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Microsoft Pays $536M to Novell

_mArk writes "This morning Novell announced that it had settled a potential law suit with Microsoft related to its NetWare product line. Microsoft agreed to pay $536 million to Novell, but this is not the end as there is another litigation against them pertaining to WordPerfect."

25 of 291 comments (clear)

  1. easy handout by Sv-Manowar · · Score: 5, Funny

    perhaps SCO went after the wrong people ?

  2. So Novell is going to let the EU case die? by Sikmaz · · Score: 5, Interesting

    "Finally, Novell has agreed to withdraw its intervention in the European Commission's case with Microsoft."

    1. Re:So Novell is going to let the EU case die? by bfree · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Personally I cannot believe this is legal. EU takes a case V MS and MS can pay off the prosecution witnesses. Is this not in itself evidence that it is an dominent abusive monopoly which will run wild without legal restraints, the exact thing "anti-trust" laws are for. Imagine you were a witness in a blackmail trial and you were called into an appeal, when asked to give evidence you say "sorry, but I made a deal with the defendant for loads of cash to not say anything so I'm withdrawing my statement". End result, you should presumably be tried to perverting the course of justice and/or the defendant tried for witness intimidation. For a business isn't the ultimate intimidation "if you don't do what we want we won't give you buckets of cash"?

      --

      Never underestimate the dark side of the Source

    2. Re:So Novell is going to let the EU case die? by aristus · · Score: 5, Insightful

      What's more, the 536M is about the size of the EU fine... so it's not really about the cash (what's a billion dollars to them?) it's about not letting *anyone*, any entity or government *anywhere*, tell them what to do.

      --
      Sometimes seventeen/Syllables aren't enough to/Express a complete
    3. Re:So Novell is going to let the EU case die? by danheskett · · Score: 4, Informative

      First off, this isn't a criminal case per se. MS is involved with the EU in a civil case - meaning no one is going to go to jail if the case goes one way or the other. Your choice of terms "prosectuion witness", etc do not jive with what the case is. The judicial world is more complex than a 40-minute episode of Law and Order let's on. What the EU is doing would be closer to investigation here. There isn't a big dramatic trial going on, or anything like that. This is a regulatory issue.

      Secondly, you say that "[MS should] be tried to perverting the course of justice". You assume that what they've done here is plainly illegal, when it's not. Filing a regulatory complaint against a competitor is a technique that is perhaps hundreds, if not a thousand years old. Commonly used for leverage, and to force settlements on other issues. Filing a complaint or statement should never cause a person - regardless of your opinion of the group being targetted - to assume guilt.

      Thirdly, you say "Imagine you were a witness in a blackmail trial and you were called into an appeal" . Again, your analogy displays a lack of understanding of what is going on. The EU hasn't tried MS. This isn't an appeal of a criminal or civil conviction, but rather, a regulatory setting where the word "appeal" means very little.

      Finally, your argument displays a clear bias against MS without examining any side of the argument other than your own. It is much more likely in this case that Novell, knowing of MS's legal trouble with the EU, decided to file a complaintant for the sole purpose of using it against MS in financial settlement negotiations. This is a tactic which has been used since literally the dawn of commerce. A similiar version is used in divorce cases aka "He beats our daughter.. but if he ups his alimony payments 50% then I will withdraw my legal complaint".

      For a business isn't the ultimate intimidation "if you don't do what we want we won't give you buckets of cash"?
      It is much more likely that in this case Novell said to MS: "look, you are going to owe on this issue anyways. If you don't pay up what we want when we want it, we will make your life more difficult with regards to the EU case, and that could cost you WAY more than this piddly $500M."

      MS here is the one being blackmailed, almost certainly.

  3. You realize what this means for Microsoft? by burgburgburg · · Score: 5, Funny
    $536 Million?
    No new boxes of tissue until Tuesday!

    Oh, the nasal anguish!

    1. Re:You realize what this means for Microsoft? by Degrees · · Score: 4, Insightful
      On a more serious note, this income for Novell is the 'payoff' for a multi-year hemorrhaging of market share....

      Almost half a billion dollars seems like a lot of money, but compare that to the loss of customers: at one time, NetWare *was* 70% of all business networks (not the internet, obviously).

      So what is that $536 Million? Something like 20 cents on the dollar?

      Not that they could have gotten any more. I'm just saying, it is kind of like discounted severance pay: nice to have, but continued income would be better.

