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New Spam Zombies Use ISPs' Mailservers

RMX writes "CNet's reporting that the new spam zombie PCs are no longer acting as their own mailservers, but cooperate with the ISPs' recommendation that instead of running your own mail server, to use theirs instead."

30 of 383 comments (clear)

  1. violation of ISP contract? by Starbreeze · · Score: 4, Funny

    Yeah, and then all those zombies lose their ISP accounts, and suddenly become much more aware of the need to secure their PC.

    1. Re:violation of ISP contract? by xtrvd · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Telus, my ISP in British Columbia (Canada) already takes a fairly agressive stance on this situation. In the past few years, they have realized that their clients are idiots and will open up any attachments they get in their email clients, even those great ones with .scr's from v1agra@sh0p0ur31337store.ch.

      In order to stop their networks from becoming ridden with viruses, they simply closed off the accounts of whom ever was infected. Sure people complained, but in the end, there were more people that were satisfied since their computer only needed to be infected with one virus for them to notice. Instead of having a computer with 20+ self-propagating viruses, the user only had one when they realized they needed it fixed.

      Joe User's seem to ignore popups and slow-downs of their computers as long as they can still connect to the internet and check their AOL email. As soon as they're disconnected, they will call up the ISP and find out how to get their computer fixed.

      If these ISP's can take the same stance against zombies becoming spam servers, it shouldn't be long until Joe User is forced to learn how to use a firewall to protect himself from being disconnected.

      As soon as we have ISP's that are *more* responsible for the content going through their networks, we'll have a better internet.

    2. Re:violation of ISP contract? by CrackerJack9 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That would be great, but for some of the same reasons Joe User isn't already securing his PC is because he doesn't know where to start, let alone how to finish.

      Let's say the ISP tells him to run ZoneAlarm (firewall for PCs), he will most likely end up just saying "Allow always" to any suspicious programs requesting internet access, or "Deny always" and he'll just have to call the ISP back to figure out why Windows can't open any TCP/IP connections....it's a great fix on paper, but I think there are a lot of other factors that need to be considered before you assume you can "just tell them to become computer security experts"

    3. Re:violation of ISP contract? by Seumas · · Score: 4, Interesting

      What kind of crappy ISP delivers messages containing *.SCR, *.CPL, *.COM, *.PIF, *.BAT and so forth to their customers?!

      And yes, Joe User tends to ignore popups, because a lot of the "professionals" are idiots. We have a radio program in Portland on the weekends hosted by some "long time computer experts". Every time the topic of "how to prevent popups" comes up, the host insists that your web browser has NOTHING TO DO WITH IT. Popups are entirely a problem with your machine being infected and you need to install a good virus scanner to avoid them.

      People have called up and said "no, I think they're talking about web popups that you get when you visit a website without a popup blocker". Rather than suggesting people use Firefox or something, he actually says "If you're getting popups, it is because you've done something wrong and aren't protecting your PC". He refuses to acknowledge (and has for many months) that if you visit a website without some form of popup blocker, you'll often encounter popups BECAUSE THE WEBSITE IS SENDING THEM.

      I mean... it baffles me that people like this are being treated like expert professionals and they're misleading thousands of people in the process of pumping up their own misguided ego.

    4. Re:violation of ISP contract? by RollingThunder · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Heck, we had our Telus business ADSL shut down because somebody bounced through a wireless card on an XP laptop that the dumb**** marketing director had enabled the "provide access to the internet" or whatever it is via.

      Our office was only on the 4th floor, and his system was right at the window, so somebody popped through and started doing crap on the Zone servers. Telus cut us off within a day, and I was damned impressed.

      I was angry too - but not at Telus. At the marketing guy and myself (for leaving open outbound access). I fixed his system, and instituted "via proxy only" outbound for port 80, and no more problems.

    5. Re:violation of ISP contract? by xtrvd · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I agree with you on making everybody a security expert. People simply don't have enough time to learn how to use a computer, especially if they just want to check their email on it. But if they cannot use their computer without it causing problems to the rest of us on the internet by being a Spam server, they need to take responsibility somehow.

      I'm going to go on a strech here. It's similar to driving a car (Please note, I said similar, not the same as). You recieve a license to use a car so that you can drive around in a controlled environment where other people reside: The public roadways. You can do what ever you want on your own environemtn (Own PC) just as you can spin doughnuts in your backyard if you really want to.

