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A Guide to Farmers In World of Warcraft

Posted by Zonk on from the look-behind-the-curtain dept.

Trounce writes "Game Guides Online has a lengthy article exploring how farmers work in World of Warcraft, including their daily quotas, techniques, schedules, and how they hide their gold surplus from employers and possibly thieving partners. It has a section on how players can benefit from shift changes and score items at low prices (which can then be re-listed at a profit). From the article: 'Of course, farmers who stay on past the ends of their shifts, while their boss and/or partner breathe impatiently down there necks, are even more amenable to agreeing to ridiculously under-market offers; so keep looking for bargains after 6:00 as well.'"

41 of 52 comments (clear)

  1. game guide. by JVert · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Article is at best interesting.

    Anyone ever used the warcraft game guide? Can't belive its actually worth $75...

    1. Re:game guide. by k_187 · · Score: 1

      Its that much? I thought about picking it up when I got the game last december, but then realized that almost everything in it is going to eventually change in some way. so I didn't.

      --
      11 was a racehorse
      12 was 12
      1111 Race
      12112
  2. Interesting, but tough to read. by ClownsScareMe · · Score: 2

    This article is organized like the worst piece of code ever written. Total chaos.

    --
    I read Slashdot for the articles
    1. Re:Interesting, but tough to read. by gizmoiscariot · · Score: 1

      Not sure if its chaos.. More like stream of thought.

      Course my stream of thoughts can be chaotic so his might be too..

      --
      Gizmo
    2. Re:Interesting, but tough to read. by Digital+Vomit · · Score: 5, Funny
      Nothing wrong with the article

      I found that there was nothing wrong with the article.

      Very informative

      I found it pretty informative as to the nature of WoW farmers.

      Good article flow

      It flowed very well.

      Prodigious use of headers improved readibility

      The use of so many headers within the text really improved the readibility. It notified you when the writer was about to start talking about a new subject.

      --
      Modern copyright is theft of culture from everyone and it retards the progress of the useful arts and sciences.
    3. Re:Interesting, but tough to read. by C0rinthian · · Score: 2, Funny

      These aren't the droids you're looking for.

      These aren't the droids we're looking for.

      We can go about our business

      You can go about your business.

      Move along.

      Move along!

    4. Re:Interesting, but tough to read. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I liked it. The author knew his limitations as a writer and worked out a way to convey the information he had accumulated. It wasn't as enjoyable to read as an article from a professional journalist but it also didn't bog the reader down with incomprehensible grammar, irrelevant points, and poorly conceived metaphors.

    5. Re:Interesting, but tough to read. by xgamer04 · · Score: 1

      The thing is, good writing shouldn't need a header every 1-2 paragraphs. If I picked up a 300 page book and there was as much whitespace as content, I would probably burn it within 5 minutes. The layout of this article isn't that bad because it's not really that long. There aren't too many main ideas discussed.

      The problem here is that it doesn't flow naturally. It discusses one idea for a while, and then we get several headings with one-paragraph texts that scream at me: "oh hey, here's two or three semi-related ideas that I didn't bother to integrate with the rest of the text". With some editing and revision (along with, like, an editor, or at least someone else looking it over), nearly all of the extra headings could've been scrapped.

      --
      When you look at the state of the world, how can you not become a radical, liberal anarchist?
    6. Re:Interesting, but tough to read. by Digital+Vomit · · Score: 1
      The thing is, good writing shouldn't need a header every 1-2 paragraphs. ... The problem here is that it doesn't flow naturally.

      I agree. I have no idea why my post was modded Insightful. I was going for Funny.

      --
      Modern copyright is theft of culture from everyone and it retards the progress of the useful arts and sciences.
  3. Planting the seeds... by gizmoiscariot · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Ill agree with the Uldaman thing. At any one time on my server (Lightbringer) you will mysteriously see 10-20 Level 60 Rogues, many of which have interesting names, most of which are Chinese.

    Farming tends to bring a lot of items into the mix, however the problem is that those of us who play the games and then try to sell the items we find, find that we aren't getting anything near what we probably should because others who find a bunch of those same items sell them for much cheaper. So yeah it keeps prices down however in some cases thats bad when the rest of us want money too.

    --
    Gizmo
    1. Re:Planting the seeds... by Ayaress · · Score: 3, Informative

      I have the same problem, and I have a solution that's actually quite productive. Take the hit and sell green drops on the cheap.

