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Intelligent Transportation Systems

An anonymous reader sends us a link to this story about the U.S. Department of Transportation working on Intelligent Transportation Systems, a long-range plan to build various sorts of intelligence into the national road system. Likely this will result in better traffic monitoring, lots of traffic planning data to analyze to help prevent traffic jams, and less privacy for everyone. The article has a paranoid bent; although they're not wrong that the system will likely facilitate privacy abuses, I wish the author had been a bit more hopeful about possible system designs that would still help alleviate traffic problems without enabling snooping, because obviously such a system could be built if the political will was present to do so.

24 of 233 comments (clear)

  1. Gotta take the bad with the good sometimes... by LostCluster · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Right now, "smart cars" that can drive themselves are confined to specially-designed test tracks because they're basically stuck operating in a vacuum of information... if cars and roads were able to communicate with each other, we'd be halfway there to having the car take over the highway driving of itself.

    Imagine stopping your car at the stop line on the way to the major highway, and simply inputing into the car that you'd like to be dropped off at exit 32A, and then relaxing as the car waits for a suitable break in the traffic flow to bring the car into the stream, and then at a rapid speed taking you to the exit while you're free to read a newspaper.

    Of course, the Minority Report scene where once your car is told to take you to the police, that's exactly what it'll do would become possible. However, if the police ever do have a warrant to arrest somebody wouldn't we want technology to tell the police where to find the person whenever possible? Afteral, warrants aren't random things, some judge has already seen enough proof of something illegal happening to warrant bringing the person in.

    1. Re:Gotta take the bad with the good sometimes... by Stile+65 · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Sure, until some script kiddie breaks into the car of the 'h0t b4b3x0r' two blocks over and has it deliver her to some place where he and his greasy-faced little friends can do what they want with her.

      I like this idea already!

      --
      I claim first use of "Error No. 0B" - or "No. 0B error." It'll be the new ID 10T!
    2. Re:Gotta take the bad with the good sometimes... by justMichael · · Score: 4, Insightful
      ...and then relaxing as the car waits for a suitable break in the traffic flow to bring the car into the stream...
      One of the best parts of this system, you don't need to wait for a spot to merge, the system will make an openeing for you to merge into.

      No more people on the freeway that don't understand that if you merge as a zipper, traffic continues to flow smoothly.

      -- Sex Toys...
    3. Re:Gotta take the bad with the good sometimes... by chill · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The problem isn't with when the police have a warrant, it is when they DON'T have one.

      You know, like with the boxes attached to cell phone trunk points that allow the FBI to record any phone call. SUPPOSEDLY they need a warrant, but I've had several telco CO techs tell me there is no method for checking that. The FBI guy shows up, punches in numbers to his black box and they pick up the tape later. No one checks.

      Even if they asked for a warrant, they aren't qualified to tell if one is fake or not. Hell, a Japanese language insurance form may do the trick.

      -Charles

      --
      Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
    4. Re:Gotta take the bad with the good sometimes... by serutan · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Instead of a highway that communicates with the car, which would mean the car could only auto-drive on intelligent highways, I would rather put the money into making the cars smart enough to drive anywhere and let the roads be dumb.

      This goes along with the idea of making wheelchairs that can walk up and down stairs, and giving them out to handicapped people, rather than building freaking ramps everywhere.

    5. Re:Gotta take the bad with the good sometimes... by justMichael · · Score: 3, Insightful
      If the lane bein merged into is already "full" (the spacing between the cars is the minimum safe spacing for the current speed) any additional cars entering the lane will result in a slowdown no matter how you merge them in.
      True, but if the flow is controlled by the system and not humans doing stupid things, it can make sure that lane is never "full" by utilizing the other lanes.

      I'm not saying it would always move at max speed, but it would flow much smoother.

      If you have ever seen what a freeway looks like from altitude it starts to make sense. I have seen the 405 in West L.A. from one of the near high rises and it moves a lot like an inch worm. Mostly because of the people making irratic lane changes and refusing to leave room for a car to merge into.

      -- Sex Toys...
    6. Re:Gotta take the bad with the good sometimes... by rainer_d · · Score: 3, Interesting

      > So what are you worried about? Evidence
      > collected without a warrant is inadmissible in a
      > court case.

