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Are Skimpy Raises the New Normal?

Lam1969 writes "Computerworld just released their latest salary survey, and it finds that IT worker bees have once again only received small raises. The article notes, "IT raises still lagged slightly behind the average of about 3.2% for all U.S. workers as reported by the Bureau of Labor Statistics. While the majority of respondents (69%) said their 2004 base salary increased from one year ago, 31% experienced either no change in salary or had their pay cut." It goes on to quote LAN specialist Stephen Noisseau as saying, "I guess that's the way the cookie crumbles ... I'll take 4% over nothing. We're getting basically cost-of-living raises.""

22 of 736 comments (clear)

  1. Welcome to reality.... by Duncan3 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    We're getting basically cost-of-living raises.

    Welcome to the way the rest of the universe works. Be glad you even got that. Most poeple have to find new jobs to get a raise at all.

    Don't worry, I'm sure another bubble will be along to get you a 100% raise every 6 months like the good ol days.

    --
    - Adam L. Beberg - The Cosm Project - http://www.mithral.com/
    1. Re:Welcome to reality.... by heinousjay · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Here's something I've noticed - take it as you will.

      People that have the attitude of entitlement, that someone must take care of them, that they deserve increases, tend to do worse in the long run over people who believe they are owed nothing and must earn every penny.

      All my evidence is strictly anecdotal, so I won't bother detailing it. Feel free to discount this.

      --
      Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
    2. Re:Welcome to reality.... by HermanAB · · Score: 5, Funny

      What? Some people have jobs?

      --
      Oh well, what the hell...
    3. Re:Welcome to reality.... by StillAnonymous · · Score: 5, Insightful

      But that discounts your increasing experience and (hopefully) better performance at your job that occurs each year.

      If there's no raise, there's no incentive to work harder. Unless of course you're easy to replace and your experience doesn't matter to the company...

    4. Re:Welcome to reality.... by SeaFox · · Score: 5, Interesting

      If enough tech workers do this then companies may give higher raises to keep their workforce. Or they (Like my company) will replace these people with people will less skills for less pay and train them with experience.

      In other words, fire the experienced employees who want a decent wage and hire unskilled workers who don't have the guts to ask for more pay and let the customers suffer with bad support while the new class learns what the hell they're doing..

      At my employer (we do contracted support) The client pays for training classes for new employees (these training classes are not as long as they should be but anyway) what happens if the company can't retain the new hires? They have to hire some more and the client has to pay for their training. At some point, the client gets tired of paying for new groups to be trained, and simply don't allow new classes. The result is a hiring freeze for that department. The employees on the project get overworked, irritable, ect. trying to cover the workload of a larger group. We may have oppertunities to earn more from overtime when this happens, sometimes these "oppertunities" are not our choice. In any case, the remaining employees don't get any additional compensation per hours for the extra workload. This situation continues until the company that hired us starts to lose money from their customers leaving from bad support or the employee numbers drop to a point where it is not possible to fulfill staffing hours. The only people who really suffer in the end is the employees who don't quit and the customers (end users) who deal with poor support.

    5. Re:Welcome to reality.... by zerocool^ · · Score: 5, Insightful


      Way to be callous, man. A 2% raise... adjusted for cost of living, that's actually a pay cut.

      Health care costs are up, gas costs twice as much as it did a year ago, houses are unaffordable - up 85% in the past year - in any location where there are jobs, but you can't live far away because you can't afford to commute, and yet you can't work for some small town company with no health benefits...

      I didn't get a piece of the Dot-Com bubble, and now that we're on the downside of it, there are no jobs that pay a living wage, and lots of us are looking for other ways to make a living. It'll come back around, and salaries will become more consistant with cost of living... but in the mean time, I wonder about whether or not I should take my 1 year old to the hospital or if his cough is going to get better on its own with time and generic robitussin, because the emergency room doctors here don't participate with my independant keycare health plan and I really can't afford it.

      Save your harsh words for the realtors, man. All I'm trying to do is scrape by and take care of my family.

      ~Will

      --
      sig?
    6. Re:Welcome to reality.... by IdleTime · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If I and the rest of my cowrkers do such a good job that the company makes a few billion dollars in profit each year and the company raise the price of our prodcts each year, but have problem giving the employees the slightest wage increase. THAT is the real problem, the company I work for and many, many others are having record years, the owners fortunes increases drastically each year because we do such a good job, WE, not THEY, because without us, they would not be rich, but without them, we couls still produce and sell the same product.

      Nobody is talking about entitlements here, that is a typical right wing talking point without foothold in reality.

      Over the past 6 years, we haven't even gotten cost of living raises, basically resulting in making LESS and LESS money each year.

      --
      If you mod me down, I *will* introduce you to my sister!
    7. Re:Welcome to reality.... by uncqual · · Score: 5, Funny
      We may have oppertunities to earn more from overtime...