      The place to make your money is on consumable items. Cloth is the easiest one, because every profession uses it, plus the reputation turnins. It's easy to get 100 runecloth in a day or two and throw it up at 4g a stack depending on time of day and server. Mithril is another easy one that can pull 5g for a stack of 20 bars. Leather is decent, too, since most professions use at least a little bit of it.

      When you get those green drops, they tend to be harder to sell. I usually cut my price low, especially with off-class stuff (cloth with strength and agility, for example), so even if you can't get it sold for equipment, enchanters will snatch it up for reagents. You can even take up enchanting yourself and burn all those drops and sell reagents or enchants yourself.

      The farmers do this too, granted, but there's a catch: Equipment, you can't sell over and over to the same people. If you have 10 level 30 swords, you'll need 10 level 30 sword users to buy them all up. If you have 10 stacks of cloth, it's a good chance you'll sell them all at once to the same person buying it in bulk.

  4. Game Vs. Experience by kenp2002 · · Score: 1

    a game is a recreational activity that alleviates the player from stress and provides and escape from reality for a period of time.

    Does EQ, DOAC, WoW, AC, or any other MMO out there really fit that definition?

    --
    -=[ Who Is John Galt? ]=-
    1. Re:Game Vs. Experience by Alcilbiades · · Score: 1

      A game is a competition that a player enters either of their own personal entertainment or he entertainment of others. Now whether a person competes vs themself, another player or a npc it doesn't matter.

    2. Re:Game Vs. Experience by secolactico · · Score: 1

      By that definition, is chess a sport? How about poker? How about Quake? Russian roulette?

      --
      No sig
  5. Sweat Shops by MrBigInThePants · · Score: 1, Troll

    I love his take on sweat shops. Seems if you live in a thrid world country than 18 hours a day. seven days a week is perfectly ok from his point of view. (hence buying their stuff is morally ok)

    And they are forced to eat hot gravel....

    1. Re:Sweat Shops by (A)*(B)!0_- · · Score: 1
      12 hours a day, 6 days a week from his description - and in an office building with sick time and paid leave.

      Did you even read the article?

    2. Re:Sweat Shops by MrBigInThePants · · Score: 1, Troll

      I did actually.

      He is NOT a proper researcher or journalist and almost ALL his "facts" are his own estimates of what goes on and a few annecdotes from people he met online.

      Not exactly investigative journalism...

    3. Re:Sweat Shops by thesnarky1 · · Score: 1

      ""And they are forced to eat hot gravel...."" Forced?! They're provided with a hot, heavy meal everyday! And you think that's bad.... tsk tsk

      --
      Want to find other gamers to play board and role playing game
    4. Re:Sweat Shops by NBarnes · · Score: 1

      So you make a claim that's wildly at odds with the article's statements, and when called on it, claim that the article's author isn't a 'proper researcher' (as if there were credentials for niche journalism, I must have missed the major in college). Way to butress your claims, I'm sure people are finding you real credible.

      This is an odd place to suddenly become terribly worried about working conditions in the third world. Gold farming is pretty cushy by the standards of countries where the alternatives can be much less... pleasent.

    5. Re:Sweat Shops by Maserati · · Score: 1

      The author is quite up front about when he's using assumptions and anecdotes (most of the time) and when he's citing facts (here and there). What may be throwing you, is that this is written from a good model of a research paper, even though it isn't nearly as factual as just most papers written like this.

      What this is, is one person's opinion, very well presented. It may be anectdotal and commen-sense assumptions, but you can follow the flow of discussion almost too well :-) It is a bit much for the content, but it works and I applaud the author for taking the effort involved in this exercise in rigorous writing.

      --
      Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1992-1951
    6. Re:Sweat Shops by (A)*(B)!0_- · · Score: 1
      No, it's not investigative journalism at all. But you say, "Seems if you live in a thrid world country than 18 hours a day. seven days a week is perfectly ok from his point of view." when in fact, he never said he believed that those hours are being worked. So you put words into his mouth and then made a claim about his moral judgement of the situation.

      A more accurate description would be that he believes it is acceptable and moral to buy from workers who have 12 hour shifts, 6 days a week with paid leave and sick time.

      If you were criticizing his research techniques, you should have come out and said so.

    7. Re:Sweat Shops by MrBigInThePants · · Score: 1

      lol.

      Troll all you like. Karma is still excellent.

      See you on the meta moderators side...

    8. Re:Sweat Shops by MrBigInThePants · · Score: 1

      I totally agree with you.