      --
      "The most sensible request of government we make is not, "Do something!" But "Quit it!"
  4. Beware the Microsoft settlements by IGnatius+T+Foobar · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Generally, whenever Microsoft settles with anyone it's bad for the free world.
    • Microsoft settles with DOJ. Result: Microsoft doesn't get broken up like it deserved, and now wants to "license" standard Internet protocols to you.
    • Microsoft settles with AOL. Result: the final nail in Netscape's coffin, and the Mozilla developers all get fired. And of course, the dream of seeing Gecko in AOL client is dashed.
    • Microsoft settles with Sun. Result: anti-Linux collusion between Microsoft and Sun.
    • Microsoft settles with Novell. Result: We don't know yet, but I'm expecting something ugly. Maybe some bizarre legal cross-licensing to prevent non-commercial software from existing?
    --
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    1. Re:Beware the Microsoft settlements by Ohreally_factor · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Microsoft settles with Novell. Result: We don't know yet, but I'm expecting something ugly. Maybe some bizarre legal cross-licensing to prevent non-commercial software from existing?

      And let's not forget the recent resignation of Chris Stone from Novell. Maybe it's just a coincidence.

      --
      It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
  5. Yawn. The river flows. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I know this means a lot to Novell, but big money moves in this industry (like in so many others) like a river. Microsoft has a viable, long term strategy for survival and success. Novell has a viable, long term strategy for survival -- maybe. Part of the Microsoft strategy is legal payoffs as the cost of doing business. Things change when companies fail to innovate. IBM was too slow to keep up so they went through a bad time. Microsoft innovates not in the realm of technology, but in the realm of selling technology. No one does it better.

  6. 1994? Should have sued them then. by garcia · · Score: 4, Informative

    The WordPerfect suit that Novell will file seeks unspecified damages arising from Microsoft's efforts to eliminate competition in the office productivity applications market during the time that Novell owned the WordPerfect word-processing application and the Quattro Pro spreadsheet application. The suit is based in part on facts proved by the United States Government in its successful antitrust case against Microsoft. In that suit, Microsoft was found to have unlawfully maintained a monopoly in the market for personal computer operating systems by eliminating competition in related markets.

    Now, I can't stand MSFT's business tactics as much as the next Slashdotter but WordPerfect missed the fucking boat on a lot of shit when it came to the migration from DOS to Windows...

    Novell bought out WordPerfect 3/94. They were supporting legacy versions of WordPerfect for DOS and updating several versions for Windows. How they expected to compete against Word was really beyond me. Any software application that basically required a function key explanation chart at the top of every keyboard was doomed when GUI took hold.

    I have fond memories of WP5.1 for DOS but I am so glad that we have moved away from SHIFT+ALT+CTRL F11 for foo. WordPerfect took over from WordStar because of superior interface and design. While many people adore WP I wonder if it is more of a holdover from years gone by rather than actual superiority.

    Personally, Word is easy to get and use and it happens to be better than what Corel/Novell was offering at the time and that's why it won out. Maybe this lawsuit was better served 10 years ago in 1994 and not now in 2004.

  7. Re:Novell is a dead company by paitre · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Novell is "reinventing" themselves as a Linux company.
    Specifically, who do you think owns SuSE these days? It's Novell.

    IMO - I think Novell has a couple of very nice products that they simply need to redeploy - a lot of the technology behind netware is actually pretty cool, but they allowed themselves to become marginalized (IOW - they sat on the laurels they built for themselves in the late80's and early '90s and it's almost put them out of business).

    Once they finish this turn around, I expect them to regain some competitiveness, but getting back into "their" market is going to take some doing.

  8. Re:$ sign in front? by TheRealMindChild · · Score: 4, Informative

    It is one of those things that are supposed to help you read by preparing the reader for what they are reading.

    It is similar to having the upside-down question marks and such in spanish... it is so the reader knows up front that they are reading a question.

    --

    "When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back!" -- Cave Johnson
  9. Re:Sue sue sue, it's the American way! by barc0001 · · Score: 5, Informative

    NetWare basically existed just to make up for the Windows networking components being shitty at the time.

    Not up on your computer history, are you? You *must* have meant to say:

    "NetWare basically existed just to make up for the Windows networking components being NON EXISTANT at the time."

    Novell Netware predates ANY Microsoft networking. For most of the late 80's/early 90's until Windows for Workgroups came out, Netware and Banyan Vines were the only way to get a bunch of PCs to form a network. I am presuming you didn't actually work with computers and networks during this time frame, because if you did, there's no way you could have made such an erroneous statement.

    And Novell has innovated quite a bit. Or were you just being ironic? Where do you think Microsoft got the "inspiration" for Active Directory, among other things?

