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Driver's Licenses with Digital Watermarks

ForceQuit writes "MIT Technology Review reports that Minnesota will begin issuing a unique driver's license designed to combat counterfeiting. It includes a reflective image (of a loon) that appears to float above and below the card when the license is tilted. It also includes an invisible, digital watermark capable of carrying security data such as date of birth. The information would be readable only through a computerized scanner, which law enforcement officers could carry."

47 of 373 comments (clear)

  1. Loons by seanadams.com · · Score: 3, Funny


    The floating images will be of loons, an enduring symbol of the state.

    I thought that was California?!?!

    1. Re:Loons by stupidfoo · · Score: 2, Funny

      Try visiting uptown in Minneapolis. Plenty of loons here too.

    2. Re:Loons by qw(name) · · Score: 2, Informative


      Actually, I was thinking of the Canadian one dollar coin. Nicknaming the new driver's license the loonie would fit here as well.

  2. You're Confused by cflorio · · Score: 3, Funny

    The picture of the Loon is actually your photo!

    1. Re:You're Confused by REggert · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I think the picture of loon is actually the photo of the moderator that mod'd that as "informative".

      --

      cp /dev/zero ~/signature.txt

  3. Driver's license security by PhotoJim · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This sounds like a good idea. Identity fraud is a serious problem. I work at an insurance office in Saskatchewan (Canada) that does license issuing among other things. We get all sorts of efforts to acquire fake ID, it's rather pathetic. Almost all of the efforts involve trying to drink under age, but these days the reality is that people will try to get fake identities for less savoury purposes. It's hard to criticize this move by Minnesota.

    1. Re:Driver's license security by Frymaster · · Score: 4, Interesting
      I work at an insurance office in Saskatchewan... We get all sorts of efforts to acquire fake ID, it's rather pathetic.

      i live in alberta where we have a snazzy driver's license with an encoded pattern and such.

      about a year ago i lost my license (along with just about every other card i have) so i headed down to one of the privatized "registry shops" to get a new one.

      really, the process was embarassingly easy. when the woman asked me behind the counter for some i.d. i said "it's all been stolen". she shrugged, took my picture, and gave me a brand new license basically on faith alone that i was who i claimed to be.

      now, she did look at the picture they had on file but, really, if you look like like your license photo you're in rough shape. bottom line: any 180 cm tall male with light hair and grey eyes who didn't look too dissimilar to me could have waltzed in there and picked up a license with my name on it, snazzy security stripe not withstanding.

    2. Re:Driver's license security by pixelpusher220 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Try New Jersey...My college roommate did this

      He took his brothers birth certificate and Social Sec Card to a different DMV(Dept. of Motor Vehicles) and said he lost his license. Since pictures weren't kept centrally (only at local offices) they gave him a brand spanking new license with HIS picture but all his brothers info on it. And the original license his brother had was never cancelled. So now two valid licenses existed for the same person with different pictures.

      Granted you needed the docs, but hey some bad guys work in groups...


      --
      People in cars cause accidents....accidents in cars cause people :-D
    3. Re:Driver's license security by Hal_Porter · · Score: 3, Funny

      My company wants to combat this by putting chips in your head.

      www.patriot-tags.com

      The civil liberties people complain, but only _before_ the implantation, they're a docile as lambs after it. Sometimes they get in trouble, robbing banks to raise money to invest in us, but the tech support guys are working on that.

      We've just got a $1B contract from the Chinese, and donated the cash to the Republican party, so we have pretty high hopes in the American market too.

      Anyhow, need go, just got that one pesky lone guy trying to screw things up.

      --
      echo -e 'global _start\n _start:\n mov eax, 2\n int 80h\n jmp _start' > a.asm; nasm a.asm -f elf; ld a.o -o a;
  4. Nothing to worry about... by duxwig · · Score: 2, Insightful

    So really, there is no need to worry from a teenage perspective. It'll be another 10 years before any kind of tavern has a card-swiper to actually tell that you're not of age. By then, someone will have found some way to replace/confuse the machine and you'll appear of age.

    1. Re:Nothing to worry about... by rkhalloran · · Score: 3, Informative

      I know one of the local pubs put in a scanner that supposedly can read all of the various mag-stripe licenses. He said saving the cost/headaches of fines for serving to minors more than covers the cost (approx US$2K).

      Don't know how many of the forgers hack up the mag-stripe data as well, but it's probably not a lot.

