Dell Teams Up With SUSE

good news by dns_server · 2004-10-29 00:07 · Score: 5, Interesting

things are starting to look good for linux, we now have a veriety of different companys that are starting to support linux. hopefully this will mean drivers will be better supported (atleast for the hardware provided).

Re:good news by Methuseus · 2004-10-29 01:14 · Score: 4, Interesting

I actually have a couple dells, 6 and 8 years old, still running on all the original hardware. They may be pretty slow compared to newer computers, but they still run. Now, a Dell from 2-3 years ago is probably not running anymore unless the person got the extended warranty, since Dell's quality went to shit in the past 4 years.

I agree that I largely hate Dell machines, but when you get them free you generally don't argue. I also hate most other machines, but lately Gateway and eMachines have had good quality. The only problems I've seen with *them* in the past 2 years have been user error. You are correct about NEC and IBM being probably the most stable prefabs, however.

You also don't tell us how old you are, just that you have been building computers since you were 11. You could be 13 now for all we know. (at least for what the average user knows)

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Re:good news by BlackHawk-666 · 2004-10-29 02:40 · Score: 4, Interesting

I used to work for a company that supplied Dell servers for the web sites we created. We had maybe 20 of these machines, and at least five of them had major issues in the first few years. One broke down so many times that eventually every single part of it had been replaced several times except the case, which I was threatening to smash in order to force them to replace this awful machine. And yeh, it was a critical production machine.
When I got a new workstation from Dell it took them 56 days to get a working one delivered to me after I told them the one they first delivered was broken. That's two fucking months!!! The reason it was broken, for the curious, is because they put the heatsink on top of the CPU but didn't strap it into place, so it wasn't doing any heat sinking at all.
I'm sure there are people out there who haven't had trouble with Dell, but for me it's always going to be a reputable company like IBM or HP in future, Dell is cheap (but costly) rubbish.

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Re:good news by Scumbumbo · 2004-10-29 02:57 · Score: 5, Interesting

Dell's hardware (at least on the server side) has always been well supported in Linux thanks to their work with Red Hat. I'm hoping this latest move makes their management utilities work better with SuSE.

A few months back I mentioned to our Sr. Dell rep that I wished they supported SuSE (preferably by releasing tarballed sources) with their management utilities. The "Red Hat only" afacli RAID management RPM installs and runs great on SuSE, but installing the other management stuff (specifically for the DRAC management) is a pain in the arse. She seemed really interested in my comment and kept asking me questions regarding my experiences with SuSE on Dell. Makes me wonder if she either knew something was coming down the pipe or if she was actually high-level enough at Dell to be one of the instigators of this.
Re:good news by Gherald · 2004-10-29 04:10 · Score: 3, Informative

> I remember similar statements back then on comp.os.linux.advocacy and they've turned out to be just as false when it comes to fortelling Linux's future. I've come to accept Linux will never be anything more than a fringe operating system, but there's nothing wrong with that. Hell, MacOS is a fringe operating system compared to the numbers Windows has yet MacOS X is one of the nicest systems I've ever used.

So the progress Linux is making is slower than it's advocates and fanboys would like, but this does in no way imply no progress has been made, or is unlikely to happen in the future. I believe your use of the word "never" is an equally unfounded exageration. The server market is still growing, the desktop market is growing, and upcoming OSS software like OpenOffice 2.0 and Firefox 1.0 will only help to further our cause.

The 2.6 branch is becomming more production ready, as well. I'm running 2.6.9 on Gentoo and much more satisfied than I was with, say, 2.6.5

As for MacOS X, clearly it will allways be a fringe operating system simply because ppc and ppc64 are fringe architectures. The Linux kernel has no such limitations... quite the opposite, in fact.

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The unofficial /. digest

Future partnerships... by jmcmunn · 2004-10-29 00:08 · Score: 4, Interesting

If we keep seeing these types of partnerships, perhaps more PC manufacturers will jump on board and start shipping Linux PC's as well. Even if it is just a Linux Live CD for someone to play with, at least then they can get their feet wet.