      Please explain this concept of "earning more" by working overtime. I'm very confused. :)

      --
      Why is there an "insightful" mod and why isn't it "-1"? If I wanted insight, I wouldn't be reading /.
    8. Re:Welcome to reality.... by suitepotato · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I grew up in a housing project on welfare (back before it became like it is today when it wasn't even a handout and you could only hope relatives better off than you treated you to a McDonald's basic cheeseburger once every few months and hotdogs with macaroni and cheese was eaten three times a week). I'm not remotely liberal. The only poor people who truly believe in the left are those who are permanently poor and broken. Those who get wealthy and still profess belief in it are part of the lie that liberalism is and has been since the words "liberal" and "liberalism" were stolen by the leftists from the old style liberals who were if anything more like the true conservatives of today.

      The horesh*t about not everyone having the same opportunities falls flat and exposed as such when you consider that every year people come here from nations where poverty isn't defined as being able to afford digital cable, a projection screen TV, leather couches, and a $30K SUV while living on welfare and foodstamps (I used to install said cable for said people while they sat on said leather couches screaming at each other over who spent the money that should have gone towards the baby's diapers; drugs? working under the table and collecting? who am I to even ask?). It's defined as "will there be any food tomorrow?".

      They come here, work hard, sacrifice mightily, just as they did every day just to live where they came from, and such pays off here where it didn't there. How is it that people come here from places where fortunate isn't a tax payer run apartment building but a scrap metal roof instead of one made of rotten scrap boards, and make it so much better?

      Does anyone think that these largely non-white people are getting a break and aren't the victims of racism and bigotry? Does anyone think "the man" is going easy on them? That they have special opportunities that people here four generations or more don't?

      They point up what American families need to do to be fruitful: stick together, work hard for the common good of the family, put off what you want right now for what you need later, and think of each other over your self. If people think this should be a world where individuals can think only of themselves and be as wealthy as they want all by themselves, they need to realize that's not generally the rule no matter what Hollywood seems like. Long term stable success is a lot of long hard work usually. If you're not up to the cost, don't step up. Stay in the project eating macaroni and cheese and sitting on your front porch staring at the beat up Camaro that you haven't got the money to get on the road. Or scamming the system while crying it doesn't pay you enough money to afford the newest X-Box game.

      I may scramble from job to job to keep my income paying a mortgage and ten dozen other bills, but I'd rather be doing this for my family than letting them sit around without hope living at the mercy of others.

      --
      If my grammar and spelling are off, I am [distracted/tired/careless] (take your pick)
    9. Re:Welcome to reality.... by Bill+Dog · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If your company could replace people with less-skilled counterparts, then they probably should've done so long ago.

      Here's what it is with most companies: After a while they take you for granted, and are no longer interested in paying you what you're worth. But to another company you're all new and shiny and irresistably mysterious, so they'll offer you more to lure you away. So your old company now has to pay market value+ to replace you, so they're now paying *more* for someone 1) they don't know, and 2) who's not familiar with the code base and procedures for getting reimbursed for travel etc. Each company would be better off working to retain the competent that are already up-to-speed on that company's stuff, but instead they in effect force musical chairs amongst all but the dead wood.

      --
      Attention zealots and haters: 00100 00100
  2. Hard Times by ackthpt · · Score: 5, Informative
    LAN specialist Stephen Noisseau as saying, "I guess that's the way the cookie crumbles ... I'll take 4% over nothing. We're getting basically cost-of-living raises."

    Took a 30% pay cut two years ago, as nothing was available but a job 40 miles from home. Only one pay increase in two years, 1.15% which has more than been eaten by the rise in petrol cost.

    It's simple Supply-Demand (Keynesian economic theory), when workers with a particular skill set are not in demand or supply excedes demand, there's not much rationale to give workers higher pay. Of course some increase is a sign of goodwill and encourages workers, but tell the beancounters.

    Oh, and the execs got about 6% pay increase this year. Can't have that lot starving, can we?

    --

    A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
    1. Re:Hard Times by Audacious · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I've gone both ways in pay scale. When I worked for a university once there was a stretch of three years when we never got a pay raise. Usually we only got a 1% or less pay raise. When I became an assistant manager I found out what was going on - the higher-ups were taking all of the money even when the state congress expressly stated that no managerial personnel was supposed to take a pay raise for that year. Pay raises of 3-5% were the norm.