    2. Re:Nothing to worry about... by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 3, Insightful

      He said saving the cost/headaches of fines for serving to minors more than covers the cost (approx US$2K).

      Not to mention the high-quality database he's been able to acquire of information about his patrons. Not just name, sex, height, date of birth, eye-color, home address and DL# -- all highly desirable to someone making forged driver's licenses --- but also the patterns of their comings and goings at his place of business, both individually and group demographics (as in Tuesday night seems to be popular with the yuppies as well as something more devious like Fred and Bob always show up at about the same time together, maybe they are having an affair).

      I refuse to let any non-government agency swipe the mag-stripe on my driver's license If they won't serve me without doing so, I don't do business with them. I have walked out on such establishments in the past, the risk of identity theft is a lot greater than the occasional hassle of such precautions against it.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    3. Re:Nothing to worry about... by mrgreen4242 · · Score: 4, Informative
      In Michigan anyway, and I am assuming most states, the mag stripe contains a very limited amount of info. There's your DL number, your DOB, and a couple of SMALL numeric codes that, from what I can tell, correlate to the office where your ID was proccessed at, and the type of license/endorsements you have (regular driver, CDL, School Bus, HazMat, motorcycle, etc).

      I am involved in a project to install new ID systems in the Sec. of State offices here, and I have personally scanned my licence into a text editor and looked at the information on there. It's something like 45 characters or so.

      If you are worried about someone getting all that iformation, it would be much more effective and much easier to have a cheap camera installed at teh point of sale (cashier register, self checkout lane, in the black light of the door bouncer types of bars) and grab medium resolution 5 fps video of everything that goes by. All that info that you are paranoid about giving up through an electronic reader is actually on the front of your license.

    4. Re:Nothing to worry about... by Olinator · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Blockpoth the quoster:

      [...] I refuse to let any non-government agency swipe the mag-stripe on my driver's license If they won't serve me without doing so, I don't do business with them.[...]
      There's a simpler way -- introduce the magstrip on your license to Mr. Bulk Magtape Eraser. Then they can swipe away, and when their reader doesn't work, you say "Yeah, that happens to my credit cards, too, sometimes -- I occasionally work around high magnetic fields." Then they have to look at the front of the license anyway. If they don't accept it, it's not like you're out anything -- you weren't going to frequent their establishment anyway, right?
      Ole
  5. Great Move, With a Caveat by Staplerh · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Don't see any possible problems with this move, apart from the immigration part. Sounds like the information encoded in the chip contains no sensitive information, so that's a bonus, and a more secure identification system makes the entire system more reliable. However, from the article:

    There will also be a "status check" notation on the front and back of licenses showing when an immigrant's visa expires, something the state already had begun to put on licenses despite opposition from civil liberties groups.

    This is a bit of a sticky point, IMHO. This isn't really necessary, and will probably achieve nothing but undue stress for immigrants, and prompt deportation if an illegal gets caught at a traffic stop (presuming that these IDs can not be forged). I don't know what Minnesota's illegal immigrant problem is, but this is a disturbing development. It's a drivers license, not a citizenship card. First step in a bad direction?

    --
    "There's no success like failure, and failure's no success at all."
    - Bob Dylan
    1. Re:Great Move, With a Caveat by PhotoJim · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Immigrants don't have the same rights as citizens. That's true in every country on Earth. While they deserve certain rights, until they gain citizenship and share in the responsibilities and obligations of citizenship, they don't have the right to gain all the benefits and rights of living in that society. I don't think that Western countries have skewed the balance too far.

    2. Re:Great Move, With a Caveat by HawkinsD · · Score: 3, Insightful
      No, sir. "Undue" stress? If they're here unlawfully, then they're breaking the law. Yes, it's stressful to be caught breaking the law. Sorry.

      Call me a fascist if you want, but this is a step in a good direction.

      --
      Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by mere idiocy.
    3. Re:Great Move, With a Caveat by Have+Blue · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Undue stress? It's the immigrant's responsibility to keep track of his legal status, and to leave the country once his license to remain within it has expired. "Illegal immigrants" are called that for a reason.

    4. Re:Great Move, With a Caveat by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      according to the article, "Fake ID cards made it possible for the Sept. 11 terrorists to board commercial flights.". I thought that had already been debunked to death.

