The Rocky TiVo-DirecTV Relationship

Thomas Hawk writes "Phillip Swann's TV Predictions is out this morning alleging that before dumping their TiVo stock last year, Rupert Murdoch's DirecTV had made a pass at buying a controlling stake in TiVo. According to Swann, 'TiVo's top management did not like Murdoch's offer,' and Swann alleges that this is why you had a fallout between the two companies. As an interesting aside, Rob Pegoraro over at the Washington Post was out yesterday warning people to not buy an HDTV TiVo, as DirecTV will be changing their high-def signal later this year and that if you bought the HDTV TiVo that you might not be able to watch network TV in high def. As an owner of one of those expensive high-def DirecTV TiVos, I sure hope this isn't the case."

Comments

YAFM (Yet Another Fine Mirror)

[winkydink]

Mirrored links

Thomas Hawk writes "Phillip Swann's TV Predictions is out this morning alleging that before dumping their TiVo stock last year, Rupert Murdoch's DirecTV had made a pass at buying a controlling stake in TiVo. According to Swann, 'TiVo's top management did not like Murdoch's offer,' and Swann alleges that this is why you had a fallout between the two companies. As an interesting aside, Rob Pegoraro over at the Washington Post was out yesterday warning people to not buy an HDTV TiVo, as DirecTV will be changing their high-def signal later this year and that if you bought the HDTV TiVo that you might not be able to watch network TV in high def. As an owner of one of those expensive high-def DirecTV TiVos, I sure hope this isn't the case."

When will they

[RedElf]

Standardize on one format or another so we don't have to buy a new TiVo like device every 6-18 months?

Re:When will they

[Sc00ter]

DirecTV is coming out with their own DVR that will be some kind of home entertainment thing. You'll have one "master" system that will do all the recording and then other systems hooked up to other TVs that will get the information from the master system. It will also allow streaming from your computer for music and pictures.

There is only two "formats" of TiVo for DirecTV, the normal ones that record the stream from the sat, and the new HDTV TiVo's that cost a grand. So I don't see why you would have to buy a new one every "6-8 months" as you suggest.

If you call them now and inquire about a DVR they direct you to the new home entertainment unit that will be coming out soon

it's true

[skaeight]

Directv is switching to MPEG-4 encoding this year with the launch of the spaceway sats. I'm sure there will be a transition period so your HDTiVo should work for a while, but there will come a point where you will have to upgrade.

A couple of good sites to find more info are:

http://www.dbsforums.com
http://www.dbstalk.com
http://www.tivocommunity.com

HD Tivo is obsolete

[Ironsides]

As DirectTV is moving forward on changing to Advanced Video Codecs (AVCs) such as H.264 the current HD Tivos will become obsolete as they can only recieve the current encoding of MPEG-2. Sorry, but tis true. I also doubt that Tivo will make an update to the MPEG-2 HDs to recieve the new codec. Also, I have heard that DirectTV is moving to the DVB-S2 transmission standard from their current DVB-S. Extra information and/or signal strength, their choice.

cablecard

[alatesystems]

This is why the CableCard is so important, so that multiple devices can operate like the company provided boxes. I have a cable company dvr, and it is really awesome, but if I wanted to use a brand name TiVo, I would be pissed at having to use IR blasters.

As far as I know, there's no cablecard equivalent for satellite boxes, but there should be. Ahh, the incredible balance between freedom and regulation.

Re:cablecard

[wembley]

The cable companies hate CableCard, which was federally mandated. They lose another revenue stream (hardware), and you have an interface they can't necessarily control and spam OnDemand ads onto.

With the repeated granting of 1-year extensions on the CableCard deadline, don't hold your breath waiting for it. We still don't have all the HD content that was FCC mandated...

Re:cablecard

[Lumpy]

you are a fucking liar.

the Cable companies do NOT hate the cablecard. It's motorola, Scientifica Atlanta and Jerrold as well as other sattelite and Catv headend gear makers.

all of them REFUSE to follow any standards and intercooperate to ensure headend and plant lock-in on cable companies. If you are an all motorola cable company you haveto throw away EVERYTHING to use any SA gear. Motorola Loves that. SA does the same damn thing.

the cablecard gives up the monopoly of locking in the cable companies to a single vendor for their headend gear.

the rest of the world uses a single standard... the US has several that are bastardized by each equipment makes to ensure there is no interoperability.

so take your cabletv company hating LIES and go elsewhere.

if you want cablecard to exist then tell Motorola to quit fighting it as well as the other equipment makers.

if they ran the damned DVB standard like the rest of the world this all would be a non issue.

