TDA (Tactile Digital Assistant) the new PDA?

imashoe writes "BonaFideReviews has just posted an article on the latest thumb-powered up-and-coming mobile device, the TDA (Tactile Digital Assistant), a possible replacement to the PDA."

Comments

not yet

[mschoolbus]

As if some PDAs aren't quirky enough...

Re:not yet

[ergo98]

As if some PDAs aren't quirky enough...

On top of that, to the best of my knowledge PDA doesn't stand for Pstylus Digital Assistant. A PDA is, by definition, a small portable electronic device to storing and accessing information. This is a PDA turned sideways with an interface that uses large buttons navigable by thumb.

Woot!

Re:not yet

[Unkle]

This is a PDA turned sideways with an interface that uses large buttons navigable by thumb.

In fact, I usually use my fingers to do much of anything with my PDA (Palm-OS based). It's just that this is meant for the thumbs, while my palm is not (necessarily, the buttons are certainly big enough that I'm sure it was a design consideration). In fact, I only use my stylus for entering text (which is a topic this article did not seem to address--how did they implement text entering?) and playing Solitare. And the only reason I use the stylus for solitare is because the program itself seems to have been designed for use with the stylus.

IMHO, this really isn't a new product, anyway. It's an evolution of the PDA, not a replacement. I've personally been expecting PDAs to more or less drop the stylus for regular day-to-day activities, but keep it around for high-precision activities. Getting text entry out of this high-precision set is the goal, and hopefully this device achieves it.

And....?

[Morphix84]

Big deal. Engadget was Talking about this last year

Re:And....?

[sych]

I don't see any sign of a review - this seems to just be the marketing information with the word "review" placed above it. Nowhere do they say they have actually even seen a unit, nor do they give any of their own opinions about the device. One thing you have to say about the company is that they sure do seem to succeed (repeatedly) in getting editors into a lather over nothing at all.

again?

[DeusExMalex]

wasn't this posted a while back with the conclusion that these things were a hoax?

Nothing to see here, move along

[Kimos]

First it was the Smart-phone that threatened to oust the PDA but now the PDA looks to take on the TDA.

As much as it would be nice to not have to fumble with a stylus, I wouldn't say that it's threatening to push out the PDA. You're just replacing one pointing device with a much more imprecise pointing device... *looks at wide thumb*

RE: I think my bro makes boards for these things.

[fshalor]

All I can say is, the're good hardware. Considering the're being built with the same machines that were used to make the SINgars for the tanks and helicopters. :)

I've played with a few finished units, and would buy one over the cheap feeling palms these days any time.

Not exactly novel...

[FalconZero]

Like everyone else, I've been using touchscreen PDAs with my thumb since I had a Casio Cassiopia E-100 years ago. Granted this TDA can take two touches at the same time, but I work my PC with one mouse, and I don't think two would make me any more productive to have two.

I use my Sony Erricson P900 every day with my thumb.

I'm also unimpressed by the 4.5 colours that the display claims to have (according to TFA). I gave up CGA years ago!
However (again according to TFA), being able to run on a single AA battery for weeks sounds like the best invention in the last 10 years! They should just licence the power control circuit technology and make millions :P

Re:Not exactly novel...

[zerkon]

The battery life stems in part from the fact that it is a B/W screen. Adding the Color screen option chops that down to "a few hours"

Who uses them?

[markmcb]

Does anyone really use PDA-type devices? I work for a large organization and run around to meetings and all that jazz, but I never have the use for one. I even received a free PDA once, but just threw it in my closet never really using it. If you've got a laptop and you've got a cell phone, is there any need for a PDA?

Re:Who uses them?

[JaredOfEuropa]

If you've got a laptop and you've got a cell phone, is there any need for a PDA?

I might do away with my PDA if someone will invent a cellphone with good PDA functionality in it... or rather if I could take calls on my PDA, I'd throw away my phone.

The reason is that I always have my PDA with me, so I can always access (and update!) my phone book, address list, to do list, notes and agenda. This functionality exists on phones but it's crap, especially when it comes to updating the info. Laptops are too bulky. A paper agenda is an option, but unlike my PDA I cannot easily back it up, and paper to-do lists and address lists don't really work.

So the answer is yes: I do really use my PDA, and I cannot think of another device or method to take its place. It does nothing I could not really do by other methods, but it's a godsend for doing these things timely, neatly and without much effort.

Re:Who uses them?

[gManZboy]

The real question is: If you've got a PDA/Phone (Blackberry, Treo, etc) is there anny need for a laptop? I'd much rather cary around a Treo than a laptop and phone to my meetings.

Re:Who uses them?

[WinterSolstice]

I'll bite, though I have to say this is one of those "use it or don't" kind of things... lots of people sit on both sides.

I use one. I live on it. It has saved my butt more times than I care to recall, and it is the only posession I have that I literally can't function properly without.

Why?

Well, I have a really high-end handheld (the iPaq 5550), with a 1GB SD card. Bluetooth, 802.11b, fingerprint scan, autobackup, swappable battery pack, etc. I use it with a keyboard and recorder at meetings. I sync all of my work on it at 30 minute intervals all day long. Wirelessly, of course. And by all of my work, I mean it literally. It contains every line of code, every document, every script, and every "critical" tool I have ever used. I keep the whole thing encrypted, and set to nuke after 3 invalid login attempts (fingerprint + password). The files are maintained in their native formats (Unix or VMS for the most part, but lots of cross platform files like PDF, HTML, etc. Also all the Office cruft). It's basically a subnotebook on demand. I have a foldout keyboard, and some additional memory cards. I carry them when I need them, and added up they still weigh less than a small laptop.

I have peformed emergency DB restores from my sailboat and (in one case) a restaurant. I have used it to tweak vacation photos. I use it to keep notes. I use it to write code or docs while waiting for other things. I listen to music on it. I use it to navigate. I read e-books daily.

I was hired at my most recent position largely because I was able to instantly tap my entire code and documentation library. When I say "Oh, I've done that before", it means give me five minutes, and I'll have it. Not "let me remember how that worked". When I moved 9 hours away and lived in a hotel, I had my entire database of information no further than my hip.

Oh, and since lots of people like to say "Well, what if it dies/gets run over/dropped overboard/etc?" The answer is simple. It backs up every morning at 04:00, and the backup is transmitted to 3 seperate servers. I do a manual backup daily at lunchtime (to CD as well as the other sites), and small autobackups happen every 30 minutes. For this data to "die" would require 3 seperate servers, the CDs, and my handheld to all choke at once.

I'm extremely paranoid with the data because it *is* my livlihood. Sure, I could operate without it, and for 3 months I had to when I was between devices. That brief experience proved the usefulness of it.

I had another experience where my laptop died last year. Corporate policy was to store data on the common drive and the laptop, and sync it. Unfortunately, this only applied to 100MB we were allowed to store on the server. What about the rest? Well, handheld to the rescue. There was the rest of my data, and I was back in business within 20 minutes (USB 1.x) on an old desktop.

So yes, some people really do use them.

-WS

Re:Who uses them?

[selfsealingstembolt]

If you've got a laptop and you've got a cell phone, is there any need for a PDA?

Well, if you do not want to drag a laptop around and still have some computing power with you, there is a need. Besides the obvious (calendering, address book, todos, ...) I use my iPAQ as MP3 Player (1 GB SD card), for running emulators (NES, SNES, GameBoy, Atari, ScummVM, ...), as mobile storage device and to check EMails (in combination with my mobile).

Yes, I could do that with my mobile, a Gameboy, a MP3Player and with a portable HDD, but why not have all in one device?

And Smartphones are, at least IMHO, the worst of the bunch. Why? I have a phone to make calls and maybe to send/recieve SMS'. If I wanted it to be a PDA, I'd buy one (what I did). Smartphones either have a large display and are too bulky to have them on you all the time OR have display far too small to be useful as PDA-replacement. Also, my mobile (a Siemens M45 - outdoor) is nearly indestructible and has a long battery life. If it had a high-res display and a 200Mhz CPU that would change.

Re:Who uses them?

[rob_squared]

And you don't have to be a uber poweruser to find it useful. I go to a university in boston and for just about all my classes I type my notes with a stowaway keyboard. When I'm between classes I can do homework in word format and email it using wifi, my phone's bluetooth, or an rj45 jack on campus. Aside from that its great for books and reviewing class notes. It plays music when i fail to recharge my ipod. And lastly it keeps all my addresses and #s. If I need to make a call i beam it via bluetooth and answer it with a bt headset. Oh, and it has a good enough calender to help me remember birthdays and spontaneous class meetings.

The ultimate

[chadwbennett]

The only PDA I will ever buy will have:

1) Cell Phone
2) Bluetooth
3) A good megapixal camera / video camera
4) more than 20 gigs of memory for the movies and pictures and MP3s
5) One that can wipe my booty

I sure hope apple comes out with one of these. In a couple of years

Get your free MAC MINI

Re:The ultimate

[winkydink]

You want something that you can wipe your butt with and then hold against your face to speak into like a cell phone?

