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Can India Become A Knowledge Superpower?

Posted by CmdrTaco on from the something-to-think-about dept.

krsmathews writes " New Scientist, in its latest issue, has a special report on India. It provocatively calls India the next knowledge superpower, though in a introductory story the caveats are laid out. It's a reasonably comprehensive look at India's high-tech research, pharma, bio-tech, space, and nuclear industries. The U.S. R&D expenditure is bigger than the next five countries put together, and India is nowhere in the picture. "

14 of 568 comments (clear)

  1. off-shoring by kloidster · · Score: 4, Interesting

    What I've been saying all along. We are telling brain-power to stay over there in India, rather than come over here to the United States. I wonder what it would be like if people like Vinod Khosla were told to work over there and don't come here to innovate.

  2. What about China? by mOoZik · · Score: 5, Interesting

    It has everything going for it. Growing economy, a collection of research labs of U.S. and domestic companies, and a desire to pace with and outdo anything the West can throw at it. I'd put my money on China before I put it on India.

    --
    A blog like any other.
    1. Re:What about China? by aacool · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Democracy and free markets seem to be better, in the long run, at fostering growth than totalitarian regimes, IMHO

    2. Re:What about China? by kaalamaadan · · Score: 4, Interesting
      In the absence of any corrective measures, I am sure even India can be like China. It has been acquiring a steady 6-7% growth rate for the past 5 years. That may not sound impressive next to China, but it is impressive when you consider that it is the *consensus* growth rate - not the huge urban-rural divide that China touts as progress.

      As a case in point, In Andhra Pradesh, the previous Chief Minister, Chandrababu Naidu transformed Hyderabad from nowhere to one of the centres of the tech glitz in India. Meanwhile, in the villages, Andhra farmers were in miserable condition - 3000 farmers committed suicide in the past four years. The farmers never forgave; Come election time, they did not forget to cast their vote. Out went Chandrababu. It was beautiful to see democracy triumph over J.P. Morgan. The same thing happened in the neigbouring Bangalore.

      There cannot be glitzy progress ignoring 75% of the people.

      Of course, this means that in the eyes of the financial analysts, India is not as lucrative as China. But, I am proud of the progress that my country is making. At least, we don't have to sweep unpleasant facts under the carpet.

    3. Re:What about China? by sfjoe · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I'd put my money on China before I put it on India.

      That remains to be seen. China's healthcare system is collapsing and, along with massive pollution, threatening to put a damper on much of the expected growth (this is Morgan-Stanley speaking, not me). China's problems reallly have no precedent so it's too soon to say whether they will be able to become anything more than a massive consumer.

      --
      It's simple: I demand prosecution for torture.
    4. Re:What about China? by YrWrstNtmr · · Score: 4, Interesting
      Likewise, the American attempt to knock down Iraq has proven to be misguided, since they had no plan for what was going to follow it.

      Jebus! The results from the first relatively free Iraqi election only came in a few days ago. Let's give the process some time to work out before it's declared 'proven to be misguided'.

      It's OK for freedoms in China to be "slow in coming", but not in Iraq? Why?

  3. The diaspora already is by __aadkms7016 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    The Indian diaspora, like the China diaspora, is already a knowledge superpower -- as a look at the nationalities of the IEEE Fellows, the US NAS and NAE, and the equivalent academies in other countries will attest. All we're discussing here is the current mailing address of the talent.

  4. And? by mindstormpt · · Score: 5, Interesting
    The US R&D expenditure is bigger than the next five countries put together, and India is nowhere in the picture.
    Money != Brains.

    It does seem that Money = Arrogance though.
  5. Corporate funding for R&D in school by 1tsm3 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    As long as the corporate funding for R&D in schools is as low as it is now in India, I don't think India (not Indians) will ever become a Knowledge superpower. I'm an Indian who is now in the U.S. It's just amazing on how many new things the undergrads in the US can work on when compared to how little the grads in India can work on. The difference is in extremes. Here in the U.S, even small univs undergrad team builds solar cars, in India, even the grads don't get enough money to work on something useful. Most of it is theory in India. Sad, but true. I wish corporates in India put enough money into R&D in Indian schools.

    --
    -ItsME
  6. cost of doing business by freshfromthevat · · Score: 5, Interesting

    In my experience (USA working with OEMs doing high tech products) the cost of doing business with Indian Engineers is too high. They have a long (45 day) import delay for prototype hardware. The engineers who hire with companies I'm familiar with stay for training and then jump jobs. The communications difficulties (time shifted from USA offices) and language/cultural difficulties (different holidays, different work culture) make doing business awkward and less efficient than working with rural Americans (for instance).

    Eventually Indian companies will run their own engineers and see some efficiencies that way. Then USA OEMs could see some serious competition. The only thing that would hold Indian OEMs back is internal costs of doing business, duties, taxes, crime, limitations on cooperation due to secrecy, government corruption, etc.. . Like here in the USA. The top dog world wide is going to be the country with the greatest efficiencies of doing business. Time will tell.

