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FCC Seeks Tech Donations for Katrina Aid

An anonymous reader writes "BoingBoing is reporting on the FCC accepting donations of tech services and equipment: 'Lack of communications systems has been identified as a critical issue holding back aid, missing persons, law enforcement, etc. in crisis areas. FCC personnel are working throughout the weekend to coordinate these efforts with private industry, with wireless technology groups, FEMA, and state governments in Mississippi, Louisiana, etc.' Efforts are being organized through PART-15.ORG."

35 of 255 comments (clear)

  1. Does anyone else? by tpgp · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Find it disgusting that emergency aid workers have to beg for money to provide vital equipment to people who are dying?

    This in a country that has spent nearly 200 Billion on an unnecessary war in a far off land.

    --
    My pics.
    1. Re:Does anyone else? by evol262 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Rather than making ad-hominem attacks about Democrats, consider the facts.

      New Orleans was not below sea level when they built it. The floodplain kept it above until fairly recently, and all the canals they dug to allow oil traffic allowed much more of it to silt out, bringing it down even further.

      Initial help DID come from state and local governments. The local government was essentially obliterated by the scope of the damage, but the police force has done what they can. Martial law was requested long before help arrived. Communications infrastructure is completely gone and it's virtually impossible to coordinate.

      I'm glad Ray Nagin is blasting the federal government. At least he's telling it like it is on the ground, which is a perspective you can't get from a flyby in Air Force One. I work for a company that provides real-time weather data. We KNEW there were 210 mph gusts before it hit. It's the worst hurricane of the century, and we were aware of it. Why was federal aid not waiting? FEMA classified a major hurricane hitting New Orleans as the 3rd worst possible disaster. The Pentagon was putting paperwork through days before the hurricane hit. Why was FEMA not more prepared?

      Think about New York in the days following 9/11. It was a tragedy, sure, but it was localized to about one city block. If they had leveled an area the size of New Orleans, and made it virtually unhabitable (through flooding/fires/collapse of the subway system/whatever), the reaction there would have been about the same. The fact that somebody has an [R] by their name on TV does not make them infallible, and any politician in New Orleans, regardless of credo, would have been in the same situation as we have right now. They knew approximately 24 hours in advance that a class 4/5 hurricane was going to hit New Orleans. A week is bullshit. Do you think they should evactuate as soon as a tropical depression forms in the Gulf because it -might- hit New Orleans?

      Your rhetoric does not a coherent argument make. Not every conservative is stupid, but most stupid people are conservative. -John Stuart Mill. I think you fit the bill. If you don't agree, think before you post next time.

      --
      "The more corrupt a society, the more numerous are its laws." -Tacticus
  2. Where does the money go? by elucido · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Can we depend on the federal government? Should we donate or just let the private sector handle it?

  3. Re:Where's the HAM operators? by gila_monster · · Score: 4, Informative

    They are setting up shop in Missippi, the Florida panhandle, and other surrounding areas. Unfortunately, there are still issues and logistics problems involved in getting operators to NOLA itself. The area needs to be secured first. One ham I know was specifically told not to enter the area with his truck carrying 200 gallons of fuel -- the fear was that he would be waylaid as he drove through the city.

    gm

    --
    Ad luna, Alicia! Ad luna!
  4. This is an adbication of responsibility by Baldrson · · Score: 2, Interesting
    The problem is much bigger than volunteers can handle. This is not a tribal crisis it is a Federal emergency. Mobilization requires money and I don't see the money. The Feds certainly have exercised the privilege of collecting enough money supposedly for the responsibility to use it to solve domestic problems such as this.

    The solution is simple:

    Volunteerism should be directed toward getting various vendors of telecom equipment to agree on a set of rules that they consider fair for awarding a bounty for telecommunications area coverage and then sign a petition to the FCC or preferably FEMA which would administer the FCC's role, presenting the rules.

    For example, let's say there's a tent city with estimated population 10,000. There is an estimated need for 1% peak load or 100 virtual circuits each capable of carrying a SIP call. FEMA pays $1000/day for each circuit. Right-of-ways are rented from FEMA with the highest bidder gaining control of the right-of-way for some minimum lease period, say a week. In the case of 802.11* this would mean spectrum allocation would operate as "land rent" system.

    How fast would those 100 SIP circuits go up?

  5. Citywide Wi-Fi by blastard · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Now would be a fantastic opportunity to install a citywide Wi-Fi network. If the ILEC was ever going to do it and get good press for it, now is the time. Could Intel use another test bed for Wi-Max?

