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Riot Control Ray-Gun for Use in Iraq

team99parody writes "An 'Active Denial System' weapon that 'fires a 95GHz microwave beam at rioters to cause heating and intolerable pain in less than five seconds' is scheduled for service in Iraq in 2006 according to CNET and the print version of New Scientist. It was recently tested on people playing the part of rioters at Kirtland Air Force Base in New Mexico where they asked the subjects to remove glass and contact lenses to protect their eyes. Hopefully real rioters will get the same courtesy. Police and the Marines are working on portable versions. Sandia Labs also has a nice writeup on this system with pictures of smaller versions of the weapon."

29 of 1,317 comments (clear)

  1. Coming to America by nokilli · · Score: 5, Insightful

    It's only logical. Our right to peaceably assemble is in the process of being eviscerated, which means that future efforts on the part of the citizenry to protest the increasingly hateful policies of this government will become more and more confrontational, and which in turn sees the government resorting to ever more punitive policies in response.

    Prediction: the ray-gun is on the streets in America in time for the 2008 Republican National Convention.

    I can't wait to hear what they consider to be acceptable levels of casualties as the result of using this thing on people.

    The thing I regret most in this life is that of all the science fiction movies I loved watching as I grew up, Soylent Green ends up being the one that most closely depicts the future.

    (I'd rather take my chances on the Nostromo.)
    --
    Why didn't you know?

    1. Re:Coming to America by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful
      put in place by a democracy
      Well, Nazi Germany started out as a representative democracy, too.

      But I didn't realize we were supposed to give people a hard time about their sigs.

      The fact is, crap like this is bad. I don't care how violent a small minority of Iraqis are. There is no sense in burning them and giving them cancer just for being in a crowd.

      And yes, if it were applied domestically, crap like this would be just as bad. The grandparent raises a good point. Recent attitudes of law enforcement towards political protesters post Patriot Act have been alarming. Add this "ray gun" crap, and you've got something bad.

      Maybe the grandparent shouldn't have singled out the RNC '08 convention, (would that offend you less?) but he is definitely right.

      In my opinion, anyone who sees a distinction between using this in Iraq and using it in the USA is extremely ignorant, naive, or worse. People are people, regardless of nationality. There are a few bad apples in Iraq but the majority are normal people like you or me. Something like this has far too much potential for misuse.
    2. Re:Coming to America by nokilli · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Absent the trend in placing new and more onerous restrictions on where, when and how many people are allowed to peaceably assemble, I might agree with you.

    3. Re:Coming to America by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's designed to be used against people. How does it sort out the "rioters"? Is it any better than the cops at the NYC RNC convention last year, who swept up everyone on the streets, regardless of their "peacable" status? Or any of the other mass arrests I've ever heard of, where my friends, or their friends, have been picked up, even when just caught on the other side of the street, on their way to work?

      Have you ever been in a public demonstration? The actual treatment of your rights - ignoring them - is enough to wake up practically anyone. Especially when you see how different it is from TV and the movies. This raygun is going to get abused even worse than batons and tear gas, because its effects are mostly invisible. So the person leaning on the trigger, farther away from the action, won't be as inhibited by feeling personal responsibility. This thing is a nightmare from hell for people who actually care about exercising freedom, rather than just hiding behind a police fantasy, fearing for their property over crowds that will never threaten them.

      --

      --
      make install -not war

    4. Re:Coming to America by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Amen, everyone properly inside the free speech cages will be shielded from the microwaves completely.

    5. Re:Coming to America by JudicatorX · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Because shotguns permanently maim and/or kill

      Because shotguns can't be used by one or two people against tens of thousands.

      Because shotguns aren't (usually) used to deny large crowds their fundamental right to assemble in peaceful process.

      Because shotguns weren't developed for crowd 'control'.

      Because before George "Fucking Haliburton" Walker Bush there were no "Free Speech Zones", and hence no "No-free-speech zones".

      --
      "It is a good divine that follows his own instructions" - Portia, The Merchant of Venice
    6. Re:Coming to America by Total_Wimp · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, it is.

      The reason is that assembling to call the government to task for the wrongs they've done is instantly reclasified as rioting and pillaging.

      Boston tea party. A bunch of guys rioted and pillaged to decry the wrongs of the government.

      Rodney King verdict riots. A bunch of people rioted and pillaged to decry the wrongs of the government.

      What's the difference? Was one violent and the other peaceful? Did one involve property damage while the other did not?

      How about the WTO protests in Seattle that were broken up with rubber bullets and tear gas? Were they causing property damage? Were they pillaging?

