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Nintendo DS Wireless in Freefall

Nicholas Roussos writes "Wired reports about four skydivers who decided to give the Nintendo DS wireless capabilities a try while they were freefalling. 'The four sky divers proved that an ad hoc network set up using the wireless functions of a Nintendo DS works perfectly at distances of nearly 400 feet while falling 120 miles an hour,' states the article."

53 of 202 comments (clear)

  1. Boring... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny
    were part of an experiment this month to discover the outer limits of the wireless capabilities of the DS
    Wow, amazing, so you mean that all that wind doesn't mess the signal up? But seriously, I think that if you got a few people with a couple of two-seater ultralights it might be slightly cooler. Well ok maybe not.

    I'll tell you what would be cool, ultralights with automatic paintball guns, heat seeking nerf missiles, and a HUD. Then have a dogfight, and when Mr. Farmer comes out of his house yelling at you for scaring the bejesus out of his livestock you make a second pass, *thunk* *thunk* *thunk* *thunk*

    Wait, what was this article about again?
    1. Re:Boring... by s20451 · · Score: 4, Funny

      I'll tell you what would be cool, ultralights with automatic paintball guns, heat seeking nerf missiles, and a HUD. Then have a dogfight

      I'd like to see the dude who tries to do an Immelman in an ultralight. Or his next of kin.

      --
      Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
    2. Re:Boring... by RM6f9 · · Score: 5, Funny

      There are such things as aerobatics-capable ultralights....
      (to avoid the temptation of flying with a paintball gun)
      Air-to-air paintball would all too often become inadvertent air-to-ground, and how much do we want to wager that Joe Farmer owns a 12 ga. double barrel that is most emphatically *not* firing paintballs?

      --
      Take the 90-Day Challenge! http://rwmurker.bodybyvi.com/
    3. Re:Boring... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

      I would just like to point out that the DS does *NOT* use ad hoc mode at all, but instead, uses infrastructure mode. The first DS into teh game acts as a wireless access point that the other units connect to.

    4. Re:Boring... by magefile · · Score: 2, Funny

      That's what the Mojave is for!

    5. Re:Boring... by RM6f9 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Gives "painted desert tortoise" a bit of a different spin, hey? Thanks for the chuckle.

      --
      Take the 90-Day Challenge! http://rwmurker.bodybyvi.com/
    6. Re:Boring... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      No, it uses infrastructure mode. The reason it isnt tunneled is because it doesnt use TCP/IP at layer 3 and up of the OSI model.

    7. Re:Boring... by Zeos386sx-16 · · Score: 2, Funny

      You gotta watch out for that lead based paint!

  2. Einstein would be pleased by SiliconEntity · · Score: 5, Interesting

    In this year of the Einstein centenary, these skydivers have managed to rediscover the Principle of Relativity - that it matters not how fast you are moving, the laws of physics are the same. Indeed, if radio waves failed to propagate for skydivers the entire structure of physics would have to be re-created from scratch.

    1. Re:Einstein would be pleased by kfg · · Score: 2, Funny

      Damn, there goes that "I'm sorry officer, but the kids in the back seat were driving me nuts with that video game thingy, so I just put it to the floor," excuse for that speeding ticket.

      KFG

    2. Re:Einstein would be pleased by Rasta+Prefect · · Score: 3, Informative

      I have a question: If the skydivers were travelling near the speed of light, would this still have worked? (note: Ignore the detail that they'd punch a Wile E. Coyote-esque hole into the planet.)


      Yes. Thats the whole point of relativity. Its just as valid to say that they're still and that the earth is moving near C towards them, in which case why wouldn't it work?

      --
      Why?
    3. Re:Einstein would be pleased by Rasta+Prefect · · Score: 2, Informative

      This is where relativity comes in. The RF signals are traveling at C relative to the transmitter. If the transmitters are moving at C - 5 MPH, then the radio waves are moving at 2C-5 MPH.


      Wrong, actually.

      Under Galilean Relativity, you would be correct. this isn't usually what people mean when they talk about relativity. The problem facing physics at the end of the 20th century was that we had two really great systems for describing reality - Newtonian mechanics with constant unchanging distances and a universal clock, and Maxwells equations that described electromagnetism. The problem was with light - Light always moves at C relative to you - regardless of your frame of reference. This totally fubars Galilean relativity, because of exactly this situation.