  6. Re:MOD PARENT DOWN by evol262 · · Score: 4, Informative

    Why is it small potatoes exactly? The cost in human lives and property damage is far higher, and the situation is worse in every measurable way. The war didn't prevent any attacks on the US. I'm sure Saddamn would have loved to take a crack at us, if he could, but he was an extremely secular leader (not associated with the religious nutjobs in Al-Qaeda) who would not have jeopardized his situation through a terrorist attack on the US. SCUDs didn't have nearly the range to hit the US. They could barely hit Israel. Afghanistan is a warzone with no infrastructure (we destroyed it all) largely controlled by regional warlords. Neither Afghanistan nor Iraq had the navy or airpower to attack the US. Period. All we're doing is giving foreign nationals (most of the terrorists in either country are from Saudi, Pakistan, and other countries) experience fighting that they would have gotten in Chechnya before so they can hit us harder next time once they know our tactics. Stop posting bullshit.

    --
    "The more corrupt a society, the more numerous are its laws." -Tacticus
  7. Re:paging Dick Cheney by PocketPick · · Score: 2, Informative

    Cheney no longer has stock in Halliburton

    Not true. Cheney has stock options, but thier unexercied. Likewise, he has defered compensation which he likely will reap upon completion of the second term.

  8. Not everyone can leave by Kiaser+Wilhelm+II · · Score: 2, Informative

    There are plenty of people who wanted to leave but they simply didn't have the resources to do so.

    Remember, much of the population in New Orleans is poor to very poor. Most of these people have no cars of their own to use.

    --
    Lord High Crapflooder The Right Honourable Vlad Craig Esther McDavenpherson III
    Destroyer of Mercatur.Net
  9. Re:paging Dick Cheney by evol262 · · Score: 2, Informative

    The deferred compensation is his salary. They spread it out over a few years to avoid taxes. I should have said, Cheney is not making any money off of his stock options. It's true that he still has stock that expires in 2007, but all after-tax proceeds are forfeit while he's in office.

    --
    "The more corrupt a society, the more numerous are its laws." -Tacticus
  10. Re:Why not let evolution take its course? by mspohr · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I think that most of those left in New Orleans were too poor to have a car or be able to afford to leave. There were some clueless tourists also.

    It's criminal negligence that our government took 5 days to get food and water (and law and order) to these people.

    After all of the money that has gone to "Homeland Security", you'd think the government wouldn't have to ask for donations for a predicted disaster.

    --
    I don't read your sig. Why are you reading mine?
  11. SomethingAwful by Mendy · · Score: 2, Interesting

    http://www.somethingawful.com/

    SA was apparently hosted there so has gone down ("either underwater or strapped to the roof of a stolen vehicle that is also underwater.").

    They've got a page up at the moment with their feelings about the whole business which is worth a read (scroll down a bit till you get to "Bless This Mess")

  12. Why, America? by LkDotCom · · Score: 3, Interesting

    People killed, property destroyed, mass reverted at "Lord of the Flyes" level. And people talking about WiMax and Ham radio.

    We, spoiled people of the Old Continent (maybe too old) are much more concerned about the human regression of the citizens of New Orleans that with tech. Did you have a look at Phuket Tsunami?
    MUCH MORE TRAGIC outcome, much more dead people and yet a cooperative environment, without people harassing others or pillaging the neighbourhood and without problems with the volunteers.

    There must be something really scaring below the thin surface of the common US citizen (or maybe under every "first world" one), something deeply wrong with a lot of people, whose first instinct is to go arming themselves as it was not a catastrophe, but some kind of Apocalypse B Movie.

    I've worked with refugees and indeed lend a helping hand in Pukhet zones, but have never ONCE seen the global and total madness generated by Katrina.

    ANd I am more than a little scared, you know?

    -
    Grammar Zealotes, please spare a non-english writer

    --
    Grammar Zealots: please spare a non-english writer (lastknight dot com)
    1. Re:Why, America? by lmsig · · Score: 2, Insightful
      There are a small minority of people who take advantage of every situation. The people of New Orleans are overwhelmingly kind, generous people (just go visit sometime when it is all back, you'll have the time of your life and see some real hospitality). Unfortunatly the media likes to sensationalize everything. A few bad apples are the problem.

      To be honest.. all of the people using this opportunity to take political pot-shots, attacks on the US, etc are doing something very similar to those looters and criminals taking advantage of the situation in New Orleans. Using a tragedy to push your own polital agenda or beliefs is disrespectful. Spend your energy on something positive instead.