    5. Re:Great Move, With a Caveat by Xcott+Craver · · Score: 4, Insightful
      You're assuming that the data on the driver's license will be correct---i.e., that it will list the bearer's current visa status.

      Will they get a free replacement whenever their status changes? Will we ever see someone mistakenly arrested because his/her license is out of date?

      If you're here unlawfully, sure you're breaking the law. If you're here lawfully but your driver's license disagrees, is that breaking the law? Does the law require you to properly maintain every thing upon which some bureaucrat decides to plaster your visa status?

      This is the same problem we have with databases of sex offenders. It may sound like a great idea, if you assume the database is accurate. But entries get stale, and suddenly people start tossing bricks through your window and beating up your kids at school.

      Xcott

    6. Re:Great Move, With a Caveat by Justice8096 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      At the present time we get the best of both worlds - we get the taxes from immigrants, but we don't have to give the same quality of service to them. Social Security is a good example - Immagrants have to pay it, but until they are citizens they have no rights to the benefits. Similarly, an immagrant has to pay property taxes if he or she owns a house, but has no rights to vote until they are a citizen.

    7. Re:Great Move, With a Caveat by Delphis · · Score: 2, Informative

      As someone who is on the downhill stretch of dealing with the INS (permanent resident with 10yr green card now), I can tell you that yes, it is already illegal if you do keep the INS informed of your current address within about 2 weeks after you move (I think it's 10 days, but I could be wrong). Those laws were pre 9/11 too.

      If it was tied in with drivers license... bleh, okay.. I ALREADY have to carry my green-card with me everywhere I go, so that's no big deal to me. The only thing different is that my green card does not have my address on, my drivers license does. So that would be additional pressure to get the drivers license renewed.

      The only time that MAY be a problem is if you move somewhere temporarily, like I recently did. I called the INS and sent in the form both times, but I only changed my drivers license once we were in our house, i.e. not the temporary apartment. So if it were law that you'd have to change your drivers license both times, that would SUCK since it costs money to do so. Mailing a form and a toll-free cost nothing but time.

      --
      Delphis
  6. Finally, a sensible state by Qzukk · · Score: 4, Insightful

    None of this encoding my life history on the card, or letting my card broadcast my identification to everyone sitting on the bus with me. This state has it right. If the cop wants my information, he can stop me and ask me for it. The things on the computer readable portion are on the card anyway, so it lets the cop scan me in and let me go on my merry way faster, without the hassle of having my DL number mistyped and coming up as some wanted murderer.

    Maybe I should look into moving.

    --
    If I have been able to see further than others, it is because I bought a pair of binoculars.
  7. Can it be produced? by nurb432 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If so, it can be reproduced. The only issue is if the cost is too high to make it worthwhile to copy.

    --
    ---- Booth was a patriot ----
  8. overkill by TedCheshireAcad · · Score: 2, Funny

    All this to keep terrorists from attacking us. And by 'keep terrorists from attacking us', I mean 'keep underage kids from buying beer'.

  9. Pictures! by adler187 · · Score: 2, Informative

    I just happened across this the other day. Filling out an accident claim I saw this page on the MN Dept. of Public Safety site which has a picture of the new liscense. My first impression was not terribly positive. To me it looks pretty ugly, but whatever.

  10. Not that much different than other states by moorcito · · Score: 2, Informative

    How is this news?

    Missouri has been issuing drivers licenses with a digital water mark of the state capitol for a number of years.

  11. Last time I checked by Thunderstruck · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In most states there is no penalty for forgetting your driver's license at home, or for travelling without it if you're not driving. (The latter would raise all sorts of right to travel issues. The former results in a warning to produce the license within 10 days.)

    So from a privacy perspective, am I not better off just leaving my license at home wrapped up in my tinfoil hat?

    --
    Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
    1. Re:Last time I checked by Thunderstruck · · Score: 2, Informative

      I think you're mistaken on this. In fact there was a recent Supreme Court of the United States case which considered the issue of whether a police officer could even demand your name, much less a state-issued identification. It was narrowly held that a name could be demanded if state law provided such. Anything more, it suggests, is probably unconstitutional.

      The case was Hiibel v. Sixth Judicial District Court of Nevada.

      This post is not intended as legal advice and should not be relied on as such.

      --
      Trying to use sarcasm in text-based forums does not work.
  12. Re:What to think. by stupidfoo · · Score: 2, Insightful

    yes, because it's all stored in the SUPER DUPER EVIL GOVERNMENT TRACKING DATABASE!

