CNN Interviews with Harlan Ellison, Bruce Sterling

half_cocked_jack writes "Over at the CNN Podcast area they have a program titled 'Hollywood's SciFi Summer'. It sounded interesting, so I downloaded it. Much to my surprise, the host, Renay San Miguel, seems to really know SF, and he interviewed Harlan Ellison, Connie Willis, Bruce Sterling, and Len Wein on their views on how Hollywood handles SF. Great listening!"

Comments

Whorelan Ellison?!

[Anonymous Coward]

The guy who tried to shut down USENET

~~~

Bruce Willis?

[sedyn]

he interviewed Harlan Ellison, Connie Willis, Bruce Sterling, and Len Wein

Does anyone else think that this placing is unfortunate? I know that I misread it on first-pass.

Is that audio stream copyrighted?

[ChipMonk]

Because, you know, it's illegal in Sweden to download copyrighted material.

Re:Is that audio stream copyrighted?

[Anonymous Coward]

Aren't web sites copyrighted unless specified otherwise?

Re:Is that audio stream copyrighted?

[Snaller]

Unless you have their permission smartass.

Re:Is that audio stream copyrighted?

[Anonymous Coward]

dear god! everyone in sweden who uses the internet is a lawbreaker! Run for your (yorgen borgen) lives!

Re:Is that audio stream copyrighted?

[Anonymous Coward]

I image that the grandparent was mocking the incorrect slashdot heading earlier today which seemed to indicate incorrectly that downloading anything which was copyrighted is now illegal.

Re:Is that audio stream copyrighted?

[Anonymous Coward]

Then it should get modded funny...

The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Nova Express]

Not many people know that Harlan "discovered" Bruce. He attended a very early Turkey City Writer's Workshop, bought Bruce's first novel (Involution Ocean), and then paid Bruce's way to the Clarion Writer's Workshop. Harlan is a prickly character, but he does have a fine eye for talent (and a gift for making the right enemies).

Bruce has "paid it forward" by helping a number of new writers (myself included) with their careers by subjecting them to the bracing fire of a Sterling critique...

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

Ellison "prickly"? You must be using some meaning of the word "prickly" that I wasn't previously familiar with.

Harlan was a wicked, wicked young man. His readings at Worldcon in NYC in the late 60's and early 70's were the stuff of massive panel debates. AND, fawning admiration by most of the attendees.

I can remember one piece that Harlan read an overtly raw sex piece from the dais at the Commodore Hotel, around the time that he published "I see a man sitting in a chair and the chair is biting his leg" in a collaboration with Robert Sheckley. I recall that Sheckley, Gunn, and Silverberg were all onthe panel and a room full of college kids had their first exposure to erotic literature.

The man wrote, and read, brilliantly. Yes, he has short-man's syndrome, but in his defense, he has taste and style and a willingness to explore just about anything as a writer.

From his Dangerous Visions anthologies to his scripts for Demon with a Glass Hand and City on the Edge of Forever to The Glass Teat and The Other Glass Teat, Ellison has cranked out a lifetime's work nearly every year for the first 20 years of his professional life. Only Isaac Asimov was more prolific.

Ellison had a legitimate, hard fought, lawsuit for copyright violation. Companies were reprinting his work and selling it without paying any royalty and Ellison had every right to fight for his property rights.

See, http://harlanellison.com/home.htm/ for Ellison's (way out of date) home page and,

See, http://www.authorslawyer.com/c-ellison.shtml/ for the copyright action.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[mbrother]

Ellison also discovered a lot of other writers, too, including Dan Simmons. While most people see his growly, larger-than-himself public persona, he can be an incredibly generous man. He called up one friend of mine who'd reviewed a story of his because Ellison wasn't sure he'd appreciated some of the subtlies of the story -- and then they talked for an hour. A guy I knew in college had written a complaining letter to him about why he was years late on a Star Trek project, and Ellison called him up to bitch back and explain, and then they talked like buddies for an hour. Interesting, talented guy.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Nova Express]

>Ellison "prickly"? You must be using some meaning of the word "prickly" that I wasn't previously familiar with.

"Prickly" as in "Every single science fiction writer older than myself I know can tell you a story about how Harlan Ellison was a complete asshat to them at one time or another." Most also have a story about how Harlan went out of his way to do something nice for them as well.

There are legions of Harlan Ellison stories in science fiction. Like the time he flew across the country to punch out Charles Platt. (Like I said, he has great taste in enemies.) Or the job he did on Andy Porter (IIRC) in Short Form. Or check out Christopher Priest's the Last Deadloss Visions (AKA The Book on the Edge of Forever.)

Make no mistake about: At the top of his game, Ellison was probably the best short story writer in the field, and I fully expect "I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream" to be read 100 years from now. But in no way, shape or form is he a saint.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

Exactly. Prickly doesn't convey the proper image of Ellison.

An under-medicated, short curmudgeon, with distinct bi-polar and antisocial traits who used his personality as a birth control device is a somewhat more accurate description of the Ellison I know.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[billyjoeray]

Another fact some people might forget is that Ellison was the technical advisor for Babylon 5

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Anonymous Coward]

Ellison had a legitimate, hard fought, lawsuit for copyright violation. Companies were reprinting his work and selling it without paying any royalty and Ellison had every right to fight for his property rights.

Unless he was foolish enough to transfer it to a digital format.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[cei]

I have one of the collections of Ellison erotica written under the pen-name "Paul Merchant." I was able to get Ellison to sign it using his preferred nom de plume (which the publisher wouldn't let him use), D.S. Merchant (for Dirty Smut Merchant). I wasn't really sure how he would handle being handed a copy of Sex Gang at a signing, but he was in good spirits. He doesn't normally sign those, but he hadn't seen a copy in a while.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[identity0]

Ellison had a legitimate, hard fought, lawsuit for copyright violation. Companies were reprinting his work and selling it without paying any royalty and Ellison had every right to fight for his property rights.

That is about as much bad spin as you'd likely find in a SCO press release. Do you work for them, per chance, gvien that your nick seems to be a rip on "groklaw"?

Hell, even your links show you're wrong - basically, people on Usenet were pirating Mr. Ellison's work, and instead of going after them he went after AOL.

For providing Usenet access.

Apparently he cannot distinguish between a company publishing something and providing open access to a network. He seems to think AOL is responsible for all the content you can access through it, like a television network. Even under the DMCA this was questionable. I am definitely no friend of AOL, but it's too bad they settled this out of court instead of kicking Harlan's ass.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[ChadN]

FWIW, in the introduction to "Prayers to Broken Stones", Harlan exclaims that it was he who "discovered" Dan Simmons at a writers workshop (and that when he is long forgotten for his own work, he will be remembered for that fact alone). Dan Simmons, of course, went on to write the early Hyperion Cantos books soon afterwards and win the Hugo. Dan acknowledges the discovery in that introduction (although his recounting of the events is somewhat different).