      --
      .plan!! what plan?
    2. Re:Why, America? by ergo98 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      People killed, property destroyed, mass reverted at "Lord of the Flyes" level. And people talking about WiMax and Ham radio.

      Jesus, here's this bullshit again. MY GOD MAN, PEOPLE ARE DROWNING AND HERE YOU ARE POSTING ON INTERNET MESSAGE BOARD! GOOD GOD MAN, GET SOME PERSPECTIVE!

      Here's the thing, though I realize this message will be missed by all of the pseudo morally righteous as they continue their campaign to post "Good god, won't anyone think of the..." messages to every message board: We, as a generalization of the Slashdot community, are in the technology arena.

      We do not produce food, filter water, or build dikes. We do technology. You get that? Does every "Why won't someone thing of the..." moron understand this very simple point? This is our domain. Maybe it isn't the most important necessity of life, but it's what we know (and other people are taking care of the other areas, and there is NOTHING WE CAN DO to help get food or water there quicker, or to restore law and order).

      As such, in the grand composite intermix that is modern society, the people who do technology ponder how they can leverage their knowledge and skills to get society up and running. Because, as I'm sure you're aware, the goal isn't just to setup a third-world state in New Orleans, but to get society running again there so people can live and work and play, and not just sit on their stacks of water and food because that's all that LkDotCom thought mattered.

  13. Evolution it's at work by Uukrul · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Why not let evolution take its course?
    There are a lot of people around the world helping (money, support, oil, etc.) the victims of Katrina. So the genes for altruism are assuring it's own survival.
    Evolution is about the survival of the finest, not the luckiest (at long run).
    --
    My city: Barcelona.
  14. Re:If you care about the victims, help them. by ErikPeterson · · Score: 2, Insightful

    I'm all for private donations.. and will make some when I get some free funds on my credit cards.. But I'd much prefer to see larger orginizations, read gas companies, step in. Their preemtive price gouging becuase demand will go up because of this should be making them enough money to help out the victims.

    --
    The world's smartest bug zapper www.zapstats.com/kickstarter
  15. DONATE NOW by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Informative

    American Red Cross

    Provides a full spectrum of services to disaster victims, including shelter, medical care, food, clean water and assisting with cleanup efforts.

    http://www.redcross.org/

    https://www2.redcross.org/donate/donation-form.asp

    Salvation Army:

    Providing hot meals to displaced disaster victims and emergency personnel working to aid those devastated by Hurricane Katrina.

    http://www.salvationarmyusa.org/USNSAHome.htm

    https://secure5.salvationarmy.org/donations.nsf/do nate?openform&projectid=USN-hurricane05

    United Way

    Identifying serious needs of devastated communities and helping not only with front-line disaster relief but with long-term recovery.

    http://national.unitedway.org/

    https://volunteer.united-e-way.org/hurricane-katri na/donate/

    America's Second Harvest

    Transports food to victims and secures additional warehouse space to assist member food banks in resuming and maintaining operations.

    http://www.secondharvest.org/default.asp

    https://www.kintera.org/AutoGen/Simple/Donor.asp?i event=67898

    Feed the Children

    Mobilizing and distributing supplies in hurricane devastated areas.

    http://www.feedthechildren.org/site/PageServer?pag ename=usw_hurricane_katrina

    https://secure2.convio.net/ftc/site/Donation?ACTIO N=SHOW_DONATION_OPTIONS&CAMPAIGN_ID=2661

    Habitat for Humanity

    Helping disaster victims rebuild piece by piece and house by house.

    http://www.habitat.org/

    https://www.habitat.org/donation/generaldonation/d efault.aspx?media=habitat&lander=MP&sourcecode=10w 39&tg=katrina&keyword=homepage_08302005

  16. Re:disgusting by benjamindees · · Score: 3, Funny

    1) Nationalize State militias.

    2) Make entire country dependent on just-in-time everything.

    3) Send military (and militias) to fight a needless war.

    4) Add layers of bureaucracy to emergency response.

    5) Stop spending money on infrastructure.

    6) Hurricane

    7) ???

    8) profit!!!

    --
    "I assumed blithely that there were no elves out there in the darkness"
  17. This is the perfect opportunity for /.ers by zippity8 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Here you go! /. collectively has resources, experience, and sufficient assets to band together and work on a finding a solution to a real problem, rather than debating about what Ballmer is saying about Google.

  18. Re:Where's the HAM operators? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    Where are we? You can find us at any of these frequencies (below). By the way, where are *you*?