Re:Future partnerships... by treval · 2004-10-29 00:14 · Score: 5, Insightful

It may be just me but I think that Redhat has totally lost the plot since they stopped producing a desktop distribution.

Suse certainly seem to be gaining ground quickly and I think one of the main reasons may be the complete range of products from Suse Personal through to Enterprise and without the restrictive licencing that RH have tried to impose.

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Your attitude is infectious...
Re:Future partnerships... by RAMMS+EIN · 2004-10-29 00:27 · Score: 3, Insightful

Perhaps it's just that Red Hat realized that one size fits all solutions aren't. They then chose to specialize on the enterprise. Not that odd; after all, that's where the money is. Now they can boast all their years of experience, plus their dedication to enterprise needs - something I think few if any other distributors can claim.

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Please correct me if I got my facts wrong.
Re:Future partnerships... by treval · 2004-10-29 00:31 · Score: 5, Insightful

You are probably right however the real volume market is on the desktop. The desktop is what drives the user applications and it's user apps sold in bulk that generate major revenues.

Just ask Billy G...

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Your attitude is infectious...
Re:Future partnerships... by FatherOfONe · 2004-10-29 00:55 · Score: 3, Insightful

The point I think your are missing is that kids who use to get RedHat to try it out and play with it will no longer do that. What they could do is get RedHat for near free and then get comfortable with it. Now they have to try Fedora. Most won't.

So someone can get SuSe for near free (box version) and then try it out. Then they can use an enterprise version when they need it in a business.

My only issue is that companies like Oracle and IBM are trying to make it impossible to load their software on anything but the enterprise versions of software. This will come back to haunt them. Those same new "developers" will just use other tools (i.e. PostGresql, MySql, Jboss etc), instead of Oracle or Websphere. IBM should have learned this with their mistake of smalltalk.

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The more I learn about science, the more my faith in God increases.

Windows XP? by darkmeridian · 2004-10-29 00:09 · Score: 5, Insightful

I'm sorry, but why does the top of that article say, "Dell recommends Windows XP Professional"?

What kind of mixed messages are they sending there?

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Re:Windows XP? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-29 00:18 · Score: 3, Interesting

I think Microsoft pay/threaten/reward (delete according to bias) system builders to say that, a lot of ads contain the same phrasing with different manufacturers pasted in.

So it's probablary just part of a standard page template, and not some conspiracy on Dell's part to confuse customers.
Re:Windows XP? by Anonymous Coward · 2004-10-29 00:22 · Score: 3, Interesting

Well it means:

Dell is paid by Microsoft to recommend it's OS. ("$COMPNAME recommends Windows XP" is so generic it can't be a accident, it's marketting.)

Dell supports Linux because that's what it's customer wants.
Re:Windows XP? by I+confirm+I'm+not+a · 2004-10-29 00:33 · Score: 5, Interesting

It's an ad that's always amused me: Dell recommendsWindows XP Professional, but supplies Windows XP Home (unless you choose to "upgrade").

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This is where the serious fun begins.

But! by koi88 · 2004-10-29 00:10 · Score: 4, Funny

But don't they know the TCO of Windows is much lower than Linux' TCO?
The customers don't want Linux. And it's unsafe. Only hippies would use it. Dammit.
Guess I have to send over Stevie B...

Bill G.

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I don't need a signature.

mirrordot link and content by buro9 · 2004-10-29 00:12 · Score: 4, Informative

I hate karma-whoring, but then I couldn't get to the Dell blog... so here's the mirrordot link: http://mirrordot.org/stories/086e42b3190e9dadcda31 da9fcc5515e/index.html

Don't worry about the text, they merely point here: http://www1.us.dell.com/content/topics/global.aspx /corp/pressoffice/en/2004/2004_10_27_rrwa_000

Which is mirrored here: http://mirrordot.org/stories/c6067beb11e039d913a6d cb073ee1d71/index.html

I wonder by Moby+Cock · 2004-10-29 00:12 · Score: 4, Interesting

I could not RTFA, the thing is /.ed already. However, I wonder if the move with SuSE is an attempt to move into some bigger European markets. SuSE is the de facto linux standard over there (as opposed to RHEL in NA) and I wonder if Dell is trying to squeeze into some business operations on the continent.