      You get your license to drive on the public roadways (Networks) and if you choose to not lock your car, then somebody else will steal it and hopefully the police will either take your car away (take your computer away) or they'll take your license away if you were the one actually doing the infraction. (ISP disconnects you from the internet)

      If you are caught doing something bad in a car on public roadways, you should be punished; if you choose to turn on that computer that is not secured in any way, shape, or form, you should not be allowed to take the use it. [Don't yell at me yet]. If you're not prepared to get into a car and harness its abilities, then you'll want to start with a car that's attached to a track, like those ones the 4 year olds use in amusement parks.
      You can consider those tracked cars like Mac's; because with all due respect, you can't become a zombie computer without at least trying.

      Until you learn to use a car, you'll never get a license to use it. Until you learn to use a computer, you shouldn't be on the internet.

      My two cents.
      Thanks for your insightful reply CrackerJack9.

    6. Re:violation of ISP contract? by ErikZ · · Score: 5, Insightful


      Yep. And the great thing about having a licence to use a computer is the immense power it gives the government over you.

      Piss off someone in power? Take away your licence.

      Mistakenly accused? Take away your licence until you clear things up.

      Go up against the latest policial hotbutton that no one takes seriously? To make it serious, they come up with a new punishment. Take away your licence!

      A licence to operate a computer is a horrible, horrible idea.

      --
      Democrats or Republicans. They are both taking us to the same place and they are not afraid of us anymore.
    7. Re:violation of ISP contract? by CrackerJack9 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      While I agree with your post, can we both also agree that "stay between the lines" "obey speed limits" and the like are much more simplistic than some of those you would need to understand to be truly proficient at protecting your home network. I realize, "don't double click that attachment that says it will show boobies if i do" isn't too complicated, but it also takes place in a different realm than driving a car does. Perhaps we should blame culture, simply that computers are relatively new, or even that you don't need a license (to show at least some proficiency and basic rules to follow, like a drivers permit) that there are so many problems that can very easily be avoided. What I don't think is that by making (people who have car accidents or get speeding tickets) them install a program that is quite complicated, (even if considering only the conceptual complications) such as a firewall, will help solve the problem to a reasonable degree. By reasonably, I mean not snatching anyone's computer away simply because they did not run Windows Update hourly. Just like we don't get driving licenses revoked after a single accident or ticket. I'm all for Computer Usage 101 coming with any computer purchase or something in that sense, but ISPs forcing them to install things or improve security beyond their capacity to do so seems unreasonable to me (see parent post/my reply).

    8. Re:violation of ISP contract? by schon · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Telus's attempts at spam control remind me of the keystone cops. They hinder people who know what they're doing, and do *nothing* to stop spam.

      Telus has had its netblocks (including the ones their mailservers are on) blacklisted many, many times - and their respons has been to simply ask for removal, without actually fixing the problem. When their mail servers got blacklisted by Spamcop, their response went something like "well, we're a large ISP, so you should remove the block."

      here is an example of Telus stupidity in action. I've received the *exact same* response from them

      They don't give out static IP addresses (even though they claim they do), instead forcing their customers to use DHCP for their mailservers (yes - even when the customers *PAY* for a static IP address) - and when the addresses change, the customers frequently find themselves in various blacklists.

      If you think that Telus is responsible, you should do a google groups search for them in news.admin.net-abuse.email

    9. Re:violation of ISP contract? by rawg · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Yeah, the police should take your car away if you leave it unlocked. You must live in California.

      Personally I would rather see it this way; if your car is doing something bad, then it should be stopped and not allowed on the road until it's fixed. IE leaking oil on the road, lots of smoke coming out of it, or parts falling off.

      If your driving down the freeway with a 300 feet of linked banners attached to the back of your car, then you should be stopped. Even if you didn't attach those banners to it.

      --
      The above is not worth reading.
    10. Re:violation of ISP contract? by jessecurry · · Score: 4, Informative

      We do this on our campus networks. Basically we get pissed off people calling us and we provide them with a disk containing a virus scanner(McAffee in our case) and some antispyware tools(Ad-aware for now, although MS's adware offering is looking surprisingly promising ATM) and a page with instructions on how to install the software and run the scans.
      The pages even have lovely pictures so the users can't(read: shouldn't be able to once they have removed their heads from their asses) make a mistake.
      When the user think that they are clean we rescan their network traffic and if everything checks out we place them back on the standard network.
      Last year almost the entire campus fell victim to adware, spyware, and virii... this year only a handful. It seems to work. If they get re-infected they lose their internet access again.