    I have to go now. I just received another block of 100 names and addresses to notify next of kin, and will pay my long-distance charges to call them to let them know their aunt / uncle / parents / kids / brother is alive and well.

    I'll take care of that - you rest.

    AMATEUR HIGH-FREQUENCY GULF COAST HURRICANE NETS

    03845.0 LSB Gulf Coast West Hurricane
    03862.5 LSB Mississippi Section Traffic
    03873.0 LSB Central Gulf Coast Hurricane
    03873.0 LSB Louisiana ARES Emergency (night)
    03873.0 LSB Texas ARES Emergency (night)
    03873.0 LSB Mississippi ARES Emergency
    03910.0 LSB Mississippi ARES
    03910.0 LSB Louisiana Traffic
    03923.0 LSB Mississippi ARES
    03925.0 LSB Central Gulf Coast Hurricane
    03925.0 LSB Louisiana Emergency (altn)
    03935.0 LSB Central Gulf Coast Hurricane
    03935.0 LSB Louisiana ARES (health & welfare)
    03935.0 LSB Texas ARES (health & welfare)
    03935.0 LSB Mississippi ARES (health & welfare)
    03935.0 LSB Alabama Emergency
    03940.0 LSB Southern Florida Emergency
    03950.0 LSB Northern Florida Emergency
    03955.0 LSB South Texas Emergency
    03965.0 LSB Alabama Emergency (altn)
    03967.0 LSB Gulf Coast (outgoing traffic)
    03975.0 LSB Texas RACES
    03993.5 LSB Gulf Coast (health & welfare)
    03995.0 LSB Gulf Coast Wx

    07225.0 LSB Central Gulf Coast Hurricane
    07235.0 LSB Louisiana Emergency
    07235.0 LSB Central Gulf Coast Hurricane
    07235.0 LSB Louisiana Emergency
    07240.0 LSB American Red Cross US Gulf Coast Disaster
    07240.0 LSB Texas Emergency
    07243.0 LSB Alabama Emergency
    07245.0 LSB Southern Louisiana
    07248.0 LSB Texas RACES
    07250.0 LSB Texas Emergency
    07260.0 LSB Gulf Coast West Hurricane
    07264.0 LSB Gulf Coast (health & welfare)
    07265.0 LSB Salvation Army Team Emergency Radio (SATERN) (altn)
    07273.0 LSB Texas ARES (altn)
    07280.0 LSB NTS Region 5
    07280.0 LSB Louisiana Emergency (altn)
    07283.0 LSB Gulf Coast (outgoing only)
    07285.0 LSB West Gulf ARES Emergency (day)
    07285.0 LSB Louisiana ARES Emergency (day)
    07285.0 LSB Mississippi ARES Emergency
    07285.0 LSB Texas ARES Emergency (day)
    07290.0 LSB Central Gulf Coast Hurricane
    07290.0 LSB Gulf Coast Wx
    07290.0 LSB Texas ARES (health & welfare)
    07290.0 LSB Louisiana ARES (health & welfare) (day)
    07290.0 LSB Texas ARES (health & welfare)
    07290.0 LSB Mississippi ARES (health & welfare)

    14265.0 USB Salvation Army Team Emergency Radio (SATERN) (health & welfare) 14300.0 USB Intercontinental Traffic
    14300.0 USB Maritime Mobile Service
    14303.0 USB International Assistance & Traffic
    14313.0 USB Intercontinental Traffic (altn)
    14313.0 USB Maritime Mobile Service (altn)
    14316.0 USB Health & Welfare
    14320.0 USB Health & Welfare
    14325.0 USB Hurricane Watch (Amateur-to-National Hurricane Center)
    14340.0 USB Louisiana (1900)

  19. PEOPLE NEED FOOD, WATER, AND MEDICINE NOT INTERNET by SuperBanana · · Score: 4, Insightful
    We can assist in reestablishing internal communications and provide connectivity to all disaster relief efforts by installing point to point, point to multipoint links, IP Web cams to assist the police and fire departments who can not be everywhere in such a large area,

    Webcams? What? There's a 24 hour curfew. They're evacuating everyone. National Guard should be patrolling with orders to detain anyone and get them to evacuation centers, and if they get shot at- give a warning, and then shoot to kill and move on. Policing New Orleans is probably simpler than it ever was- and it will only get easier as they finish the evacuation.