      My point really is that this is not slashdotworthy. I am not rating this article in competition to other articles on the net, only to slashdot articles.

      I don't come here to read articles on conjecture and opinion...

    9. Re:Sweat Shops by MrBigInThePants · · Score: 1

      Maybe you should try reading the article:

      "My personal impression is that while perhaps a limited number of the farming operations Ive learned about may, in some regards, impose sweatshop conditions on their employees, many, perhaps most, dontespecially when local norms are taken into account."

      He leads onto this from saying that working conditions in 3rd world countries are not like ours, then goes on to say that he heard about bosses who keep raising levels of work.

      Sick leave whenever you want it in Indonesia...yeah right...

      He admits that he KNOWS they exist and then says IN HIS OPINION that they are not the majority.

      Why? because it makes him feel better? He polled a sample of them?

      Or he met a few and they told him that?

      Did you know that indonesian/malay workers in nike/puma factories SAID EXACTLY THE SAME THING when the inspectors come. Guess what happens if they whistle bow?

      Chat log anyone??

      Come on people, I thought slashdot was better than this...

  6. Fair by adderofaspyre · · Score: 3, Informative

    I found the article interesting as it does not try to judge farmers but try to bridge their world with that of the ordinary player. Worth reading.

  7. At least it'll be legitimate by faloi · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I wonder how information like this, assuming even half of it is true, plays into larger corporations attempts at legitimizing the behavior (like SOE recently did for EQ2)? I've always argued that if the game play is boring or tedious enough that someone would consider paying real money for some advancement, it's time to consider another game. As an avid MMORPG gamer at one point, I can say that I suffered through bad game play for the social aspect of it. Now that I'm sort of off that, I tend to get bored with more MMORPGs rather quickly. I don't need l337 items that badly, and I don't like playing an easy game forever to achieve some level or other bonus.

    --
    "It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education." -Albert Einstein
  8. what about bots? by slicer622 · · Score: 3, Interesting

    sure, chinese peasants are cheap, but you dont have to feed, clothe and shelter processor power.

    1. Re:what about bots? by HTL2001 · · Score: 2, Interesting

      parent has a great point... for the MMO I play (Ragnarok Online) there is even an open source bot. In the past there were several, and well documented cases of people from everywhere running farm bots on trial accounts, gaining ~9mil per character in 2 weeks time (e-bay price was ~$6/mil at that time). And this was with paying no money for a subscription as well... if they had bought a subscription (which some had) they were able to make a lot more.

      the problem with bots is they can act realy dumb, (for instance, in Ragnarok, moster locations were changed drasticly, making it hard to bot without significant setbacks and making it horrably obvious that you are botting) and may not stand up to whatever test the GM's of a particular game have to detect that someone is not using a modified client or something other than the client
      I suppose a single person could watch over several bots, but unless they were graphical representations and took into account the way the real client handles packets, it would probably be easier for one person to watch over several machines running the game using the macro option (or even, one machine using a splitter program, though I don't know of one)

      --
      By reading this, you have given me brief control of your mind.
    2. Re:what about bots? by Ayaress · · Score: 1

      I've played RO. WoW, though, is a bit more active. The gameplay is just too varied. Every class functions quite differently, and most of them have a number of variations in their talent builds that also effect their play a lot.

      Just for an example: My main is a rogue. He's assassination/subtlty, and uses daggers. With this, winning a fight is all about getting the jump, building a combo quickly, and getting a big finishing move. I do 80% of the damage in the first and last hits of a fight. However, my friend is a rogue with combat talents instead, and he uses swords. He does much more sustained damage. Like me, 40% of his damage is in the last hit, but the rest is spread out evenly rather than focused in one big hit like mine. Another guildmate of mine is the (very rare) mace-wielding combat rogue, and his strategy is all about stunning. He does lower damage than both of the other versions, but his target spends half the fight unconscious.

      Blizzard used Diablo 2 as a dress-rehearsal for an MMORPG. They learned how to prevent bots from working, and at the same time make an infinitely less boring MMORPG than most of the rest. Granted, they only have ten classes, but each one has three quite different playstyles. Sometimes diametrically opposed: Holy priests are all about protection and healing, Shadow priests are all about weakening and damage. There's just a lot more variation to deal with in making a bot.

