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External TV Tuners/PVR Devices Tested
Solomon writes "TV Tuners for the PC have existed for a long time but with the ever increasing popularity of TiVo-like services and the possibility of replicating such features on your Windows PC with little effort and a small investment, tuners have been getting a lot of attention this year.
Today there's three-way shootout posted at TechSpot with products from Digistor, Transcend and a very appealing offer from RTV called the VEG that lets you play consoles in your monitor. Although neither of these devices can match TiVo completely, they do give you a very cheap alternative."
Anyway, I have a 9600 all-in-wonder, and I really really like the cable tv tuner deal. I desperately need to upgrade, but I am having a hard time parting with the built in tuner. I suppose these would be a good alternative.
Jerry
http://www.syslog.org/
...to use USB tv tuners. Arent there problems with moving all that video across the USB interface? I remember talk about making an Xbox run Myth off a usb tuner, and it was quickly denounced as impossible....I heard the same thing about a laptop and a WinTV USB hauppauge tuner....
So? Is this true?
-thewldisntenuff
My MythTV HowTo
...of any external tuner that claims to let you play console games. *Every* external tuner I've seen has had too much lag to let you play console games.
They failed to review the best product available, EyeTV
I paid the going retail price for a Windows screen reader and got a free Unix computer!
Anybody else get the Piano Tuner advertisment?
not a bad little roundup... however as someone who is seriously in the market for a value ended PVR, i would have like to have seen a comparison with a hardware Mpeg2-encoded PVR in the mix.
The author mensions the word 'quality' quite a few times... some hardware encoded screenies would have been a good way to measure those statements.
DO your research FIRST, and just buy a PVR-250 or PVR-350. Friend of mine didn't listen to me, and went and bought himself a cheap $29 tuner card for $180 -- and no MPEG.
I have an old non-mpeg tuner card, and it works great with MythTV. Dedicate a box to the task. Get a nice TV-Out card that you can live with. Get the remote control, or a longer-range wireless keyboard.
MythTV blows my mind everytime I use it: KnoppMyth
Zhrodague.net - I do projects and stuff too.
Am I the only one who even though I actually use Windows more than Linux only wants Linux on my HTPC (PVR or whatever you call it)?
On the one hand, I could use MCE or XP and SnapStream, on the other hand, I could get more features cheaper and without the limited lifespan that affects all Windows software. I mean, these things might actually work with MythTV, but how the hell would I know without digging through all the reviews and catalogs that google turns up?
And still only the PCHDTV card and the WinTV cards really support Linux at all. WTF?!
offtopic !?
To answer your question, is the tv worth repairing ? I bought my girlfriend a decent 31" for about $129. It might be an obvious issue if you crack it open, but if it's more complicated the repair bill/parts might not be worth it.
Warning: I'm on my Christmas Trolling Spree (TM) :)
/. front
/. this year :) More "news" like this on the front page and it will be for good :)
I mean things like:
replicating such features on your Windows PC with little effort and a small investment
doesn't make me shiver or feel anything besides deep sadness for the (again) experienced ingorance wave.
First, I don't care how newbies are just discovering that their computers can do more than playing nobrainer video games for the price of a used car.
Second, still don't really care how greenhorns can make a Windows PC record anything. I mean I do to some extent like helping people out, or such, but not to the extent to read about it on
Then, let's say there are people out there who use their computers for PVR-like purposes for more years than the supposedly informed writer knew such pieces of hardware exists. Sometimes I just wonder how many useless rants could one write on some evident applications of computers these days and there would be a mass of people who would still buy them as new stuff.
I'm out, hopefully no more
I am putting myself to the fullest possible use, which is all I can think that any conscious entity can ever hope to do.
wake me up when their are directv or dish network compatabile cards. I refuse to give money to charter.
Although neither of these devices can match TiVo completely, they do give you a very cheap alternative
These devices with their budled software can't match TiVo but a good card like the PVR-x50s or a cheap card with a stong CPU can far exceed what TiVo can do in a MythTV setup.
The problem is the $ products tend to avoid things like automatic commercial skip, or worse yet (TiVo) some want to add their own. All this for what? $15 a month
I don't think so...
I was interested in TV tuners and PVR software and so forth for a while, but then I realized that being able to watch and record TV on my computer still does nothing to improve the actual content that passes for entertainment on TV.
I haven't done research yet, but I know Firewire is practically designed to carry video. I have heard that there are a lot of these designed to hook to Firewire, so I'm a bit dissapointed by all three of the reviewed models.
I think anyone who has tried one of these http://www.apple.com/imac/ can't help but think of it as the perfect design for a PVR.
nnooiissee
One aspect of the review mentioned the Indeo codec for one of the devices.
There was also no mention whatsoever of hardware MPEG2 encoding.
If it doesn't encode MPEG2 in hardware, it's not worth buying. Period.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
..the possibility of replicating such features on your Windows PC
Windows PC? You mean Linux or other OSs can't do that task? Well.. MythTV is the killer app and it runs on Linux. While all my Windows apps died waaay too often I'm glad I found a rock solid Linux solution that has impressive list of features.