    Once order is established, take all that money for wireless access points, webcams...take all those consultants etc...and hand them wader boots. Have them cart water, food, and medicine to people. Go door to door searching for survivors. Go to the relief centers to help there. Because THAT is what we need. A simple radio network will suffice for short term communications (National Guard and HAM operators can probably help there more than anyone else) and should be easy given the lack of interference. Cell service would be a luxury, and suggesting ANYONE needs 802.11b is absolutely stupid. This is a bunch of vendors saying "hey, we'll help, but only if you let us use our most expensive, fancy, unnecessary equipment". You don't deploy a VoIP network, when the cost of one VoIP router will buy you a dozen hand-held radios. You don't give one person a nice big steak with roasted potatoes when you can give 1000 people rice.

    PEOPLE NEED FOOD, WATER, AND MEDICINE. THEY NEED TO BE EVACUATED STILL. THEY DO NOT NEED LAPTOPS WITH INTERNET ACCESS. THEY NEED VOLUNTEERS MOVING THAT FOOD, WATER, AND MEDICINE- NOT SETTING UP #$@!ING WEBCAMS. The Mayor of New Orleans has been pretty clear about what he needs. Food, water, medicine, and busses to get people out so they stop rioting and looting. I believe the quote was "the president was talking about getting some school bus drivers down here. Thats' a joke. Get every greyhound bus in the country down here."

  20. Geeks unite! by goon+america · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Watching this disaster unfold, I'm struck by the generosity of individual people who want to help and the complete ineptitude of the agencies that are supposed to be managing this crisis. I feel sort of frustrated because I would like to help but I live very far away and basically the only thing I can do is give to the Red Cross and just watch it all on TV.

    We should all work together and develop open source collaboration software for disaster relief efforts.

    Capabilties:
    * Supercharged task list. I need supply $X at location $Y using vehicle $Z. People should be able to do the reverse, say I have supply $X at location $B but need vehicle $C. Must be able to work with very large numbers of people using it.
    * Reporting connected to mapping. People should report on the ground what conditions are and report what is needed where
    * VOIP phone bank. People around the world can volunteer as telephone operators for a central hotline. Obviously it's going to be harder to get web access in some situations so these people can take phone reports help them use the site through that, or just help them with whatever else they need
    * Interlingual support. Language barriers are often a problem in disasters, especially those with international teams working together. This needs to be coordinated.
    * Lost and found. People can post stats and descriptions and photos into a database that can be searched easily. People should also be able to do the reverse and register "I'm OK".
    * Publicity effort: if this thing works then we need to publicize it so that people know to use it
    * Scalability: this needs to scale to meet high variable demand. People should be able to donate servers and bandwidth. Should be load-tested to meet what seems like unrealistic loads.

    I'm really struck by the way that individuals out there are helping one another. I saw one guy saying he was in Nevada, but he was willing to drive to Houston to come pick up someone who needed a place to stay... If we could come up with an application that helps individual people out there help with each other, we could have our own relief movement without needing the government. The big problem with the government agencies seems to be that they can't co-ordinate with one another (even though that was supposed to be the whole point of the Department of Homeland Security). There's really no limit to the people out there who would help if they only knew how, if there was a centralized "task list" maybe we could get the right help where it was needed faster.

    Let's do it.

  21. Re:PEOPLE NEED FOOD, WATER, AND MEDICINE NOT INTER by uncadonna · · Score: 2, Informative

    Families have been split up. People need to find each other.

    Groups of people are stuck on roofs and under underpasses. The buses and helicopters need to know where to go.

    Information needs to be collected and disseminated from a lot of places.

    That's where the tech comes in. These are not trivial needs now.

    They should have been set up in advance, but like a lot of other things that should have been set up in advance, apparently they weren't.

    --
    mt
  22. Re:Where's the HAM operators? by Chanc_Gorkon · · Score: 3, Informative

    Try doing a little research:

    http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2005/08/30/1/?nc= 1

    The ARRL is also asking for volunteers on thier website. Thier are hams operationg from Slidell, and there was also a active station on top of LSU hospital. There has not been a bigger effort because it's incredibly HARD to get around in New Orleans right now. The hams ARE there, have been there and are proceeding to setup operations. Remember, it even took the military sometime to assemble staff and supplies necessary for the effort.

    --

    Gorkman

  23. Re:MOD PARENT DOWN by evol262 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    And you know that how?

    Because they did not have the ability to do so. If Iraq had been able to strike the United States, they certainly would have done so in the 10 years between wars. As stated, Saddam was an incredibly secular leader. He only really cared about staying rich and surviving unharassed. He would not have jeopardized it to attack the US.

    And he funded suicided bombers in Israel.