      Even then, the monsters are more varied than I ever saw in Everquest. Even as a rogue, which is one of the more straightforward and simplistic classes to play, I have four different ways to go through combat, depending on what I'm fighting. Low armor stuff, Ambush, sinister strike up a combo, finish with eviscerate. Low hp stuff, ambush, SS, and Slice and Dice for the speed buff to start out my next fight. High armor stuff, cheapshot, SS for the combo, kidney punch, loop around behind, double backstab, finish the combo with gouge and backstab again, then eviscerate for the (probable) kill.

      Sure, you probably can make a bot for WoW, but with so many different combinations to deal with, it can get mind boggling. I've got decent experience with four classes, and if I didn't decide to stop typing after this paragraph, I could easily give you over 100 different combat strategies just from those, not counting the fact that many dungeon bosses require specially tailored strategies to fight - if you go into a fight with Onyxia the way you would with Random World Spawn Mob #26, you could end up getting your entire party killed in the first 5 minutes, even if they know what they're doing.

    3. Re:what about bots? by BluffBlank · · Score: 1

      In fact, there was a highly successful and widely used bot in WoW. I actually used it to level a Mage from 1 - 60, and a Priest from 1 - 54, found numerous rare and epic items, paid for my epic mounts, etc. However blizzard has continually updated their bot detection system, to the point where people were getting banned left and right for using the bot. Most people stopped using it a couple months ago, when the programmers of the bot gave up trying to get around Blizzard's detection.

      But all classes, including rogues, did work very well, as the bots themselves were mostly open source C# classes written and improved by users.

      The bot and underlying functions are now opensource, and be found if you look hard enough.

  9. Mileage may vary by MMaestro · · Score: 4, Insightful
    If you play a MMO to become the #1 uber-l33t player on your server/shard/realm/world, then no you're not going to find a MMO that fits that defination.

    If you play a MMO to play with your friends at your own pace, your own way, then most MMOs will fit that defination.

    Gold/credit/gil farmers cater to the first group. They're the ones who want the uber-l33t gear, the level 20/50/60/75 characters with all the skills, spells and special abilities unlocked. The second group generally cares more about the journey rather than the ending. The line between the two groups obviously cross, but for the most part its pretty distinct.

  10. His analysis on the effect on the economy... by Sathias · · Score: 2, Interesting

    ...is majorly flawed. No-one has argued that the selling of large amounts of items pushes up prices. What has been argued is that people buying larger amounts of gold than they could ever get in causal play gives them a big burning hole in their pocket. Why wander around collecting herbs if you can take a minor dent out of your supply (which you can just spend money to buy more) to get them instantly from the AH?

    It is exactly the same reason that the US can't solve its budgetary problems by "printing more money". Increase the supply of money and you push up inflation. The 24-hour high-pressure farmers increase the rate of gold into the server by a lot, and this has the same effect.

    If you ask me this article looks like it was written by someone from one of the gold selling companies, giving helpful hints such as when to be one of the farmers customers, in order to legitimise their business. It's a pity they have to ignore and argue against basic economic principles to do so.

    --
    Blessed are the 1337, for they shall pwn the earth.
    1. Re:His analysis on the effect on the economy... by paulish · · Score: 3, Informative

      > ...is majorly flawed. No-one has argued that the selling
      > of large amounts of items pushes up prices.

      The author did not claim that anyone so argued. He said, more or less, that there is a contention that farmers, being greedy, overcharge for their items and thus raise prices.

      > What has been argued is that people buying larger amounts
      > of gold than they could ever get in causal play gives
      > them a big burning hole in their pocket.

      Perhaps that argument has been advanced; but if so, it was advanced *in addition to,* not instead of, the assertion disputed by the author.

      >If you ask me this article looks like it was written by
      > someone from one of the gold selling companies, giving
      > helpful hints such as when to be one of the farmers customers,
      > in order to legitimise their business. It's a pity they have
      > to ignore and argue against basic economic principles to do so.

      Hmm, the article is published on a website belonging to a company whose business appears to be restricted strictly to selling game guides and access to private, insiders, game-related discussion forums.

    2. Re:His analysis on the effect on the economy... by Mondoz · · Score: 1
      "If you ask me this article looks like it was written by someone from one of the gold selling companies, giving helpful hints such as when to be one of the farmers customers, in order to legitimise their business. It's a pity they have to ignore and argue against basic economic principles to do so."

      His helpful hints can let you screw the farmers over.
      Did you actually read the article?