Its a shame they didn't compare these products against MythTV. I've been using it quite happily for some time on my Linux box equipped with a Hauppage TV card. I suspect it works out cheaper than the options offered in the article and has comparable features to a tivo...
This being /. it would be reasonable to expect a comparison of their ease-of-use under a (for example) RedHat or Debian box, or even BSD.
Anyone know?
Just another "DOJ fascist authoritarian totalitarian bootlicker" -- Zeio
Although neither of these devices can match TiVo completely, they do give you a very cheap alternative
How cheap is it really going to be by the time you've added everything up.
A dual tuner DirecTV tivo with 80 hours space is $100 and $5 a month covers up to 8 of them on an account.
I doubt you can get a pc with sufficient horsepower, storage, and a couple of these capture dongles for that.
This
frankley MPEG is broadcast to me so I dont need to do anything but shunt it down the wires but linux and windows for that matter are really BAD at this becuase of the tuner drivers conexant should be ashamed
sort out the DVB drivers and you make more sales right now anyone who buys anything to do with DVB that is not a Set Top Box gets burned
(the linux drivers are new and in 2.6.10-rc3-bk16 and sothe old truth is once again new = buggy alot of great work is done but more to do )
regards
john jones
most vcrs have perfectly good tuners...if your tv has a composite in just plug a vcr into that and use the vcr to tune channels
If you can repair it yourself then it *might* be worth doing.
However it's unlikely that the problem will jump out at you, and modern tv's use fairly compact circuitry that'll not be easy to work with.
The biggest thing about tivo is that IT JUST WORKS.
I've played around with snapstream and mythtv and they work ok, but getting reliable guide data can be a pain in the ass.
I know i spent more than 1 hour a month trying to keep snapstream running - hence tivo is cheap too.
It more than likely is a problem with cold solder connections on the main circuit board. It can be a very tedious job, but you'll end up saving yourself about $60.00 if you do it yourself. Just remember to unplug the TV.
could they pick some of the crappiest cheeziest bunch of external tuners to test?
What about hauppauge wintv usb 2 or plextor convertX PVR (which has both PC and Mac pvr software)
For internal devices I like the wintv pvr250. Yes the pvr150 is cheaper and comes with a better remote/ir blaster, but the pvr250 is better supported in linux with the ivtv drivers being pretty mature/stable for that card.
*shrug*
rampy
Build Your Own PVR/HTPC news, reviews, &
I don't know what's available on the PC for this. It is known that USB really isn't up to the requirements for streaming video. On the Mac side there the new El Gato EyeTV 500. The choice in Firewire is mostly because it is required for HD video streaming, not to alleviate some USB silliness.
I've tried various hardware/software solutions on Mac and PCs, but as expected nothing was really a TiVo.
I don't know why it took me so long to do this, but I eventually just bought a cheap used TiVo with a lifetime membership (about $200) and hooked it up to my Mac. The benefits are that it's not using any of my 4 internal drives or FireWire/USB ports. It has all the advantages of TiVo...suggested recordings, remote programing, home media, etc... but I view it on one of my monitors either full screen or in a small window.
I can easily transfer shows off and burn to DVD, and since one of my monitors has a secondary ntsc input port, I can always continue to watch even if for some reason I need to restart my Mac. Also no problems if a show is on that needs to be recorded at the same time I might be doing some heavy processing.
I say this almost every day, but Apple should buy TiVo. They could put a FireWire port on the TiVo box and/or create an OS X version of the software...this plus a million other areas of synergy.
Has anyone done this?
Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.
Is there any digital PVR type of machine that I can get without paying the $15/month fee? I'm wanting something to replace my VCR, but without the tapes. I don't want or need it to automatically record "suggested" shows for me. And I don't care about most other frilly Tivo features. I don't have cable TV, and I don't need it to play my MP3s or be connected to the 'net. Just plain-old record channel 4 at 8PM for one hour, etc. I want to pay $250, plug it in, and use it. Is there anything out there like that?
The PVR-150 does not work with the ivtv driver or Myth. It is close to working. According to the mailing list, the audio does not work yet. One developer reported a solution. He has not rolled his code back into the main driver yet.
I hope the PVR-500 becomes supported by ivtv. It has two tuners on a single card, a great gain for people building compact MythTV systems.
Be very careful when purchasing hardware for MythTV. It is a fantastic package, but only with the right hardware.
Does anybody have recommendations for an external Linux-compatible TV tuner with MPEG-2 or MPEG-4 encoding and a High Speed USB2 interface?
isn't this really suited for use in hotel rooms for all those "in-house" movies? How soon before the company outbound sales guys all will want these?
I bought one of these recently. So far, I like it. It does a good job with analog cable too (unencrypted digital cable channels work too but over-the-air is looks better). The worst I can say about it is that there aren't any Linux drivers, AFAIK at least. I save HDTV shows to my Linux server. HDTVtoMPEG2 and related tools work on the saved streams.
;-).
Standard def is so last century
I just picked up a $199 (after rebate) TiVo from Best Buy.. the 80 gig model. Add to the $199 the cost of lifetime subscription to TiVo's programming service ($299).