Re:cablecard

[PepeGSay]

Moderate parent up. He is dead right. Cable companies do not make any appreciable money on cable boxes. This is because the cable companies screwed up their provider model for the cable boxes and locked themselves into the few providers which they pay nearly $500 for a cable box. I worked for a cable company and this was one of the big reasons they supported the DOCSIS standard for cable modems which brought cable modems down into the $80 range, and possibly even lower now.

This is Business news, really.

[ackthpt]

I heard on the BBC WS this morning that LG and Matsushita had settled some stink about IP and plasma screens, which restricted markets in Korea and Japan, until settled, but didn't think it was 'News for Nerds' and was 'stuff that didn't matter'

With TiVo selling out to Comcast and pushing pop-up ads, I can't feel much positive about them anymore.

Foxblocking Tivo?

[AtariAmarok]

With Murdoch taking over all of Tivo, we'll need a sort of different kind of Foxblocker for this. I suggest gluing a couple of cable TV jacks to either end of a wooden spool, and inserting this in your incoming co-ax cable.

Times they are a changin...

[barfy]

I am an owner of the HDTV box, and yes it was expensive, and it has already been broken and replaced once ...

But it is the *ONLY* box that does what it does. 2 OTA tuners, 2 Satellite Tuners, both OTA and Satellite HD...

But Mpeg4 is coming, and this box has NO way to deal with it. And even as an owner of the box, I welcome MPEG4, as this will give me what I really want... Not "digital quality", but "quality digital". Replacing all of the boxes out there is cheaper than building and launching a satellite. HD will be where they go first, but eventually ALL DirectTV will be mpeg4.

I am sad that there was a breakdown between Tivo and DirectTV, because the combo *is* the best way to watch tv today.

There is some promise apparantly for us HDTiVo folks to replace our boxes with something "as good or better". We shall see when it happens. For now, I LOVE my HDTiVo.

Pleasing customers

[notthe9]

I doubt that they would make the devices like the article poster's non-functional too soon, seeing as people who buy stuff like that are often the kind of customer who would get the most pissed off.

Business before hate.

Re:No problem.

[Gannoc]

http://www.epa.gov/chemrtk/vccep/sponsor2.htm

pffft. Running water. All of you people out there with your runner water are just rotting your minds and bodies. In my family, we read books and discuss philosophy while making the 3/4 mile trek to our well. We don't use running water, and we're better people for it. Don't even get me started on electicity and your demon antibiotics.

Re:No problem.

[pjbgravely]

I live in a fringe area with no cable. I can get broadcast channels using rooftop $150 antennas and signal boosters. I got a HDTV tuner and now can see of the channels crystal clear, that is when they are broadcasting, most aren't full time yet. I am only 45 miles from one city but the hills really block the analog signal, while the digital gets through. It might be worth your while to try next year when most will be digital.

Yes it is true

[doormat]

DirecTV will be moving to a 8PSK signal modulation system and to MPEG-4 for HD for the SpaceWay satellite system, both of which are incompatible with the HD DirecTivo. You'll still get the old HD channels broadcast over the older satellites (Ku band, QPSK and MPEG-2), but none of the new fancy stuff (Ka band, 8PSK and MPEG-4).

Answers to Foxblocking

[AtariAmarok]

Where oh where is the conservative answer to this? The "RatherNot (tm)" CBS news blocker. The "Clean the Air America" radio filter. The "Ted Turnoff" CNN filter. And last but not least, the "Moving Out" web filter that blocks moveon.org.

Rocky & TiVo

[Anonymous Coward]

Bullwinkle: Hey, Rocky! Watch me pull a TiVo out of this hat.

Rocky: That trick never works.

/Bullwinkle reaches in hat and pulls out MGM Lion's head.

MGM Lion: ROOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAARRRRRRRR!!!