      Yeah. But what if there is no court ?

      http://www.cato.org/dailys/08-21-03.html

      http://web.amnesty.org/report2004/usa-summary-en g

      "What worth is a phonecall Mr. Anderson, if you cannot speak"

      Rainer

      --
      Windows 2000 - from the guys who brought us edlin
  2. White House by MikeMacK · · Score: 3, Funny
    a shadowy government agency that doesn't respond to public inquiries about its activities is coordinating a plan to use monitoring devices to catalogue the movements of every American driver

    The White House?

  3. Total privacy ends at your doorstep... by LostCluster · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Remember, your right to total privacy ends the moment you step out of the house. Your car already bears a linkable-to-its-owner token in teh form of a license plate. Many of us has willingly added another intentifying device in the form of an electronic toll payer such as EZ-Pass.

    1. Re:Total privacy ends at your doorstep... by SydShamino · · Score: 4, Insightful

      /again...

      You don't get to be "private" in public, per se, but I do feel it is important that you be able to be "anonymous" in many cases.

      "So, how can you be anonymous when you have a license plate?" you might ask.

      Simple, there are 300 million people in the country and, at any given time, no one -cares- to read your plate and track where you are. If you commit a crime, or if someone with a similar car committed a crime, then sure, a police officer might see your car and check your plates. But, if they don't match, the officer will move on. The event is eventually forgotten and there is no "proof" that the event ever happened.

      Cameras that record (or, in this case, machines that monitor your location electronically) change that. 25 years from now, someone can go back to a camera (computer checkpoint) and see who passed in front of it last night. This where anonymity is lost.

      Let's assume you buy pr0n from a shop. Your license plate is visible to all who care to look, but again, -no one cares-. Now add a "911 cam" with a tape recorder, and, at a later date or with the use of more computers, the names of every person who ever visited the store can be retrieved. There goes your political career.

      Let's assume you go to church. Again, outside of the church itself -no one cares-. But, add a camera, and the government knows everyone who visted a certain mosque, ever. Or, they know everyone who attended mass last weekend.

      In summary, yes, if there is reason to care, the government can already track you in public. But this takes the efforts of a human, which means it is rare, costly, and, most importantly, not permanent. Eliminate human involvement from the monitoring and it becomes routine, pervasive, and, worst of all, permanent.

      ------------

      One last thing:

      >> Many of us has willingly added another intentifying device in the form of an electronic toll payer such as EZ-Pass.

      Suppose there was a freeway exit in your town. The only thing at that exit was a pr0n shop. Would you use the EZ-Pass to pay the toll at that exit? Do you think everyone in the country would? Or would you prefer to pay cash for that spot?

      --
      It doesn't hurt to be nice.
  4. Unintelligent Idiot Systems by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

    see also: Slashdot

  5. It will never work, because... by Sheetrock · · Score: 5, Insightful
    People are behind the wheel, and people drive like idiots.

    In the ideal traffic network, everybody would drive at approximately the same speed with a fair cushion of space between each car and faster traffic in the left lane. That careful balance is destroyed with the first SUV driver that's constantly swerving from lane to lane trying to get an extra five or six seconds cut off the trip (not to mention that these large vehicles generally clog the road even when driven normally.)

    To improve traffic, we need to continue putting the emphasis on low-fuel consumption and on quality mass-transit. At least until we get robotic cars that operate according to some sort of centralized traffic planner.

    --

    Try not. Do or do not, there is no try.
    -- Dr. Spock, stardate 2822-3.




  6. Seattle has some smart freeways... by funny-jack · · Score: 3, Informative

    Anyone who lives in the Seattle area and doesn't check the traffic conditions before they hit the freeways is missing out.

    It's a nice system, and they're constantly (although slowly) expanding it.

    --
    You probably shouldn't click this.
  7. What about older cars? by TuxMelvin · · Score: 3, Interesting

    How do they enforce this among drivers of older cars? What if I drive a 67 Mustang, or a 89 Grand Am? My car was made in 1995, and I love it... I'll drive it until it's undrivable. What do they do with me?