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Hortensia Patel]

Wasn't there a "Victims of Harlan Ellison Support Group" at one point? I seem to recall Dave Langford writing about it in the dim and distant past.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[dbIII]

Ellison had a legitimate, hard fought, lawsuit for copyright violation. Companies were reprinting his work

He also suggested completely shutting down USENET during some legal action after some of his stuff was posted on the net - prickly and not really interested in looking at details or worrying about consequences. At that time USENET was actually useful and not the morass of spam and possibly russian child porn it is now.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Anonymous Coward]

I fail to see how an entire sentence compares to a simple adjective. Care to suggest a genuine alternative to "prickly" or are you just trying to score points instead of make one?

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Anonymous Coward]

I didn't know that Harlan paid Bruce's way to Clarion! But I'm not surprised. I know of one or two other people who he paid to go to Clarion.

One of my favorite Harlan stories took place at the Clarion workshop Bruce attended (1976?). People were sitting around one evening and somebody made a remark about what a loser Bruce was, because he never hung out with the rest of the writers. Harlan yelled at them and said that they were the losers, because Bruce Sterling was in his room every night writing, while they were all goofing off. Harlan said that Bruce would someday be a famous science fiction writer, because he cared about writing more than anything else. Talk about predicting the future!

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Anonymous Coward]

Are you sure punching out Charles Platt doesn't qualify for sainthood?

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

Haven't seen a copy of one in 25 years!

It does show that Ellison had range and guts.

I just don't remember if it was really all that good,.. How does he compare with Nin?

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

I predate "groklaw" and wouldn't rip Heinline's "grok" from Stranger in a Strange Land. Shame that paralegal decided to start a blog without an original name - still a nice blog that.

I've had this nick since 1987 when I started using it on The Well and BIX. That was the year I started law school.

As for the case: the law makes you take certain steps. In Chess you must open with a pawn or a knight. Period. Them's the rules..

For Ellison - who acted through his attorney - and it was the attorney came up with the strategy - the route he took and rules he used were both: successful and mandated by law.

Ellison had been fighting print pirates for years - this was just the war on a new front. He won and AOL lost. How many people have the guts to bring a suit and risk losing and paying a massive attorney's fee award to AOL? Check the pleadings. There is a fee petition in there and the Court denied it...but it could have bankrupted Ellison had the decision gone the other way. Fee petitions are decided by judges - not juries.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

In the law you ask for more than you can get. Nobody opens with their bottom dollar.

As for the strategy, USENET wasn't hurt by Ellison. Usenet, and the Internet have been hurt far more by the few hundred individuals who spam and crap all over everything.

Ellison was a leader in exploring individual legal rights over Internet matters. His argument advanced individual rights. Exactly what is the problem with that?

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[ediron2]

At that time USENET was actually useful

In 2000?! No way. At the time, the endless september had already come and (never) gone. Think about it: that is how this suit got a footing: AOL turned on the idiot stream, Harlan noticed, Kersplat!

TO call USENET useful at this point, I suspect you've got the same definition as I do: Useful compared to it being gone, but a faint shadow of itself and only useful thanks to deja-news and massive killfiles.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Malleus Dei]

An under-medicated, short curmudgeon, with distinct bi-polar and antisocial traits who used his personality as a birth control device is a somewhat more accurate description of the Ellison I know.

Sorry, but any description of Harlan that leaves out the word "brilliant" is incomplete. I am yet another member of SFWA (just how many of us are on here?), and I first met the larger-than-life Harlan back in the Seventies. I know a ton of Harlan stories that range from his boyhood to the dead gopher to some private acts of kindness that would make your jaw drop. (And I'm not telling any of them.)

IIRC in the movie "My Favorite Year" there's a great line: "With Swan you forgive a lot."

Likewise Harlan.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

Brilliant - agreed!

However I was responding to the inherent inadequacy of the term "prickly" as a descriptor of Ellison's demeanor...

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Anonymous Coward]

Ellison had a legitimate, hard fought, lawsuit for copyright violation. Companies were reprinting his work and selling it without paying any royalty and Ellison had every right to fight for his property rights.

Copyright is not property. It's a government-granted privilege to be identified as the author and temporarily restrict other people from performing some forms of copying and broadcasting. It's completely different to property.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[ucblockhead]

How about "Ellisonian".

:-)

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[identity0]

Ellison had been fighting print pirates for years - this was just the war on a new front. He won and AOL lost. How many people have the guts to bring a suit and risk losing and paying a massive attorney's fee award to AOL? Check the pleadings. There is a fee petition in there and the Court denied it...but it could have bankrupted Ellison had the decision gone the other way. Fee petitions are decided by judges - not juries.

And this is why people hate lawyers. You completely ignore the fact that AOL was in the right and Ellison and his lawyers were wrong to target them as if they were a pirate publisher, instead of as a common carrier such as a phone company.

It's because of crap like this that the internet is starting to look like a shopping mall in a police state. Do you seriously want your ISP to be trying to monitor everything?

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

I'm rarely interested in flame wars, but *this* may be an exception.

You SUPPORT AOL?

Change the hypo: It's Walmart selling illegal copies (e.g. copies of your book that you (and/or your publisher) didn't authorize and the sale is one from which you don't receive a royalty - but Walmart receives their cut from every book sold.

Now, do you want Walmart stopped from making a buck from you?

AOL was the largest single source of downloaders that could be identified. AOL made a buck from the thieves.

AOL had NOTICE.

AOL ignored the notice and continued to permit tens of thousands of copies to be downloaded...for which AOL made $ for connect time.

As for hating lawyers - good - it only encourages us.

Grow up. The world is full of free riders and, absent lawyers you would be screwed.

Got seatbelts?
Taking safe meds?
Eating (mostly) safe food?
Your drinking water OK?
Can you see a mile in any direction on a clear day?
Got the right to vote, hold a job or marry a person not of your race?
Are you a woman who can vote, own land and run a business?
Does your car withstand a 5mph rear impact without bursting into flame?
Did you buy a PC without buying a bundled copy of Bill's OS?
Making minimum wage, or beyond?
Have time and a half over 40 hrs a week?
Go to a public school with people of different ethnicity?

Send your thanks to the attorneys.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[identity0]

I don't support 'AOL', I support *any* ISP, university or network that provides Usenet access to do so without threats made against them based on the irresponsible actions of some on the network. If you want to stop copyright infringement, attack the pirates, not the network.

Your reasoning will lead to the MPAA/RIAA getting my ISP(and yours) shut down because a bunch of asshats decide to pirate movies over it.

Your analogy is flawed, because Wal-mart directly controls and procures everything in their stores. A better analogy is that of a toll bridge, over which some people conduct illegal business, like drug smuggling, but the majority of users are legitamite. Shutting down that bridge because you think it's not right for them to profit off some illegal users does not change the fact that they have no obligation to check every car that goes across.