      From the POV of the guys in the Air, obviously the radio signals are traveling away at C. However, according to Maxwell, this is also true for the guys on the ground. Einstein resolved this paradox by doing away with a universal clock, and for that matter universal distance and mass.

      --
      Why?
    4. Re:Einstein would be pleased by jericho4.0 · · Score: 2, Informative
      There are a lot of people answering you, and only a few know what the hell they are taking about. Two simple things to remember;

      Electromagnetic radiation in a vacum travels at 1.8026175 × 10^12 furlongs per fortnight, always.

      Time is not the same for everyone, and bends to make the above possible.

      --
      "A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing" - Alan Perlis
  3. excitement! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Funny

    nintendo ds, cause falling 120miles/h towards the ground isent exciteing enough.

    1. Re:excitement! by Adrilla · · Score: 4, Funny

      Just don't forget to pause, so you can pull the chute.

      --

      "Plans are for fools! Oglethorpe, the plutonian (Aqua Teen Hunger Force)
    2. Re:excitement! by niteice · · Score: 2, Funny

      i need a mod "+5 shit, he's right..."

      --
      ROMANES EUNT DOMUS
  4. Please turn off your electronic equipment... by FuryG3 · · Score: 5, Funny

    So now when they kick you and your friends off the plane for using wifi while in flight, you'll be all good.

  5. Why should it not work? by imsabbel · · Score: 4, Funny

    I mean, there is no/little relative velocity, and radio waves are fast (plus there is no ether :D).

    As to the whole thing... I really dont know. Its cool, but it sounds like a real potential for darwin awards ("damn, ill get you. Just a nother round..." *splash*)

    --
    HI O WISE PRINCE. WHT TOOK U SO DAM LONG?
    1. Re:Why should it not work? by Newander · · Score: 2, Funny

      At those speeds, it really makes very little difference.

      --

      Jesus saves and takes half damage.

  6. The Video by bscience · · Score: 5, Informative
    There is a torrent serving up the video of the PSP and Nintendo DS tests here:

    http://stashbox.fromtheshadows.tv/

    or the actual torrent:

    http://torrents.fromtheshadows.tv/fts_box1.0.avi.t orrent

  7. Good to read..... by wpiman · · Score: 5, Funny

    It is good to read about some real world applications with todays technology. Usually these articles are so theoretical....

  8. This is really cool... by Smiffa2001 · · Score: 4, Interesting

    ...though I'd really hate to try it. I get sucked into "the zone" when gaming and computing so tend to ignore most outside stimuli (feel free to correct spelling, etc.). Hope that my parachute would be automatically opening, otherwise...

    1. Re:This is really cool... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

      Well if it does open automatically and you're not paying attention, I would image that while YOU might slow down, the Gameboy wouldn't (well unless it has a little parachute of its own, or you have a really good grip).

  9. So? by Locke2005 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    1) Wow. Line-of-sight is line-of-site!
    2) If all 4 of them are falling in the same direction at the same speed, than their velocity is irrelevant; their relative velocity is zero.
    3) What networked games can you actually finish within the 60 seconds before you hit the ground?

    --
    I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
  10. An EM Signal at 120MPH? by ColdZero · · Score: 5, Funny

    At speeds like that, how could the speed of light even hope to keep up?

  11. SPLAT by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Funny

    Dude, I fragged you!
    No, dude. I fragged you first!
    No Way! I fragged you first.

    SPLAT!

  12. What about different speeds? by Kainaw · · Score: 3, Interesting

    If they are all travelling at the same speed - so what? What if one was still and the other was travelling at 400mph? Could they still communicate? I know, they would be too far apart if the moving one went in a straight line. But, what if it went back and forth? The issue is the simple doppler effect. At what point is it unable to handle wireless communications?

    I only ask because I feel that we will eventually have wireless transmitters in all cars to monitor traffic and assist in directing traffic away from congested areas. At what speed do cars lose effective communication with stationary antennas? Cell phones seem to work just fine at 100mph+

    --
    The previous comment is purposely vague and generalized, but all of the facts are completely true.
    1. Re:What about different speeds? by kfg · · Score: 2, Informative

      Cell phones seem to work just fine at 100mph+

      As radio communications with Apollo seemed to work just fine at relative speeds of about 25,000 mph. As others have noted EMR is really, really fast and doppler shift is relative to that speed.