      --
      Those who know, do not speak. Those who speak, do not know. ~Lao Tzu
    11. Re:violation of ISP contract? by ThisIsFred · · Score: 4, Interesting
      What kind of crappy ISP delivers messages containing *.SCR, *.CPL, *.COM, *.PIF, *.BAT and so forth to their customers?!

      Probably the kind of ISP that realizes it's a security issue related to Windows, and therefore one of the risks best dealt with by the end user. Editing users' e-mail based on a file extension is stupid anyway. That's probably the same kind of thinking that went on at Microsoft's OS development group when they implemented file-type detection; More specifically, that shallow thinking is what is directly responsible for the Windows vulnerabilities based on extension-only file-type detection and the shell's automatic file association helper.

      So why not stop there? Windows' shellexec helper also attempts to do something with .zip, .wav, .mid and .mp3 extensions. Would you like your ISP to discard those messages automatically? I send a lot of material between work and home in .zip format. I'd change ISPs if some dunderhead was stupid enough to filter my e-mail based on meaningless extensions.

      Jesus, why are we still having this discussion? It's real simple for Microsoft to fix: Make it so any file coming from someplace other than the local filesystems is downloaded to disk only. Or simply give IE and Outlook their own file helper registries, where the default is to just download the file without attempting to open it. People have been setting up their own helper applications in Netscape for years, and no one ever died of exhaustion from the extra work.
      --
      Fred

      "A fool and his freedom are soon parted"
      -RMS
    12. Re:violation of ISP contract? by McNally · · Score: 4, Funny
      Personally I would rather see it this way; if your car is doing something bad, then it should be stopped and not allowed on the road until it's fixed. IE leaking oil on the road, lots of smoke coming out of it, or parts falling off.

      It's not quite clear from context: did you mean "IE" to represent "id est" or "Internet Explorer"?
    13. Re:violation of ISP contract? by NoSuchGuy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Remember:

      1) Never ever let a marketing person configure some hardware!
      2) Never ever let a marketing director use the internet unattended!


      This sounds funny but it is meant seriously!

      --
      Grundgesetz * 23. Mai 1949 - 30. November 2007 - http://www.vorratsdatenspeicherung.de/
    14. Re:violation of ISP contract? by Frank+T.+Lofaro+Jr. · · Score: 4, Interesting

      How about this idea?

      Demonstrate you can use a computer responsibly and you can get an SSL-like certificate from any number of private companies and other organizations saying so.

      People would be free to send email without such a certificate.

      People would also be free to reject any such email. Or accept it, it would be their choice.

      --
      Just because it CAN be done, doesn't mean it should!
  2. Simple solution by MarkRose · · Score: 4, Interesting

    There's a very simple solution that many webhosting companies already use -- the ISP should force their users to authenticate with the server, using secure SSL. It's good practice any way, and doing so would make even more work for the spam bots (they would have to find the user's login and password for the SMTP server).

    --
    Be relentless!
    1. Re:Simple solution by kerrle · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Or the bots could ignore that, and just send out with the default mail settings - most users would have OE set to remember password, so no real gain there.

    2. Re:Simple solution by Osty · · Score: 4, Informative
      It's a shame that people are so attached to their horrid Microsoft Outlook email client. Otherwise, two problems could be solved in one fell swoop: Have users SSH into the ISP email server, and use a simple client like Pine to send and receive their email.
      First, this setup would enforce strong user authentication, as the parent wisely suggested. Secondly, it would eliminate that whole host of attacks against bad email clients (eg. Outlook) that the average computer user inexplicably blames on their ISP.

      I'm going to assume you mean "Outlook Express" when you say "Outlook", otherwise your argument has no merit. Even then, Outlook Express isn't as bad as you make it out to be. For example, both Outlook and OE support SMTP-AUTH, via SSL or not (as well as both POP3 and IMAP-v4 over SSL). That addresses your first problem, which at this point is an ISP issue rather than an MTA issue. Your second point is really only valid for OE, and then only if you've never bothered to use Windows Update (in which case you're asking for other problems anyway). Outlook has blocked bad attachments since a service pack for Outlook 2000 (there have been two versions of Outlook since then, XP/2002 and 2003). Outlook 2003 (which is the only version I have installed right now, so I can only speak to other versions on memory) will also block malicious content in the body of the message itself (scripts, images linked to external sites, etc). If you're still getting infected by email viruses while using Outlook, you're either running a ridiculously old version, or you're explicitly overriding Outlook's protection mechanisms.

      Moving everybody back to pine (or better, mutt, but that's my own personal preference) via ssh is not an acceptable solution. Forcing everybody through a webmail interface is only slightly better, but even that is not very desirable (see the new Outlook Live service from Microsoft that lets you read your hotmail email via Outlook rather than the web page, or RPC over HTTP in Exchange 2003 that lets you access corporate email without a VPN rather than using OWA).

    3. Re:Simple solution by mcc · · Score: 5, Funny

      Otherwise, two problems could be solved in one fell swoop: ... use Pine

      But then they would have a third problem.

  3. Many ISP mail servers get blacklisted now? by enosys · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Will many ISP SMTP servers get automatically blacklisted because of this?

  4. This is easier to solve by digitalgimpus · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Unlike when they did it on the clients, this puts it through a limited number of gates.

    ISP's will likely start limiting outbound email to x email/hr. Companies and ISP's will likely start monitoring and kill quicker.

    This will benefit spammers for a very short period, then bite them in the ass.

    ISP's and companies aren't going to tolerate a spike in CPU usage, and possible blacklisting if they can take care of it. They will start blocking IP's from sending mail, etc. etc.

  5. Re:Why aren't they using SMTP-AUTH? by PornMaster · · Score: 4, Informative

    Not only does it authenticate the user, it also provides a way to revoke authorization on a per-user basis in a way that still allows the user to receive a mail explaining why they're unable to send mail -- simply shutting off the user's internet access doesn't do this, and putting in ACLs to block only port 25 from their IP probably isn't practical on many ISPs' infrastructures.

  6. can we expand the war on terra to include spammers by trolluscressida · · Score: 5, Funny

    I would love to see a Special Ops unit bust down the walls of a spammer's house, beat him, gag him, beat him again, send him to Guantanomo Bay for eternity, and than C-4 the spam servers.

    Everyone should write their congressmen requesting this.

  7. Re:Zombie trick expected to send spam sky-high - t by hunterx11 · · Score: 4, Funny

    If you're karma whoring, at least have the decency to format your text. Only some people hate whores, but everybody hates ugly whores.

    --
    English is easier said than done.
  8. Email Meltdown my ass by mg2 · · Score: 5, Funny

    If we just switched to a secure email system (SSL/TLS, or whatever), a lot of these dumb problems would go away.

    Yes, I know some mail clients don't support this functionality, but come on. Name one of the modern clients that won't do it. Thunderbird, Mail.app, Eudora, Outlook ... they all know how.

    I suppose then you just have to convince users. This, though, should be the easiest part:

    Dear User,
    This email is to notify you that your neighbor has been recieving your monthly e-bank statements and password confirmation emails because you are stubborn and insist on using insecure email protocols.

    Incidentally, we'd like to thank you for your subscription to DAILY LESBIAN ACTION MAIL!!!1

  9. We're winning by SiliconEntity · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is the best sign yet that we're winning the war on spam. This is exactly what measures like SPF were designed to induce - forcing zombies to go through the ISP rather than sending mail themselves.

    Now all the ISPs have to do is to filter and detect sudden jumps in email traffic. It will be easy for them to detect systems which have been infected. This will catch the small number of users who suddenly start running high volume email lists from their home systems, but those cases will be few enough that they can be dealt with manually.

    This is the beginning of the end for the zombie spam problem!

  10. Re:Unnamed processes by rusty0101 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That presumes that the process name will be pre-defined. We already have viruses that generate a new name for their executable, or library, and use that name to modify the workstation or server's database to automatically launch it each time the computer is rebooted. If this virus also is generating spam, it will be run with the process name of the executable or library, and at best you will see a process name that you don't recognize. Considering the fact that a significant percentage of the population of computer users do not even know how to bring up the task list, much less know what each process that normally runs is, is named, or does, telling them to kill off any process that looks like 'libraryname0.dll' is not going to be particularly helpful.

    Your best bet is to find a personal firewall that asks you if application x is allowed to generate network traffic. Hopefully the firewall will tell you more, such as the type of traffic the application is attempting to generate, but even that can be more information than a general user is prepared to try to asses.