    Yes, he paid the families of the suicide bombers who attacked in Israel. Everybody in the Middle East hates the Israelis, even westernized countries like Lebanon, and it's not a secret. He paid the families posthumously, though. It wasn't as if he was recruiting them. He wasn't a great guy by any means, but terrorist leader he wasn't.

    Yeah, like that's how they would choose to attack the US. Has nothing to do with them funding and homing the terrorists.

    See above. bin Laden did do that in Afghanistan, but he could just as easily be doing it now from Chechnya, Pakistan, or wherever the hell he is. The Taliban wasn't really involved in any manner other than getting paid to look the other way.

    I said they were unable to attack the US through military means because that's precisely the threat that our government offered and so many people seemed to believe. Remember, though, everybody looks out for number one. The government leaders in Afghanistan and Iraq had no more desire to get ousted, impoverished, and possibly killed than any other leaders anywhere. National governments do not attack the United States as it stands right now. We didn't even catch the Al-Qaeda leaders from Afghanistan, they just moved. Why do you think we're any safer now?

    Or maybe the YOU are learning their tactics? I mean, if they attack the US they aren't going to be attacking in a conventional way and therefore aren't going to be confronted by an ARMY force are they?

    On the other hand, the military are understanding how the extremists work and at the same time are seeding liberty in countries which could certainly benefit from it. Look at Afghanistan for an example. They've made amazing progress in such a short amount of time and many countries (and the UN) are ensuring success. Admittedly Iraq is not as successful (yet).

    Yes, WE are learning their tactics. They like to ambush us in the hills. Couldn't we have learned that from any insurgency or guerilla operations? Make a case study out of what happened to the Soviets in the 80s in Afghanistan. Same effect. All we're learning is that they're very hard to root out and they like to shoot at us. On the other hand, they are learning how we operate, what equipment we use, what tactics we use, when we use airpower, and what we have at our disposal.

    Yes, we're seeding liberty all right. We are doing good things in Afghanistan, no doubt. Women have a lot more rights, and there is more infrastructure (though a lot of that is the Caspian Oil Pipeline). Unfortunately, the last estimates I heard from my friends in the military (who were deployed there) were that we maintained a functional control zone of 100m around Kabul. The rest is provisional warlords and druglords.

    Try this site instead it has less propaganda

    --
    "The more corrupt a society, the more numerous are its laws." -Tacticus
  24. Re:MOD PARENT DOWN by grumbel · · Score: 2, Informative

    #### The war didn't prevent any attacks on the US.
    ### And you know that how?

    Maybe you have missed the fact that the US invaded the country, searched it for month and found absolutly no evidance of any plans to attack to US?

  25. Re:Obscure and secret taxes by ErikPeterson · · Score: 2, Interesting
    --
    The world's smartest bug zapper www.zapstats.com/kickstarter
  26. Re:MOD PARENT DOWN by evol262 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    You missed my point. The Iraq war wasn't needed to prevent a conventional attack on America by the Saddam's government but there are many ways that it could have prevented attacks on the US. Keeping the terrorists busy, showing the liberals middle-east that the US is serious about liberisation of the middle east. In the long term, stability in the middle east will mean less attacks. In the short term, the terrorists are busy in Iraq.

    Yes, the terrorists are busy, for the short term . That's the worry. Previously, they were sent to Chechnya or another war zone to get experience. Very few of the insurgents in Iraq are actually Iraqi nationals. I fear what we're doing is training them to fight us in a few years, and training them to hate us. Countries over there (which are far from liberal, Lebanon aside) don't want us sticking our nose in from across the world.

    If we were serious about the 'liberation' of the Middle East, we should have started a long time ago. Israel should not have been allowed to hold the Golan Heights and the Sinai Peninsula decades after treaty. Saudi Arabia is one of the most autocratic, restrictive countries on Earth. They're our 2nd closest ally (after Israel) in the Middle East. Why didn't we stop Mbutu, or Pol Pot, or the genocide in the Sudan? We're showing we care about our interests. I can't honestly say why we're there (not for the oil, as they certainly would have expected almost total loss of the oil fields from the first war), but it's not for liberation.

    You can't seriously believe that do you? The Taliban have a fundamentalist islamic vision and so does bin laden. I really don't see how you can think they were just "paid" to look the other way.

    We actually have a fairly good picture of the organization. Similar hijackings were planned in the late 90s (stopped in the Phillipines before they happened). We have a good idea of the chain of command. The Taliban was not involved in planning. They were superfluous for funding, since bin Laden is independently wealthy, and the money trail doesn't lead to them anyway. Taliban troops may have assisted training camps, but they weren't involved in direct action.

