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Marvel Sues City of Heroes Makers
Walkiry (and many, many others) writes "In yet another copyright bickering lawsuit, Marvel is suing NCSoft and Cryptic Studios over their MMORPG City of Heroes due to copyright infringement, apparently because of the costume creator. "Marvel argues that the game's character creation engine easily allows players to design characters that are virtual copies of its own superheros, including 'The Incredible Hulk'. Marvel seeks unspecified damages and an injunction against the two companies to stop using its characters." There are quite a few people suspicious that this is nothing but an effort by Marvel to undermine Cryptic Studios' successful game to prepare for the launch of their own comic book based MMORPG." USA Today has the story as well.
A new low in using the courts to unethically hurt the competition. It makes me scared to innovate. For example, I'm writing a music description language. If someone uses it to create music that is significantly similar to a copyrighted piece of work, am I going to get sued? This abuse of the courts is killing this country.
This is akin to suing Bic because it allows users to draw pictures extremely similar to Hulk or Wolverine.
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"All hail the glory of the Hypnotoad."
Disney sues Macromedia for failing to prevent customers from using their software to infringe upon Disney's Intellectual Property.
You're violating our IP rights.
Thanks,
You friends from Marvel
Honestly, though. Companies are taking IP far too seriously these days. Calm down, get over it. If anything, it shows whatever you're doing is working, because it's popular! Don't trash it by being a jerk.
"An infinite number of monkeys typing into GNU emacs would never make a good program."
Ah yes, the Hulk - because BIG GREEN GUY with TORN PANTS is such a hugely original concept and - what's that Mr. Hyde? I wouldn't like you when you're...mad... no... wait NOOOOO!
This is really really stupid. It's like suing crayola cause kids can draw Spider-Man. The game provides the tools to create a character and it's up to the player to make him look how they want.
Is Cryptic supposed to keep a database of all colour schemes of all super heroes that ever existed (also the multiple costume variations they occasioanly pull out to boost sales) and prevent users from picking them. How many do you think there are? Probably over 10,000 from Marvel and then there's DC and all the rest. It's one thing if the game makers were to rip off Marvel but this is entirely different.
If they want to be asses they should follow the RIAA's lead and sue users. I hope somebody at Marvel comes to their senses and stops this BS.
They should sue the end-users.
Then go bankrupt from the bad publicity.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
I guess they forgot that they taught the world how to create these characters, right?? I remember having the "How to draw" books and having a couple of them dedicated to Hulk, She-Hulk, X-men, etc. Look out everyone, hide those books if you still gottem. It's Stan "Wannabe Elliet Ness" Lee comming to get you!
- my $.02? - you can't have it...it's all I have!!
I know they've ben trying for months now.
If they detect user's with "Hulk" in their name, they will often reset that character's name to "Generic Hero x" and give them a day or so to pick a new one. This is even if the character looks nothing like the Hulk.
I mean, please. Some characters are just so friggin easy to copy. The Hulk is a big green (or grey) buy with torn shorts. Is it Cryptic's fault that Marvel isn't very original in their design?
Sure, a character like "The Punisher" or "Wolverine" would also be easy to duplicate in the game, but who cares! People aer building the character they want. They want someone with sharp metal claws and a ever-familar beard, then so be it. If they want to be big and green, so be it. If they want a red and gold armor suit of battle armor, let them.
Personally, I think DC would have more of a leg to stand on. They have tons of heros with pretty generic looking costumes (solid-color tights with an emblem). Many of Marvel's characters have hard to copy designs.
Shame on Marvel, or at least on their legal department.
Oh well, I stopped playing a few weeks ago anyway. It just stopped being fun.
The thing is, I wouldn't play a Marvel Comics based MMORPG even if they did have one out (which they don't, and I seriously doubt we'd see one before 2006).
I don't want to play a super-hero who is second banana to Spider-Man or the Fantastic Four or the Avengers. I don't want to have to deal with people wanting to be able to storm the Avengers Mansion because they think they should be able to.
I want to make a hero who is as unique as I can make him, and is not burdened down by years of comic book history, much of which is crappily written. (I refer you to the Clone Saga, in particular, and most titles that start with the letter 'X'.)
Kierthos
Mr. Hu is not a ninja.
It came down to the EULA which states that your character and all derivations or representations thereof are property of Cryptic and NCSoft. To which I asked pointedly "What about the Fantastic Four?"