      And then of course there's all the pillaging that was going on in Tiananmen square.

      Whenever you have a government force putting down "riots", you better take some time to figure out why so many people are so god damned upset. Calling them a bunch of pillagers is moste definately missing the point.

      TW

    7. Re: Coming to America by kalel666 · · Score: 5, Informative

      I know this is one of those things that "everybody knows", that the US armed Saddam in the 80's, but the facts speak otherwise. Yes, we supplied Iraq with monies and arms, but we were far behind those paragons of International virtue like:

      USSR 17503 50.78%
      France 5221 15.15%
      China 5192 15.06%
      Czechoslovakia 1540 4.47%
      Poland 1626 4.72%
      Brazil 724 2.10%
      Egypt 568 1.65%
      Romania 524 1.52%
      Denmark 226 0.66%
      Libya 200 0.58%
      USA 200 0.58%

      But don't take my word for it. Refer to the report from SIPRI (Stockholm International Peace Research Institute) here: http://projects.sipri.se/armstrade/Trnd_Ind_IRQ_Im ps_73-02.pdf

      If you're going to blame the US for something, go ahead, but a least blame us for something legitimate.

      --
      I HAVE CUBIC WISDOM THAT TRANSCENDS AND CONTRADICTS ONE DAY GODS
    8. Re:Coming to America by anaesthetica · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Your moral equivalency is really quite striking.

      Everyone has the right to assemble peaceably to protest what they consider a grievance against our duly elected and representative government.

      The Boston Tea party did not protest against a democratic and elected government, but against a monarch taxing unrepresented citizens.

      The Rodney King rioters damaged and looted the property of their fellow private citizens in protest of government action. That's completely unjust to those that had their homes and stores wrecked. A march, a rally, fiery public speeches, petitions, a sit-in at the court or city hall--all of these would have been acceptable. But the rioters damaged their neighbors in their anger at the government, and such action is rightfully stopped. It is one thing to protest against a monarch and another to protest against an elected and accountable government.

      WTO protesters in Seattle were not uniformly non-violent. Many private citizens, once again, had to pay the price for someone else's anger at the government. That's fundamentally unjust, that I might have my property destroyed by someone angry, not at me, but at the government.

      Tiananmen square was certainly peaceful to begin with, although I don't doubt that as it went on the protesters engaged in provocation with the police. But, you cannot draw equivalency between protest in a public square against a totalitarian government and protest in the streets of LA against an elected government's decision which involves destruction of private homes and stores. There is no moral equivalence there, whatsoever.

  2. Health implications by JemVai777 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I Wonder whether its usage can contribute to cancer down the track?

    --
    "The problem with our economy is that our budget is balanced by people who aren't" - A.E.N.
    1. Re:Health implications by Tezkah · · Score: 5, Funny

      I Wonder whether its usage can contribute to cancer down the track

      ... only if you use it to light your cigarette. =)

  3. "non" lethal? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting
    • Interesting that they focus on the non-lethal aspect. I'd suspect the military would also be interested on whether you could turn up the power a bit, and you have a lethal ray gun that can hit lots of people at once.
    • Wonder if the volunteers of which the article speaks were found in a similar way that earlier human radiation 'volunteers' were found.
    • Wonder if making people feel like they're being burned alive counts as torture?
  4. Little Waves in an Ocean of Hate by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 5, Insightful

    That's the way to win "hearts and minds" of people angry at the US occupation forces: zap them with rayguns. We'll teach them how the 21st Century US welcomes them with "compassionate conservatism", by frying them with rayguns. After sizzling whole towns, there's no way they'll ever listen to insane jihadists telling them that the Great Satan has burned them with hellfire, that we're all better off in a medieval fiefdom under god. Yeah, sticking Iraqis into a microwave oven is exactly the way to get them to calm down, stop their civil war, and break out those flowers they're supposed to be greeting us with.

    --

    --
    make install -not war

    1. Re:Little Waves in an Ocean of Hate by Doc+Ruby · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Well, some Americans now remember that Nixon revealed in tapes before the 1972 elections that he was backing the South Vietnamese only long enough to win reelection, then he was dropping them like a napalm bomb. Which he did, to the cheers of the hippies. If third-rate burglars like G. Gordon Liddy hadn't given the press and prosecutors the kind of easy meat they needed to nail Nixon, he would have claimed he pulled out of Vietnam as the "peace president", and sent his Chinese ambassador, George Bush Sr, to a landslide election in 1976.