    If your firewall tells you that 'tobmaps.exe' is trying to send e-mail to your isp's mail server, you might tell it no, don't allow that sort of traffic. If it tells you that 'tobmaps.exe' is attempting to connect to login.yahoo.com via http, you might inadvertantly allow it, even though login.yahoo.com is the first step towards sending e-mail through Yahoo.

    In most cases however you can probably tell your personall firewall to block all traffic to any IRC network, unless you speicifically approve the app, and know what you are doing. Of course over time spambots are going to move on from IRC channels to Instant Messaging services, to various p2p applications, if they haven't already.

    Saying 'kill off any process named xyz-abc.exe' is all well and good, but is probably going to be a one shot solution to a small subset of the people infected with a spambot.

    -Rusty

    --
    You never know...
  11. Re:Eh? Because... by kd3bj · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Why didn't they think of it earlier?

    Because I suspect it doesn't work as well. It's pretty easy for an ISP to notice 100,000 emails from one sender pumping through their SMTP server, but relatively difficult to notice those mails when sent directly through the net. Also, outgoing servers are often set up with throttling.

    Of course, nowadays, ISP's have no excuse in either scenario. There are plenty of network monitoring tools that will notice spamming.

  12. RFC 2476 by tepples · · Score: 5, Informative

    I have a lot of customers that go on the road ... They just leave the SMTP set to us, and we have secure logins. Voila. Oh, but we can't use port 25 because a lot of ISPs block it.

    You're using SMTP AUTH over TLS on port 587/tcp per RFC 2476, right? ISPs have fewer legitimate reasons (if any) to block 587/tcp out than 25/tcp out.

  13. Law is the answer and the answer is law! by D4C5CE · · Score: 4, Informative
    Right below "TFA", there's a link to Yet Another Interesting Article.

    Just take a look at the statistics:

    Europe has only had strict laws against junk communications for two years (Article 13 of Directive 2002/58/EC), they have only been in full force since November 2003 (and the provisions for criminal penalties are not even in place in each and every corner of the European Union yet) - but they mean pure and simple opt-in, and look how this continent's "spam output" already has become almost completely insignificant.

    The U.S., I'm afraid to say, have put next to nothing in the way of these sociopaths: only a now-you-CAN-SPAM-more-than-ever Act that lives up to its name in the worst of ways, by legalizing most of the spam, enacting an unworkable opt-out onus on the users, and putting anti-spam warriors at the legal risk of interfering with (and being taken to court by the operators of) what is considered a legitimate "business model" except for some of the worst abuses - and for however little it is, all of this even an entire decade too late.

    Reliance on technical solutions and minimal government intervention is just fine for many things - but it's failed in the fight against spam.

    Here is how to do it:

    Where the rights of the users and subscribers are not respected, national legislation should provide for judicial remedies. Penalties should be imposed on any person, whether governed by private or public law, who fails to comply with the national measures taken under this Directive.
    (...)
    "electronic mail" means any text, voice, sound or image message sent over a public communications network which can be stored in the network or in the recipient's terminal equipment until it is collected by the recipient.
    (...)
    The use of automated calling systems without human intervention (automatic calling machines), facsimile machines (fax) or electronic mail for the purposes of direct marketing may only be allowed in respect of subscribers who have given their prior consent.
    (...)
    In any event, the practice of sending electronic mail for purposes of direct marketing disguising or concealing the identity of the sender on whose behalf the communication is made, or without a valid address to which the recipient may send a request that such communications cease, shall be prohibited.
    That's certainly nowhere near rocket science, and if the above looks a bit complicated, that's probably just because
    • a directive is a (binding) template for lawmakers in all of the European Union's member states
    • necessarily, the legal techniques as well as the "Legalese" itself vary between jurisdictions
    • this is a great one-ban-fits-all provision that outlaws each and every flavor of spam at once
    "First Amendment" implications: zero (and yes, of course there is freedom of speech in this part of the world as well, and even more of that speech could be heard if it wasn't drowned out by American spam - some of which comes relayed thru Asia of course) - it only bars some people from "pissing in everyone else's pool", but certainly not from speaking their mind!

    There is nothing wrong with following an example that works so well, even if it is from Europe...

    Call your congresscritter now to outlaw unsolicited commercial communications, place a hefty fine and jail time on the offenders, and put an end to these abuses before they put an end to eMail itself.