Slashdot Mirror


Congressman Seeks Scientists' Personal Data

jfengel writes "The Washington Post reports that House Energy and Commerce Committee Chairman Joe Barton (R-TX) has requested raw data and personal financial information on three scientists who published a paper which claimed that temperatures rose precipitously in the 20th century. Colleagues (including other Republicans) are calling the investigation 'misguided and illegitimate.' Barton has long been an opponent of government action on global warming."

13 of 632 comments (clear)

  1. Not black and white. by FTL · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Every time a study comes out saying that Windows is more secure, faster and cheaper than Linux, the first thing Slashdotters ask is "Who funded this study?" Which is exactly what the Chairman is attempting to establish. Are these scientists unbiased, or are they in the pocket of some lobby group. It's a critical question. Having said that, it can also most definitely be a form of harassment.

    Based solely on the editorial, it looks like in this case it is more the latter than the former. But we don't know the whole picture. In fact that one-sided editorial is an excellent example of bias; nowhere does it even outline the Chairman's view.

    It comes down to an interesting question. If personal and professional finances are off-limits, how else can politicians determine whether a complex statistical report has been "paid for" by an interested party?

    --
    Slashdot monitor for your Mozilla sidebar or Active Desktop.
    1. Re:Not black and white. by it_flix · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Every time a study comes out saying that Windows is more secure, faster and cheaper than Linux, the first thing Slashdotters ask is "Who funded this study?"
      The paper was published in the Nature magazine. It doesnot matter who funded the studies, it has been peer reviewed and the results agreed upon by a majority of the author's peers who know the subject matter best. The day Microsoft comes out with a clear test methodology and peer reviewed comparision analysis, which is not likely, is the day slashdotters would stop asking the question.

      --
      www.notesmax.com
    2. Re:Not black and white. by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Maybe the congressman should disclose in who's pocket he is.

      Agreed - the kind of stuff Barton is asking for is way above and beyond the kind of information that required by campaign finance reporting laws.

      Additionally, and this is key here - scientists, by definition, work via the scientific method and thus bogus conclusions will be challenged and repudiated.

      Politicians, by definition work by demagoguery and hot air and thus bogus claims will often go unchallenged and even supported by specious argument and distraction.

      Barton is using the later to try to attack the former, which to anyone with even a hint of scientific training, is ridiculous.

      --
      When information is power, privacy is freedom.
    3. Re:Not black and white. by drerwk · · Score: 5, Interesting

      It does not matter who funded the studies
      Actually, Nature requires that you disclose financial interest when you publish. http://www.nature.com/nature/authors/policy/compet ing.html/ Including: "Funding: Research support (including salaries, equipment, supplies, reimbursement for attending symposia, and other expenses) by organizations that may gain or lose financially through publication of the paper."

    4. Re:Not black and white. by selfdiscipline · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, of course he's not using scientific method, because most politicians don't have scientific training. Which makes the fact that they run the country a little unsettling. There's one job a politician absolutely has to be good at: getting the most people to vote for them. Too bad skills for that job aren't really transferrable to any responsibilities in running the country besides diplomatic issues.
      If it wasn't too easy to introduce bias into the scientific method, I'd say our government should be more meritocratic.

      --


      -------
      Incite and flee.
  2. Al Gore's presentation... by garcia · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Many scientists and some of Mr. Barton's Republican colleagues say they were stunned by the manner in which the committee, whose chairman rejects the existence of climate change, demanded personal and private information last month from researchers whose work supports a contrary conclusion.

    I was lucky to recently attend Al Gore's presentation on Global Climate Change. While I don't care about Global Warming at all (I see it as an eventual end of society and part of the Earth's history) but I did find that Al Gore's excellent multimedia presentation to be full of the very evidence that proves Global Climate Change is occurring and increasing in speed.

    Why are these leaders creating issues for scientists unless they are trying to strongarm them? Were they seriously thinking that this data was created from false research? Antarctica is losing large slabs of ice at an alarming rate but it has nothing to do w/temperatures rising?

    Again, Global Warming is something that's going to happen and it's inevitable, but we don't need to be harassing science because our political survival depends on it.

  3. A giant hoax by squiggleslash · · Score: 5, Funny
    I've asked this before, and I'll ask this again: can anyone show me one piece of evidence, one absolutely concrete fact based argument - not speculation, but facts- that proves that human beings are causing Republican Congresses?

    I know, I know, the liberal scientists will probably talk about hot-air and inflammatory rhetoric causing electoral heating. Some say that if we don't curb emissions like this one, we may have an increase in heated opinions, leading to an increase in Republicans. Many blame the continued use of fossil fools for this problem.

    But there's little evidence to show this. For one, Michael Crichton says these governments are purely cyclical. Over time, you get Republican Administrations, then Democrat Administrations, then Republican again. Apparently there's a wealth of historical evidence to show this fact.

    Then there's the so-called scientists and how their theories change. According to many back in 2004, we were supposed to get a Democratic administration! Now they're saying we're having Republicans. Why should we believe them now?