What about workstations? by ZorinLynx · 2004-10-29 00:17 · Score: 3, Informative

Dell still charges the "Windows Tax" on all its workstations. Try ordering a Dimension series without Windows, for instance. Not possible! They only offer Linux on two particular models of workstation (Precision) which are expensive and are limited in what video cards you can purchase with them.

Dell only seems to want to support Linux on the server side. They should support Linux all the way! If they don't want to offer it pre-installed on their workstations, they should at least offer a machine without Windows.

Argh!

-Z

how much tweaking... by gp310ad · 2004-10-29 00:23 · Score: 3, Interesting

What does it mean when Dell and Suse or IBM and ??? (RedHat?, Debian?, Knoppix?, all three and more?) deliver a server with 'certified' linux?

Has anyone bought one of these for work and taken a good look at the install?

I see the 'support' part, but do they:
1. compile kernel (./config options) for that particular box?
2. config all applications for that particular box?
3. more than '1' and '2'?

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Do not look into LASER with remaining eye!

Re:how much tweaking... by jimicus · 2004-10-29 00:58 · Score: 4, Interesting

What does it mean when Dell and Suse or IBM and ??? (RedHat?, Debian?, Knoppix?, all three and more?) deliver a server with 'certified' linux?

Has anyone bought one of these for work and taken a good look at the install?

Yes. My former employer was an IBM shop, had 250 Linux servers and around 1,200 desktops.

We bought servers without an operating system. Some (not all) models arrived in parts - disks, memory processors and rack-mounting kit were all shipped in separate boxes and you fitted them yourself. My understanding was "every bit of hardware here works under Linux".

Experience demonstrated that this was indeed the case, only you sometimes had to download kernel patches (which were generally open source, they just hadn't made it to the mainstream kernel).

I don't know whether or not the pre-built servers had these patches pre-installed - I'd imagine so.

SuSE on the Desktop, please ! by InodoroPereyra · 2004-10-29 00:27 · Score: 4, Interesting

I would bet that with the gaining momentum of Linux as a corporate/govenrment desktop environment, teaming up with SuSE could be a good idea for Dell. Not that RedHat is horrible unusable or anything, but SuSE is more polished and integrated for the end user, and they are in a position of offering top of the line KDE, GNOME or a combination of both.

The power of the US by peterprior · 2004-10-29 00:27 · Score: 4, Insightful

I'm not really suprised. Now that Novell has bought SUSE, they are dealing with a nice big US corporation which must be very familiar to them.

Before Novell bought them, SUSE was seen as this oddball German company who probably seemed a world apart from a US Corp like Dell.

Bad news for Red Hat... by Thaidog · 2004-10-29 00:33 · Score: 5, Interesting

Now that novell has bought SuSE, major fundage means major comp now for Red Hat. Personally I think SuSE is more user friendly than Red Hat is now... with YAST playing a major role in that. Easy to configure, even for an end user to get a basic server up and running or whatever else. I see this hittin the lowend workstation level big time as well since most of the hardware cerifications Red Hat has SuSE has too (too a point).

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||| I still can't believe Parkay's not butter.

Dell Laptops? by Manip · 2004-10-29 00:38 · Score: 4, Insightful

I love Dell, and I am pleased with this new deal (advancement of Linux is always good news). The question I really want answered is when will I be able to guy a laptop from Dell (or anyone else) with Linux pre-installed?

I just don't like the idea of paying £30 more for a copy of XP home or 2k which I will be removing and replacement with my fav distro .. Seems silly to me that so few DO offer a Linux alternative.

SuSE vs Red Hat by DrugCheese · 2004-10-29 00:40 · Score: 3, Interesting

I was always under the impression that SuSE was the most popular distro. I think they were the first to commercially distribute linux. While Red Hat as the most popular in the U.S. SuSe was the most popular world wide?

I've long thought SuSE to be far FAR superior to all other distros I've tried and have said over and over again that it can be used by a newbie to linux or a mission critical server application out of the same box.
In a couple years (or less the way SuSE is in the news more and more recently) people will agree that Red Hat is no longer the name when it comes to a great pre-packaged linux.