    Do they force me to buy a new car? What if I can't afford it? Do they force me to install this equipment on my car? Perhaps it might communicate with the onboard computer, but this doesn't solve the problems of older cars without one.

    I'm not really worried about people tracking my every move, to be honest. I'm mostly worried about the government tracking how fast I'm going. Most people don't really care about privacy issues, but people aren't going to buy new cars if they tattle on you every time you do 75 on the Interstate.

  8. Just better traffic lights please... by Chris+Carollo · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Personally I'd be happy with traffic lights that were just a little bit smarter. Like:

    1. Not turning yellow when there is ONE more car remaining to make a left turn.
    2. Trying to prevent cars from waiting multiple cycles in general.
    3. Doing very short green lights when there are only a few cars waiting.
    4. Adjusting timing based on time-of-day and traffic patterns.

    There have been attempts to "smarten up" lights here in Austin, but half the time they just end up misreading the situation and doing something wacky like giving a special left turn green for 30 seconds when there's no one waiting to turn left. Couple that with some of the nation's longest red lights, and you get one of the nation's highest rates of red lights being run.

    Even a good web-based feedback mechanism where the public can point out poorly timed lights would be a huge benefit.

  9. Mobility is important for economic well being by G4from128k · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Imagine a world in which employers could only hire people within walking distance of the company. The quality of the workforce would go down and many people would be stuck in jobs that suck. Imagine a world in which the only goods you could buy were those found at tiny neghborhood shops within walking distance. The selection and pricing would suck.

    The farther people can comfortably commute to work, the better the match between employer and employee. The farther people can comfortable travel to find goods and services, the better the selection and economies of scale. Current transportation systems (cars, buses, etc.) let people travel greater distances, but introduce stresses and uncertainties (traffic jams). If Intelligent Transportation System can increase the average speed of travel or reduce the uncertainties in travel times, people will enjoy less stress in life, find better jobs and find better goods and services.

    --
    Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
  10. Right to Privacy? by erick99 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Sometimes I feel like the Right to Privacy groups infringe on my right to enjoy and take advantage of some truly incredible technology. If we can put together an intellingent roadway system that saves most of the 42,000 deaths a year, I am all for it. I am not trying to flame the discussion and I truly do understand the issues at hand. However, some of this technology is pretty good and we should consider, thoughtfully, the advantages before stomping the life out of it.

    --
    http://www.busyweather.com/
  11. What a waste of money by Rosco+P.+Coltrane · · Score: 5, Insightful

    U.S. Department of Transportation working on Intelligent Transportation Systems, a long-range plan to build various sorts of intelligence into the national road system.

    Translation for the car industry lobby-unaware:

    Many roads are filled to capacity. Most people don't have the physical ability to react quickly enough if they were asked to drive closer to each other, to cram more cars per mile and more car passages per hour. As a result, we auto-makers have lobbied the powers that be to start a program to develop a system to take away control of their vehicles from their human owners/drivers and into the hands of the car computers, or the USDOT's central computer.

    Of course, this will be ruinously expensive both to the government, to equip thousands of miles of thoroughfare with computer trackers (or whatever it'll be) and to the consumer, to equip their new "auto-autos" with the right tech wizardry, not to mention new raised roadtaxes etc... BUT BUT... we get to manufacture more cars, which means keeping jobs in the US and keeping the economy going (yeah, right...) and, more importantly, keeping the cash flow in our auto industry CEOs going.

    Hint: cars that drive very very close to each other, and follow a road to a tee, and consume very little compared to today's automobiles, and don't need a parking spot, and bring you right into most major cities, already exist: they're called a train, and they've been around forever.

    Europe, and most of the world proves that moving people by train is convenient, ubiquitous, and quite livable. The United States proves that lobbying from powerful industries can kill viable, more sustainable transportation solutions very effectively.

    --
    "A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
  12. What of motorcycles? by Shivetya · · Score: 4, Interesting

    One thing that worries me, as a motorcycle rider, is where do we figure in? Are we lost in a world where a few seem hell bent on control at any cost?