      Now that Bush Jr is in front of the camera, they're not making any of those mistakes again. Rumsfeld, the Secretary of Defense who "lost Vietnam" by officiating over the fall of Saigon, has been sure not to let any bodies get counted, let alone televised. President Vice President Cheney learned, while on Nixon's staff, to stay in the privacy of the president's shadow, letting him speak whatever the political genius whispers in his earbuds.

      But it's all so similar to Vietnam, which was so mostly successful for the Republicans, with such clearly identifiable mistakes. This time, though, the press knows they can grab the limelight like Woodward and Bernstein, and turn minor careers into popular myths, guaranteed lifetimes of selling books and being hailed as geniuses. That's why they're howling for Rove now, after 5, 25 years of watching that reptile get away with literal murder (or accessory to).

      Personally, I remember Watergate, and I really remember Iran/Contra. It's not an echo: it's the same creeps, with the same playbook, updated from their Superbowl losses to work with some new blood. Blood all over their hands.

      --

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      make install -not war

  5. That's a relief by legLess · · Score: 5, Insightful
    From the article:
    Burn injury is prevented by limiting the beam's intensity and duration.
    Well thank god for that. We all know the customary restraint of law enforcement and military personnel will prevent any civilian injuries,
    --
    This isn't as much "normalization" as it is "don't take so many drugs when you're designing tables."
  6. Wouldn't this be foiled by ostsJoe · · Score: 5, Funny

    by tin foil?

    1. Re:Wouldn't this be foiled by Boricle · · Score: 5, Insightful
      I suspect that what happens then is that they use the "less-lethal" tool first - anyone left standing, or with shiny foil face masks are then categorised as "combatants" and "more-lethal" tools are then used.

      The trick will be to incorporate the foil into some unobtusive clothing, dress up like a woman in head-to-toe covering (otherwise it will look strange if you are in full head covering). Or maybe a member of the Klan with some sun-glasses on. That'd be unobtrusive (not). Any kind of full body covering will do. Cow costume..., Scuba gear, ummm....

      Of course the fact that you are not running away screaming might still be a bit of a clue.

      Probably won't do much for improvised explosives though.

      ...which reminds me, I must remember to wrap my passport in foil..

  7. So many questions by Valacosa · · Score: 5, Insightful
    My first thoughts:
    • How wide-focus is this? Would police be able to use this on the street without frying everyone?
    • Could some sort of protection be made against this? (Portable Faraday cage, maybe?) If not, what's to prevent one of these falling into the black market and eventually being used on Police?
    • So Iraq has become the population-control guinea pig. What's even better is that this will probably be viewed by police as a magical dissent-eliminating ray. It's not. If people can't peacefully protest (or even riot), dissent is just forced underground, causing it to be made manifest more anonymously, more unexpectedly, and likely more distructively. Instead of more protests or riots, we have more things like...say...roadside bombs.

      Wait, isn't that terrorism? Using this thing could increase terrorism? Fucking wonderful.
    --
    "Live as if you'll die tomorrow." Ridiculous. You could die later today.
  8. "Nonlethal" at the sandia article by hobotron · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Nonlethal weaponry is a horseshit myth.

    The term they should have used (and what law enforcement uses now, after more than a few wrongful death lawsuits, is the term of "Less lethal". Did any of the Kirtland Air Force Base participants have a pre existing heart condition? I bet they didnt let pregnant women participate.

    Im so glad that when every time one of these proportedly nonlethal weapons pops up its run under a FULL and accurate barrage of labratory and set up tests, which almost never reveal the compounding issues that lead to death in real world enviroments.

    The news.com article asks a few of the many lurking questions to this system. We all know this device is going to Iraq to go through real world testing before its used here in the US. Someone is counting on all the "little kinks" that are more than likely deadly will be ironed out under the public eye.

    I find it highly ironic that our testing of this indescriminant weapon will be used in our even more indescriminant war.

    Terrorists dont use large crowds as weapons, if you stop and think at why this weapon would be needed, its ultimately crowd control on our home front. Now why would we need that? Lakers winning again? I highly doubt it. Someone had a plan when they initated and funded the development of this, and it doesnt look like a good one.

    --
    There is truth in humor.
  9. Re:mod these trolls down. by grumpygrodyguy · · Score: 5, Funny

    Why the heck are mods modding this flame-war up!?!

    What could be more on-topic than a flame-war?