      On another front, a friend of mine was also working at the university. After three or four years of never getting a pay raise he decided to find out what was going on. In his case, he wanted to look at the accounting books. It turned out that the accounting books were on the top floor of the library accesible only by stairs and no photography equipment was allowed on the top floor. Also, no pens, no paper, no pencils, nothing - except yourself. (Althought you could ask for a pencil and paper as you will see here in a sec.) It took several hours (and several days) of making requests for various accounting books, being told they were not available, being denied access to records, and the like to finally get hold of the books he wanted to look at. Turns out they were all done in pencil and several of them had areas that had been erased. Lucky for him, the sections he was looking for were still in good condition. After looking at the pages he asked for some paper and a pencil. The person would only give him one sheet of paper, one pencil, and stood over him while he copied the information from the book to ensure he didn't modify the books. Only one sheet of paper was allowed per person per visit. So it took him a while to get all of the facts. It turned out one person who had hired on with the department had funneled almost all of the funds to themselves. Something like a 30% pay increase each year for the past few years thereby doubling their salary in a very short amount of time. Since the "librarian" had stood over him and watched him copy everything he had the foresight to get the person's name as a witness to what he'd done so there could be no mistake about what he'd found out. He threatened to expose the whole affair if the offending person wasn't fired. They were and the money got distributed like it was supposed to be distributed to everyone. No charges were ever filed against the other person.

      This is why I hate the "let's hide what everyone makes" mentality of most companies. As the saying goes "Evil can not stand the light of day but loves the darkness of the night." Which is to say that you can not do covert things unless you hide, misdirect, or mislead others in what you are doing. So remember that the next time raises are (or are not) handed out. Those people above you didn't take a "0%" pay raise. They took their cut out first and then went "Oops! There's nothing left for the rank and file. Oh well! Maybe next year!"

      One last thing: Any time your boss gives you little or nothing as a raise; just remember this one thing - Every company has to file their income tax returns and those returns are open to public scrutiny. But more importantly, there is a company that already does this for you. They are Standards and Poor. Any major library in any major city will have the S&P books on hand for each year. All you have to do is to go to the library and look up the year you are told you are not going to get a raise (or even if they cut your pay). You can look up your company's information, see what the head of your company had to say about that year's profit and loss, see what dividends were paid to the stockholders, and even see how much money the company's owner made for that year (and you can compare it to the year before's amount to see what kind of a raise they got). Go and look at it. See how much of a pay decrease they took. I think you will be very surprised to find that even in the worse years they didn't take a pay cut or no raise at all but instead usually take about a 7-10% increase every year. Not to mention bonuses they may have taken on top of their pay increases.

      Something to think about.

      --
      Someone put a black hole in my pocket and now I'm broke. :-)
    2. Re:Hard Times by keraneuology · · Score: 5, Insightful
      Somebody must have imparted a momentary impulse to a patellar tendon because I just saw a knee jerk.

      I do not begrudge effective, honest and successful CEOs their salaries. If they earn it, they earn it.

      BUT

      Ovitz did not deserve $140 million. Ken Lay did not earn his $42 million in 1999. Ebbers did not deserve a guaranteed 1.5 million annual pay for life. Jure Sola did not earn his $20 million bonus for hitting targets one quarter out of 16 as the investors in the company saw shares fall 78%.

      The complaint isn't how much CEOs make... it is how much BAD CEOs make. Could I perform as well as a CEO? Well, pay me $1,000,000/month and I'll see if I can drive the nation's largest retailer into the ground along with 57,000 jobs like Chuck Conaway did.

      Why do companies exist? To generate profit. If the CEO can't do that then the CEO needs to be replaced. And if the CEO is engaged in any sort of corruption, fraud or outright stupidity then he has to go.

      Are all CEO's inept, devoid of skill and undeserving of large salaries? Absolutely not. Only a silly extremist would make such a claim.

      However. I find it inexcusable to tell the employees that there isn't enough money for raises (or even adequate equipment) then siphon off several times the profit for one overpaid and underworked twit who just isn't bringing any value to the organization.

      --
      If the g'vt kept the data on you that google does you'd better believe you'd be calling it "doing evil"
  3. Raises shouldn't be the norm by heinousjay · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Is it really a valid expectation to automatically get a salary increase? What happened to earning it? I feel pretty confident in saying that 69% of all workers didn't perform above average, so why should they be expecting a reward?

    --
    Slashdot - where whining about luck is the new way to make the world you want.
  4. 0% raise is a pay cut by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    And keep in mind that a 0% raise is actually a pay cut, due to inflation. If you're not averaging about a 2% raise every year, your income in terms of buying power is declining.

  5. Disorganized Labor by Safe+Sex+Goddess · · Score: 5, Interesting
    I was already modded down as a troll in an earlier posting last week for being pro-union. But no one tells me to shut-up:-)

    I'll say once again:

    Blue Collar = Organized Labor
    White Collar = Disorganized Labor

    Democracy is about working together to be treated fairly. Why should corporate profits leap by huge percentages while employee salaries do not?

    --
    Abstinence is a government conspiracy. www.SafeSexZone.co
  6. Reality vs. perception by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    After 2 years of unhappiness and general lack of hope in my current job, my group has a 30% turnover.