    The soviet situation was different. Firstly, they didn't succeed in installing a government and getting 9 out of 10 eligible votes to vote and secondly they didn't have another superpower (america) helping the other side.

    Perhaps you need to review what happened with the Soviets. They did install a government, though there was no voting. They fought Mujahideen rebels, much as we are today. They didn't control much outside of Kabul, much as we are today. The big difference is that we DON'T have another superpower (the USSR was a superpower at the time, but I'll assume you made a typo and meant 'did' instead of 'didn't') supporting the other side (as we did, supporting the rebels against the Soviets).

    I agree that it isn't ideal but good things take time. The situation under the taliban wasn't much better (warlords, drug lords etc). The taliban had "methods" for dealing with drugs which "liberal" governments wouldn't agree with.

    Anyway, I just can't understand people who run around claming that afghanistan has been destroyed by the US and that they're worse off. I really can't.

    I didn't say things are worse than they were, I said they don't have much infrastructure (we bombed out the railways and roads, which are still largely in ruins). Things are better than they were, but the US populace as a whole doesn't have much patience for nationbuilding, and I have a feeling we're going to end up pulling out before we stablize the region. At some point, and probably soon, we'll get sick of seeing casualty reports from rebels that just don't seem to go away and pull out. That'll leave them in the same place they were in before we got there.

    --
    "The more corrupt a society, the more numerous are its laws." -Tacticus
  27. THIS SAYS IT ALL by Philip+K+Dickhead · · Score: 3, Insightful
    Sometimes an emailer says it better than I ever could. Read this. Read all of it. You know why I endorsed Kerry last time? Not because I liked Kerry or ever dreamed of backing him. I'm not a liberal. I'm not a Bush-hater. I backed the war. Initially, I trusted and supported this president to the hilt at a time of great danger. But I was forced to back Kerry of all people because Bush's gross incompetence at a time of national peril was simply too great a risk to continue. Now we have the proof:

    "I've considered myself a socially libertarian, fiscally conservative Republican for a very long time. I got along with the idea that I wasn't going to get a whole lot of help. College wouldn't be free. Job training would cost money and time. And I'm probably a decent example of up-from-not-much.

    But after watching what's happening in New Orleans-an American city that I've loved, visited and have always wanted to return to - I can't ever vote for these people again.

    Being a Republican means that you expect the government to do just a couple things for you and nothing else. Build a road. Defend us from enemies, foreign and domestic. Stuff that would be a lot less organized if we all had to do it ourselves. Everything else is just gravy.

    And as we poured money into Department of Homeland Security, and the Federal Emergency Management Agency, I thought, "Right on," because some of that money's bound to fall on my head.

    Well, something else would fall on my head first.

    I work for the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department. And that means that if something really catastrophic happens in MY city, and they ask me to stick around, that's the job. We have A and B teams and I'm a disaster recovery specialist on Team A. I've drawn up plans with names like Drawbridge and Smoldering Crater.

    Here's what these people would do for me.

    They would leave me there to die.

    Look at the facts. There's no coordination on the ground right now. The city has no fresh water, no electricity, no services. The floodwater has so much oil and toxins in it that it's flammable.

    In psychology they have what is called a fight-or-flight response. When faced with danger, do you subdue it or do you flee? Some of it has to do with risk assessment, but in this case, there is no flight. There is nowhere to run. So flight means die. If my choice was to pull a pistol on a truck driver or Nat, Jarren, Jayson, or any of you dies, that's no choice at all.

    I'm not talking about the looters grabbing big-screen televisions and basketball hoops. I'm talking about the ones that are chest-deep in water carrying bottled water and diapers. You can't tell me for three days to be patient, the bus is coming, and they're piling up bodies in the street median.

    We have known that this sort of disaster could occur for a century. Hell, the tour bus driver told me about it on the plantation tour. This means that we have been able to envision the stark reality of this occurring for a week-the newspapers all said the storm would hit New Orleans last Thursday.

    A week to get buses? A week to get fishing boats? Trucks? This is the United States! I read someone who said, "All the people who weren't bedridden, or had money, or had cars left. The people that are left had none of those things."

    There are people tonight who are going to sleep on overpasses for the fourth straight night. There are prisoners who will do the same. There are people dying at a convention center because no one will tell them that no one is coming for them, and the National Guard is protecting the kitchens. There are police officers who are turning in their badges because they've lost everything, have no guidance, and don't want to be shot by a looter.

