Australian Do Not Call Register

green-e writes "Looks like us Aussies are finally introducing a national 'Do Not Call' register. Under the plan all telemarketers would be banned from calling homes after 8pm on weekdays and 5pm on weekends. Companies that call a household on the register could face fines of up to $220,000 (AU), which could be legislated early next year. About time something like this should be set up. How effective has it been in the US ?"

Comments

As an Australian I can honestly say

[AbRASiON]

It's about time.

This is awesome and I hope it's enforced thoroughly.
Sure it's going to cost some people some jobs - but lately the calls have been coming from other countries anyhow.

Marketing is invasive enough as it is, my number at home is not to be called for any old reason - this is just plain RUDE, 30 years ago you wouldn't dream of this crap happening.

Re:As an Australian I can honestly say

[ankarbass]

I'm not on the american register. But, I've noticed several things.

1) There ARE fewer calls. Fewer companies seem to be willing to risk the fines or pay for the lists.

2) Companies seem to love to play the "We have a relationship" card much more than they used to. They go out of their way to make sure I know that.

3) Those that call are much more aggressive. They are using automatic systems to make calls more and more. I seldom get a person directly on the other end. Even though I only get a few calls a month, it is for this and other reasons that I'm ditching my landline and going to voip only.

With voip it is both easy to have multiple phone numbers that can be changed quickly. Further it's much easier to filter by caller id and completely control how each call is handled. f you don't know the secret personal number which I can change at the drop of a hat, you won't get to talk directly to me ever. I have separate permanent numbers for places I do business with so that they will ALWAYS have to leave a message. Those numbers can take ALL the junk calls they want to dish out because they will NEVER ring a phone in my house. Only my personal voip numbers ring a phone and only if your number hasn't been blacklisted.

Voip is to phones what email is to postal mail. Your physical address no longer has any meaning and it's easy to set it up so that you control what is coming and going based on how available you want to be.

Re:As an Australian I can honestly say

[tpgp]

Well, as an Australian I can honestly say that this will be useless.

From TFA:

Market research companies, pollsters, charities and religious organisations are likely to be exempted.

Riiiiiiggght.... Market resarch companies on the list of exempted organisations?

I'm also quite sure that Politicians will be exempt from this.

And quite frankly - the one person I do not want spamming me is John Howard (lying Australian Prime minister)

This is the phone message he left on many peoples phones prior to the last election:

JOHN HOWARD (phone message): Hello, I'm John Howard. I've taken the unusual step of contacting you with this recorded message to let you know we have recently announced what our first seven tasks will be if re-elected to office. So on Saturday, I ask you vote for your local Liberal member Peter Lindsay. This is John Howard. Thank you for your time.

Think about it - will you trust a do-not-call register from a goverment with a prime minister willing to make marketing calls and send email spam through his son's company?

Re:As an Australian I can honestly say

[minorproblem]

I ussually just start talking in swedish and they go away pretty quickly, works with those hobos who ask for money also.

Only not after 8pm?

[Anonymous Coward]

... why not a complete ban on those annoying calls all day?

$220000?

[Biogenesis]

What's up with the fine amount? $200k + GST?

Re:$220000?

[benk]

It's likely that the fine is expressed in "Penalty Units", the value of which is currently $110. (see http://www.austlii.edu.au/au/legis/cth/consol_act/ ca191482/s4aa.html)

The theory is that Parliament just sets a penalty for each statutory contravention in Penalty Units according to its perceived seriousness, and can update them all automatically eg to account for inflation by amending a single section of a single piece of legislation (the Crimes Act) rather than every section imposing a penalty (which would be a nightmare). It's quite elegant for the legal profession.

It's likely that there will be a maximum penalty of 2000 Penalty Units for the contravention, which today = $220k, and in future may rise.

What's interesting is that some Acts I have dealt impose penalties in the range of 1 to 30 Penalty Units, so this is quite a big fine, relatively speaking. disclaimer - i'm a lawyer but i'm not your lawyer and this is not legal advice. don't rely on it!

How effective has it been in the US ?

[frovingslosh]

How effective has it been in the US ?