    You know what those barcode scanners do? They simply read the unencrypted data that is stored in the magnetic strip. They're not connected to any network or anything else.

  13. Right to stay here is not included by Mr+Guy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    You are afforded basic human rights by the constitution while in our country. We don't have to let you stay in our country. If anything this move is better for immigrants than some of the other proposed solutions, because they have to be caught breaking another law, as opposed to simply having their ID broadcasting with an RF chip. Sure, our immigration laws can be silly, but part of that is due to the fact there is no one litmus test to tell who's a productive member of society and who isn't. In my mind, we should actively be seeking out illegals who are working in this country not to deport them, but to grant them visas and begin collecting taxes from them. I know, it's simplistic given the wages many of them earn, but I have a hard time divorcing the right to live in the USA with the responsibility to pay taxes. I guess I believe in "pay to play".

  14. Lic. was not originally intended to be a ID by StateOfTheUnion · · Score: 2, Insightful
    I think that this is indicative of a problem throughout the United States that has snuck up on the government.

    Driver's Licenses were intended to be exactly that, a license or permit that demonstrates that one is legally permitted to drive. They happened to have a photo of the person on them . . . how this became an official government identification card was something of an accident. Private groups started using the driver's license as ID to cash checks becuase it provided some level of photo identification . . . but there was no common standard for confirming identity when applying for a license. Some states were very slack about this (For example, in Virginia until recently, one only needed a form from a lawyer asserting one's identity with no official documents whatsoever.)

    It's good to see that states are recognizing that the driver's license is a de facto identification card in the US and they are taking counterfeiting seriously.

  15. It's only a piece of paper by OhHellWithIt · · Score: 4, Insightful
    All this hullaballoo (sp?) about encoding information in driver's licenses, etc., misses the point. The purpose of an identification card is to give the person/machine examining it assurance (to the required level of certainty) that the person presenting it is who he says he is. However far you want to go in determining that, it doesn't do a thing to enhance national or provincial security, nor does it do anything to tell the state trooper who just pulled you over that you have a sawed-off shotgun under your seat or a USB disk drive in your pocket.

    Holography and RFID make the document harder to counterfeit. Some biometric information, like the color of the person's eyes, height, weight, etc., is useful in establishing that the bearer is the person belonging to the ID.

    Nonetheless, none of this is worth a whit if the ID is issued fraudulently. Here in Virginia, we had a problem with DMV clerks issuing driver's licenses to anyone for the price of a bribe, as well as notaries public who would vouch for anyone for a fee. The licenses themselves were machine-readable, with some kind of special seal on them that would be difficult to counterfeit, and included the information I mentioned above. A policeman could be reasonably sure the driver is the person in the photo. But, at bottom, because the controls on the license issuing process were bad, and the identification accepted by DMV was so weak, it was possible for anyone to get a real Virginia license or ID card that would be acceptable as genuine anywhere.

    --
    "Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past." -- George Orwell
  16. Re:Debunked by danknight · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Ah, but if you repeat it enough, then it becomes truth

    --
    wanted: one clever sig,apply within
  17. Legal info from a Minnesota Attorney by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    For the first time I actually have something to contribute. As an attorney in Minneapolis who works with mostly undocumented immigrants (illegal immigrants) I think i should add a couple of details to this.

    1) Minneapolis has an ordinace preventing police from asking about a persons immigration status, unless that status is a part of another crime. (so this means at a traffic stop they can _not_ ask you about your status) There are two reasons behind this law. One reason the city passed this law is to encourage immigrants to feel safe and comfortable with city police, to report crimes, call for help, not leave the scene ect. However the primary reason for the law is that federal law gives sole jurisdiction over immigration matters to federal law enforcement. That means that even without the Minneapolis ordinace the local police can't enforce immigration law. Just like the Immigration officers can't arrest you for speeding or running a red light.

    In Minnesota you can not get a license if you are an undocumented (illegal) immigrant. And an estimated 60,000 undocumented immigrants live here. Right now they either have no IDs or occasionly an ID from their home country - and these are often difficult to validate or even read if not in english.

    A few of the main reasons people push to give undocumented immigrants license are 1) becuase that way they will have ID and police/banks/hospitals/ect will know who they are 2) they will have to pass the drivers test if they want to get an ID and that will encourage many (not all) to learn the traffic rules 3) once they get a drivers license they will be able to get car insurance 4) terrorists have enough resources and money to get IDs other places, so this law has little impact on well organized terrorists.