    There are people tonight inside a concrete domed stadium with holes in the roof and no air conditioning who were told the buses are coming today, and they might, or they might not. There is no food. There is no water. There are bodies floating through the

    --
    "Speaking the Truth in times of universal deceit is a revolutionary act." -- George Orwell
  28. Re:Why not use the existing emergency supplies? by YrWrstNtmr · · Score: 2, Insightful
    Fema is aware that there are supplies there, so I assume the Fema manager for Louisiana is aware of it also as it is his/her job to know such things and it is his/her duty to make sure the governor's office is aware that there are first responder gear available for them. Of course this assumes the managers in place are competent and not political cronnies...

    FTA:
    "A federal official said the department's Office for Domestic Preparedness reminded the Louisiana and Mississippi governors' offices about the stockpiles on Wednesday and Thursday, but neither governor had requested it."

    Again...WTF are the governors doing?

  29. Re:Why not use the existing emergency supplies? by Ironsides · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Fema is aware that there are supplies there, so I assume the Fema manager for Louisiana is aware of it also as it is his/her job to know such things and it is his/her duty to make sure the governor's office is aware that there are first responder gear available for them. Of course this assumes the managers in place are competent and not political cronnies...

    The governors ARE aware.

    --
    Fly me to the moon Let me sing among those stars Let me see what spring is like On jupiter and mars
  30. Ham radio operators have batteries and generators by Rick17JJ · · Score: 2, Interesting
    Many of the ham radio operatiors around the country are already preprared for emergency operation with batteries, small generators and other equipment. They typically have several radios at home and at least one in their car, truck or RV. Sometimes I see them driving around town with a small antenna farm on the roof of their car. Ham radio clubs in nearly every city around the country have an annual "field day" where they set up their equipment at remote locations. Many ham radio operators are also members of an orgination that does regular emergence communication drills (I forget what that organization is called).

    Where I live in Arizona, city officials and local hams, for years, have been working together to be prepared for emergencies. I remember how thoroughly they prepared together for Y2K. As Y2K approached local hams with plenty of batteries and other equipment were pre-positioned at hospitals, police stations, fire stations and other key locations. At some of those locations they still have their own antenna on the roof. The city itself had installed diesel backup generators at the city sewage treatment plant and at each of the wells for the city water system.

    I have never really been active in ham radio although I do have a general class license. Many hams are already prepared to communicate with each other across thousands of miles or across town without the help of electricty from the power company. If their antennas get blown down they can quicky set up a simple wire antenna hanging from a tree. Many are already set up for long distance communication while operating from their car, truck or RV. They can communicate using voice, various digital modes or CW (Morse Code). Some hams even use slow-scan television or ham radio satellites. Perhaps they should just try to send more ham radio operators into the area.

  31. is intelligence hereditary? by Xtifr · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Actually, the original question is not as dumb as it sounds. (And no, I'm not going to bring up anti-scientific bullshit like Idiotic Design.) One might as readily ask, is strength hereditary? The answer is, somewhat-but-mostly-not. The capacity for strength (and possible limits) are hereditary, but strength itself is developed through exercise. Within the ranges allowed by heredity, one can develop a magnificent physique or turn into a lard-butt. And, unlike muscle, the brain does most of its growth in the very early years; thus early stimulus is far more important to the development of intelligence.

    Secondly, "intelligence" is not really a thing. It's a combination of a number of brain functions. We've reified it into a single thing, but it's not. Even something as simple as running speed is actually a combination of factors: leg length (hereditary), muscle tone (developed), lung capacity (some of both), etc. And what we call "intelligence" is far more complicated than that.

    There is a sort of myth that genes map to traits, but nature is rarely that simple or straightforward. Most of what we would recognize as traits are tied to combinations of genes. And on top of that, what we might call "capacity-for-intelligence" is based on a large number of traits. And individual genes are far more widely spread through our gene pool than most people realize.

    Clearly there are genetic components to intelligence, but at the same time, the simplistic, eugenic "solutions" this suggest are, frankly, idiotic. As is the thread-starter--evolution takes place on a timescale of millions of years, not hundreds or even thousands. The so-called "Darwin Awards", for example, are sadly misleading and sadly misnnamed. Killing a few thousand idiots may increase the average IQ of our species, but is highly unlikely to "improve the gene pool". (Even assuming that we were smart enough to quantify such "improvement", which is highly doubtful.)

  32. Re:Where's the HAM operators? by JHDrexler · · Score: 2, Informative

    Hey Dude, if you can get me a list of people to call then I will donate the phone time to call them.

    If I don't confirm receipt, then I didn't it.

    JHDrexler