Different strokes for different folks, I guess.

Star Trek anyone?

[Killjoy_NL]

The first thing I thought of was the "Padd" from Star Trek. Those things might become more realistic if they can be cheaply built.

But after reading the advertisement (you can't call it an article IMHO) I saw that we have a long way to go.

I think I've seen this before

[Dark Paladin]

Perhaps even in a Slashdot port (but I won't call "dupe" yet).

It does look interesting, but my #1 worry: thumbprints. It's just part of my nature, but when I'm working on something with a screen, I get pissed off when I see all the grimy greasy thumbprints all over it marring my view.

Of course, I'm going to have to see how well this argument stands up as I look into buying a Treo and worry about how my thumbs will mess up the surface.

This is the Jackito...

[david.given]

...which has been covered here before, back in June 2004, in this and this article (both submitted by Roland Piquepaille. YHBW.)

Hmm. June. I'm surprised this hasn't moved along a bit more since then, it looks like a nice little device. However, it does actually seem possible to order the thing, now, from their rather naff website, although the price ranges from 600 USD for the cheapest version to a staggering 3500 USD if you want all the accessories.

There's a good collection of add-ons, though --- anybody actually thinking of ordering one?

screw tactile...

[Edzor]

i want a Tactical Digital Assistant! mmmm cruise missiles at the touch of a mobile button.

No Thanks

[Sheepdot]

From TFA:
The Jackito doesn't come with character recognition software built-in.

I'll stick with my Speak-N-Spell, thank-you-very-much.

Nintendo DS ads were right?

[the_skywise]

It's good to touch?

I'm waiting...

[curtisk]

until they make one that use elbows for input, once technology catches up with that concept, I'm THERE!!

Thumb prints

[rf0]

Am I the only one that find using tuoch screens without a stylus or similar is that you end up with a greasy screen?

Rus

That would be "other people"

[sczimme]

Does anyone really use PDA-type devices? I work for a large organization and run around to meetings and all that jazz, but I never have the use for one.

Ah, yes - the "I am the world" fallacy. You are not a statistically significant sample set, so your assessment of something as !useful does not actually mean that the item is !useful.

Anecdotal evidence: observe other people in the meetings; examine the sales statistics for PDA vendors; observe the myriad PDA options at your local electronics or office-supply store. Obviously there is a market for PDAs, and here is why:

Laptop: the most features; more weight; larger footprint; generally shorter battery life [compared to PDAs or phones]

Phone: far fewer features than laptops; much less weight than a laptop

PDA: in most categories (features, weight, size, power consumption) the PDA occupies a niche between laptop and phone

Re:That would be "other people"

[markmcb]

Ah, yes - the "I am the world" fallacy. You are not a statistically significant sample set, so your assessment of something as !useful does not actually mean that the item is !useful.

[Insert Proper Southern Accent] Sir, I applaud you for insight. The world is ablaze with your firey intellect.

I seldom see people use PDAs for much more than address books. I know tons of people who own them, but very few that actually use them. I also understand the differences between a phone, PDA, and computer. I just fail to see why you'd spend the cash on a PDA when you can get a very small, light weight, battery efficient laptop for not much more money that does so much more for you.

Re:That would be "other people"

[trentblase]

Some of us would like to replace the pens, paper, books, etc with a single pocket-sized device.

Extremely Underpowered

[cbulock]

I'll start by saying that I have never actually seen one of these devices in person since they haven't been released. But I did do some research into the specfics of this machine and posted that info here: http://www.cbulock.com/2004/07/jackito_tactile_dig ital_assistant.html
Some of the highlights:

The base unit, $600. Oh, but you wanted color? Not included, an extra $138. And what about the wireless capabilities? Also, not included. Bluetooth, an extra $80, WiFi, another $150 on top of that. Would you like a camera, add on another $100. So, just for a decent PDA, and by that I mean color screen and WiFi, this device is already going to cost $888.

The main CPU is a Mitsubishi CPU (M30803) and from what I can find, that tops out at 20MHz. The other "CPU" mentioned is the Texas Instruments CPU (MSP 430), a 50 cent processor that, while it has low power consumption, doesn't seem to be all to powerful. Couldn't find any specs other that it's a 16-bit processor. Seems that it's mainly used to perform simple tasks such as controlling an LCD screen. The other "CPU's" mentioned are simply programmable logic chips probably also used to control other simple functions on the device such as sound and video. So, there are just a number of simple microchips all performing basic tasks to power this device. Every PDA or computer has a number of chips that back up the main CPU to perform tasks.