      In any case they have invented these things called "variable resistors" that can be used to make a simple circuit popularly refered to as a "tuner." They gone even further and created circuits that automatically seek and lock onto a signal, popularly known as "scanners." The radio in your car can probably serve as an example of one of these (FM signals can drift far more than you're ever going to see from a doppler shift on your wireless equipment).

      Note that the radio in your car works just fine no matter how fast you go, but please, don't tell the officer about this post, K?

      KFG

    2. Re:What about different speeds? by Grond · · Score: 5, Insightful

      So I looked up the relativistic Doppler effect and plugged in some numbers.

      For a relative velocity of 400mph you get an observed frequency of 2.39999856GHz.

      Now, looking at the 802.11b spec available at the 802 working group site I see that it operates in the 2.4 - 2.4835GHz range.

      So the Doppler effect at 400mph introduces a difference in frequency equal to .0017% of the total frequency range. Unfortunately, I don't know what the tolerances for 802.11b are, but I have difficulty believing that .0017% would cause much trouble.

      Now, backfiguring for a more common 5% tolerance, we get something like 500,000m/s or 1.1 million mph. So, yes, 802.11b probably won't work between passing spaceships. Aside from that, we're probably safe.

  13. Cool. by JackAxe · · Score: 3, Funny

    I won't personally be trying this with my DS anytime soon. If I wanted to pee, besides in my pants while playing my DS, I'll just do it in the bathroom.

  14. Good thing they didn't use the PSP... by solowCX · · Score: 5, Funny

    They might have hit the ground before they booted up the game and loaded the level. ;)

    1. Re:Good thing they didn't use the PSP... by Aqua+OS+X · · Score: 3, Funny

      Nah, I'd be more concerned about having enough battery power to play the PSP wirelessly during a 60 second freefall.

      --
      "Things are more moderner than before- bigger, and yet smaller- it's computers-- San Dimas High School football RULES!"
  15. Re:worthless by Adrilla · · Score: 3, Funny

    You don't want those UMD's to come accidentally shooting out at that height.

    --

    "Plans are for fools! Oglethorpe, the plutonian (Aqua Teen Hunger Force)
  16. Gotta Get that High Score by StarWreck · · Score: 5, Funny

    Jimmy! PULL THE STRING!!
    *waves hand* Just a second man
    For the love of god! Deploy your parachute!
    I just gotta get the high score, I'm almost there. *SPLAT*

    --
    ... and in the DRM, bind them.
  17. Uhhh... by Sheepdot · · Score: 2, Funny

    Reminds me of a bash.org IRC quote:

    Zanthis(ALE): AFK, tornado

    Has a whole other meaning in this context.

  18. Now, I can sleep by ip_freely_2000 · · Score: 3, Funny

    "The four sky divers proved that an ad hoc network set up using the wireless functions of a Nintendo DS works perfectly at distances of nearly 400 feet while falling 120 miles an hour"

    I'm glad they proved it, it was really keeping me up at night.

  19. stylus by muel · · Score: 2, Funny

    The Nintendo DS is already a hassle to control with two hands while on the ground - how the heck did these guys keep their styluses steady mid-descent?

  20. OH CRAP, I DROPPED IT!! by AvantLegion · · Score: 2, Funny
    Oh how cute, we put a mini-parachute on it too! Whew!

  21. Yeah... by l00sr · · Score: 5, Funny

    I get pretty bored skydiving too.

  22. Physics/Math test by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

    1) If Bob is in the baggage car of a train traveling north at 90MPH and Margaret is standing still 10 cars north of Bob, each car being approximately 40 feet long, home much time would pass before Bob crashes into Margaret? Show your work.

    2) If I put two chickens in a bag and give you the bag, how many chickens do you have?

    3) If radio waves from a Nintendo DS travel at roughly 186,000 miles per second, how fast would two parallel trains moving in the same direction have to travel before the conductor in each train could no longer receive signals from the other conductor's Nintendo DS?

    4) If you were in a car travelling at the speed of light and you flashed your high-beams, would anything happen? Assume you're on the New Jersey Turnpike.

    1. Re:Physics/Math test by earthbound+kid · · Score: 2, Funny
      2) If I put two chickens in a bag and give you the bag, how many chickens do you have?

      None -- you only gave me the bag, they're still your chickens.


      See, I knew the *AA people read Slashdot!!
  23. Galileo would be pleased.. by rufusdufus · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The skydivers experience is consistent with Galilean relativity, Einstein's special relativity wouldnt have much of an effect in this situation.

