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What is Mainframe Culture?
An anonymous reader asks: "A couple years ago Joel Spolsky wrote an interesting critique of Eric S. Raymond's The Art of Unix Programming wherein Joel provides an interesting (as usual) discussion on the cultural differences between Windows and Unix programmers. As a *nix nerd in my fifth year managing mainframe developers, I need some insight into mainframe programmers. What are the differences between Windows, Unix, and mainframe programmers? What do we all need to know to get along in each other's worlds?"
Comment removed based on user account deletion
"What do we all need to know to get along in each other's worlds?""
You could try exchanging porno links to one another, that seems to be the way nerds bond. Just a thought.
..Punchcards, ENIAC tattoos and nipple piercings that look and spin like tape reels.
Starsucks
"Giant Fucking Flamewar on /.: Story @ 11"
https://www.accountkiller.com/removal-requested
What do you all need to know to get along in each other's worlds?
1. Windows bad
2. Unix good
3. Linux better
This is Slashdot, what kind of response did you think he was going to get?
The preceding message was based on actual events. Only the names, locations and events have been changed.
I think it's the beards. Windows programmers are usually cleanly shaved, unix programmers are usually bearded, and mainframe programmers usually have gray beards. They probably have a distinct smell, but I'm not going there.
:-]
For Unix devs:
1. Learn to CamlCase your API, variable names, etc.
2. Turn all '-' or '--' into '/' in command line arguments.
3. Use 'dir' instead of 'ls -l'
For Windows devs:
1. Learn to lowercase all your API, variable names, etc.
2. Turn all '/' into '-' or '--' in command line arguments.
3. Use 'ls -l' instead of 'dir'
I once had a signature.
Windows programmers don't know how to program without a GUI.
Linux programmers don't know how to program with a GUI.
Mainframe programmers wonder what a GUI is.
end humor transmission.
I am scientifically inaccurate.
The length of the beard?
Mainframers know that you cannot reboot a machine willy nilly, since someone may be running a simulation that takes 6 months to complete, he may be in month 5.5 now and on first name basis with the guy that normally signs your pay cheque...
Oh well, what the hell...
windows programmers have to learn completely new shit every two years. unix programmers keep programming the same shit year after year.
laugh. it's a joke.
My problem? I was perfectly gruntled, until some numbnuts came by and dissed me.
I'm curious as to which definition of MF you're using...
Just look at the tools in the trunk of their cars. The Linux and Windoze guys will have a few screwdrivers rolling around there. The mainframe guys have blowtorches.
Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
That is not the best assumption, as the Windows app is likely to be running alongside Bonzi Buddie and at least 7,000 pieces of malware and virii.
Don't blame Durga. I voted for Centauri.
Where the control-key modifier is in Unix, the Enter/Return (one of these) is in Mainframes, is the wavey flag is in Windows.
The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
How do you post something from December 14, 2003, and get away with calling it news for nerds?
No existe.
Mainframe guys don't reboot their system. Unix guys reboot the system occasionally. Windows guys reboot their machine several times a week.
... I have plenty of karma to burn, and this looks to have been posted to start a huge flame war. Why fight fate?
1. Windows is teh bestest, like EVER!
2. Unix is ok, you get good at typing...
3. Linux stole from SCO!
I will now invite retorts. (ducks)
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
You could try exchanging porno links to one another, that seems to be the way nerds bond. Just a thought.
You are sooooo right, and if you handn't posted as an AC, I would have sent you this sweet link, called goatse.cx, to cement our friendship.
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
1. Windows programmer: There are two sub-phyla of Windows programmer:
A) Fanatic Windows programmer: Refuses to use any software not made by Microsoft or an approved Microsoft partner; openly mocks Linux, unix, Firefox, and you when you suggest any of the three; programs exactly the way Microsoft tells him to in MSDN articles, and is deeply distrustful of any different approaches; loves IE and is laden with spyware and viruses, but refuses to admit it, saying things like "it's the hardware; I need a new machine".
B) Normal Windows programmer: Uses Windows because it's what everyone else has (and he wants to sell them things); uses Firefox and generally avoids IE; understands that Windows is limited and imperfect, but finds it useful for some subset of tasks; is interested in Linux but vaguely irritated by Linux fanatics calling him a sell-out. Secretly wants to eat spicy Schezuan with the Linux geeks, but not that fanatic with the blue hair (she's too freaky);
2. Linux (2 sub-phyla):
A) Fanatic Linux user: despises Windows users, seeing them as the zombie hordes following Bill Gates, his Satan; throws things at Windows users when they're within range, shouting "Shoo! Shoo! Get back on your short bus and go home!"; compiles everything from scratch to install, because otherwise he'll feel unworthy; generally only uses "Free" software, eschewing anything even remotely non-free, which seriously limits him. Secretly feels betrayed by the moderate Linux users, wants to eat Schezuan with them but knows that Windows guy will be there, so goes for pizza instead.
B) Normal Linux user: Uses Linux because he doesn't have to worry about spyware and viruses (much) and can simply use and enjoy his machine without having to put up with a lot of annoyances; is intrigued by Windows but dislikes the Windows fanatics, who make fun of him (he suspects they live in a town with lead water pipes, and forgives them in pity); he generally doesn't care what other people use as long as his Slackware instance is running well; he occasionally uses Knoppix to rescue one of his Windows-using coworkers when their registry gets corrupted; Secretly enjoys the look they give him after he recovers all their data, it makes him feel Wizardly. LOVES Schezuan food.