    1. Re:Legal info from a Minnesota Attorney by _UnderTow_ · · Score: 2

      They are not 'undocumented' immigrants. They are fucking ILLEGAL immigrants. They are here ILLEGALLY, ergo they are ILLEGAL immigrants and should be put out of the country for any infraction that brings them to the attention of authorities.

    2. Re:Legal info from a Minnesota Attorney by cayenne8 · · Score: 2
      "However the primary reason for the law is that federal law gives sole jurisdiction over immigration matters to federal law enforcement. That means that even without the Minneapolis ordinace the local police can't enforce immigration law. Just like the Immigration officers can't arrest you for speeding or running a red light."

      So, why aren't the policemen, who find and illegal alien (a lawbreaker) not immediately turning them over to the Fed's for deportation? This is lunacy. A law, a serious law is being broken, and they should be immediately deported.

      --
      Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
  18. Alberta by Redfrost · · Score: 2, Informative

    Alberta (Canada) came out with a new driver's licence a few years ago. It was quite a step forward from the traditional print-it-off-on-paper-then-laminate-it licence. Check it out:

    http://www3.gov.ab.ca/gs/driverslicence/
    "An original. Just like you." Glad my taxes went towards picking that. Probably had a committee set up and daily meetings for 3 months to come up with it.

    Security features used on the card:
    http://www3.gov.ab.ca/gs/driverslicence/sec urity.h tml

    Picture of the card:
    http://www3.gov.ab.ca/gs/driverslicence/fea tures_f lash.html

  19. Re:I live in MN by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    This is nothing new. We have had the loon (state bird) on them many years ago. Now, we have the word "Minnesota" instead, same kind of thing. The loon looks better and will be harder to fake than a word (ever see a loon?)

    For a long time there as been a 2D barcode

    I think the state bird should have been the moskeeto; that is the thing people remember and see a lot of in MN.

  20. Re:terrorists DID NOT use fake IDs by YrWrstNtmr · · Score: 2
    Between the 19 hijackers, they had 63 'valid' licenses from various states. One would presume that at least 44 of those were 'fake'.

    This type of license identification and verification might be one way of plugging that loophole.

  21. Re:terrorists DID NOT use fake IDs by quarkscat · · Score: 2

    Damn right, they didn't!

    The 9-11-2001 terrorists that needed to have
    driver's licenses got real ones from the
    Commonwealth of Virginia. At that time, VA
    didn't even require proof of residence in the
    state. This has subsequently changed in VA.

    However, ID fraud is still prevalent in the
    Metro DC area. There have been employees of
    the Social Security Administration (in Baltimore)
    who were finally arrested for selling SSNs.
    Employees of DMVs in both Virginia and Washington
    DC have been arrested for selling legitimate
    drivers licenses to persons without proper
    identification (just cold hard cash). And the
    FBI and DHS/INS recently raided a home in NoVA
    where more than 1,900 sets of forged IDs (BCs,
    drivers licenses, and other documents had been
    created for illegal aliens from Indonesia. This
    illegal enterprise had been on-going for more
    than 3 years, and generated more than 2-1/2
    million USD in revenue for the perpetrators.

    I, for one, would welcome a national ID card
    that used photo, blood type, fingerprint(s),
    and DNA sequence. I don't much care for the
    notion of an embedded RFID that broadcast this
    data, but using adequate encryption that requires
    an official scanner to read (like Minnesota) does
    sound pretty reasonable.

  22. Picture of the new license by Seltsam · · Score: 2, Informative
  23. In other gov't cost-efficiency news... by Jonboy+X · · Score: 3, Funny

    The US Federal Reserve has just announced a new space-age digital holographic RFID watermarking scheme to prevent currency counterfeiting. The technology will be used exclusively on US $1 bills (the most frequently counterfeited), and cost approximately $35 per bill to implement.

    --

    "In a 32-bit world, you're a 2-bit user. You've got your own newsgroup, alt.total.loser." -Weird Al
  24. Seems like overkill by jimfrost · · Score: 4, Insightful
    I have long wondered about all these technologically marvelous anti-counterfeiting driver's licenses. Is driver's license counterfeiting really common enough -- or serious enough -- to make these technologies economically worthwhile?

