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More Details on IE7 Tabs
GraemeDonaldson writes "Another member of the IE dev team, Tony Schreiner, has revealed details of IE7's tabbed browsing implementation including the fact that the user will retain control over how tabs are handled." From the post: "Regarding script, there is no "target='_tab'" feature or any direct access to tabs from script beyond what is available with multiple windows today. We are working on balancing the default behavior for whether a window opened from script opens as in a new frame or a tab. Currently, windows that have been customized, such as hiding a toolbar or making the window non-resizable, will default to opening in their own standalone frame, whereas ordinary pop-up windows will open in a new foreground tab. CTRL-clicking and middle-clicking links will open those links in a background tab."
Man. This is so ridiculous. I couldn't care less if the IE team would copy the exact behaviour of 4 year old tech. Oh wait...
fair enough, but firefox is the first browser in a long time to threaten m$ft's monopoly... so "their" features are being "borrowed"
Get your torrents...
- correct implementation of box model
- support for png alpha transparency
- full support for css2
- support for application/xhtml+xml mime type
let's worry about the back end before we do anything with the front endI look forward to how Microsoft will respond to the recent challenge to their browser dominance, but anything short of Adblock for IE will keep me with Firefox. I can't believe how much nicer the Internet is with Firefox and this single extension.
Middle-click or ctrl-click... yep... Mozilla (I don't like firefox!) has the exact same behavior. They should have used a different keystroke, the copy wouldn't have been so obvious.
Qui ne va pas à la chasse n'a pas de gibier
PHP Queb
Looks like customers win here. Maybe Firefox wasn't the first to ever do multiple tabs, but their popularity spurred MS to do something to make their own browser better. Once customers start seeing other features in Firefox that aren't in IE and start complaining they will be (slowly) added. Competition works! But of course we already knew that....
From the article, the guy claims it was quite a bit of trouble to implement tabs for a few different reasons. I imagine that they couldn't get it ready for SP2, and they just made an excuse.
Yeah, and they said they didn't want to use them because they would confuse users. But now, it sounds like they'll have a combo of pop-up windows, and tabs! What's the point of having tabs if you still have your pop-up windows?
"Would it kill you to put down the toilet seat?" -- Maya Angelou
No Thanks. Microsoft is full of crap. They sit around and do NOTHING for the past 3-4 years (since they slaughtered Netscape). And now that finally there's competition they get off their lazy a$$es and steal other people's ideas once again.
M$ gets no respect from me.
eTrade SUCKS
It also seems like they are quite sincere in catching up fully in the browser feature race. Now IE will have a pop-up blocker and tabs. Sounds a lot like we again have a nearly identical major feature set as a neat bulleted list for marketing. Plus, IE will forever have a faster start-up time (by cheating).
We need to stay ahead in features to stay competitive. We need more features to watch porn more efficiently!
Webmaster Wanted - Entropic Reactions
"whereas ordinary pop-up windows will open in a new foreground tab. "
Hmm, how about ordinary pop up windows not opening AT ALL!?!?
I have just started using Firefox and I love how most pop-ups are blocked, and the ones that do happen to pop thru open in a new Background window so they are easily killed...
from TFA:
"We are working on balancing the default behavior for whether a window opened from script opens.."
How about let me choose what behavior I want from my browser instead of making all of these "defaults" which I will end up changing anyway because they are usually the less intuitive choice. sheesh.. i'll just stick with Firefox.
Side note, since changing to Firefox, my 4 home systems which my family uses (that used to fill up with spyware weekly) have been running spyware free now for 2 weeks. Thanks Mozilla...
That's idiotic. I can't imagine why anyone would care that they "copied" Firefox et al in providing tabbed browsing, which has become a standard feature in practically every current browser -- so why on earth should they confuse people by using their own proprietary invocation method just to differentiate their product, when every other browser on the market uses middle-click?
I can imagine the uproar from people just like you if Microsoft actually followed your advice: "They're breaking standards! They introduced their own incompatible proprietary interface just to promote browser lock-in!"
Criticize them for their predatory business practices all you like, but this kind of shit is purely assinine.