So yeah $500 is a lot for a glorified VCR... but I have to say that the damn thing is so easy to use it was worth it.
I set the thing up to my wireless network in minutes. Now I can stream MP3s onto it from my server. Photos too.
Sure you can piece your own together using MPEG decoder cards and free (or not) software, but you're gonna spend more time tinkering than you would watching TV. And if you include the price of your computer, you're gonna spend a lot more than the $500 that I did.
Not to mention the thing will never lock up, get a virus, or need to be reinstalled.
-David
Does anybody know if it's possible to save the dvb-t mpeg stream directly on the disk with some dtt pci card?
;)
I read somethere that this is possible for (some?) dvb-s cards.... does it work on dvb-t cards too?
I would prefer saving it rather than re-encoding to mpeg2 while capturing...
Any suggestion for european dvb-t cards that have this feature will be appreciated
My name is Phil Robinson, and I use the Indeo codec like I breathe air! Take that!
I bought my PVR-350 in October, I think. It works fine. I had to take a few poorly documented steps.
Get a newer ivtv driver. As you know, the stable drivers are way out of date. The official ivtv site is worthless for new hardware. I use one of the 0.2.0-rc drivers.
Get a newer kernel for its tuner.c because the newer PVR-350 cards have a new tuner, the LG TAPE iirc. I did not want to recompile the whole kernel. I grabbed tuner.c from 2.6.9, stuck it in my kernel source tree and compiled the modules.
I suggest joining the ivtv-devel mailing list because these drivers are very new and you may benefit from advice if you decide to make your card work under Linux.
I must say I used to do that analog capturing stuff, but even with the top cards, the quality is very sub-par compared to DVB capturing. You loose a lot doing non-prefect mpeg decoding, then passed thru cheap DACs, filters, wiring (and interferences), more filters, ADC (crappy sampling), on-the-fly (not very efficient) encoding... You just loose too much quality, even with much higher file sizes. DVB just works, 100% quality - no loss at all, small file sizes, cpu loads around 1%... It's just all around better. The only thing is, of course you need to have some DVB streams available (I use DVB-S), it won't do a thing for crappy analog cable or the like (I don't know anyone who still uses that).
If not, I'd get a satellite set-top box/PVR dealie. For 300$ cdn, you get one with a 80gb HD in it. It works *out of the box*. No OS install, no patching/upgrading/rebooting, no drivers needed, no setting up the remote control manually for your apps, no codecs required, no PVR software to install, no BSODs, none of that - plug it and it works. And just like DVB capturing, it's lossless (they both record the mpeg from the transportstream).
I've given up on analog capturing about 4 years ago, and I'm NEVER going back to that. I'd do OTA as well if there broadcasts in my area.
///<sig
On the remote chance someone might do this, DON'T. You will get shocked. Picture tubes build up a considerable charge. If you aren't careful (or pull that wire from the side of the tube) you are likely to find that out the hard way.
it's a review for none tech people, not something i would expect to read on slashdot...
there is no clear indication of if they use software or hardware encoding. and no indication of whether they work under mythtv or MS media cneter 2005 edition.
This Sig is removed due to factual inaccuracy
The poster is wrong. USB 2.0 has bandwidth to spare even with an uncompressed HDTV signal, so does Firewire. A regular television signal does not require compression to go over a USB 2.0 or Firewire connection.
A television signal would need to be compressed for 11 Mbps USB 1.1.
Getting TV into the PC is easy. Getting it out is the problem.
It seems the best way is still to get a cheap gf4 with tv out and live with the hideous interferences.
Do you really have to have a TV with VGA in for thousands of dollars ?
I use a Hauppage WinTV PVR USB2 mpeg encoder/tuner. It works great on my 4 year old laptop (600MHz) with a PCMCIA USB2.0 card.
I run it with SageTV, as all the other options I tried (BeyondTV, GB-PVR, etc couldn't handle the older hardware.)
Your hybrid is not saving the environment. Its purpose is to make you feel good about buying something.
I have a cheap DVB-S card (skystar2), a hush Epia M10000 with onboard mpeg2 decoding and use http://www.cadsoft.de/vdr/VDR. There is a plugin to get EPG data. You can control it with a web based interface. A simple command line or a plugin writes recordings to DVD etc. etc.
Useful if you live in Europe
realkiwi
There is enough quality TV anywhere to make it worth it having a device that makes it easy to record it.
Movies, music, documentaries, news (or wahtever rocks your boat).
Elitist people are terribly annoying, when they describe their niche likes one discovers that normally they are as despicably unintersting and boring as the tastes they deride so easily.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
http://ivtv.sourceforge.net/ Join the ivtv-devel mailing list if you want to follow the project and learn about its current status. The project page itself is too far out of date to be very helpful.
http://ivtv.no-ip.com/ The ivtv driver is under heavy development. This site by a developer named Chris Kennedy has newer releases of the driver. 0.2.0-rc works well for me.
Get shocked makes it sound like one of those funfair buzzer things. IF YOU'RE NOT CAREFUL, YOU WILL DIE.