      --
      /sig
    3. Re:His analysis on the effect on the economy... by mmalove · · Score: 1

      Here are my own thoughts on the economic impact of gold farmers. Most players in the game, as they progress, will eventually replace a given item on that character, at which point it gets sold to an npc for gold, or disenchanted (the soulbound prevents the item from continuing to circulate among players). If it's vendored, the amount the item sells at is the amount of gold added to the world economy, if it's disenchanted, there is actually a zero gold addition (shards are consumed in an enchantment, cannot be vendored, and do not increase the vendor value of an item). If another player offers 1000 gold for an item, the overall amount of gold on the server won't change, therefore there should be no inflation. Since many players are not enchanters, it's reasonable to say that most of the greens a farmer finds translate directly into increased gold on the server. But if they are, say, shard farming, it can't ever lead to more gold. It may decrease the value of the high end enchants at best, which would actually lead to a drop in price. Further the high amounts people pay for say, a krol blade (900 gold) do not translate into 900 gold added to the economy. In fact with auction house fees as they are, more gold is usually lost in the listing than the item will eventually vendor for when the buyer finds something better. Now since the article talks about most farmers making the most money from selling epics and reagents to players, and I believe this to be true, then their farming is having a minimal impact on inflation. Prices are driven up mainly in my opinion because of alts - addition characters played by the same player. Someone that raids the high end content has access to a great deal of gold compared to someone on level 10. It is faster for them to make a sum of money with their main character and buy low end reagents, than to use the lower character to collect said reagents. That's why you can sell a stack of briarthorn for several gold, even though the potions you could make from it are far less valuable than the reagents you put in. This is why low end enchants are driven down in cost to the point most are offered for free. It's got nothing to do with chinese farming, it's secondary characters powerskilling on a primary character's bankroll.

      --
      You can get 15 minutes of fame, but you can go down in history for infamy.
  11. Monopolization of certain non-instance areas by kongjie · · Score: 1
    I'm not going to argue with the author's economics or his lenient attitude on farmers.

    My basic feeling is that I don't want to support farming because it subverts the spirit of the game and it supports a system by which workers do not end up having better lives. Even if it were likely that farming could become a "career," I don't think it adds up to a gratifying career. I think the bottom line is that it supports a fat cat who had the capital to buy the necessary hardware and network access but someone without imagination--essentially a parasite.

    The biggest gripe that I have with farmers, and that is farmers in the plural--two or more banding together to work a hunting area for hours at a time, blocking others from coming in. Sure, if you can get enough people together you can drive them off, but they are acting differently from regular players because of the extended amount of time they'll haunt an area. A regular player may chase you away with sufficient manpower, but eventually they'll have something better to do. A farmer just stays and stays.

    1. Re:Monopolization of certain non-instance areas by Aim+Here · · Score: 1

      One of the author's suggestions on farmers - use your character as a sort of security deposit box for them- would actively support farmers themselves (by allowing them to 'steal' from their boss, if that's the word), and help eradicate farming (by pissing off their boss and making sure they only receive a minimal income). If I played these overpriced subscription games, I'd try that, and enjoy sticking it to someone else's man...

  12. WoW leveling info by Sun+Tzu · · Score: 1

    Another source of tutorials for WoW newbies is WoW-Camp. It contains a fair amount of leveling info.
    --
    Barebones and SFF computer reviews.

    --
    Geeky modern art T-shirts
  13. Uh, game guides online is associted... by Pizzop · · Score: 1

    ... with this site and IGE. This is just propaganda.

    --
    How to Speak Leet
  14. Re:Article sounds like bs. by fain0v · · Score: 1

    Just to counter your first point. I was farming 2-3 stacks of icecap in an hour and Selling them for close to 20 gold a stack. I was averaging about 45 gold an hour which is 540 gold in 12 hours. Prices vary, and I have no doubt that they can easily make 400 gold in 12 hours since Im sure my method was not the most efficient way of farming.

  15. Re:Article sounds like bs. by unclethursday · · Score: 1
    Interesting tidbit, most farmers farm at either tyr's hand in the EPL or Sitilus (sp). tyr's hand actually got hit with a nerf on how fast the guys respawn to prevent farming there.

    Which, actually, hurts me, too. Now that I have a 60, I seriously want to get myself up the money for an epic mount and don't feel like spending the rest of my life in BG queues to get my rank up to the point where I can get the PvP epic mount.

    Tyr's Hand was a good source of income for me, especially since the mobs sometimes dropped over 20s at a time, and drop a lot of runecloth so I can get the price of my epic mount down in Darnassus.

    Though, now with my feral buff, I might be able to survive a bit more inside the wall, instead of just farming the ones outside the wall.