SIERRA TANGO FOXTROT UNIFORM
As a web developer, I am looking forward to seeing IE7. Seriously. While I do recommend Firefox to people when the opportunity comes up, all I really care about is the rendering. If IE7 does a good enough job with CSS and the DOM in general that I can code something once and it'll work most of the time in all the common browsers, I'll be one happy camper.
I know we'll never reach the point where 100% of code will "work on all browsers the first time, every time". But if IE's performance gets to the point where its quirkiness is no more of an issue than Safari's or Gecko's, then that'll be good enough for me. Right now IE probably adds 30% to my development time for any project, because the reality is things have to work acceptably well in IE.
#DeleteChrome
Microsoft is the ONE entity in the universe in a position to do this right, and they pass.
... they are those apps you hate that use windows in windows ... well if those same apps used tabs instead of tile, cascade or just get in the way, you would be loving them)
... This is a slam dunk. How could they have missed this?
Tabs should not be a feature of the browser, they should be a behaviour of MDI windows. (you remember MDI windows
The browser should be an MDI app and should get tabs for "free" from the window manager.
They have the OS, they have the windowing system, they have the browser
cjcyrxv
MS has been pushing an SDI interface for almost 10 years for discrete work items (Different documents in Word, for instance) and MDI for related items (code files in Visual Studio, for instance).
Ah, the dilemma of standardization. MS thinks of different documents in Word as discrete work items. I tend to think of applications as discrete work items, so I like all the Word documents available in one place, without the clutter of multiple windows. When Firefox opens something in a new window instead of a new tab, I usually close it and middle-click instead. Many people claim that you should use fewer, fuller directories, and open them in seperate windows, I like the sorting qualities of deeper, emptier directories, and I hate having a new window open up every time I click on a directory (8 just to get to what I'm working on).
Standardization is nice for programmers, trainers and tech support. Flexibility is nice for users. Most of us spend too many hours a day on a computer. Saving a few seconds (on a regular basis), a train of thought, or a little bit of frustration by having the computer work the way we think is a big win. That's why I like Unix, as well as old-school Unix programs like Emacs or AutoCAD. I can make them do what I want, I don't have to learn to do things their way. (Then again, sometimes I could probably be more productive if I learned the new way of thinking...)
I think it's ironic that people avoid Unix because it isn't "user friendly", but I consider it more user-friendly than the other big OSs (haven't used OS X much yet.) Sure it might be harder to learn, but it's worth it. I don't use a computer the same way as a newbie, why should I use the same interface? One thing about a zero learning curve system is that a newbie can be as productive as a 10-year user. The other thing is that a 10-year user is no more productive than a newbie.
So standardize on what is available, but provide many options and lots of customizability. Provide virtualization so that the apps don't have to think in terms of whether a command was typed, clicked, or input through thought control. Always provide a base-level fallback or easy switch to defaults, so that a tech can work at any machine without having to find the user's commands, or can fix a newbie's messed up interface. The holy grail is a system that is dead easy to use initially, but which helps the user become more advanced and customize, such that they grow to work better with each other.
Jeez,
* I have Win95 and they haven't given me any NTFS yet! * Winge.
* Ford haven't updated my 1969 Mustang with ABS, and airbags either. * Winge.
Do you not understand? - in commercial world OLD products aren't given new features. It doesn't matter whether you are talking software, cars, or washing machines.
Thats no reason to stop bitching about MS, is it?
In a commercial world products with serious flaws are recalled and people given their money back + they are held libel for any damage they cause.
It will be a crappy implementation which favors the advertizers and not the end user.
(And if they could fix their damn stylesheet bugs: When you select 'ignore font sizes' it is supposed to ignore line height as well!)
If Google really cared they would fix Android Chrome to reflow text, instead of discriminating
We know for a fact that some of our customers are Windows only, and others are unix (AIX). The former are either clueless, or very locked down - for either IE is the most likely choice. They will not install firefox for us. IE doesn't run on AIX, so we have to support firefox.
Half the developers prefer a Unix desktop, and run Konqueror/safari (one guy brings his own laptop cause we only supply x86), while the Windows people run firefox. We could drop Konqueror/safari, but once you have firefox those are trivial. We cannot drop IE or firefox because there are known customers that are locked into one.
in commercial world OLD products aren't given new features
Yeah, you're right. That's why Win2000 will only run the version of IE it came with in the first place.
Oh wait...
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.