  10. Re:Sue sue sue, it's the American way! by paesano · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Gee, I don't know. Maybe some of the failures of Word Perfect (and every other competitor) had something to do with Microsoft's ability to lock them all out of every large Enterprise by their bundling practices. Innovate? Microsoft? Your kidding, right? Their only innovations have been with slimy business practices. No one can dispute their absolute genious there.

  11. Strategy on Microsofts part to legitimize lawsuits by 3770 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Is it a strategy on Microsofts part to legitimize software related lawsuits?

    They have really deep pockets. They can afford to pay. When the pay they achieve two things:

    1) They can stop worrying about the lawsuit and continue with their business.
    2) They also legitimize the claim of the other company, in this case Novell, thereby setting a precedent.

    When Microsoft sets a precedent it means that the next company that Sun or Novell or SCO sues will almost certainly have to pay. There is a precedent after all. But that company might not be able to pay. And then Microsoft has one competitor less.

    --
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  12. Re:Don't Care Who or Why by DigitalRaptor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    First shots?

    You think this war started today? And Novell started it?

    Go to the US Patent Office website and do a patent search for "Microsoft" and one for "Novell" (under the field "Assignee Name").

    See who has been doing it more, and longer. I'll save you the trouble:

    Microsoft: 3,520, since March 21, 1985
    Novell: 243, September 24, 1990

    Microsoft has Novell beat by an order of magnitude and then some. To give you some perspective, Amazon.com are famous for their patents, and they only have 41.

    Microsoft is the poster boy for patenting anything and everything, and trying to use their "licensing" schemes to control and monopolize the market.

    Nobody but William Gates is "forcing" Microsoft into this patent war. They are the agressors, not the victims. And they know exactly what they are doing.

    --
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  13. Re:1994? Should have sued them then. by stratjakt · · Score: 4, Insightful

    There are still keyboard shortcuts for everything in Word, if you want to go ahead and learn them to improve efficiency.

    That's what they teach you in those MS Word courses at the local community college (at least thats what the good ones should teach you).

    I don't know them, because I don't use Word but maybe twice a year.

    With WP I had to know them, which sucked, until 5.1 came out and you could use a mouse to access pulldown menus.

    That is, before WP 5.1 came out, I would actually do school reports and stuff in GEOWrite on my old C64, leaving the PC collecting dust. I'd rather wait for the screen to refresh than spend forever scanning over the template to look for the "italics" hotkey.

    --
    I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
  14. Re:WordPerfect by Reziac · · Score: 5, Interesting

    And "monopoly" would imply *lack* of choice. People used WP by choice back then even more than now -- in WP's heyday, WP had direct competition from Wordstar, MultiMate, and numerous other word processors of varying capability. WP cornered what was then a very competitive market because of several factors:

    1) support for every printer known to man
    2) features that users wanted (notably, features for lawyers, which no other product bothered to include)
    3) excellent free tech support for one and all (legal user or not)
    4) Reveal Codes (the ultimate timesaver for complex documents)

    WP only lost the market lead by being slow and lame to the Windows bandwagon, and I think more critical, by radically reducing their free tech support.

    Until WPWin8, where WP got its Windows act back together, WinWord was prettier to look at, but Word has *never* been superior in any way, and as you say about file formats -- lordy!!

    BTW, tho I have (and use, and collect) most WP versions, I still use WP5.1 as my everyday workhorse, and I lurk on the WP OO.o mailing list. :)

    --
    ~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
  15. Re:Sue sue sue, it's the American way! by subsolar2 · · Score: 5, Informative
    WordPerfect became the market leader, then they got all fat and lazy, providing the opportunity for Microsoft to come along and eat their lunch with just a few new features that the folks at WordPerfect were too lazy to implement.
    Ummmm WordPerfect got locked out of the OEM market because of agreements with PC manufactuers limiting what non-Microsoft sotware could be sold pre-installed.

    Not being able to get WordPerfect pre-installed and being forced to take Office or crappy Works pretty much killed WordPerfect. Wordperfect is still a better product than Word ... Quattro and Paradox have been exceeded by their MS counterparts, but WP is still better in my opinion.

  16. Re:Business practice by schatten · · Score: 4, Insightful

    You might be a little young to remember, but Word Perfect has been around for quite a while. MS Word always seemed to be the competitor up until Office 95 and more so after Office 97. WP was quite slick in 5.1/5.2 and prior.

  17. Actually... by Ironsides · · Score: 4, Insightful

    WordPerfect became the market leader, then they got all fat and lazy, providing the opportunity for Microsoft to come along and eat their lunch with just a few new features that the folks at WordPerfect were too lazy to implement.

    Actually, what happened is that when Microsoft came out with Windows they refused to give the WordPerfect programmers access to the Windows GUI APIs. This prevented them from making a version of Word Perfect that would run in a window instead of through MS-DOS. Microsoft released their MS-WORD with Windows support and became the market leader because no one wanted to stick with a DOS only aplication. It wasn't until later when MS-WORD was the leader that they finally let the WP Programers have access to the APIs. That is why they have a case against Microsoft.

    --
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    1. Re:Actually... by Reziac · · Score: 4, Insightful

      That's interesting, and given that, I hope Novell wins.

      At the time, the statement from WPCorp boiled down to "Windows is a flash in the pan and we hate it anyway, so we're not doing it". But one does have to wonder how much of that was sour grapes.

      And it certainly does explain why early WPWin versions were pretty poor and not real stable -- they were literally groping in the dark.

      But WP's demise started before Windows became ubiquitous and long before Word ever got a market foothold -- it began when WPCorp ceased offering free tech support to one and all, back in early 1994. They'd previously even supported pirated copies, and had a large steady market of upgraders from that (happy pirates frequently *buy* the next version, and WP's support made 'em deleriously happy).

      Of course, with the state of tech support now, it kinda looks like WPCorp was precocious :/

      --
      ~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
  18. Re:No, by civilizedINTENSITY · · Score: 5, Informative
    First a little history:
    1983: Novell introduces NetWare X and NetWare S
    1985: Novell introduces Advanced NetWare 2.0
    1987 Apr: Microsoft introduces OS/2 Lan Manager, an network operating system to compete with Novell's NetWare. It's a patched up rehash of IBM's old PCNet.
    1988: Novell introduces Advanced NetWare 2.15.
    1988 Oct: 3Com introduces the 3+Open network, based on Microsoft's Lan Manager (based on IBM's old PCNet). In 1990 a famous "shoot out" was held between 3+ and Novell NetWare. 3Com dropped out of the network software business in Dec 1990.
    1992: Novell purchases Unix from AT&T
    1993: Novell introduces NetWare 3.12 and NetWare 4.0. 4.0 introduces Novell Directory Services in place of the Bindery.
    1994 February: Microsoft released Windows for Workgroups 3.11, adding networking to the product. The network, derived from IBM's primitive PCNet, is so totally piss poor people continue to buy Lantastic instead.
    1994 October: IBM released OS/2 version 3.0, an operating system far superior to anything Microsoft had, or would have for years. IBM launched a major campaign to get software developed for it. Many major software houses signed up to port their applications, but nearly all had to drop OS/2 development when they read the NDA (Non-Disclosure Agreement) for the Windows95 development kit. If you were developing anything for OS/2, you could not participate in the Windows95 program. The NDA itself required total secrecy, so the reason everyone dropped OS/2 development was only rumored for years.
    1994: Novell purchases WordPerfect and Quatro Pro.
    1998 October: Novell introduces NetWare 5.0. NetWare gets great reviews, and Microsoft feels the heat, especially from comparisons between NetWare 5.0 (shipping, works great) and Windows NT 5.0 (very, very late; very, very buggy, not shipping yet), so renames Windows NT 5.0 to Windows 2000 to stop the 5.0 vs 5.0 comparisons.
    2000 Jan: Novell introduces NetWare 5.1. Windows NT 5.0 still not shipping.
    And, yet again, it wasn't MS inovation:
    "Network Basic Input/Output System was designed for IBM by an organization named Sytek, Inc. It was created to provide an easy-to-use programming interface for connections between computers over a network. Microsoft began developing products for the MS-Net and LAN Manager (the predecessor to Windows NT) using the NetBIOS interface, anticipating the popularity of the standard. Ironically, the standard is only popular today because of Microsoft's implementation of it."
  19. More Mac viruses? by Jussi+K.+Kojootti · · Score: 4, Interesting
    This is really off-topic, but was there really a time when there were more Macintosh viruses than DOS/Windows ones?

    AFAIK, the first viruses were spotted in 85-86 and they were on dos. The first 2-3 years were pretty quiet (well, there was the Robert Morris internet worm).
    Then in the beginning of the 90s or so there were Brain, the Jerusalem-family, Michelangelo, and most notably the first kits, Dark Avenger and VCL. All for DOS/Windows. According to my memory, at this time viruses were already 'Microsoft country'.

    So was the Mac virus hegemony between these periods, or does one of us have a memory fault?