    1. Re:Galileo would be pleased.. by Jerf · · Score: 5, Informative

      Not the theories of Relativity, the Principle. There is a difference. Einstein's theories of Relativity solved an increasingly important conflict between physicists beliefs that the Principle of Relativity was true (an intuitive belief) and their inability to put solid math around the way the Universe works.

      The first chapter of this work should help. Basically, the principle of relativity is that physics is the same for all inertial reference frames; Einstien put that together with the fact that light appears to travel the same speed for all observers. Galilean relativity doesn't work with that; it has other contradictions inherent in it (it can't answer the Zeno paradox, again, see the linked work), but it takes longer to notice. There are other relativity theories that haven't panned out, either.

      Pardon the pedantry, it's intended to be educational.

  24. Not... really by gotr00t · · Score: 2, Interesting
    That's only the first part of Einstein's postulates. The other one states that there is a fundamental constant that is absolute for every frame: C, the speed of light. The radio waves that these skydivers were using for their wi-fi connection are EM waves, propagating at speed C.

    It is not surprising that their wireless worked in the least, as to be able to detect any relativistic effect, their frame, determined by gamma=(1-v^2/c^2)^(-1/2) would have to be close to or greater than 1. That would be darn close to the speed of light.

  25. Re:One Lines by jbarket · · Score: 2, Funny

    Since when does Carrot Top try out new material on Slashdot?

    --

    -----
    jonathan barket
  26. Philosophical question... by Pinkoir · · Score: 3, Funny

    Do you really have a network when all nodes got just got dropped?

    Hur hur hur...

    -Pinkoir

  27. Solexo-diving... by Dark+Coder · · Score: 3, Funny

    If four skydivers were in space (exo-solar-diving) free-falling from Jupiter toward the Sun with an intent to drop into Earth after a few braking maneuvers (what a rush! Oh wait, you'd barely feel the solar wind, uh?).

    So, once again if four sport-extremists were sol-exo-diving, would that 20 K-mile/per second put a dent in your line-of-sight RF communication channel?

    Yes...barely I leave you to do the math.

    (plus, then, no one can hear you scream in space)

  28. Last Words by 955301 · · Score: 3, Funny

    Skydiver 1: Is it working?

    Skydiver 2: What?

    Skydiver 3: He said, IS IT WORKING?

    Skydiver 4: Mine is up!

    Skydiver 1: Okay, so is mine now.

    Skydiver 2: What?

    Skydiver 3: HE SAID, HIS IS WORKING NOW!

    Skydiver 2: OKAY THANKS!

    Skydiver 4: Start the game already.

    Skydiver 2: What?

    Skydiver 1: Okay Cool, I can see everybody!

    Skydiver 3: .... I feel like I forgot something... my charger .... or ....

    WHUMP!!

    --
    You are checking your backups, aren't you?
  29. Here comes the science by sunami · · Score: 4, Informative

    I hate to break it to you guys, but so long as the people are moving at the same velocity, there isn't any kind of problem. If all of them had been moving at .999 speed of light (in our point of view), there still wouldn't be a difference, because they are all in the same frame of reference, and they would all measure the speed of light from their point of view to be 3.0x10^8 ms^-1. No doppler effect of the radio waves would be created, and no greater time lag would ensue. It's as if they aren't moving, because according to each other, they aren't!

    1. Re:Here comes the science by jridley · · Score: 2, Interesting

      If all of them had been moving at .999 speed of light (in our point of view), there still wouldn't be a difference

      Well, there might have been; some lower frequencies of external source could have been shifted up into a wavelength that would have interfered with their wireless, or sunlight from behind them may have shifted downwards.

      Also, light from in front of them may have shifted into gamma rays or higher and killed them before they managed to get to level 2.

    2. Re:Here comes the science by skeptic1 · · Score: 2, Informative
      Umm... radio waves don't travel at the speed of light.

      Umm...yes they do. Radio waves are part of the electromagnetic spectrum. ALL electromagnetic radiation travels at the speed of light.
  30. Obligatory Futurama reference by ari_j · · Score: 3, Funny

    Of course [it can't]! That's why scientists increased the speed of light in 2208.

  31. Mixed bag by rinkjustice · · Score: 2, Funny

    The good news was the four skydivers proved that an ad hoc wireless network using the Nintendo DS works perfectly at distances of 400 feet while falling 120 miles an hour...

    The bad news is neither the Nintendo DS or the four skydivers bounce very well.

    Meh. Batting .500 ain't bad.