    Granted riding on the slab isn't my ideal way of point A to point B but I have to question, just how many roads will I lose access to if "controlled" becomes the norm? (slab = interstate)

    I can deal with items like EZ-PASS and the like. I already have access to HOV lanes, regardless of the logic of it. I am just curious where bikes fit in.

    --
    * Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
  13. This article is bull by smitty45 · · Score: 3, Informative

    At least, about how the DOT does ITS research in some sort of vaccuum.

    The research that has been going into ITS has been happening for years, and it's been going on in the same building as the rest of the DOT agencies research projects.

    I know, because I worked there.

    There are a LOT of things that the US government does with respect to transportation safety and efficiency, and no one pays attention to it. The fact is, the USDOT has been doing excellent research on a lot of topics that takes the (at least US) auto manufacturers *YEARS* to adopt or evaluate. Because it's like this:

    NHSTA and Federal Highway come up with very smart ideas and research. State budgets and car manufacturers fight these good ideas, tooth and nail, because they cost money.

    Lee Iacocca and Chrysler didn't come up with airbags, the USDOT did, years before.

  14. Re:Ok by mikvo · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's got to be one of the most paranoid articles I have read in a while. I work for my state Department of Transportation in the Intelligent Transportation Systems (ITS) division. And yes, there is a national architecture. Virtually every state has a state or regional architecture based on the national architecture. And while there may be those who have thought of the "snooping" potential, that certainly isn't the goal. You claim there is no public pressure for it. Well, there is a constant stream of complaints about the traffic conditions and weaknesses in the transportation system. ITS is an attemt to improve that and respond to the growing demand to improve our nation's roadways. The use of ITS technologies has a significant impact on increasing the capacity of existing roads, and reducing accidents. Hundreds of thousands of dollars, and dozens of lives are saved annually through the use of technology on the roadways in my city alone. Not to mention the reduction in polution and saving travelers like yourself time by keeping the traffic flowing. This isn't some clandestine attempt by the government to find out whether you've had your windshield repaired lately. Extreme care is taken to ensure that these systems are not used to identify and monitor individuals. Let's face it: technology is becoming an increasingly central part of our lives. It isn't going away. Let's not fight it. But let's work together to ensure that it is used responsibly and effectively.

  15. Woo woo - Personal Rapid Transit by Colin+Smith · · Score: 3, Informative

    Could be put in place today. Basically it's information theory applied to mass transit systems. It's the only public transport system which promises to ammeliorate traffic congestion on the roads at a remotely reasonable cost, though it isn't going to completely replace the car. The traditional mass transit systems are massively expensive, inefficient and inconvenient in comparison.

    Read up on it:
    http://www.gettherefast.org/
    http://www.cprt .org/
    http://faculty.washington.edu/~jbs/itrans/P RT/
    http://www.acprt.org/

    American PRT system:
    http://www.skywebexpress.com/

    UK PRT system:
    http://www.atsltd.co.uk/

    --
    Deleted
  16. ITS has many applications by SirWhoopass · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The problem with a train is that you need high population desnity along that route. This isn't all that common in the US, which is sparsely populated compared to much of the world.

    ITS applies to rural areas too. I work for the ITS Institute at the University of Minnesota. It's not like ITS is a new thing. It's been around for more than a decade. There is a too.

    An example of rural ITS work is driver assistance technologies (like heads-up-display) for snowplows and emergency vehicles (police, ambulance). Driving across a rural farm road in a blizzard can be quite difficult. We developed a HUD system that projected an image of the road, based on DGPS location information.

    I'd like to add that I'm not against trains or mass transit. Certain areas of the US can utilize trains effectively, many already do. Personally, I think trains are great for urban areas. In Minnesota, we've finally opened our first urban rail line since the street cars disappeared 50+ years ago. It has surpassed all expectations for passenger levels. Now the people who claimed it would never have been used now claim that the expectations were artifically low. It isn't just the "car lobby". There are people out there who actually fear mass transit as if it's a plot to take away their cars.

  17. They exist in other places too! by antdude · · Score: 3, Informative

    See my list of good traffic map sites:

    Traffic.tann.net/.
    Sigalert.com.
    Metrocommute.

    --
    Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).