Guess what, people should be held responsible for what they do on the networks, they should not be able to shift the blame to the networks themselves. "Waaah, my ISP made money off of it, blame them, blame them!"

I think you will find that Slashdot is not the place to bring your pro-censorship bullshit, troll.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

Censorship never entered this discussion - this was about theft and profits running to third-parties arising from the theft.

Walmart does not publish - it sells. The hypo remains valid. AOL's (then) vast userbase made them the right target. The tollway analogy fails because the bridge is a single route - all traffic uses the same route. Were Walmart is only one source (albeit a very big source) of the stolen property then it makes sense to shut down the retail outlet's ability to sell the stolen goods.

Malum per se and malum prohibitum are manifest at the retailer - the bridge is merely a path and reaches only malum prohibitum. Intent, my friend, defines the apex of the liability curve.

The problem was protecting the writer's rights - not attacking the Internet. The case was - and remains - a valid exercise of the right to petition the courts for redress of grievnces.

You want responsibility for people but none for companies who make a buck off of illegal trade. Think harder: there is liability for all or none.
When you resort to name-calling you have run out of ideas.

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[VAXcat]

Well, she was much taller...

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[grolaw]

Nin and Ellison - quite the comparison: "Little Birds" v. "Sex Gang" - though they both made money from their erotica I suspect that Nin had the better return on her work. As for the height comparison: it all depends on the measure....

Everybody agrees that Harlan could be a real dick....

Perhaps the horizontal measure of the man exceeded the vertical?

Re:The Sterling-Ellison Connection

[Anonymous Coward]

I predate "groklaw" and wouldn't rip Heinline's "grok" from Stranger in a Strange Land. Shame that paralegal decided to start a blog without an original name - still a nice blog that.

"Grok" is part of the English language now. You might as well call anybody using the word "email" unoriginal. If we all invented new words for things, nobody would be able to understand what another person was saying.

A new record for Slashdot?

[Qwertie]

A story so boring that it's only got 6 comments 15 minutes after being posted!

Re:A new record for Slashdot?

[$RANDOMLUSER]

> A story so boring that it's only got 6 comments 15 minutes after being posted!

Really???
frist psot!!!!
w00t!!!

Re:A new record for Slashdot?

[Anonymous Coward]

It's because everyone has to actually listen to it first.
Of course, that usually doesn't stop people from posting comments about the printed articles...

Re:A new record for Slashdot?

[ghee22]

you must have your moderation at +3

Re:A new record for Slashdot?

[webdesignr]

Maybe it has something to do with the Holiday weekend.

Re:A new record for Slashdot?

[Scaba]

Holiday? Are you talking about July 4th? Do you think the entire world celebrates the anniversary of America gaining independence from England?

LTFPC?

[maynard]

Maybe folks are Listening To the Fine PodCast before commenting?!?!? Naaaaa.... --M

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Ph33r th3 g(O)at]

He tried to force USENET providers to screen posts and allow him cancellation privileges at will. That's not just protecting his precious stale old short stories.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Anonymous Coward]

And if you're IP was being strewn across newsgroups, you'd just accept it? Give me a freaking break.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Ph33r th3 g(O)at]

What choice would I have? And it isn't as if he hadn't already been paid many times over for it. All he succeeded in doing was turning people who had never even heard him off of his work and exposing himself as a net.kook.

Who are they

[Quentusrex]

Would anyone be so nice as to briefly, or not, explain who these four people are? What they have done that people would recognize? etc? I surely don't recognize their name.

Are these people worth reading about, other than the fact that they got slashdotted?

Re:Who are they

[1000baseFX]

Your showing both how young you are and the fact that our schools are failing.
These are some of the bigger names in Science Fiction.
Never heard of "A boy and His Dog"?.

Re:Who are they

[mbrother]

Connie Willis -- Mulitple Hugo award winning sf author. Best known novel is probably DOOMSDAY BOOK. Harlan Ellison -- Multiple Hugo award winning sf author. Best known for short stories like "I have no mouth and I must scream." Also did some TV (e.g., Star Trek, Outer Limits) and movie work. Bruce Sterling -- one of the founders of the cyberpunk movement and still a big tech guru publishing regularly in Wired. He's won some of those Hugos, too, I believe. Try the ground-breaking cyberpunk anthology he edited in the 1980s called MIRRORSHADES. Len Wein -- probably the lesser of these four. Best known for THE PROBABILITY BROACH, which is probably the pinnacle of Libertarian SF featuring an alternative US where there was no constitution.

Re:Who are they

[Sangloth]

Bruce Sterling is a founding father of cyber-punk, next to William Gibson. Despite the role-playing world's that come to mind when cyber-punk is mentioned, Sterling's worlds are believable and his stories aren't very action oriented. One of his latest books was about politicians in the US in about 40 years. Bruce more looks at social trends then technology, that's not to say tech isn't in his books, but in general they are about society.

Connie Willis wrote the Doomsday book, a story about a time traveler stuck in Europe during the plague. There was a very heavy historical emphasis, in practice it was a historical novel. She's written other timetravel stuff. Her books aren't so much fun as interesting.

Harlan Ellison's books are fun. He is a brillant writer who should not be let out in public(The man is very easily offended, and not afraid to attack with a chair or what not when he is offended. If he's not violent, he's shouting furiously, and it really doesn't take anything intentional to set him off). He wrote I have no mouth and I must scream and Repent Harliqin said the Tick Tock Man. Harlan's books, and Harlan have a extreme cynical viewpoint that's very entertaining. Harlan started out attending sci fi conventions, and has many big sci fi writer friends. I don't know that his writings really fall in a sci fi category (To be clear, Harlan's books pay no attention to science at all, it's more experimental modern writing), but they are good reads.

I've read a ton of Sci Fi, and I've never heard of Len Wein. A quick google says he's a comics guy invovled heavily with X-men, fantastic 4, hulk, and the watchmen series. Some one else will have to give a perspective here.

All three authors are big names in Sci Fi, although none of them give more then lip service to the sci part. I can barely think of who else might belong on this list over them. (Well...Philip K. Dick, Asimov, Heinlien, Bester, Clarke, Cambell(Editor, not an author) a couple other golden oldies. Of living people under 70, Bear, Guin, Stephenson, Kress, and Gibson...Still that's a wish list... )

Still, these are the names of real Science Fiction in the last 20 years (Star Trek and such belong in fantasy or action). I'm not trying to be elitist. These are big names... If you don't know these people, you don't know science fiction...

Sangloth
I'd appreciate any comment with a logical basis...it doesn't even have to agree with me.

Re:Who are they

[oneiros27]

I remember that one!

See Spot.
See Spot run.
Run Spot, run.

I think we moved on to Hooked on Phonics after that ... or maybe it was the one where Spot gets a ball. A red ball. A big red ball.