    --
    .. Blub falls right in the middle of the abstractness continuum. -- Paul Graham
  7. I liked this one... by bogaboga · · Score: 5, Interesting
    [...]The US R&D expenditure is bigger than the next five countries put together, and India is nowhere in the picture."

    This I should mention includes inflated costs and bribes for bureaucrats. The Russians do much more and produce very durable space and nuclear equipment for less than one-third of our cost as Americans. This same reasoning presumes that if an individual lives on less than a dollar a day, they must be very badly off. I visited Uganda where a meal costing 4 US dollars was more than enough for me for two days!

    Yes, India can and will be superpower whether we like it or not. It's not how much money one spends guys. The latest Russian aircraft costs less than half as much as our most advanced one, yet delivers more power and is even easily maintained. I wish our politicians get this into their heads.

  8. A growing kid by argoff · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I like to look at India like my precious daughter. She is growing 5 times faster than I am now, but she will likely not grow taller than I for quite awhile. The fundamental things holding back the USA are taxes, regulations, intellectual "property" restrictions, and just plain too much restrained freedom.

    Eventually India will reach these barriers too, and so will the rest of the world until someone finds out how to persue and implement the "next generation" of freedoms. So even though they might eventually outsize the US because of sheer population - they will probably not surpass it per/capita until the next frontier of freedom is reached. (it will probably be ocean based communities in international waters)

  9. As Someone who just came back from India... by AnyLoveIsGoodLove · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I took a trip to the south of India (Kerala, Banglore, and Channai (Madras). I spent a month and for the most parts avoided the tourist areas. My inlaws live far away from the nearest town in Kerala.

    discoslure:

    I'm a 31 year old white male whose worked in the computer industry since I graduated from college.

    A few General Observations:

    What India has going for them....

    1) I've never seen a country so utterly focused on education (remember I spent my time in the South). Education is the only way out for Indians. The pressure is unbelievable for young people to perform in school. Everywhere you go you see signs for schools / education

    2) English is spoken fluently among the college educated. English is the language of business in the south (in major cities, white collar type of work) b/c there are 19 "official" languages with an unbelievable number of dialects. Combine with the business process outsourcing (BPO), and you get a lot of focus around English language skills. I tried to learn the local dialect, but everyone wanted to practice English...

    3) India graduates over 1 M engineers a year. There schools are extremely competitive. Areas such as Kerala have a 100% literacy rate, this meets or exceeds any Western country...

    4) Motivation and drive. It's amazing what people will do to better themselves. This motivation and drive provides the foundation for the above. Spending a week in Bangalore was absolutely refreshing (and the food was great). To see all the young people full of life and excited was contagious... I can't wait to go back. I love seeing all the tech companies signs....

    5) Economics. The largest middle class in the World, in sheer numbers. In India, it takes 2,000 USD a year to achieve a middle class lifestyle, that's ~1,500 EUR and ~1200 UK sterling. This middle class will drive the world's manufacturers to provide low priced quality goods, and the whole world will benefit.

    6) Politics. Democracy works, although its not neccessarliy the kind the US imagines. A diverse group of cultures / languages get a long in a basic sense. Is it perfect no, but it gives me hope for places like Iraq.

    What Challenges are ahead for India

    1) Education: The focus on engineering has led to a culture that is not entrepreneur focused. It takes a diverse set of skills to move out of the BPO / Manufacturing mindset. Take Apple's IPOD. It took American design and a world wide supply chain to make this happen. The key is the design. That's what makes a product sell, manufacturing is important, but if you don't move up the chain, you will always have difficultly. Note to engineers: Get jobs that are customer facing and can't be outsourced...

    2) Gaps There are 100's of Millions still in dire poverty and extreme education. If the middle class and the rich get too far ahead of the rest of the country, I think there will be a lot of social unrest.

    3) Environment. India is a shit hole to put it nicely. If they don't clean up sooner rather than later, India will face a lot of health care cost for the population. Also, in Kerala, fresh water is an issue.

    It's the old problem of changing mindsets. The tech version is a company that sold hardware and now wants to sell software or services only. Its huge change and most fail.

    That's it I look forward to replies to others who have been to the south and I'm curious what your opinions are...

    I loved it and I can't wait to go back......

    --
    "It's technical in a psychometric kind a way" -- C. Parish
  10. Europe publishes twice as many science papers by Cryofan · · Score: 4, Interesting
    According to this study, the so-called "social democracies" of Europe do far better at publishing peer-reviewed papers when you compare them to America on a per-capita basis. The social democracies of Belgium, Denmark, Finland, the Netherlands, Sweden and Switzerland published 2 papers in peer-reviewed journals for every 1 by America, when you correct for population. Here is a news story covering the study.


    The above mentioned countries have a population of 53 million and generated 12.7% of papers, while America, with a population of 288M, published 34%.


    One might speculate whether the social democracies with their high taxes and well-funded universities do more hardcore research. Here in America it seems that research is aimed more at the low-lying, commercially-viable fruit.

    --
    eat shiat and bark at the moon