    --
    The government has a defect: it's potentially democratic. Corporations have no defect: they're pure tyrannies. -Chomsky
  10. Re:Talked about earlier... by Rei · · Score: 5, Interesting

    No, they'd rather people not shoot protesting crowds. If the crowds are using lethal force or threatening the position of our troops, our troops will use lethal force back with or without our magic ray gun.

    Seriously, from a practical standpoint, what will happen the first time we fire this thing into. say, one of al-Sadr's regular 10k+ angry-mob protests? Everyone with glasses risks going blind; everyone with metal on them gets burns. Everyone with a pacemaker risks getting their heart stopped. It'd be almost a guaranteed new Sadrist revolt, plus easily increasing other Shia and widespread Sunni insurgency recruiting, while not killing any insurgents. Of course, the effects don't apply just to the crowd; beams keep on going.

    But lets take this further than the obvious anger that the US using some sci-fi style technology on a country that has no ability to resist it would inspire. Everyone who gets cancer within a few months of such a usage within half a dozen blocks of the site will blame it on the US's new "pain-ray". Everyone who miscarries? The same. Everyone who gets a headache, who has a heart attach, who comes down with a nasty disease... it'll all get blamed on the device.

    Strategically, this is an awful decision.

    --
    Point of interest. Offering to shoot us might not work so well as an incentive as you might imagine.
  11. Why is it ... by chrispycreeme · · Score: 5, Insightful

    with all our technology, science, power and resources, all we seem to do is come up with more and more fucking evil disgusting ways of hurting people? This is fucking sick.. Does nobody else see this?

  12. Re:Totally Inappropriate Slashdot Article by The+Wooden+Badger · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Tell me about robots, new types of air-conditioner and spacecraft but keep this weapons crap out of here - we geeks are pretty much pacifists and don't care about this stuff.

    Yeah! tell me about Quake, and Doom, and Half Life, and Counter Strike, and Halo, and Unreal...

    --
    Heroscape, it's like legos combined with anachronistic wargames.
  13. Freedom Ray by HunkaHunkaBurninLove · · Score: 5, Funny

    This will nicely wrap up our hearts-and-minds campaign.

  14. Re:Right... I'm sure that's it by arodland · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Government, as an institution, is supposed to exist to solve (or at least mitigate) the people's problems.

    The average person, when placed in a position of power, wishes to use that power to improve his own situation. Such a person, in a government position finds that the best way to increase his personal power is to increase the size and importance of his domain of power -- which, as we've seen, is based upon "solving" some problem that the people have.

    The best method they've found so far is to create the problem with one hand while solving it with the other. Move more responsibility from the people to the government, and justify more work. Create more complications and loopholes in the tax codes, and work harder to bust tax evaders. Make more things illegal, and make law enforcement look good. It's a justification to do more, to take more of your money for your own good. It is evil. It's a million acts of small, petty evil in the guises of kindness and service.

    As to the bit about the Republicans -- it's been said before that the US is run by two parties: the party of Evil and the party of Stupidity. I agree with that assessment, but I think that the roles change day-to-day. Neither one is any better than the other.

  15. they've used this in Miami by pirateshot · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I have anti-globalization activist friends who were in Miami in 2003 protesting the FTAA meeting going on at the time. They tell me that the cops (other than having their own embedded journalists, getting extremely favorable corporate media coverage, beating people senseless and blinding some people with pepperspray) used some sort of microwave weapon on them and it made them throw up. For more info on that protest, check out a movie called the Miami Model http://www.ftaaimc.org/miamimodel.

    1. Re:they've used this in Miami by basic0 · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I'd never heard of this "microwave weapon" until now, but you may be referring to the "Long Ranged Acoustic Device" which has been in use by police and military for years now. Apparently, with the right sound frequency, it's able to cause nausea and disorientation within seconds. More info can be found here

    2. Re:they've used this in Miami by Khyber · · Score: 5, Informative

      You are right, it was indeed the weapon you describe.

      It's been known for quite some time now that using waves of sound can do all kinds of things to the human body. Using stereo-separated soundwaves of differing frequencies, you can create a harmonic that your brain respods to. This has been shown to make people sick, or make them feel better and give relief from a headache. It's also shown to be possible to make people hallucinate, put them to sleep, pep them up, and more. Our skulls and brains respond rather well to nice resonating frequencies. Kudos for you bringing this up. Makes me wish I could post and mod at the same time.

      --
      Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
  16. The answer is: TINFOIL! by notany · · Score: 5, Funny

    Tinfoil. Tinfoil hat, dungarees, under your normal clothes. And you can carry tinfoil placards that reflect microwaves back to police.

    --
    Dyslexics have more fnu.