    Anyway, if Joe Barton can discredit the notion that human beings have anything to do with Republicanism, and he's doing a fine job right now let me tell you, I think this will be a great thing.

    --
    You are not alone. This is not normal. None of this is normal.
  4. Debatists have a term for that. by CyricZ · · Score: 5, Insightful

    "Republicans have perfected the strategy that if you don't like the message, seek to discredit the messenger."

    Professional debatists and philosophers have a term for that: ad hominem attacks.

    Indeed, due to the declining education standards in most of the Western world, many younger people are not aware of such a concept. That is why those politicians, regardless of their political affiliation, who resort to the use of such logical fallacies are not held responsible for their faulty debatery.

    --
    Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
  5. And in the other corner ... by jamesl · · Score: 5, Informative

    For a different perspective on the same news:
    http://www.climateaudit.org/?p=274#more-274/
    The head of the Energy Committee is asking for the source code for the statistical calculations that "prove" we're experiencing global warming. Code that was developed with US Government money.

    No more than an open source advocate would expect.

    The source has now been released.

  6. Re:Ignore the Spin; Follow the Money by Edmund+Blackadder · · Score: 5, Insightful

    So your theory is that there is some nefarious secret ultra rich organization that loves the earth so much that they are bribing scientists to alter their studies in favor of environmentalism.

    That would be really great but I doubt it.

    BTW scientists are trained to describe their studies in detail and ensure they are repeatable. The way to check a scientist's veracity is to repeat the study and see if you come up with the same results.

  7. Rep. Joe Barton financial stats by Animats · · Score: 5, Informative
    The top industries supporting Joe Barton are:
    1. Oil & Gas $224,398
    2. Electric Utilities $221,951

    Top contributors

    1. Anadarko Petroleum $55,000
    2. SBC Communications $20,550
    3. Comcast Corp $19,000
    4. Dominion Resources $16,000
    5. Reliant Energy $15,000
    6. Valero Energy $15,000
    7. TXU Corp $14,250
    8. Lyondell Chemical $13,250
    9. Texas Industries $13,000
    10. El Paso Corp $11,998

    Any questions?

  8. The only real test by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The paper was published in the Nature magazine. It doesnot matter who funded the studies, it has been peer reviewed and the results agreed upon by a majority of the author's peers who know the subject matter best.

    Passing publication review is important. But it is not meant to be a judgement about the correctness of the paper's results -- instead, it is about whether the paper ought to be published or not.

    In science, the only real test is reproducibility.

    For example, the paper "Observation of Cold Nuclear Fusion in Condensed Matter" [1] passed peer review, as it should have. But its results could not be reproduced reliably, so as of this moment its authors' conclusions are considered to be (at best) flawed.

    Or for another example, take pentaquarks. Some experiments claim to have unambiguous evidence of their creation in certain production channels. Other experiments claim to unambgiously show that they are not produced in similar -- often, nearly identical -- production channels.

    The research on pentaquarks, from both sides, is quality work and certainly worthy of publication. But it is almost certain that someone's experimental methodology is flawed. So the status of pentaquarks remains controversial, as it should.

    The ultimate scientific test is to continue trying to reproduce results with improved methods, and to see what nature tells us. This is the essence of peer review.

    Publication review is an important part of this mechanism, but it is only one part of the entire cycle of peer review.

    [1] S.E. Jones et al., "Observation of Cold Nuclear Fusion in Condensed Matter," Nature 338: 737-740 (1989).

    1. Re:The only real test by MillionthMonkey · · Score: 5, Informative
      Theory = not reproduced enough to be called a Law or Fact.
      In the American vernacular, "theory" often means "imperfect fact"--part of a hierarchy of confidence running downhill from fact to theory to hypothesis to guess. Thus the power of the creationist argument: evolution is "only" a theory and intense debate now rages about many aspects of the theory. If evolution is worse than a fact, and scientists can't even make up their minds about the theory, then what confidence can we have in it? Indeed, President Reagan echoed this argument before an evangelical group in Dallas when he said (in what I devoutly hope was campaign rhetoric): "Well, it is a theory. It is a scientific theory only, and it has in recent years been challenged in the world of science--that is, not believed in the scientific community to be as infallible as it once was."

      Well evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape-like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered.

      Moreover, "fact" doesn't mean "absolute certainty"; there ain't no such animal in an exciting and complex world. The final proofs of logic and mathematics flow deductively from stated premises and achieve certainty only because they are not about the empirical world. Evolutionists make no claim for perpetual truth, though creationists often do (and then attack us falsely for a style of argument that they themselves favor). In science "fact" can only mean "confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold provisional consent." I suppose that apples might start to rise tomorrow, but the possibility does not merit equal time in physics classrooms.

      Evolutionists have been very clear about this distinction of fact and theory from the very beginning, if only because we have always acknowledged how far we are from completely understanding the mechanisms (theory) by which evolution (fact) occurred. Darwin continually emphasized the difference between his two great and separate accomplishments: establishing the fact of evolution, and proposing a theory--natural selection--to explain the mechanism of evolution.
      -Stephen Jay Gould