This was going to bite them in the ass eventually, as they allege to own everything you create, even if it's not yours to create.
My suspicion, as I've voiced elsewhere, is that they will be required to remove these characters from the game, and pay damages to Marvel, and probably DC and whoever else, in the end.
Then, of course, there's the obvious ownership issue of this guy.
I am currently going to sue HP because I just realized the scanner I bought can be used to make perfect copys of my copywrited artwork. Plus, I'm also going to use sony because their dvd burners can make perfect copys of my copywrighted home movies. Who's with me? Millions of SCO lawyers are about to lose their job and are ready to work with us.
They should just license the characters from Marvel and then sell an Expansion pack with all of the Marvel characters included.
http://www.kubuntu.org/
The worst part about this little tale is that the makers of COH made a good faith attempt to eliminate look-alike heroes who attempted to use trademarked names. They even accepted lists of names from the major comics publishers for their block list.
Your argument is equivalent to saying that it's ok if the elite (in this case, those skilled in drawing) violate copyright, but to make that available to everyone is wrong.
In fact, neither case is correct, and the horrible nonlogic of damaging a general purpose system with the goal of restricting certain things is stupid.
To take this from the other side, if Marvel wins this terrible case, then that implies that creating a character in City of Heroes is akin to creating one in a comic book- so if your guy has an orange cape and yellow tights and black hair, maybe you can sue someone who introduces such a character in comic books. Meaning that, if you want to create a comic book with an entirely new character, you can't just check the history of comics, you have to access the CoH (and any other relevant MMORG) database to make sure you aren't "infringing" on a similar design that some kid in Kansas came up with at 2 AM on pot.
WWF sued WCW for using "Hulk" when Hogan switched over. Marvel then sued WWF for using "Hulk" for all those years. To the best of my knowledge WCW decided to call him Hollywood Hogan at that point and WWF dropped it's suit. When WWF dropped it's suit then Marvel dropped thiers. In that case Marvel clearly had to counter sue or WWF would have set a precidence and taken the copywright for "Hulk". Incedently the name Hulk Hogan was taken from the Incredible Hulk TV show with Lou Ferregno(sorry if I misspelled that).
The irony is, it's unlikely Marvel's own game would actually let you play the Hulk[tm], Wolverine[tm], et cetera, just as Star Wars online doesn't let you play Luke, Han, and so on.
So they're suing over a game that lets you mimic their own heroes, arguing that it ruins the market for their own superhero game, even though their own game won't let you play their own heroes.
A.
Had a great looking character, big, with green skin and torn clothes. I was going to call him "The Incredible Bulk". Now I'll have to make him smaller, put him in a business suit, and call him "Marvel Blows Chunks Man". His super power is his magic briefcase, from which he can throw thousands of pleadings and C&D letters, completely papering over his opponent. Fear him!
Soylent Green is peoplicious!
...having thwarted efforts to create new superheroes who might stop him, LawyerMan's sinister plan for world domination draws one step closer to fruition!
What makes the character a rip off?
For example, if I have a character named Ferro Man, who wears an armored suit, am I infringing on Iron Man? Okay, what version of Iron Man, then, is Marvel preventing me from copying? The gray suited one? The red and gold armored one? The one who flies and blasts things? What if I change the name and sex to Ferro Woman and Marvel later comes out with a character named Iron Woman?
And how is Marvel planning on preventing users of their own future game from creating a BattyMan or a Green Lamp character? Will DC sue Marvel when Marvel releases their game?
Cryptic does police as much as they can, but is a character named the Uncredible Bulk a problem? What if the character is a skinny white girl?
What if I have an Asian character with claws named "The China Wolf"? Am I infringing? What if Marvel decides next week to change Wolverine into an Asian girl?
Anyhow, just things that pop into my mind. I currently have a character on CoH whose name was just used on the Cartoon Network's Justice League Unlimited show and was previously not used for a superhero. If DC changes her costume or powers to look like my character, can I sue them (or rather, can Cryptic sue them, since they own that character now)?
Just things to thing about.
Vincent J. Murphy
Spandex Justice
They have STRICT warnings against this, and in their terms of service is the following.