Re:Who are they

[mbrother]

Ack, I blew it on Len Wein! L. Neil Smith is the author of THE PROBABILITY BROACH. Len Wein has done some media and comic book work.

Well, I said he was the least well-known of these four in SF circles. Guess I just proved that assertion with a data point.

Re:Who are they

[haystor]

No, "A Boy and His Dog" was more like:

See Jane.
See Jane run.
Run Jane, run.

Re:Who are they

[Forbman]

might as well throw in David Gerrold to the list, too. Larry Niven. Maybe even Jerry Pournelle.

If anyone has gotten the "alien invasion" right, it's Gerrold. Anyone who disputes this obviously has not seen Mother Nature in action (i.e., kudzu, himilayan blackberry, thistles, morning glory/bindweed, reed canary grass, et many al) when it comes to "alien" species slowly, then quickly, overwhelming an area in the span of about 1-3 years.

It starts out slow. there's a few here, a few there. We'll pull them out. OK. Next year, there's a few more. OK, maybe some Roundup or Crossbow. Ahhh shit. Get out the tractor.

Re:Who are they

[nanoakron]

Peter F. Hamilton - best UK newcomer. More focus on the 'Sci'. Read him, you'd enjoy it.

Re:Who are they

[julesh]

Gerrold, of course, is an author who also frequently gets the "who?" reaction, despite having written possibly the best loved Science Fiction story, ever.

I keep intending to read some of the Chtorr(sp?) books, but keep putting it off. I want to be certain he'll finish the series first. :)

Re:Who are they

[STrinity]

Yes, read Peter F. Hamilton. Provided you enjoy characters who have so little depth they make Mace Windu look like Hamlet, and prose so awful you could use it for shipping material.

Re:Who are they

[Res Publica Defenden]

Perhaps most importantly, Len Wein created Swamp Thing.... This set the stage for Alan Moore's genre-defining take on the character in the 1980s. Moore's run on Wein's character ultimately helped redefine the comics medium.

Re:Who are they

[cgreuter]

Connie Willis wrote the Doomsday book, a story about a time traveler stuck in Europe during the plague. [...] Her books aren't so much fun as interesting.

I never did manage to finish The Doomsday Book but I really enjoyed both To Say Nothing of the Dog and Bellwether and I would consider both of them to be great fun.

Willis tends to alternate between funny and dark. Doomsday was of the latter while the other two were more of the former. If you're curious, check them out or try one of her short-story collections. Impossible Things is a pretty good sampling of her work.

Re:Who are they

[mink]

I'd add Michael Swanwick to the list of current Science Fiction authors, but I am heavily biased.

SF == SourceForge

[Anonymous Coward]

For a second, I was hoping they were covering SourceForge on CNN.

Bruce Sterling free books

[chill]

Bruce is pretty hardcore into cyberpunk. Check out the links, including a LEGAL digital copy of his "The Hacker Crackdown" at http://project.cyberpunk.ru/idb/library.html

-Charles

Re:Bruce Sterling free books

[Anonymous Coward]

And for an interesting look at where the US may be heading in terms of the environment and politics, I recommend Sterling's more recent works, including "Heavy Weather", "Distraction", "Zeitgest" and "The Zeinth Angle".

This is a guy who really knows what is going on.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[grolaw]

Harlan, and anybody else who was proud of their work, would fight to keep their creation - both in the form that it was written and under some mechanism to recover payment for the work.

Harlan was right. End of story.

Outrageous!

[Anonymous Coward]

... the host, Renay San Miguel, seems to really know SF, and he interviewed Harlan Ellison...

Ellison will of course be utterly outraged at the fact that he was interviewed, and will probably start a lawsuit about it.

Re:wish I had an ipod

[1000baseFX]

Hey, pull your head out. They're mp3's.

An interesting listen-to

[AndrenidEnder]

although I'm unsure it really did more than simply reaffirm what we already knew: that Hollywood often fails at accurately representing the genre of Science Fiction.

Bruce Sterling?

[lheal]

My mind filled in: "oh, the Twilight Zone guy".

Then I realized that Rod Serling was probably dead of lung cancer by now, and that I didn't know who Bruce Sterling was.

Re:Bruce Sterling?

[cei]

Then again, with the parent post misreading as "Bruce Willis", that could be "the Twilight Zone guy" too... Bruce starred in the New Twilight Zone episode based on one of Ellison's short stories, "Shatterday".

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[mbrother]

At this time in tech history, I think it's to a writer's advantage to give away their work online, and that it actually helps sales of paperbacks and hardbacks. I put my money where my mouth is and my first novel, Star Dragon (Tor 2003), is available for free download from my site under a Creative Commons license. That's a decision that I made and my editor has supported. I hope it helps me generate sales at the milli-Ellison level or better.

But it's against the law to copy stories without permission. Harlan is old school, and as obnoxious as all hell when he wants to be, and that's his right here. Sure, publishers need to change their business model, but they haven't just yet. Respect the artist. If you think he sucks so much, why do you want to read his work anyway?

I wanted to use a story by Geoffrey Landis in my astronomy class last semester. I emailed him up, asked him if I could make 120 copies for my students, and he said absolutely. Even asked if I wanted the story in electronic form. If he'd said no, I wouldn't have done it.

Ellison is the William Shatner of Written Scifi

[infonography]

He's too busy puffing up his rep to write anything inventive. It's been what 25 years since he did anything worth reading. Funnier still, Bill Shatner has actually written better SciFi then Ellison. Why does the name Ellison seem to come with a air pump plug directly into the head? Larry is the same way. Seeing either of them is like watching a Bobble head doll that talks. (actually babbles)

Re:Ellison is the William Shatner of Written Scifi

[grolaw]

Not a chance.

Read, Dogfight on 101

Then compare Shatner with Ellison, if you can.

A simple, solid short story of a family man and his "souped-up" car. Ellison is a craftsman who mastered the short story - Shatner came late to the party and only because Roddenberry cast him in a SF role.

Ellison is a writer, first, last and always. His muse may wain, but the body of work is solid.

Finally, Ellison has done dramatic readings for years. It is another outlet for the artist and many of those are classics.

See, http://www.audible.com/ and search for Ellison as narrator.

Re:Ellison is the William Shatner of Written Scifi

[mbrother]

Ellison has continued to produce good work in recent years, just not things as famous and ground-breaking as he did once upon a time.

And what makes you think Shatner actually writes? His name on some books?

Re:Ellison is the William Shatner of Written Scifi

[infonography]

Case in point, Along the Scenic Route ["Dogfight on 101"], (ss) Adam Aug 1969

And a lot of others have dug into that road-rage vein, there was even a card game by Steve Jackson Games called Car-Wars. And as I recall they mentioned a different story of the same vintage as inspiration.

Re:Ellison is the William Shatner of Written Scifi

[tengu1sd]

William Shattner provides the cover name, I've been told by several sources that there's at least 2 Ghost-writers behind Shattner's books.

Not that this is a bad thing if they're willing to take the check and pass credit on Big Name Actor. It's a business you know and the next Tek book is coming out, check out the William Shattner homepage for book store appearances.

Re:Ellison is the William Shatner of Written Scifi

[Chris Mattern]

Case in point, Along the Scenic Route ["Dogfight on 101"], (ss) Adam Aug 1969

And a lot of others have dug into that road-rage vein, there was even a card game by Steve Jackson Games called Car-Wars. And as I recall they mentioned a different story of the same vintage as inspiration.

Er, it's a board game, in the wargame/simulation vein. I still have my copy.

Chris Mattern

Ever read Firefly by Piers Anthony?

[crovira]

Not Firefly, the movie by Wheadon.

That was a disturbing book as much for its fundamental premise as for its denoument as for its cast of characters. (A paedohile who is a victim of his young 'victim'.)

This was a great book which made me think.

Re:Ever read Firefly by Piers Anthony?

[JLF65]

It is a great book. I have it sitting on the shelf just a few feet to my left. A lot of his stuff is just teen whacking material, but that one is really some of his best work.

RFTA?!

[Anonymous Coward]

One time when you can't say that.

Ellison on Religion

[mcleodnine]

With this summer's wanna-be blockbuster shrouded in the cloak of Tommy Cruises' Scientology rant, I'm dead curious to hear what insight Harlan has to offer on this topic.

C'mon. You know you want to tell us.

Please?

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[SA Stevens]

Why do writers have to take actions that some pundits think 'is to their advantage' to keep face?

In this Country, In this Era

[Quentusrex]

In this mostly planned economy, that too often verges on and grows ever closer to a socialism, why would the public school system teach anything about SF? They are already bogged down trying to teach multi-ethnic understanding, the extremes of bipolar(atleast politically) secularism, not equal opportunity but equal reality, social irresponsibility and trust in federal courts for all matters moral and ethical, and the many other view "new" initiatives in place today.

Can you really blame any graduate from the US Public School System for not knowing the 4 names?

Re:In this Country, In this Era

[Forbman]

They should make students read "Player Piano", by Kurt Vonnegut.

Capitalism? Only on eBay, auctions and garage sales. Otherwise, might as well call it corporate socialism. Govment makes more and more policies that are solely for benefit (or punishment) of industries or enterprises. That people might be involved is paid at best lip service.

Re:In this Country, In this Era

[indifferent children]

They are already bogged down trying to teach multi-ethnic understanding, the extremes of bipolar(atleast politically) secularism

That would be an argument for teaching more SF. SF has long been a force for social change, usually in a liberal, multi-ethnic, secular* direction. If the schools were the subversive influence that you claim, SF would be required reading.

* secular not necessarily meaning anti-religion, but the bronze-age religions (Zoroastrianism, Athenian mythology, Hinduism, Judaism and its decendents: Christianity and Islam, etc.) rarely get favorable treatment.

Obligatory...

[Grendel Drago]

I'm stone deaf, you insensitive clod!

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh! You said "end of story"! That's that nail in the coffin for THIS argument!

Ok everyone, we can stop debating this one, because "grolaw" has it all sewn up.

Look, just because "grolaw" says it's true, doesn't make it so. Now, shoo.

He offered that insight on Hour 25.

[Stormbringer]

...back in the 80's. Hour 25 is now online-only, but it was a 2-hour Friday-night program on KPFK-FM in Los Angeles, hosted by Mike Hodel and Mel Gilden, at the time, and Harlan was a frequent guest. No doubt, Eric Foss has the entire broadcast archived on tape somewhere.

From what I recall, Ellison said something like, "I attended a party in New York, along with some other writers, including L. Ron Hubbard, and Hubbard was saying something about 'Y'know what I should do? Invent a new religion. That's where all the real money is.' And, next thing you know, he came out with his next book, 'Dianetics'."

Re:He offered that insight on Hour 25.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yup. Heard him say this exact thing at a UCLA science fiction convention (Yay, Enigmacon!) in the late 80s.

It's slow

[Anonymous Coward]

Anyone got a torrent of the mp3?

From Kurosawa to Blade Runner

[AHuxley]

Great to hear some good comments about Hollywood and remakes. So much cash, cpu power, world wide sales and yet they always totally fail with plot. How many ppl know of the SW Kurosawa link? There is a good interview with Steven Spielberg talking about War of the Worlds with a great line about remakes 'Why does Hollywood remake a classic? Because they didn't get it wrong the first time.' http://www.abc.net.au/tv/enoughrope/transcripts/s1 385190.htm

Re:wish I had an ipod

[ken_devon]

That link points straight at a 40 meg file. And their web server **hasn't melted**. Amazing, simply amazing.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[aichpvee]

I'd take it as a sign that I had "made it" and be happy. Unless they were trying to claim it was their IP, at which point I'd find who was doing it and go to their house with a shotgun rather than waste time trying to shutdown the distribution channel.

podcast?!?! WTF?!?!

[aichpvee]

podcast has to be the most idiotic word EVER. It's just a fucking mp3 download!!!

Next thing will be these same idiots pizzacasting dinner from Domino's and dvdcasting a movie from Blockbuster. And don't forget to oilcast some fuel from the Texaco while you're out, morons!

Re:podcast?!?! WTF?!?!

[InfinityBuffer]

Pizzacasting will pave the way to a new era where you can download pizza instantly. This is extremely important to the way humans live.

Ellison

[east coast]

Is there any slashdotters that really hold Ellison high for his works? I had a paperback of some of his short tales and I just couldn't get into it.

My only other real knowledge of Ellison is a ST:TOS episode and his rants on the late CNet from sci-fi. And when it comes down to it rants are rants; much like assholes everyone has one and normally since most are based on opinion alone very few of them ever mean anything.

I know the man has an extensive work pool but I've never met anyone with a seriously high opinion of anything he's ever done.

And no, this is not a troll but rather a question of who likes this guy and for what reason?

Re:Ellison

[Anonymous Coward]

Some of his early work was just purely pulp sci-fi, and a lot of it just isn't really engaging on anything more than an escapist level.

That said "love ain't nothing but sex mispelled" and "angry candy" are some of the only books I've read that made my insides knot up and my face to contort with anxiety just from the vivid ways in which he conveys emotional pain. They're some of the best stories i've read anywhere.

Re:Ellison

[bhima]

Well... It's like I think he's super great... but you are pretty much guaranteed to get a good read with his works, rather than the crap shoot you get with other authors.