Bullwinkle: Oops. Guess I need a new hat.

No surprise

[sunderland56]

I'd have loved to be there during the meetings... one megalomaniac headstrong Brit and one megalomaniac headstrong Scot, in a room together, both thinking they're God. Wonderful. Odds on those two agreeing is so close to zero nobody's going to give you odds.

I get DirecTV HD, but there's no way I'm spending one dime on anything so close to bankruptcy as Tivo.

Re:No surprise

[Generic Guy]

I get DirecTV HD, but there's no way I'm spending one dime on anything so close to bankruptcy as Tivo.

Okay, I can't just let this dog lie undisturbed. TiVo is not close to bankruptcy, despite their misgivings on Wall Street. In fact, as of their last conference call, they are expecting to turn profitable by the end of this year. They intend to balance revenue from three streams: hardware, subscriptions, and ad sponsers. That's good news for TiVo faithful.

The bad news is that they plan to reach profitability by sacrificing the ideals which brought them the love in the first place. Their hardware gets less reliable each iteration and harder to hack (for your own software patches). They sell ad space on the interface top menu. And now they are beginning to push pop-up ads on their paying subscribers (while you fast-forward). The recent deal with Comcast will put some variation of TiVo software on Comcast DVRs, most likely with the pop-up ads.

It remains to be seen how losing 2/3 of their base from DirecTV (in 2007) will affect TiVo, but they should be profitable by then. Don't hate TiVo for 'dying' like BSD and Apple. Instead, hate TiVo for sacrificing their own ideals.

DirectTV TiVos safe

[deanj]

If you have one of those DirectTV TiVos, DirectTV is the outfit that sold it to you in the first place. If they change their signal, complain to DirectTV, not the TiVo.

I can't wait for the new formats!

[Chris Pimlott]

I'm glad to see I'm not the only excited about this upcoming switch! I mean, sure,
Ku band, QPSK and MPEG-2 are alright. But
Ka band, 8PSK and MPEG-4 are clearly going to blow them all away! (At least until Ko Band, ¥PSK and MPEG-7 come out...)

Rumored Trade-in Plan for new HMCs

[ac3boy]

Here is the rumored trade-in plan to get the new HMCs. It is very generous but I hope they stick to it.

HMC Cost update.

Latest info:

Two base (HD HMC) units with different capacity.

1) 240 GB - $499 + $99 for SD units and $199 for HD remote units
2) 480 GB - $599 + $99 for SD units and $199 for HD remote units

Trade in Values:

HD-TiVo -> High capacity unit + 2 HD remote units
SD TiVo -> Low capacity Unit + 1 SD remote unit
SD Receiver -> Low Capacity unit and 1 SD for every three (3) SD receivers.
It's basically a price match. For example, if you have two SD TiVo's and an standard HD unit, you can obtain the High Capacity + 1 HD remote unit in exchange.

Values on units for trade in:

Standard SD Receiver - No value for HMC - 1 for 1 on SD remote units
Standard HD Receiver - Low cap HMC or 1 HD Remote unit
1 TiVo - Low Capacity HMC + SD Unit
2 TiVo - High Capacity HMC + SD Unit, or High Capacity + SD Unit

Dollar Value:

SD Receiver $99
HD Receiver $399
TiVo $199
HD TiVo - $899

Re:TV? What is that?

[LetterJ]

No different than the mind control device that has managed to turn all people without a TV into automatons, reciting the same liturgy of disdain at every available opportunity. You are not morally superior, intellectually free or otherwise improved simply because of your rejection of TV.

Likewise, I'm not a better person because I choose not to drink alcohol. Does not drinking alcohol give me more time to pursue more "noble" activities each week that is unclouded by alcoholic distractions? Absolutely. However, so would a number of other choices like avoiding Slashdot. Is my wife a better person than you because she abstains from participating on this site? No.

TV is one form of entertainment out of many. And, despite the deep longings and ideal dreams of the anti-TV elite, removing televisions from homes will not result in 230 million Americans suddenly picking up Tolstoy. Rather, they'd simply turn to other forms of entertainment that demand equally little of their intellect.

I enjoy TV. I enjoy movies. I enjoy books. I have not stated a logical paradox in the previous 3 sentences.