(e) Character Name. In order to use the service, you must create a character and choose a name for your character to identify your character to other Members (your "Character Name"). You may not select as your Character Name the name of another person, or a name which violates any third party's trademark right, copyright, or other proprietary right, or which may mislead other players to believe you to be an employee of NC Interactive, or which NC Interactive deems at its sole discretion to be vulgar or otherwise offensive. NC Interactive reserves the right, in its sole discretion, to (1) delete or alter any Character Name or (2) terminate any license granted herein, for any reason whatsoever, including, without limitation, any suspected or actual infringement of any trademark or trade name right, copyright, or other proprietary right.
(f) Super Group Names, Super Group Member Titles, Battle Cry, and Character Description. While accessing the service, it is possible to name your Super Group, give titles to members of your Super Group, create a Battle Cry, and write a Character Description. You may not create a Battle Cry, Character Description, give a name to a Super Group, or give a title to a Super Group member that is the name/description/title of another person, or a name/description/title which violates any third party's trademark right, copyright, or other proprietary right, or which may mislead other players to believe you to be an employee of NC Interactive, or which NC Interactive deems at its sole discretion to be vulgar or otherwise offensive. NC Interactive reserves the right, in its sole discretion, to (1) delete or alter any name/description/title given to a Super Group, Super Group Member, Battle Cry, or Character Description or (2) terminate any license granted herein, for any reason whatsoever, including, without limitation, any suspected or actual infringement of any trademark or trade name right, copyright, or other proprietary right
Sadly, in copyright law sometimes you're WORSE off trying and failing than not trying at all, because if you're trying to stop a practice then you can't claim you were unaware of the infringement.
(Sorry in advance for the long post)
Does anybody remember the good old days...
...when companies tried to actually be better than their competition instead of taking legal measures to ensure that they don't have competition?
...when you could have a clever idea and actually be free to proudly develop, sell, or give it away instead of hiding it or anonymously distributing it?
...when stupid people sometimes got sued for doing stupid things, instead of smart people ALWAYS getting sued for doing smart things?
I've played City of Heroes, and it's a cool game. It's a very original idea in MMORPGs, and there is NOTHING in the game that in any way helps, steers, or suggests that a player create any superhero that I've ever heard of before. All of my characters are 100% made up by me, as are over 99% of the other characters I've seen online.
Can you create a character that looks like other licensed characters? Sure, but that's by virtue of the flexibility of the character creation options with billions of combinations of body type, costume styles, accessories, and colors available. The "sue people who use pens" analogy is appropriate and right on the money.
I have seen a few characters now and then that are imitations of "real" comic book characters. When I do see them, I tend to think it's kind of lame. (Really, do you suffer that profound a lack of imagination that you can't come up with something original?) Obviously, another reason people may do this is because they are avid fans of existing licensed characters. No one (neither the publisher NOR the player) should be punished for this type of activity. Sometimes when I like a character in a movie or on television, I'll impersonate them in various real-life situations. ("I've got a bad feeling about this...") I'm not trying to rip off or demean the character, it's the opposite: sincere appreciation for the character.
Hopefully, this lawsuit will be tossed out before it sees any kind of light of day for, among others, precisely these reasons:
1. City of Heroes does not entice or conduce players to create likenesses of licensed characters. In fact, they actively discourage it by threatening to ban players who do so in their license agreement and screening character names for all common (and many uncommon) licensed character names. This is a reasonable effort, and to demand more would be holding the publisher to an unreasonably high (and unreasonably costly) standard of vigilance.
2. By asking the publisher of City of Heroes to disallow the possibility or ability of creating likenesses of licensed characters, you are effectively asking them to unreasonably cripple their product by severely limiting the ability of players to customize their characters, an important selling point of their game. It would be similar to asking Microsoft to prevent Microsoft Word from being able to type the scripts to copyrighted television shows.
3. I'm not conceding this point by any means, but EVEN IF City of Heroes did somehow entice or conduce people to copy licensed characters, Marvel cannot possibly prove that they have suffered any damages from the publisher's actions. If they were receiving complaint letters from people threatening to boycott The Hulk because of something a hulk character did in City of Heroes, maybe, but even that's a stretch since it is obvious to reasonable people that City of Heroes and Marvel are not associated with each other. Also worth nothing is that Marvel does NOT have a competing product on the market, so it is not like City of Heroes is stealing customers by swiping the likenesses of Marvel's characters. (sigh)
The key in all of these reasons is the standard of what is reasonable (and unreasonable). I hope with every fiber of my being that the publisher fights this lawsuit for several reasons. First, if they settle, then it is effectively an endorsement for Marvel to continue making unreasonable demands on companies and individuals. Second, if M