Re:Ellison

[bhima]

whoops! I meant "It's NOT Like"

Re:Ellison

[Anonymous Coward]

Harlan Ellison is beloved by many for being someone who fought the good fight in the 60's and 70's. From supporting farm workers to fighting against taboos, he was a role model to a generation of writers that would come after. He also encouraged hundreds of young writers personally, in many, many selfless ways, offering advice as readily as a spare couch. I have never met a man who was so kind and giving.

Harlan was also probably one of the first science fiction writers who could read a story aloud to an audience and keep them spellbound. Unfortunately for history, most of his output was in short story form and so didn't get the acclaim that novelists got. Track down an anthology like "I have no Mouth and I must Scream" to see why his fiction was respected. But unlike most authors, his bravery, courage, love, and kindness were as important as his written work.

Re:Ellison

[reymyster]

I Have No Mouth and I Must Scream & Shatterday are 2 that are particularly standing out in my mind as having loved...I could probably think of more, but not at 4 in the morning.

Re:Ellison

[Bhodi]

I'd say there are just a few people who like Babylon 5, on which he was a 'creative consultant'. He gave enough input to the series that his name is shown prominently at the begining of every single episode.

I personally love B5 but I feel it doesn't hold a candle to some of his literary works (check out The Essential Ellison for a sampling of that).

As far as name recognition and viewer/readership of the general populace, I'd say B5 is his most 'famous' work.

Re:Ellison

[julesh]

Is there any slashdotters that really hold Ellison high for his works? I had a paperback of some of his short tales and I just couldn't get into it.

Ellison ain't for casual reading, that's certain. Try some of his screenplays if you can't get into his stories: there are several episodes of the original Outer Limits series that he wrote; "Demon with a Glass Hand" is often considered the best, and is frequently cited as an important source of the inspiration for "The Terminator".

Also, some of his best work is in things he has edited, rather than written. The anthology, "Dangerous Visions" is considered by many to be a groundbreaking point in the world of SF short stories. I hear he is also a good friend of Joe Straczynski's and was highly influential in the writing of B5.

Re:Ellison

[Malleus Dei]

Is there any slashdotters that really hold Ellison high for his works?

Me.

Re:Ellison

[OSXCPA]

Ellison is known mostly for his 'human-centric' science fiction. Best example, IMHO, is "I have not mouth and I must scream". Not for the exclusively 'hard' sci-fi fan, but thought-provoking nonetheless. He also did some work on the original Trek, and between then and now had published a LOT of work. He's like a less-emotionally blasted, bitterer version of P. Dick. Basically, I like him because he treats his characters like people, rather than cutouts, which I see a lot in fiction in general, and Science Fiction in particular. Oh, and his rant about turning Asimovs' "I, Robot" into a screenplay (NOT the W. Smith version) in the published, illustrated screenplay is worth the purchase price. Angry, ranty - yes. Worshipful of good material, yes. 'Worthy'? IMHO, yes.

Re:Ellison

[SA Stevens]

Ellison is almost a 'litmus test for geeks.'

Or was, awhile back. I remember being twisted by his work back in about 1978 in ways that I've never recovered from. And that was late in his work.

People who don't read much but who watch 'sci-fi' on teevee and think they understand the genre probably haven't read 'The Glass Teat' but really, really need to.

Re:Ellison

[Anonymous Coward]

I think the same. He's over-rated. If you want to read stuff that'll knock you out, try to find some William Hjortsberg. Especially "Gray Matters"... Written in 70 or 71, it makes The Matrix look like something a four-year-old drew.

Re:Ellison

[graikor]

I've been a huge Ellison fan since the first time I read "Repent, Harlequin!" Said the Ticktock Man in the early 80's.

A few other very good Ellison stories include:
Mefisto in Onyx
Grail
Djinn, No Chaser
Pretty Maggie Moneyeys
Shattered Like a Glass Goblin
Paingod
The Deathbird
Anywhere but Here, With Anybody But You
Chatting With Anubis
Midnight in the Sunken Cathedral
Paladin of the Lost Hour

and many others I'm too lazy to type out.

The thing about Ellison's writing that grabs so many people is that he expertly blends fantastic settings and situations with real human drama. The events descibed might be bizarre or possibly futuristic (although Ellison's work usually has a timeless quality), but the emotions the characters are dealing with are very real and familiar.

/My personal Ellison story - Harlan had a huge line for autographs at Dragoncon '99, and I was too far back to be able to get my book signed before he had to leave. He came back on his own time to sign for all the people who got cut off in that line. A real stand-up guy!

Re:Ellison

[swordgeek]

I love Ellison's work. No question that he's something of an asshole, but he's an entertaining one, and often not nearly as serious as people think he's being.

Since no one else has mentioned it yet, find a copy of "The Deathbird." If you can find the collection called Deathbird Stories, it has many of the other recommended works posted here. Also read "A Boy and his Dog," and then rent the movie (one of the only real SF movies ever made).

Now, why do I like his works? First of all, they're uncompromising--Ellison writes what he wants, and pulls no punches. OK, that's not entirely difficult to manage. However, Ellison taps into the heart of human emotions--his writing in The Deathbird is so powerful that it makes me weep, and not just with sadness but also partly with relief and closure. Not many other authors can manage that--Murakami is one, and I'm not sure I can think of any others--maybe Gabriel Garcia Marquez.

Also, there's his wicked sense of humour--A Boy and his Dog is a brilliant black comedy, and too many people have missed that aspect of his writing.

One secret: Read his short stories one at a time. Sit down, read one, and then walk away. Maybe go back to it in a few days, but don't read them back to back, or you'll just glue them all together in your mind.

Re:Ellison

[Frumious Wombat]

Don't forget some of his non-fiction (or at least non-fictionalized) works, such as, " The Three Most Important Things in Life: Sex, Violence, and Labor Relations" which can be found (apparently officially) at http://harlanellison.com/iwrite/mostimp.htm/ . Two suitably bizarre accounts, and then his Half-day employment by Disney.

Having read some of his personal essays, as well as the standards such as, "I Have No Mouth, but I Must Scream", I would say the operative adjective isn't "prickly" but rather "obstreperous".

Re:Ellison

[Malleus Dei]

Ah, Deathbird Stories. I'm in SFWA and have been reading SF&F since the fifties and nothing in the genre has ever had the emotional impact on me of Deathbird Stories.

You write that he pulls no punches? That's not the half of it. Harlan pulled out every single emotional stop when he wrote those stories. He's gut-punching the reader when he's not pulling the reader's heartstrings.

I've read just about everyone in SF&F, and IMO the two greatest writers of short story in the genre are Harlan Ellsion and Cordwainer Smith (a pseudonym for Colonel Paul Linebarger, Ph.D - psychological warfare expert, military officer, CIA agent, and professor of Asiatic Studies at Johns Hopkins University's School of Advanced International Studies).