    I remember hearing over and over that raises where only 2% for the last couple years. In fact, due to cost cutting they stopped collecting the trash cans on a daily basis. Now, instead of individual trash cans in our cubes, we have communal trash cans in the hallways, which are emptied once a week. BTW, we keep having record quarters.

    So, when my boss's boss threatened to give me a bad review and no raise, I shrugged my shoulders and informed him that "My annual 2% raise is close enough to 0% that it didn't matter." I then proceeded to tell him that he had a structural problem. The lack of raises provided him with no "stick" and the lack of advancement opportunities provided him with no "carrot."

    I have already decided to leave as soon as the first of the year comes around (and I quality for the End-of-Year bonus).

    The funny thing. I honestly believe I got a 2% raise last year. That is what everyone says the raises were. I was doing some record keeping this weekend and noticed that I actually got a 8.25% raise last year.

    Sometimes perception and reality don't match.
    I am still leaving though.

  7. Hopefully by t_allardyce · · Score: 5, Funny

    I give my Chinese sweatshop kids a raise now and again, usually about a cent a month extra, sometimes a dollar bonus if they've been churning out consistently good shoes. It keeps moral up and gives them the belief that they might one day make enough money to break free of their shackles. I would warn bosses against so called 'perk raises' for example taking the number of tardiness lashings down might seem like a good idea but I've had problems when the workers start boasting about it and eventually UNICEF or someone finds out that we actually _are_ lashing them. That was a pretty costly lawsuit. In all I would say treat em mean and keep em keen. Its far better to threaten a wage reduction for poor work than to offer a raise for good work, instead just tell them that you're only paying the Pakistani kids half the price and that will get them feeling pretty good.

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    This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
  8. And in other news.. by siliconeyes · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Salaries in India to go up by 11.4 percent, possibly the highest in the whole world.

    As a small mobile software developer in India currently looking for fresh business and perhaps adding employees other than myself to the business, this news makes me have second thoughts!

  9. The paradox by Y-Crate · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What always gets me every time we have a discussion about raises is that any call for pay increases to the rank and file is met with fierce opposition by those who claim it will obliterate the economy via inflation and will rob shareholders of their rightful gains while sending corporations reeling into bankruptcy.

    So, I must pose the question, why is it perfectly fine for managers (especially those in the upper echelons) hand out massive raises to themselves and their cronies that are often the equivalent of several times the average salary of their subordinates? The typical CEO makes 450 times as much as the average person they employ. Even when business is bad, layoffs are rampant and wages stagnant, the raises for the managers continue - because according to them, poor performance is always the fault of the lower rungs, while good quarters are always thanks to their expert stewardship.

    The auto parts company Delphi is asking for their non-management staff to accept 50-69% pay cuts, (these workers were described as being basically worthless in a speech the CEO gave two weeks ago) while the managers that have presided over the company sliding into bankruptcy are going to get massive raises.

    Please explain who spending tons of money to compensate workers who are being asked to produce more per hour, work more hours and accept fewer fringe benefits like comprehensive healthcare coverage is some evil, evil thing that shall destroy every company and drive them into bankruptcy, while distributing the same amount of money to the higher ups is no problem whatsoever?

  10. Be prepared to quit by ucblockhead · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Many places flat out lie. Be prepared to quit. It's often the only way to get a real raise. There was one place that, after I had worked there nearly a year, gave me a 2.25% raise, claiming that it was "all they could do". So I went and got another job. When I have notice, they offered me an immediate 10% raise if I'd stay. I laughed at them, and suggested that if they would give decent raises, they wouldn't have such a problem keeping good people.

    Unfortunately, there's too many saps out there who complain about shit raises, but won't go out and do something about it. Don't like your raise? Get a new job, and then when you leave, tell them exactly why. If more people did that, raises would be higher for everyone.

    --
    The cake is a pie
  11. Re:Loyalty is Stupid by Jah-Wren+Ryel · · Score: 5, Interesting

    This is what I don't understand. If you feel that a pay-cut is unfair, why do you stay with the company?

    Health insurance. It isn't the only reason, but it is decent sized. In particular pre-existing ailments. A lot of health insurance plans will not cover pre-existing conditions until you've paid 12 months worth of fees.

    For anyone with a kid or spouse with a pre-existing condition, the thought of no coverage, especially if the condition could dramatically worsen, is enough to keep them from even considering switching employers.

    Which, is why I believe employeer-provided health insurance is evil. I don't believe in state-provided insurance either for all the inefficiences that come with socialism. I do advocate for personal health insurance, where you are personally responsible for each dollar spent for fees and it has no ties to your employer or any other group that would use it to coerce you into acting against your own best interests.

    --
    When information is power, privacy is freedom.