Nice description

[UnknowingFool]

TDA (Tactile Digital Assistant)

Back in my day, we used to call them secretaries.
Thanks, I'll be here all week. Try the veal.

Not Created Equal

[Nom du Keyboard]

relies entirely on your thumbs for input, which are harder to lose than a stylus.

That above is worth Insightful+1.

But what I want to know is, does it come with a settable thumbsize? All thumbs are not created equal. Given the many attributes of my mouse that I can reconfigure, does this let me set thumb-size, thumb-pressure, thumbprint...

Thumbprint. Now that would be a great security feature. It knows my thumbs from everyone elses. That alone would make it worth buying, but I didn't see that feature listed yet.

$50 million to develop?

[bedok77]

The GUI looks like it cost only $5.

Touch screen = Dirty screen

[netsavior]

Seriously, ever lose your stylus and use a finger? If the "Future" is thumb input and STILL no usable keyboard, we are just spinning our tires. I see no advantage to this device other than obvious and lame "Thumbs are harder to lose than a stylus" from TFA. I have *gasp* a pocket pc based PDA and I can say that the snap-on keyboard I use for my PDA took it from "Toy" to "Tool" and the fold out keyboard took it from "Good enough for email" to "Perfect for working out of an airport". With a PDA I carry it, a WiFi card, 2 keyboards and a charger and I am good to go for business travel (sounds like a lot, but it all fits in my jacket pocket). With a TDA the ONLY difference would be I would also have to carry a cleaning cloth and some cleaning solution so that I could read the screen, however since there are no applications or SDK for the TDA, I would not be able to get work done anyway, so I guess I could just leave it all at home.

Tactile?

[slim]

This seems like the very opposite of "tactile" to me. I used to own a programmable A/V remote with a touch screen, and I never got on with it because there was no touch feedback. I wanted to feel where the buttons were, and whether I was pressing it.

There's scope to invent a tactile screen which would achieve this: "touch pixels" ("tixels"?) that can rise or lower under software control.

Either product is BS or article grossly wrong

[Dan East]

Many facts stated in the article cannot possibly be correct:

It feeds on a single AA battery, which according to the company, can sustain for several weeks.

Pretty good battery life for device with "seven processors" and a 320x240 display.

The Jackito measures 140 x 80 x 16 mm

AA batteries have a diameter of 14.5 mm. That leaves less than 1 mm thickness for the case on either side of the battery. The unit would have to be thicker than 16 mm.

a large 4.5 color QVGA LCD fingertip touch-screen

4.5 color? The pictures of the device show what appears to be a black and white screen, so perhaps that is 4 level grayscale.

2.5 MB SRAM

That reduces the capability of the device to legacy Palm-type functionality. How can that compete with new multimedia Pocket PCs with 128 MB RAM that even sport hardware accelerated 3D?

The Jackito is available for sale on www.jackito.com at a list price of 600

$600 for a PDA without a color screen, only 2.5 MB RAM, no integrated WiFi or bluetooth, and is not compatible with either Palm or Pocket PC?

Also Novinit says that the finger's contact area is hundred times larger than that of a stylus and a stylus exerts hundred times more pressure on the screen than a finger.

First, I've never had a problem breaking the screens of my PDAs with the stylus. Second, they are out-right admitting that you can't achieve the same precision using your finger as a stylus. Third, a great deal of the screen is now obscured by something much thicker than a stylus. Finally, assuming the touchpad driver simply uses the center point of the large touch area (ie your thumbprint) as the pointer position, then it is impossible to touch the very edges of the screen, which is where the scroll bars reside.

you can choose the screen type (color or monochrome)...MP3 player...Bluetooth

How can they power a color screen, an MP3 player (ie driving headphones) and bluetooth with a single AA battery?

Dan East

Interesting screen...

[David Horn]

...a large 4.5 color QVGA LCD fingertip touch-screen...

Is this 4.5 colours (huh?) or 4.5 inches? Or centimetres? Or Ohms, or light years, perhaps?

Someone needs to get their dictionary out before submitting reviews to Slashdot. I only read two paragraphs because of the appalling grammar and the fact that it didn't seem to "read" fluidly.

it keeps coming, and coming, and coming...

[yivi]

I can't get enough of this TDA thingie.

Hopefully we'll read about it again soon.

Electronic thumb

[RichardX]

Can I use it to hitch a lift on a vogon ship?

All thumbs?

[ebvwfbw]

Great for those of us who are all thumbs! The trouble is those people are usually butter-fingers too.