By the way, if you haven't read any Cordwainer Smith, do yourself a big favor: dig up a copy of The Best of Cordwainer Smith and read it.

If you can't find that collection, look individually for "The Ballad of Lost C'mell," "Scanners Live in Vain," "The Game of Rat and Dragon," "The Crime and the Glory of Commander Suzdal," "Golden the Ship Was - Oh Oh Oh," and "Mother Hitton's Littul Kittons."

You won't regret it.

Why it has to be protected

[DynaSoar]

mbrother (739193) sez: "At this time in tech history, I think it's to a writer's advantage to give away their work online"

Unless things have changed a great deal recently, at this time in legel history it's all but necessary for writers to keep their work off the net unless the publisher releases it for that.

Almost all writers' contracts require that they sign over e-rights to the publisher as part of their contract, whether or not the publisher intends to do anything with them. The writer signs away the e-rights, or doesn't sign the contract.

Note that e-rights are rights to publish, not ownership. The writer still owns them.

Along comes the work, posted online. The author has to make an effort to protect the work, because signing the e-rights gave the publisher the right to release it. If the writer doesn't, they are in violation of their contract and the whole thing can be cancelled.

A few writers like Harlan can afford to take on a case like this themselves, and can afford to refuse to have an e-rights clause in their contract. Most can't. If they want to get the contract, they sign the whole thing, and they're stuck having to do their own police work.

If a writer has signed a publishing contract for the work that includes an e-rights clause they can't publish it on line, and they have to try to prevent others from doing so.

At least that's the way it was explained to me by Charlie Petit, Harlan's lawyer during the lawsuit, while I was serving as material witness and slated as expert witness. Harlan was protecting his own work because he wanted to, not because he had to, because he didn;t have to contend with these silly e-rights issues in contracts. He also did so because newer authors didn't have the resources to be doing things like this all the time, and he wanted to see this made public so they wouldn't get screwed out of being able to be authors.

Re:Why it has to be protected

[1u3hr]

Along comes the work, posted online. The author has to make an effort to protect the work, because signing the e-rights gave the publisher the right to release it. If the writer doesn't, they are in violation of their contract and the whole thing can be cancelled.

Rubbish. Why then do none of the other thousands of authors whose work you can find online do this? As long as the author himself has not put the work up, which would violate most publishing contracts which give the sole right to publish to the publisher, then it's not the author's responsibility to police this. The publisher has the right and means to do this should they want. Authors' contracts usually delegate the authority to pursue infringement cases to the publisher. I guess Harlan's didn't think it was worth the trouble to try to sue someone who had scanned and OCRed some of his stories.

Actually, from what I know about this case, Harlan has no moral high ground. He made a deal with the guy who posted the files, the person who directly and knowingly violated his copyright, so he would give evidence against AOL, which WAS NOT the news server the files were posted from, merely one which carried the newsgroup with deep pockets.

Re:Why it has to be protected

[julesh]

He made a deal with the guy who posted the files, the person who directly and knowingly violated his copyright, so he would give evidence against AOL, which WAS NOT the news server the files were posted from, merely one which carried the newsgroup with deep pockets.

And refused (or rather, incompetently failed) to remove the material when requested to do so, thus losing their legal protection against such things. His stance on AOL was entirely fair, I believe.

Re:Why it has to be protected

[1u3hr]

And refused (or rather, incompetently failed) to remove the material when requested to do so, thus losing their legal protection against such things. His stance on AOL was entirely fair, I believe.

Do you know anything about Usenet? It's practically impossible to comply and run a decent feed. Usenet is ephemeral anyway. Articles expire in days or weeks; and no single ISP could delete a post from every other server. And as I said, it did not originate with AOL, they have no authority to delete it from other servers. But more importantly, my point stands: Ellison gave a free pass to the guy who posted his story, and went after the company that had unwittingly allowed access to it. You may think this justified, but if generally applied this would lead to a completely locked down Internet, ISPs wouldn't let you use news, IRC or anything that allowed you to upload for fear of being sued. If Ellison wanted to protect his copyright he had a case against the poster, he published it. AOL acted as the delivery service, (I don't know if they tried the common carrier defence). That he ignored the willful act and went after the jackpot loses any moral authority he has on the subject.

Re:Why it has to be protected

[Anonymous Coward]

I think I should note that I can easily find some (much?) of his work on p2p apps. He went after one fish, but the rest of the school simply went right by.

Re:Why it has to be protected

[julesh]

Do you know anything about Usenet?

Yes. I've been a user on and off since '94, and have wasted away a lot of time on various groups.

It's practically impossible to comply and run a decent feed. Usenet is ephemeral anyway. Articles expire in days or weeks; and no single ISP could delete a post from every other server. And as I said, it did not originate with AOL, they have no authority to delete it from other servers.

Yes, but they could have complied with Ellison's actual request, which was to remove it from their own servers. And, legally speaking, were required to do so. Which was why, when they failed, they were sued.

Re:Why it has to be protected

[1u3hr]

Yes, but they could have complied with Ellison's actual request, which was to remove it from their own servers. And, legally speaking, were required to do so. Which was why, when they failed, they were sued.

I don't know if that's true -- "legally required" how? Doesn't really matter anyway, that was susbsidiary to my point, which I won't bore you by repeating. Also, after looking up the status of this case, Ellison has settled with AOL and they've kissed up now. I wonder how much he screwed them for.

Ellison said: "Through this litigation, I have come to realize that AOL respects the rights of authors and artists, and has a comprehensive system for addressing the complaints of copyright holders. I would not have settled this case if I were not sure that AOL is doing what it can do to fight online piracy. Because not all Internet service providers are as responsible as AOL, and because individual acts of online piracy continue, I am glad to have called attention to the problem of online piracy through this litigation.

I'll note that you can download Ellison's books on alt.binaries.e-books to this day. Personally, I either buy or borrow real books to read so I have no personal agenda.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Anonymous Coward]

I wanted to use a story by Geoffrey Landis in my astronomy class last semester. I emailed him up, asked him if I could make 120 copies for my students, and he said absolutely. Even asked if I wanted the story in electronic form.

Oh yes. 120 students who'd never heard of him before get to read a story by him. If there's one thing non-bestseller authors need, its word-of-mouth and getting their writings in front of potential readers. He'd be mad to refuse (assuming the publisher slipped up and Landis still owns some of the rights to his stories and can give permission...)

Or put it another way: Tell a hard SF author you want to use his story for teaching astronomy, what do you think he's going to say? Flattery will get you everywhere.

Obligatory Baen books link, about what giving away your texts does for the sales of non A-list authors: http://www.baen.com/library/palaver6.htm

Haven't seen/heard it yet...

[sgant]

Let me guess: all Harlen Ellison talks about is how great a writer he is and how much better his script for "City on the Edge of Forever" was than the one filmed for Star Trek.

Am I right? I mean, that's ALL this guy talks about.