3. Mainframe users: Aren't sure what all this "Linux" and "Windows" nonsense is about, and suspect it's a fad the kids are following; Are very fond of their new VT-100 terminal (2400 baud! Kick ass!); Are starting to suspect they might be in for some trouble -- they've had to page all their data off disk to tape a THIRD time this month, how can their disks keep getting full? They're 40MB!!! SOMETHING funny's going on... Are secretly nervous about the boss and that young intern kid and the new box they've been setting up in the corner; those two keep giving us significant looks, what IS that, some kind of new networking thing? Bill over in tech support said it had "blades" in it...; and they still laugh about how "Emacs Makes A Computer Slow". Ha ha ha! Snort!
Farewell! It's been a fine buncha years!
When a mainframe becomes loaded with spyware, you do not throw it in the dumpster!
Ask your team, also known as the entire mainframe community
Simulation result will still be 42
3.243F6A8885A308D313
Yeah Im guilty of taking one of these jobs down.. The guy was a total dick, and if the simulation is that involved, here is an idea, SAVE YOUR STATE time to time. Besides power failures do happen ;)
[ ] Unix
[ ] Mainframe
[ ] Windows
beard #2
[ ] Unix
[ ] Mainframe
[ ] Windows
beard #3
[ ] Unix
[ ] Mainframe
[ ] Windows
My first day as an operator, they had me printing on the old Xerox 9790. I was happily typing jobs into the queue via JES2 with $pprt2. The whole system froze about a 15 minutes in. Panic ensued, but nobody - especially me - knew what happened. They sent me to lunch while systems, the HSM guys and the operators tried to figure it out.
When I got back everything was fine and there was a big "$P" on my locker. I flubbed a key and typed in $P which is the command to halt JES2 (yes, systems should have disabled it from the print terminal). They were all very good humored about it and showed me how to IPL that Sunday where I got my chance to type it at the correct time.
US Democracy:The best person for the job (among These pre-selected choices...)
What can you program in Unix that you can't in Windows.
Er.. programs that run for more than 30 seconds without turning blue?
Not that blue isn't a perfectly good color...
no offense.
Like this?
The truth about Scientology, Xenu, and you: Operation Clambake
> Linux programmers don't know how to program with a GUI.
> Mainframe programmers wonder what a GUI is.
Corollary for end users - and yes, my Dad's first email message to me was indeed sent in all caps:
MAINFRAME USERS THINK THAT USING ALL CAPS WHEN SENDING MEMOS IS PERFECTLY NORMAL
Linux users think that using all caps in email is YELLING.
windows users dont no how 2 use nething but there im proggy
Hmm, we were doing Spice simulations on a Sperry-Univac - friend of mine forgot to add a maximum pages command to limit the printouts in case of an error and read his stack of punch cards, then waited and waited and waited.
Eventually, he ran it again and was just about to run for the third time, when the elevator door opened and in rolled a trolley full of paper from the high speed printer in the basement...
Oh well, what the hell...
I GNU there'd be someone who'd question our free superiority!
Hey You got a problem with my PDP 11/24? Its got everything I need, PT readers, dual bootable 8.5 inch drives and a 3 mb HD
(scary things is I am serious)
Bad Panda! No Bamboo for you! In matters of importance ACs will not be responded to. Want to say something critical,OK
You had PUNCH CARDS? We wrote all our code in HARDWARE! We had to go to the iron ore mines, fight off the dragons, endure the bitter code, dig out our the iron ore, dig out the coal, build a fire, smelt the ore, and cast the little magnets in our core memory, find some lodestone, magnetize each core, then wire them together with the South end at the Top to be a Zero and the North to be a one. :)
Wow, what a post! I typed the whole thing into teco and it played the Star Spangled Banner on my DECwriter III !
MAN SHOOTS ROVER!
You had ZEROS?
Dad? Is that you?
We really need your help
http://www.gofundme.com/help-sherry
I even worked with two Mac guys with beards
No, no... those are called "goatees".
No sig
The Windows admin washed his hands, then pulled out twelve paper towels and thoroughly dried both hands up to the wrists in two seconds flat.
The Unix admin took out one paper towel and very carefully, using every bit of dry towel, dried his hands perfectly in under one minute.
The Mainframe admin breezed through without stopping to wash his hands at all.
"Somewhere along the line" he said, "we learned not to piss on our fingers..."
Do not mock my vision of impractical footwear
Later that afternoon, the Mainframe admin got a horrific case of E.Coli poisoning from the handle of the urinal.
No, I don't trust in god. He'll have to pay up front, like everybody else.
A five year old AIWA with 30 Watt speakers. You're welcome to it if you can get past the German Sheepherd and survive having six .45's emptied into your chest from my revolver.
Edward@Tomato - /home/Edward/ man woman
man: no entry for woman in the manual.
"Qua!?"
Years ago, I worked with a grizzled old mainframe veteran. Let's call him Dan. Earlier in his career, Dan ran the datacenters at American Express and FedEx. Dan knew big iron.
One day, a few of us were ooh-ing and ahh-ing over the latest whiz-bang quad-Alpha box. Dan just laughed, shook his head, and said: