vote doesn't count. Turnout and engagement is correspondingly low.

    If you take a look at the democracies of Europe however, people are far more engaged in politics and the turnouts during elections are on average far higher than the US or UK. That's because their voice can be heard, every vote counts...

    The difference is proportional representation:

    http://www.mtholyoke.edu/acad/polit/damy/Beginnn in gReading/howprwor.htm

    --
    Deleted
    1. Re:Make every vote count. by arudloff · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Your vote doesn't count? The last election was decided by hundreds of votes.

      Say what you will about the electoral college or even make the argument in regards to florida (but of course, we can't have digital voting machines to increase accuracy, thats to insecure!... sigh. pick a side..). Just remember that these are not mainstream issues in the rest of our government and those elections are just as important.

      Don't like the sitting president? Don't wait four years and sit around bitching. Get off your ass and vote accordingly for your congressional races. Republicans swept up two years ago while all the dems sat at home and whined about what was going on. Their votes mattered then, it matters this November, and in two years, those votes will still be important.

      You think after Clinton we would have learned.. the best presidents are presidents who are gridlocked by an opposing congress ;) (I say that in jest, but in my short lifetime it does seem to hold a bit of water).

      All that being said, I don't care who you vote for or what you base your vote on. Majority (of the union as a whole, not just the cities) rules. Get out and vote.

  16. This is pretty much 100% bullshit by RLiegh · · Score: 5, Insightful

    In much the same way that over-paying 20-something year old ameteur html coders did not create a "new economy" so this too will fizzle.

    Most notably, Rap has not been an ameteur medium since the time when public enemy became big and the labels decided to push it. Unless you are an affancido (sp?) of Rap, none of the people you have heard of are 'ameteurs' except in the artifically created sense that eminem, vanilla ice, the village people and the monkees are 'ameteurs'. Rap has been a slick, professional and tightly-controlled form of expression for almost two fucking decades now.

    Mod me flamebait if you like, but as someone who's lived through the "grunge", the "alternative" and the "internet" revolutions this -to me- stinks to high heaven of yet more masturbatory and self-congratulatory hot air.

    Which is appropriate, as the "revolution" being touted signifies nothing.

  17. Technology is negating corporate money by Cryofan · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Many of these people are not really amateurs. Some of them are making a living at these pursuits, although admittedly not as good a living as the so-called professionals.

    What is happening is that cheap technology is negating the advantage that Big Corporate Money gives to corporations or to business people who have some serious capital, either personal monies or loaned monies.

    I cannot overstate how great this makes me feel or how important it is.

    I see much of human interaction in the economic marketplace, in the world of employment and jobs and commerce, as akin to interactions in animal society, especially the way that social animals interact, and in animal sibling interactions.

    In America, at least, it all comes to nature, red of tooth and claw.

    What happens is that the more powerful entities use current advantage, monetary advantage, to snuff out competition, and then, ironically, they call it the "free market."

    You see many examples of this: one young male in the lion pride was get bigger than the others, and use that advantage to drive off the other males, and then mate with the females.

    But cheap technology is like some sort of vitamin supplement that evens up the competitors.

    --
    eat shiat and bark at the moon
  18. diff amateur and professional by Vague+but+True · · Score: 4, Insightful
    Here's what I've been told the difference between a "professional" and an "amateur" is.

    A professional does the job, even when they don't want to do. An amateur does it whenever they feel like it.

    Being a professional doesn't mean you're any good at it (e.g. look at all the "professionals" in our fields (IT/Med/Law/Bus/etc) that have degrees, yet they're as dumb as a box-of-rocks).

    Getting paid to be a professional is strictly a bonus.

    --

    I'm not a doctor, but I play one in bed.

  19. I agree! by aasania · · Score: 5, Funny

    I've always thought amateur porn was WAY better than the professional stuff!

  20. News for nerds by mrogers · · Score: 4, Funny

    So you're saying that corporate stuctures somehow ruin productivity, stifle innovation and creativity, and turn the skills you once loved into the job you dread from the first moment you wake up in the morning? It's news to me but OK, if you say so...

  21. other amateurs in history by phyruxus · · Score: 4, Insightful
    The Wright brothers were bicycle enthusiasts who turned to flight research. The UCLA IMP team (designers of the protean "switch") expected to be replaced by "the real experts" any day, only to discover there were none but themselves. The fathers of the American revolution were educated, but I don't think it'd be appropriate to call them "professional revolutionists". Steve Jobs was a Homebrew Computer Club member - so was Steve Wozniak.

    Charles Lindbergh was a mail pilot before he made the first flight ever across the atlantic (L.I. to Paris).

    All the original "elite hackers" of the early information age were total amateurs.

    Every "professional" was once an amateur. Our culture has come to identify a slick suit, fancy title and wad of cash with skill and ability. Being a "pro" means you have proven yourself to the mainstream, maybe that you were a better amateur than some others, maybe that you were in the right place at the right time. Years of experience are good, yes. So is imagination, fresh perspective, and untapped potential.

    A point? uh... (digs furiously) uh...raincheck?

    --
    "A witty saying proves nothing." ~Voltaire
    "d'Oh!" ~Homer
  22. Re:Stupid by jest3r · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The "amateur revolution" is hardly new ... in fact a brief look back at most pop culture / technology revolutions would reveal that those responsible were barely out of highschool / college.

    The article talks about Rap music ... when in general almost all popular music comes from artists in their late teens.

    The article talks about Linux ... when in fact the top operating systems today have their roots in college dropouts / 20 somethings who you would hardly call experts.

    The article talks about games. How old was John Carmak when he build his first 3D gaming engine?

    Fresh ideas coming from "amateurs" is the norm ...

  23. Not news in astronomy by kakapo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Amateur astronomers have always had a big impact, there is nothing new going on here. Many comets are found by amateurs, as (until recently, when the process was automated) were many extra-galactic supernovae. Likewise, many amateurs have devoted a great deal of time to monitoring variable stars.

    In many cases, these observations are not done by professionals because the return on each *individual* observation is small, and they could not justify the time. But there is singificant synergy, since a researcher interested in (say) variable stars has access to many different light curves from each star thanks to the work of amateurs.

    The technology used by amatuers has improved, with cheap CCDs and computers -- but the same technology has also made professional instruments much more effective than they were in the days of photographic plates and clockwork drives.

    To my mind (as a theoretical physicist who started out as an amateur astronomer in junior high) an analagous activity is bird watching: professional ornithologists use a huge amount of use of data gathered by amateur "birders", who are often exceptionally knowledgeable about the species they look at, and who gather data from a love of observing the natural world. But this is not high tech, so Fast Company didn't see it.

  24. AdidasNet by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Rap music wasn't promoted by "Pro-Ams -- committed, networked amateurs" unless you mean sneakerNet. Decidedly low-tech, ghetto kids invented rap with turntables from garbage cans, because they couldn't afford any instruments, and no one in the Bronx was throwing away guitars. They couldn't even get on the radio for years, so playgrounds and cassette tapes were their medium. By the time even analog FM radio started playing them, they were already a cultural institution, which radio and video networks (like MTV and ClearChannel) have largely destroyed, transforming cool smartass party kids into glossy spokesmodels product for global consumer brands. Some "rap" is still bubbling underground, with its original spirit, riding both social and digital networks.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

  25. Article is worthless by tin+foil+hat+dude · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What the stories author failed to understand is that these Pro-Ams have always been around, its just that now the author is an adult and has opportunities to join adult organizations.

    Take for instance Ham radio operators, one of the more interesting things to do is joining huge worldwide networks to "pass traffic" (messages) from place to place. MARS, the Military Affiliate Radio System is Amateurs used to pass personal messages from military personnel to their families back in the US. This still is used but has really fallen by the wayside with cell phones and e-mail and the like.

    Starting in the 60's Ham radio operators launched a series of satellites constructed by unpaid amateurs (www.amsat.org) AMSAT-OSCAR 7, launched in 1974 still being listed as semi-operational. These amateurs have since 1961 launched a series of 50 other satellites.

    Amateurs and groups of amateurs a century ago in the 1910's fostered a world wide revolution called the aeroplane. Some of their groups like the Aviator Club in France still exist.

    Voulunteer organizations run by people that I guarantee look at the organization in a professional light are nothing new. Fraternal organizations like Elks or KOC or OddFellows, or any of a thousand others (http://www.exonumia.com/art/society.htm) all have declining and aging memberships. This is not because people are not doing the same kind of joining or voulunteering, Its just that instead of putting on the goofy hat and going to the lodge on friday night, everyone is putting on the goofy hat and joing the rest of their StarCraft clan on-line on friday night.

    Even the authors own point that some of these Pro-Ams are astronomers is foolish. Perhaps 99 percent of all astronomers EVER have been amateurs, and many comets have been discovered over the past 100 years by amateurs or groups of amateurs. Are these amateurs working any less professionally than somone being paid for the work?

    There are millions of small groups of unpaid amateurs producing research and journals and inventions and discoveries. To think that there is anything unique or new about this is just plan wrong. The author of the article has made the fatal error that many young people make of believing that they have discovered some truism of the human condition that their and only their generation has come up with, and that anything more than 20 years old is worthless. Perhaps the author should remember how his own industry came to be and remember that no one got paid to run the Homebrew Computer Club.

    --
    Reality is all that stuff that doesn't care if you believe in it or not.--Solomon Short