It has been pretty effective. Telemarketing calls were coming in hot and heavy right up to the last day, then stopped completely the day the ban went into effect. (Our ban is complete, not just an after-hours ban, as long as there is no business ralationship with the caller.) But since then a few telemarketers have figured thay can get away with breaking the law as long as they keep a low profile. I now get perhaps a call a month that is in clear violation of the law. I report these to my state's Atournet General office, but I've never heard of anything being done about them and over all we have only heard of one or two sucessful prosecutions they have done against anyone breaking this law. So it has helped a lot, but it's not perfect and I would like to see even more teeth in it.

In Sweden

[gagge]

We've had this in Sweden for some years, a register called "NIX" (which means something like "nope").
I think it works pretty well but not 100%. It's really easy to sign up, just call a number, enter your home phone number and confirm.

Works in the UK too

[irw]

Nobody asked, but...

I stayed off the do not call list in the UK ("telephone preference service") for a while, used to average one call per day. Im not getting any since joining, though it took a month or two to settle down.

Like the US, it's a complete ban unless they already have a business relationship with you.

Just use this

[mattjb0010]

The telemarketer counter-script.

Too many exceptions in the US

[spywhere]

The law in the US has helped, but there are still telemarketers of one type or another.

I work from home, and use my cell as the business phone. Our POTS line gets five or six calls a week, even with the law and Anonymous Call Rejection... but at least ACR means that I have a phone number displayed for those that do get through.
Some are companies we deal with, but I tell them to put us on their Do Not Call list immediately or lose our business. (I 'threatened' the NRA: I explained that I would donate $100 to the Democratic National Committee for each subsequent call... alas, there were no more calls).
Some claim exemption from the law, saying they don't have a Do Not Call list. I reply that they'd better start one, because I will charge them with harrassment and criminal tresspass in Delaware if they ring my phone again, and did I mention that my wife is a lawyer? (They never call again).

Most important is to take a polite but aggressive approach as soon as you answer the phone, controlling the call (and therefore the caller):
Hello, this is Tina from AMC and I...
Tina? What's your full name, Tina?
Tina Brown...
Thank you, Ms. Brown. I am required by Federal law to inform you that this call is being recorded. And what do the letters "A M C" stand for, Ms. Brown?
Uh, the Annoying Marketing Council...
And where is the Annoying Marketing Council located, Ms. Brown?
In Walla Walla, Washington, but I...
And what is the phone number of the Annoying Marketing Council, Ms. Brown?
Sir, I am not permitted to...
Actually, Ms. Brown, Federal law requires you to provide that information.
Okay, it's 215-555-4242...
Ms. Brown, the reason I've asked for this information is to put your company in my [imaginary] Telemarketer Database, and now I need you to put this number on your Do Not Call list, effective immediately.
I can do that, sir, but it takes up to 30 days to be removed from our list...
Actually, Ms. Brown, you will need to make sure it happens immediately. If I am called again by the AMC -- even if it's five minutes from now -- I will immediately file civil and/or criminal complaints against the Annoying Marketing Council, and against you personally.
Sir, I should let you speak to my supervisor...
No, Ms. Brown, Federal law requires that you, the caller, handle this. I need to go. Rest assured, if the AMC appears on our caller ID again -- even if we don't answer the call -- you will hear from our attorney... and she's my wife, so she works for free. Goodbye. [click]

I get no repeat callers.

how to avoid *all* telemarketers

[cohomology]

For the past 10 years, I've gotten *at most* two telemarketing calls per year. How did I do it? I once made a "credible threat to sue" AT&T Wireless. There's an industry wide list of people like me, and they don't call us.

I learned the technique from a colleague familiar with the industry. First, know your legal rights. Second, keep a hand-written log of occasions when you have asked to be added to the no-call list of a telemarketing firm. Be careful to have them spell out the name of the firm and the city they operate out of. Then wait for them to make a mistake. If they call you again, after the six month grace period the law allows them to update their paperwork, you've got it made.

Don't shout or be nasty; just read them the log and indicate that you are aware of your legal rights and are interested in collecting the statutory damages. They asked me to "please call this special number to be removed ... " but I just said that I wasn't going to lift a finger to help them. Remember, if it went to court, the case would be decided on "the preponderance of the evidence," and a corporation has no choice but to pay for legal council at trial - they can't represent themselves. Everything is on your side, so they just add you to the list.

Enjoy.