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*DrugCheese rants*

Dell was offering RedHat 3 years ago by vasqzr · 2004-10-29 00:40 · Score: 3, Interesting

What's this have to do with anything? It really doesn't mean anything.

Linux is EXPENSIVE from Dell. Most people are going to do what we did, buy Dell $329 servers, and install a downloaded version of (insert your favorite distribution)

Re:Dell was offering RedHat 3 years ago by mgoss · 2004-10-29 00:48 · Score: 3, Insightful

Linux is EXPENSIVE from Dell. Most people are going to do what we did, buy Dell $329 servers, and install a downloaded version of (insert your favorite distribution) Not everyone wants to download and install Linux themselves plus get it set up the way they need it to. I don't know how worth the money buying a SuSE linux box from Dell would be, but it could be worth it. I think the point is to make it easier for current Windows users to move over to a Linux box. I have seen a demo of the new SuSE and it looks pretty sweet. I definitely think this has a chance. Not everyone is a geek enough to be fine with downloading and installing Linux themselves so we get more stuff free more easily. I guess that's the price we "pay" for being Linux geeky.

Re:Old storie by B2382F29 · 2004-10-29 00:42 · Score: 4, Funny

Wait another 2 days and we have it again as a dupe on slashdot..

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Move Sig. For great justice.

No such thing as bad news. by numbski · 2004-10-29 00:42 · Score: 4, Insightful

I really think everyone is looking at this wrong.

There is no such thing as bad news when it comes to Linux distros being picked up, not even from a corporate point of view.

I get this a lot with wireless broadband. If a 'competitor' springs up across town and starts covering areas that I also service, if we cooperate, we'll both get more customers. If we in-fight, people will get the idea that wireless broadband is unreliable. When people work together, provide excellent service, everyone benefits. There's plenty of market terrain out there to be had, and no everyone needs to become a huge mega-comglomerate.

No one linux shop needs to become the next M$ or Apple. Sure, they could, but they don't need to in order to prosper. There's still plenty of Linux territory to be had. I'd say this is as good a news to Red Hat as any, so long as both RH and SuSE are commited to excellence.

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Karma: Chameleon (mostly due to the fact that you come and go).

Considering the limited.. by Tracer_Bullet82 · 2004-10-29 00:43 · Score: 3, Interesting

product options and the somewhat contradictory message in Dell's policy, this may not seem to be a significant step.

Dell however has the image of providing good support(at least in my neck of the woods)

Seeing that Dell can ofer and support for Linux;I'm presuming they will, this can show to the general public that (Dell considers) Linux is/as a viable option.

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Nonsense by YrWrstNtmr · 2004-10-29 00:47 · Score: 5, Informative

Try ordering a Dimension series without Windows, for instance. Not possible!

3 clicks
Dell|Small Business|Desktops
"Dell Alternative Operating System Desktops" is listed right there with the others. 'N Series' Dimension, Optiplex, or Precision. Either RH or no OS (FreeDOS in the box).

The Dimension N starts at $319

Ah, I think I get it. by RealProgrammer · 2004-10-29 00:55 · Score: 4, Funny

For $175 per single-CPU server annual maintenance subscription and $269 for a dual CPU subscription, Dell and Novell offer Linux customers additional choice on Dell's award-winning PowerEdge 1850, 2800 and 2850 servers.

I'm not sure understand the reasoning there. It'll cost Dell 54% more to support a dual-CPU box, is that it?

Oh, I see. Dual support desks, dual techs, dual phone bills (to India and Utah).

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sigs, as if you care.

SuSE might be the "enterprise" Linux? by TheLoneGundam · 2004-10-29 01:23 · Score: 3, Insightful

Since SuSE is the default distribution that IBM uses for their Linux on z/Series (or S/390) and this announcment is for Dell Servers, this might be another small step to getting in some corporate doors - start with some Dell Servers, then consolidate onto a mainframe box for lower (supposedly) TCO. We've been talking about Linux on our big iron, and if it was the same Linux as on the servers I know certain PHBs would have a warmer, fuzzier feeling.

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