    Sure, 20 years ago I <cough> knew some people who might have made fake Pennsylvania driver's licenses in order to purchase liquor. Back in those days the license was nothing but a Polaroid, very easy to clone. But when the states started going to those funny reflective laminations then cloning became a losing proposition (not that it was particularly hard to duplicate those, either, but it was even harder to make them look bad enough to be real).

    Even when it was really easy to fake a license it was more or less a toss-up as to whether to make the license itself or the supporting documentation. For more than a decade now the easiest way to get a fake license (so I hear) is to print up the supporting docs and go get a real one. Way easier. They give out driver's licenses like candy on Halloween, after all.

    This kind of fraud is certainly commonplace around colleges, but I find it hard to get worked up over some kids getting hold of alcohol. (It's pathetic that our drinking age is 21 yet the driver's license age is 16 -- that is a recipe for disaster. If anything, the two should be switched.) In a traffic stop the police call it in, in which case the computer wouldn't know about a false ID and it'd be obvious what's going on -- no matter if the ID is a fancy thing or just a slip of paper. Heck, they don't even need the physical driver's license anymore in most places.

    So I figure the theory here is that it's for preventing identity theft (eg cashing checks in someone else's name -- although the reliance on driver's licenses, obtained via privilege rather than right, for that process is a rant in and of itself) and that doesn't seem like it's worth a lot of ID technology investment either.

    I suspect that many pour misguided souls think that harder-to-fake driver's licenses would stop something like 9/11, in which case I would point out that the 9/11 hijackers had fraudulently obtained real driver's licenses, just like the college kids do. They were legitimate so far as the system knew.

    Until they get around to fixing the lack of any real identity check during the process of applying for a license, not an easy or inexpensive thing to do, all these technologies are worthless.

    --
    jim frost
    jimf@frostbytes.com
  25. Not fascist, just ignorant by alienmole · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Immigrant Americans (i.e. every American citizen alive today, whose family immigrated here sometime within the last couple hundred years or so) have continued to live up to the reputation which they created early on with the native Americans: "white man speak with forked tongue".

    On the one hand, tens of millions of illegal aliens are welcomed into menial jobs throughout the country: from farm labor to maid work to nannies. Ordinary people employ them, as well as companies. You even get illegals doing not so menial work, like tech contracting. Illegal aliens collectively form an essential part of the economy.

    On the other hand, the INS (or whatever it's called nowadays) is the most dysfunctional federal agency of them all, and it's not just the agency's fault - it's a function of the national schizophrenia in which cheap labor is desperately needed, but the fiction needs to be maintained that not anyone who wants to can come here to work. Quotas for immigrants aren't even close to realistic in terms of what the economy needs - you could eliminate all the legal immigration and the economy would continue to function just fine, the legal immigration is really just there for show at this point. You couldn't do the same with the illegal immigration.

    So, you ignorant anti-immigration types out there (and you are anti-immigration, if all you support is the current legal immigration system which is just for show, and a poor show at that), just keep on with your little fantasies about the way life works in the imaginary U.S. of A. that you live in, while the rest of us live in the real world which you don't understand. The difference is between the two is that the real world isn't going to go away, whereas your fantasies will become harder and harder to sustain as long as you continue to refuse to acknowledge your national addiction to cheap labor supplied by illegal aliens.

  26. Big Brother the Grocery Clerk by gelfling · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Shit just what we need another device to track us in the complete absence of either a coherent process that controls how they are handed out in the first place AND any sort of legislative brakes on the data that is embedded on it or what data its usage gathers.

  27. This is moot now by Beautyon · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...Beginning in 2005, the Department of Homeland Security will issue new uniformity regulations to the States requiring that all Drivers Licenses and Birth Certificates meet minimal Federal Standards with regard to US citizen information, including biometric security provisions...

    Because the federal government now controls the universal standard for Drivers Licences.

    Its clear that the house should never pass a bill with more than 10 pages; these provisions were buried in a 3000 page bill, which no legislator read before voting.

    Each congressman should be forced to read every page of the bills that they sign into law, and they should be made to sign each page indicating that they hare read the page.

    Then again, no one in america cares about any of this, and for certain, at least 59,054,087 people will think that its a good idea.

    --
    ATH0 Bitcoin: 1DnwFLXczVZV8kLJbMYoheUrpqHesjxrSi