Re:Haven't seen/heard it yet...

[djlowe]

"Let me guess"
Why guess? You can listen for yourself, and spare the rest of us your ignorance.

Oh, and his first name is spelled "Harlan", BTW.

Re:Haven't seen/heard it yet...

[sgant]

Nah...I'd rather guess and try to be clever than to actually spend time actually RTFA...er...L(isten)TFA I guess in this situation.

I mean, this IS Slashdot. And you of course fulfilled the other Slashdot requirement of correcting someone's spelling when it doesn't matter at all.

Bravo! Good to see someone keeping the old traditions alive.

Re:Haven't seen/heard it yet...

[tverbeek]

Ellison is known to be willing to share his strongly-held opinions about many other topics.

Slashdot as therapy

[abulafia]

An under-medicated, short curmudgeon, with distinct bi-polar and antisocial traits who used his personality as a birth control device is a somewhat more accurate description of the Ellison I know.

I feel much better about myself now. Thank you.

Re:Slashdot as therapy

[grolaw]

Harlan would have:

Punched me out

stolen my gal

hogged the dais

and, bragged about it.

You do nice graphics. I feel much better about you, too.

You are ranked 400,000 on Amazon

[Anonymous Coward]

I checked Amazon and found that your novel, "Star Dragon" is ranked 400,000 place with only 4 customer reviews. Tell me again why free distribution helps new authors?

New authors should worry about improving their writing craftsmanship instead of distribution systems. Readers have to be interested in your books and want to read them before you can sell them or even give them away for free.

Re:You are ranked 400,000 on Amazon

[julesh]

I checked Amazon and found that your novel, "Star Dragon" is ranked 400,000 place with only 4 customer reviews. Tell me again why free distribution helps new authors?

You do know that the percentage of SF books still in print after 2 years is rather low, don't you? Books tend to only sell many copies in the first 6 months to a year after their release. If you want to continue selling after that, you need to keep interest alive by having another novel published that's more successful...

Also, for this to do much good, we have to hear about his novel before we can download it. Then, well, it might not improve sales of this one -- I'm going to download it now, having just heard about its availability for the first time, but I'm unlikely to buy it. I might watch for his next one and buy that, though, if I like it. It's a good way of raising your profile.

Re:You are ranked 400,000 on Amazon

[mbrother]

The paperback has been out for over six months, the hardback for closer to two years. The vast majority of books sell the majority of their copies within the first few months of release. That's how the business works.

And a new author who doesn't worry about publicity and advertising is hurting their own career. You'd like to think that a great book will sell on its own merits, but people have to know a book is great in the first place. Star Dragon got great reviews, and was a finalist for the John W. Campbell award for best science fiction novel of the year. It's a good book for its readership...if they know it exists.

I expect the biggest benefits will come when my second novel is released.

You're right, new authors should worry about their craft. Published writers should worry about everything in their power to control, from craft improvements to publicity. It's not like you can't do more than one thing.

Re:You are ranked 400,000 on Amazon

[sakshale]

I checked Amazon and found that your novel, "Star Dragon" is ranked 400,000 place with only 4 customer reviews. Tell me again why free distribution helps new authors?

Did you read the article? The author gives numbers demonstrating that the sales of his books increased after being posted. Your question implies that Amazon stats are significant. However large it is, Amazon still is only one vendor. Could it be that most online sales go through the Bean site? I have no clue. Possible most sales go through the local book store. Again, I have no clue. The author, however, posted the summary statistics for the sales through all channels. That just might be a clue....

Won't waste time on video

[Odd John]

Notice the irony. Writers, whose only skill is the written word, who have strongly criticized the poverty of TV/movies/video, are being presented by CNN in a low quality video format.

I'd prefer to read a transcript of the interview than:

- wait for a 40 meg download to

- watch low resolution video

- with low resolution audio of talking heads.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[julesh]

At this time in tech history, I think it's to a writer's advantage to give away their work online, and that it actually helps sales of paperbacks and hardbacks. I put my money where my mouth is and my first novel, Star Dragon (Tor 2003), is available for free download from my site under a Creative Commons license. That's a decision that I made and my editor has supported. I hope it helps me generate sales at the milli-Ellison level or better.

Thanks. I'm actually downloading it right now; it's good to be able to read some work by new people so that I can learn whether I like it or not. I discovered Charlie Stross, David Weber and Mercedes Lackey like this, and I hope your story can come close to some of theirs. :)

Out of interest, who is your editor? I'm wondering whose desk I should aim to get my novel manuscript onto, you see. ;)

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Anonymous Coward]

Here's some IP for you: the English language. It's "YOUR IP", arsebiscuit.

Re:podcast?!?! WTF?!?!

[julesh]

podcast has to be the most idiotic word EVER. It's just a fucking mp3 download!!!

Actually, it's a subscription-based syndicated audio article.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[mbrother]

Yes, I agree with what you say. It makes sense. I was mainly making the counter-Ellison point, that many science fiction writers are not rabidly anti-file sharing the way he is, because there are good arguments for doing it.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[mbrother]

Drop me a private email (mbrother@uwyo.edu) and I'll give you, or point you at, as much good advice and information as I can. It's hard to break in, but I believe that if you write a good book it will sell. There are pitfalls to avoid, and things that can make the process easier.

Re:podcast?!?! WTF?!?!

[Anonymous Coward]

"pod-"

What do "pods" have to do with anything? (besides humping Apple's iPod?) MP3 files are not iPod specific.

"-cast"

A subscription is not really a broadcast, is it?

So the entire phrase is wrong. Yet people keep using it because they're retarded "fashionable" sheep and a more accurate phrase like "mp3 subscription" or "audio subscription" or "audio syndication" or even "audiosyn" isn't "cool".

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Mr2001]

Sure, publishers need to change their business model, but they haven't just yet. Respect the artist. If you think he sucks so much, why do you want to read his work anyway?

It is possible to respect someone and his work without obliging his every wish about how it should be enjoyed and distributed. For example, Kafka wanted his writings to be destroyed upon his death... but we're all better off today because someone decided he was wrong.

Re:Oh, PULEEEZE

[Impy the Impiuos Imp]

> At this time in tech history, I think it's to
> a writer's advantage to give away their work online,

That may be, but it's still up to the writer to do this, not for people to steal his work, ummmmm, "for his own good."

Re:podcast?!?! WTF?!?!

[mge]

It's just a fucking mp3 download!!!

Not only that, its 41 MB. Thats right.

41 MB of SPOKEN WORD INTERVIEWS !!!
I've got perfectly listenable copies of the H2G2 radio series, and they run to aprox 11MB per 30 miute show, so this better be good...

Re:podcast?!?! WTF?!?!

[mge]

FF reported it was 41Mb. Turned out to be 33MB
for 36 minutes of spoken word.